
                   comp.os.os2.misc                 (Usenet)

                 Saturday, 27-Nov-1999 to Friday, 03-Dec-1999

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: christian.hennecke@ruhr-uni-boch...               27-Nov-99 02:21:25
  To: All                                               27-Nov-99 03:29:02
Subj: Re: Quicktime & OS/2

Message sender: christian.hennecke@ruhr-uni-bochum.de

From: Christian Hennecke <christian.hennecke@ruhr-uni-bochum.de>

Charles Cohen schrieb:
> 
> I have the Quicktime plugin ready and waiting to use but when I choose
> the file wahtever.mov from nba.com I get the plugin loaded but no movie
> plays and the forward button just beeps....any ideas why this is
> happening?

Ah, it's Quicktime time again!

Do yourself a favour and buy Quickmotion from Pratice that also contains
AnPoCodec (AVI Codecs). I NEVER managed to get Quicktime 2.1 to work
with WIn-OS/2 and so did a lot of others. You may have success if you
can get a copy of 2.0 for Windows 3.1, but even then you'll have to try
lot's of tweaks. Some hints and a different timer.drv for Win-OS/2 are
in ftp://hobbes.nmsu.edu/pub/os2/games/adventure/mystfix.zip.

Christian Hennecke
-- 
Keep passing the open windows! ("The Hotel New Hampshire", John Irving)

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: not organized (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: dunmunro@direct.ca                                27-Nov-99 01:29:17
  To: All                                               27-Nov-99 03:29:02
Subj: K6-3 at 500mhz

From: dunmunro@direct.ca (Duncan Munro)

I have my FIC 503+ MB and K6-3-450 (AFX 2.2v) CPU running stable at
500mhz (5X100) at 2.4v.


Could someone with an Athlon and\or a P3 could post results with the
same applications?

here are some benchmarks:



Sysbench 0.9.4e result file created Fri Nov 26 16:52:17 1999

Machine name       - Unknown machine
Manufacturer       - Unknown manufacturer
Motherboard        - Unknown motherboard
Chipset            - VIA Technologies - VT82C597 / VT82C597AT Apollo
VP3
Processor          - AMD K6-3 PR300 through PR450 AMD-K6(tm) 3D+
Processor stepping 5.9.1
External cache     - 32Kb internal instruction cache, 32Kb internal
data cache
Graphics card      - NVidia - Riva 128 TNT GUI+3D Accelerator
Storage Controller - unknown controller
Storage Controller - VIA Technologies - AMD-645 / VT82C856A/B PBC, IDE
Controller
Storage Controller - VIA Technologies - AMD-645 / VT82C856A/B PBC, IDE
Controller
Machine data
Coprocessor        = Yes
Processors         = 1
RAM                = 255.93 MB

Operating System data
OS/2 version       = 20.40
CSDLevel           = XR0M010_
FIXLevel           = XR0M010_
Revision number    = 9.034
Priority           = Dynamic
Maxwait            = 1
Timeslice          = (32,32)
Protectonly        = NO
Swap file size     = 40.00MB
  ...initially     = 40.00MB

Video data
Resolution         = 1152x864x16 bits/pixel
Number planes      = 0
Screen Access      = Direct
Bank Switched      = No
Bytes/scanline     = 2304
Aperture size      = 16515072
Manufact. code     = 4318
Chipset code       = 32

 Graphics
   BitBlt S->S copy      :      311.666    Million pixels/second
   BitBlt M->S copy      :       21.784    Million pixels/second
   Filled Rectangle      :     1169.424    Million pixels/second
   Pattern Fill          :       32.263    Million pixels/second
   Vertical Lines        :        7.330    Million pixels/second
   Horizontal Lines      :        7.950    Million pixels/second
   Diagonal Lines        :        7.695    Million pixels/second
   Text Render           :       17.265    Million pixels/second

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
   Total                 :      232.377    PM-Graphics-marks

 CPU integer
   Dhrystone             :      699.800    VAX 11/780 MIPS equivalent
   Hanoi                 :      399.000    moves/25 microseconds
   Heapsort              :      255.300    Million Instructions Per
Second
   Sieve                 :      407.400    Million Instructions Per
Second

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
   Total                 :      495.476    CPU integer-marks

 CPU float
   Linpack               :       37.820    MFLOPS
   Flops                 :       88.580    MFLOPS
   Fast Fourier Transfrm :       36.960    VAX FFT's

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
   Total                 :       63.652    CPU floating point-marks

 Direct Interface to video extensions - DIVE
   Video bus bandwidth   :       59.581    Megabytes/second
   DIVE fun              :      213.393    fps normalised to
640x480x256
   M->S, DD,   1.00:1    :      202.647    fps normalised to
640x480x256

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
   Total                 :       76.544    DIVE-marks

 
 Memory
   5    kB copy          :     1834.646    Megabytes/second
   10   kB copy          :     1868.303    Megabytes/second
   20   kB copy          :     1874.678    Megabytes/second
   40   kB copy          :      901.608    Megabytes/second
   80   kB copy          :      633.521    Megabytes/second
   160  kB copy          :      622.456    Megabytes/second
   320  kB copy          :      181.194    Megabytes/second
   640  kB copy          :      146.353    Megabytes/second
   1280 kB copy          :      117.500    Megabytes/second
   5    kB read          :     1099.962    Megabytes/second
   10   kB read          :     1103.598    Megabytes/second
   20   kB read          :     1101.127    Megabytes/second
   40   kB read          :      973.486    Megabytes/second
   80   kB read          :      907.290    Megabytes/second
   160  kB read          :      907.690    Megabytes/second
   320  kB read          :      444.375    Megabytes/second
   640  kB read          :      431.997    Megabytes/second
   1280 kB read          :      355.124    Megabytes/second
   5    kB write         :     1591.553    Megabytes/second
   10   kB write         :     1596.472    Megabytes/second
   20   kB write         :     1594.659    Megabytes/second
   40   kB write         :     1149.717    Megabytes/second
   80   kB write         :      979.968    Megabytes/second
   160  kB write         :      979.174    Megabytes/second
   320  kB write         :      220.329    Megabytes/second
   640  kB write         :      206.652    Megabytes/second
   1280 kB write         :      166.334    Megabytes/second

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
   Total                 :     1029.469    Memory-marks

 
 
 Disk I/O disk 0-2:  8809 MB - QUANTUM FIREBALLP KA9.1 (7200rpm)
   Avg. data access time :       11.600    milliseconds
   Cache/Bus xfer rate   :       25.192    Megabytes/second
   Track 0 xfer rate fwd :       19.494    Megabytes/second
   Middle trk rate fwds. :       16.423    Megabytes/second
   Last track rate bwds. :       11.052    Megabytes/second
   Average Transfer rate :       15.656    Megabytes/second
   Disk use CPU load     :        4.010    percent

-----------------------------------------------------------------------
   Total                 :       93.476    Disk I/O-marks

 
and my very own port, betabyte,  AKA byte\2:

look for it at hobbes.nmsu.edu as bytewarp.zip





BBBBBB    YYY Y     TTT    EEEEEEE   \     222
BBB   B    YYY      TTT    EEE        \   222
BBB   B    YYY      TTT    EEE         \ 222
BBBBBB     YYY      TTT    EEEEEEE      \2222222

BYTEmark (tm) Native Mode OS/2  Benchmark ver. 2 (10/95)
NUMERIC SORT:  Iterations/sec.: 252.660891  Index: 6.479647
STRING SORT:  Iterations/sec.: 30.933689  Index: 13.822024
BITFIELD:  Iterations/sec.: 37381815.760546  Index: 6.412301
FP EMULATION:  Iterations/sec.: 14.892041  Index: 7.145893
FOURIER:  Iterations/sec.: 3883.273381  Index: 4.416434
ASSIGNMENT:  Iterations/sec.: 2.865332  Index: 10.903089
IDEA:  Iterations/sec.: 462.889361  Index: 7.079768
HUFFMAN:  Iterations/sec.: 218.155674  Index: 6.049461
NEURAL NET:  Iterations/sec.: 3.038366  Index: 4.880910
LU DECOMPOSITION:  Iterations/sec.: 72.210123  Index: 3.740856
...done...
===========OVERALL============
INTEGER INDEX: 7.897617
FLOATING-POINT INDEX: 4.320243
 (90 MHz Dell Pentium = 1.00)
==============================

[E:\bytecpu\beta]

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: via Internet Direct - http://www.mydirect.com/ (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: christian.hennecke@ruhr-uni-boch...               27-Nov-99 02:33:10
  To: All                                               27-Nov-99 03:29:02
Subj: Re: tcl/tk for OS/2?

Message sender: christian.hennecke@ruhr-uni-bochum.de

From: Christian Hennecke <christian.hennecke@ruhr-uni-bochum.de>

Frederick Heitkamp schrieb:
> 
> Is there any?
> 
> My searches came up negative.

Hobbes: ftp://hobbes.nmsu.edu/pub/os2/dev/tcl contains binaries, source
and documentation for tcl/tk for PM. There is even tkinter in
/dev/python.

The Power-Users BBS: ftp://24.2.168.186/pub/os2/unix/xfree86/ports/tcl/
contains an X version and some tools.

Christian Hennecke
-- 
Keep passing the open windows! ("The Hotel New Hampshire", John Irving)

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: not organized (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: hamei@pacbell.net                                 27-Nov-99 01:43:25
  To: All                                               27-Nov-99 03:29:02
Subj: Re: rawrite error message

From: hamei@pacbell.net

In <nsworyybayvaxarg.fls7na0.pminews@news.onlink.net>, "Alex Bell"
<afjbell@onlink.net> writes:
>On Thu, 25 Nov 1999 12:30:43 -0500 (EST), Daniel wrote:
>
>>ahoy 
>>I'm trying to rawrite some debian linux base disks, using rawrite 2.0 (dos
>>program running in os/2 warp 4 fixpack 11's dos window ) I get the error: 
>>Attachment failed to respond
>>what does that mean?  I've fiddle with as many of the  dos environment
>>settings as possible?  Suggestions?
>>
>>I also tried rawrite1.3.3 and it says: attempt to DMA across 64k boundry
>>
>>I used both of these utilities before when I did not have a fixpack
installed
>>and they worked succesfully, however I did have to change some of the basic
>>dos settings, all which I have tried this time.
>>
>>Daniel
>>
>The problem has nothing to do with fixpacks.  It means that the version of
>Rawrite has been designed to work from a Windoze dos window.  I have found
>that Calderal OpenLinux rawrite works well in an OS/2 dos window, but
>TurboLinux and Mandrake rawrites must be used from a Windoze dos window.
>
>Hope this helps.
>
>Regards, Alex
>>

there's also an "rawrite2" that is linked from the Apple page for 
downloading NeXT drivers. It worked fine in an OS/2 DOS window 
to create two NeXT floppy images, and has some improvements 
over earlier rawrites.

sorry I don't have the URL at hand, but try www.apple.com, head
for the NeXT information, the additional device drivers diskette
download page has a link. I believe it will work with 2.88 floppies 
as well.

--
hrad ngravvd

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: SBC Internet Services (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: hamei@pacbell.net                                 27-Nov-99 01:29:24
  To: All                                               27-Nov-99 03:29:02
Subj: Re: PC Week - Peter Coffee

From: hamei@pacbell.net

In <bp3t3sclfrtcdcs47kp92p82g5fqnh580m@news.kraftwerk.net>, Martin Nisshagen
<forkd4nisse@dtek.chalmers.se> writes:
>
>Not bigger than IBM and many other companies (if you think that's of any
>relevance to if they should be treated with justice or not, which I
absolutely
>think not -- everyone should be treated fairly in the court *regardless* if
>your a small business or a very large one -- even if it's popular among some
>people to hate large companies on a general basis).
>

I agree with you entirely - and note further that if I appeared even in
traffic 
court with doctored evidence I *would* be in jail very quickly.

When we see Mr Gates and his attorneys in jail for perjury and tampering
with evidence we'll be beginning to see equally fair treatment for all.
Officers
of the court (all attorneys licensed to practise) are not permitted to tell
lies, under oath or otherwise. When Bill gets his own cell in Alcatraz we 
can start to rebuild our faith in the American justice system. 

We don't hate Microsoft - we hate crooks. Since the two are coincident it
is easy for you to to misunderstand the motives.
 
 
>Best regards,
>
>m a r t i n | n
>

--
hrad ngravvd

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: SBC Internet Services (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: jim.danvers@mindex.com                            26-Nov-99 22:20:06
  To: All                                               27-Nov-99 03:29:02
Subj: Re: Sound Cards and OS/2 (Creative PCI 128?)

From: Jim Danvers <jim.danvers@mindex.com>

Thanks for the response Tom...

I'm becoming increasingly frustrated with the OS (OS/2) in general.  :(  It's
to
bad too - I ran it back "in the day" when bbs's and FidoNet were the way that
computer geeks communicated and it was a superb platform for the hardware and
software that was available at the time.  Now...   I have twice the processing
power, 8 times the hard disk space and memory, yet I can't get it (OS/2) to
run
all of my periphals (or even install in some cases) with the PC's that I have
around here, and unfortunately the outlook for it continues to spiral
downward.
On the other side of the coin though, the MS product (9x-NT) all install and
run
with all of my hardware with a minimal of issue.  {sigh}  I'm spec'ing out a
new
PC - guess that I'm just going to have to take my time, do some research on
ALL
of the peripherals that I would like to use with it, and ensure that
everything
that I choose will work with Linux & OS/2 - Win compatibility is a no brainer
-
you ~know~ it'll work.

-=- J.D. -=-

tom wrote:

> Jim Danvers wrote:
>
> > Hi guys...
> >
> > I just installed Warp 3 (blue spine) and am trying (hoping) to get audio
> > running on this box - it has a Creative Labs Sound Blaster PCI 128 card in
> > it and I have not been able to locate any info on getting it running as
> > yet.  I'm dual booting this box @present w/Win95 and the audio card works
> > fine.
> >
> > Anyone have any pointers or suggestions?
> >
> > Thanks in advance....
> >
> > -=- J.D. -=-
>
> Good luck, unless it comes with OS/2 drivers you are
> out of luck.  There are very few PCI devices that
> comes with them.
>
> Tom Street
> 920-693-2824
>
>    S E M C O
>          Street Electric Manufacturing Company
>       Mfg. of the QuadJoy mouse for quadriplegics
>       and people with high mobility impairments.
>
>          see it at  http://www.quadjoy.com

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: kerwinlu@hotmail.com                              27-Nov-99 03:38:07
  To: All                                               27-Nov-99 03:29:03
Subj: Re: Sound Cards and OS/2 (Creative PCI 128?)

From: "Kerwin" <kerwinlu@hotmail.com>

Glen D <glen@rockyhorror.Zkaroo.co.uk> wrote in message
news:y7xHJI5dddgW-pn2-l0qnL6dDwn80@dialup200.coruscant.kingston-internet.net
...
> On Fri, 26 Nov 1999 17:12:27, Jim Danvers <jim.danvers@mindex.com>
> wrote:
> > I just installed Warp 3 (blue spine) and am trying (hoping) to get audio
> > running on this box - it has a Creative Labs Sound Blaster PCI 128 card
in
> > it and I have not been able to locate any info on getting it running as
> > yet.  I'm dual booting this box @present w/Win95 and the audio card
works
> > fine.
> Creative released the source code to the Linux SB:Live drivers so it
> should be possible to port it to OS/2.  Any volunteers?

I saw an article in Taiwan's OS/2 newsgroup as few weeks ago,
they said that because Creative&Aureal released their driver source code,
one company called Theta Band Software decided
that they are going to write OS/2 drivers for Creative&Aureal's chips.
But they are not going to release the source code.
And, if there are any other companies who want to write OS/2 drivers for
these chips,
Thera Band Software will never write the OS/2 drivers again anymore.....

Does anybody know it's ture or not?

Kerwin


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: BigPond Internet Services (http://www.bigpond.net
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rjlapham@infinet.com                              26-Nov-99 22:37:19
  To: All                                               27-Nov-99 03:29:03
Subj: Re: PC Week - Peter Coffee

From: rjlapham@infinet.com (Jerry Lapham)

In <383E6008.600FA046@opera.no>, on 11/26/99 
   at 11:25 AM, Bj rn Vermo <bv@opera.no> said:

> I'll admit that Windows 386 multitasked DOS programs "surprisingly
> well". We were surprised that it worked at all, knowing what Windows
> looked like on the inside. And it DID multitask DOS programs much better
> than it managed to do with Windows programs - which is not really saying
> much.

That's certainly not my experience here.  Win386 wouldn't run DOS apps *at
all* on my brand new Heath/Zenith 386/16 in 1988.  I had to go to Deskview
to get DOS taskswitching.  As I recall, even MS was using and recommending
Win286 at the time because Win386 just didn't work.

    -Jerry
-- 
============================================================
Jerry Lapham, Monroe, OH
E-Mail: rjlapham@infinet.com
Written Friday, November 26, 1999 - 10:37 PM (EST)
============================================================
MR/2 Ice tag:  I hadn't been too worried about Y2K until Bill Clinton
announced that it won't be a problem.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Voyager.Net - East Lansing, MI (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: uno@40th.com                                      27-Nov-99 05:18:26
  To: All                                               27-Nov-99 03:29:03
Subj: Re: PC Week - Peter Coffee

From: uno@40th.com (uno@40th.com)

Esther Schindler? (esther@bitranch.com?) wrote (26 Nov 1999 22:03:36 GMT):
>That's far from a complete list, uno. For instance, it leaves out

Moved to .advocacy.

>> Here's a near-complete list on OS2 from ES/SR, going back to
>> March '98 or so:

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Yanaguana (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: sdunnin@iw.edwpub.com                             27-Nov-99 01:09:22
  To: All                                               27-Nov-99 03:29:03
Subj: DCITU - Digital camera image transfer utility ??

From: Steve Dunning <sdunnin@iw.edwpub.com>

Does anyone know the whereabouts of this little gem?

The links I've found to it from OS2SS and others are bad.

It this product still available?



--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: UseNet Server, Inc.  http://www.usenetserver.com 
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: wayne@SPAM.tkb.att.ne.jp                          27-Nov-99 17:12:10
  To: All                                               27-Nov-99 05:14:15
Subj: Re: Netscape Communicator 4.61 install problems

From: "Wayne Bickell" <wayne@SPAM.tkb.att.ne.jp>

On Fri, 26 Nov 1999 14:13:40 -0800, Alan Ianson wrote:

:>Thank you very much Wayne. I have my second profile running now and I'll
create an object
:>for the profile manager in my Netscape folder.. :)

If your Netscrape folder is still empty you can also create
the other icons.

-edit -l en_US		This is for Composer

-mail -l en_US		This is for Messenger

-browser -l en_US	This is for Navigator

-l en_US		This is for Communicator

Cheers

Wayne





******************************************************
Wayne Bickell
Tokyo, Japan
wayne@tkb.att.ne.jp
******************************************************
           Posted with PMINews 2 for OS/2
  Running on OS/2 Warp 4 (UK)  + FixPak 9
******************************************************



--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: AT&T Internet Service (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: jyouells@lifestream.microserve.com                27-Nov-99 03:23:02
  To: All                                               27-Nov-99 05:14:15
Subj: Re: Internet connection

From: John Youells <jyouells@lifestream.microserve.com>

Sushenjit Bandyopadhyay <bandyo_nospam@all.wam.umd.edu> wrote:

>I have a similar problem with the PPP internet connection.  After a 
>few days of dialup working perfectly, one day it would stop working.  
>I think its a router problem, but I don't know how to fix it.  A 
>reboot does it, but there has to be a better way.  When the problem 
>occurs, a 
>"netstat -ar"  gives the following result:
>
>[E:\]netstat -ar
>
>  destination         router          netmask   refcnt   use  flags  
>snmp intrf
>                                                                     
>metric
>        default     128.8.3.105         0.0.0.0    0      110  UG      
> 0  ppp0
>      127.0.0.1       127.0.0.1 255.255.255.255    0     5484  UH      
> 0  lo
>    128.8.3.105     128.8.23.30 255.255.255.255    1        0  UH      
> 0  ppp0
>
>addr            0.0.0.0 interface 10 mask 0  broadcast            
>0.0.0.0
>addr        128.8.23.30 interface 10 mask ffff0000  broadcast        
>128.8.3.105
>addr          127.0.0.1 interface 0 mask ff000000  broadcast          
>127.0.0.1
>
>
>the fourth line with addr  0.0.0.0 gets added when the problem occurs. 
>How do I correct this?
>
>Thank you in advance.
>
>Sushenjit
this might not be helpful but after having routing problems with Injoy on a
Warp3 ((RED) FP 40 and some 'unusual' tcp/ip and MPTS upgrades) ipgating to a
Warp 4  4.1 TCP/IP I was getting dropped connections between the 2 machines
after some idle time. Researched some old archive messages on the same problem
and found out that I needed to rem out a line in the X:\MPTN\BIN\SETUP.CMD
that
the TCP/IP config puts there ( see below) 

setup.cmd 
route -fh
REM arp -f
ifconfig lo 127.0.0.1
ifconfig lan0 192.168.0.10 netmask 255.255.255.0
REM ifconfig lan1
REM ifconfig lan2
REM ifconfig lan3
REM ifconfig lan4
REM ifconfig lan5
REM ifconfig lan6
REM ifconfig lan7
REM ifconfig sl0  
route add default 192.168.0.1 -netmask 255.255.255.255 -hopcount 1
REM  REM the next line out and add -hopcount 1 to the previous line
REM route add -net 192.168.0 192.168.0.1 -netmask 255.255.255.0 -hopcount 1
ipgate off

This produces a more resonable routing table that doesn't grow with all sorts
of
internet routes in it ( and I don't loose connections between the warp 3 and
warp 4 machines now.... 

this is the table now: 

[D:\]netstat -ar
  destination             router                netmask     metric flags intrf

0                      192.168.0.1            255.255.255.255   1  UGSP   lan0
127.0.0.1              127.0.0.1              255.255.255.255   0    UH     lo
192.168                192.168.0.10           255.255.255.0     0    UC   lan0
addr 127.0.0.1 Interface 9 mask 0xff000000 broadcast 127.0.0.1
Multicast addrs:
 xxx.x.x.1

addr 192.168.0.10 Interface 0 mask 0xffffff00 broadcast 192.168.0.255
Multicast addrs:
 xxx.x.x.1 (ISP's gateway) 

  

Hope it helps, 


John Youells
LifeStream Computing

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: LifeStream Computing (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: OS2Guy@WarpCity.com                               27-Nov-99 00:20:15
  To: All                                               27-Nov-99 05:14:15
Subj: Re: DCITU - Digital camera image transfer utility ??

From: Tim Martin <OS2Guy@WarpCity.com>

Steve Dunning wrote:

> Does anyone know the whereabouts of this little gem?
>
> The links I've found to it from OS2SS and others are bad.
>
> It this product still available?

The link we offer at Warp City is good.  It is:

http://charette.dyn.tj/dcitu/index.html

Tim Martin
The OS/2 Guy
Warp City
http://warpcity.com
"Grab The Early Bird Special Now!"


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Warp City (http://warpcity.com) (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rsteiner@visi.com                                 27-Nov-99 01:53:18
  To: All                                               27-Nov-99 05:14:15
Subj: Re: OS2, NT or Linux

From: rsteiner@visi.com (Richard Steiner)

Here in comp.os.os2.misc, =?iso-8859-1?Q?Bj=F8rn?= Vermo <bv@opera.no>
spake unto us, saying:

>Tom Plunket wrote:
>
>> Umm, if you had a slow computer why would you run Gnome?  If you
>> did a default install, you've probably got Enlightenment running
>> too...
>
>Sure - comparing same to same. I had been running Aurora with WPS and
>everything on it, including the Java GUI for LVM and TCP/IP configuration,
>and Gnome / Enlightenment does not add nearly as much functionality as I
>used to have.

Enlightenment is a window manager known for its large size, its interface
customizability via arbitrary bitmaps, and its relative instability.  It
isn't as strong on raw functionality (IMhO) as several other wm's are.

Gnome is a desktop still in a relatively early state of development and
quite rough around the edges (it's about where KDE was 8-10 months ago),
and it seems noticably slower than KDE here even on my PPro/200.

I'd advise you to take a serious look at a less extremist Linux desktop
environment like KDE or WindowMaker before passing any sort of judgement
on the general performance of the Linux desktop as a whole.  What you
are seeing is an extreme case, and it can be made MUCH faster.

>This shows something I really knew all along - X is terribly inefficient.

Of course -- X is a network-distributable desktop.  You'd really have
to compare OS/2 with an X server running to compare the two fairly.

>It also demonstrates that OS/2 is very efficient - with the same feature
>set it outperforms Linux and all UNIX-versions on the same hardware. Try
>OS/2 without PM and WPS against a command-line Linux, and you'll see.

I do think that OS/2 is faster on the same hardware than Linux is, even
if you boot the two into text-mode only.

-- 
   -Rich Steiner  >>>--->  rsteiner@visi.com  >>>---> Bloomington, MN
     OS/2 + BeOS + Linux + Solaris + Win95 + WinNT4 + FreeBSD + DOS
      + VMWare + Fusion + vMac + Executor = PC Hobbyist Heaven! :-)
              Yes, but did you read the REALLY fine print?

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: FIELDATA FORTRAN ENTHUSIASTS CLUB (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rsteiner@visi.com                                 27-Nov-99 02:05:26
  To: All                                               27-Nov-99 05:14:15
Subj: Re: PC Week - Peter Coffee

From: rsteiner@visi.com (Richard Steiner)

Here in comp.os.os2.misc, esther@bitranch.com (Esther Schindler)
spake unto us, saying:

>Incidentally, Peter and I have known one another personally for at 
>least ten years. I need your analysis of his motivations, especially 
>when you've never so much as talked to the guy.

I questioned Peter's statement myself via direct e-mail, Esther, mainly
because he seemed to be saying that the FoF's failure to mention the OS/2
1.x vs Windows 3.x time period has somehow invalidated Judge Jackson's
entire OS/2-related argument.

I believe that the OS/2 1.x timeframe wasn't mentioned simply because
it isn't all that relevant to the case at hand, which is a case about
Microsoft's alleged abuse of their monopoly in the Intel OS market.

OS/2 was mainly being pushed by Microsoft as well as IBM in the early
days of OS/2, and it was superior even in those days to Windows 3.0 in
a number of contexts.

He completely fails to mention this.  Instead, he picks something that
seems to be relatively obscure (the two platforms' relative ability to
run DOS apps), he makes a flippant comment about Windows 3.x and its
"32-bit" nature versus a 16-bit OS/2, and he ends with the apparent
conclusion that Windows was clearly superior to OS/2 back in those days
and that this is why OS/2 really failed.

Huh??

I don't know why he chose the relatively odd context that he mentions
in his article (running DOS apps), since (to my knowledge) OS/2 really
wasn't being marketed as a solution for DOS users until OS/2 2.0.  It
seems like a very strange bone to pick given its intended audience at
that time (mainly business users writing to the native OS/2 API).

Also, he totally ignores the fact that OS/2 was 32-bit and Windows 3.x
native software was almost completely 16-bit for a longer period (1992,
1993, 1994, and most of 1995), and that during that time OS/2 ran DOS
software a LOT better than Windows did.  Heck, the better DOS support
is the reason that I switched to OS/2 in the first place!!!

I think it is clear that the FoF is mainly addressing a somwhat later
time period (from 1992-1996, when OS/2 2.x and 3.x were being actively
presented by IBM to the mainstream as an active alternative to Windows,
when it provided better capabilities than Windows, and when Microsoft
engaged in most of its platform-leveraging activities).

More importantly, I believe that Peter's comment is potentially *VERY*
misleading to folks who are not familiar with the history of Windows
and of OS/2.  That makes his comment potentially VERY harmful.

I do think the actions of IBM back in the OS/2 1.x days hurt OS/2 at
the time, but I think he is greatly overstating their effect in later
years, and I believe that OS/2 would easily have been able to recover
from that harm were Microsoft not engaging in a variety of Windows-
leveraging activities with ISVs and OEMs during that time period.

In my mind, three things really hurt OS/2 in the 2.x and 3.x days:

 * lack of preloads,
 * lack of drivers,
 * lack of name-brand applications.

A case can be made that all three of these were influenced by actions
on the part of Microsoft towards developers and PC vendors, and that
each of these items had far more impact than everything that happened
to OS/2 and its potential developers in the OS/2 1.x days.

In other words, I think Peter missed the mark with his short comment,
and I also think his comment had the very real potential to seriously
mislead his readers.

That, in my mind, is irresponsible journalism.

If you'd like to defend him, please do.  :-)

-- 
   -Rich Steiner  >>>--->  rsteiner@visi.com  >>>---> Bloomington, MN
     OS/2 + BeOS + Linux + Solaris + Win95 + WinNT4 + FreeBSD + DOS
      + VMWare + Fusion + vMac + Executor = PC Hobbyist Heaven! :-)
           "Is that seat saved?"  "No, but we're praying for it!"

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: FIELDATA FORTRAN ENTHUSIASTS CLUB (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: wayne@SPAM.tkb.att.ne.jp                          27-Nov-99 18:50:07
  To: All                                               27-Nov-99 10:30:01
Subj: Re: Hauppauge TV card advice.

From: "Wayne Bickell" <wayne@SPAM.tkb.att.ne.jp>

On Sat, 27 Nov 1999 00:24:22 GMT, Lorne Sunley wrote:

:>Unfortunately the G400 card I have, will not work with
:>the SDD/2 beta 9 or beta 11 drivers after a cold boot.
:>Some messing around installing the Matrox drivers,
:>resetting to VGA, and then installing the SDD/2 drivers
:>without a power off will let the SDD/2 drivers work with
:>the GRADD VCAFILT driver for the TV card. 

I could not get my machine to boot to the desktop with my 
ATI card, GRADD 0.79/0.80 and the VCAFILT driver.


:>Both the model 401 and 404 cards work with the
:>ATI 3D Rage II C card under WSeB. The regular
:>IBM GRADD 80 drivers only seem to work with
:>the Matrox Millenium II card for the TV GRADD
:>output.

:>My brother has an ATI Rage Pro and uses the
:>SDD/2 beta 9 drivers with his model 404 TV card,
:>but the IBM GRADD 80 drivers won't work with
:>the VCAFILT GRADD driver for the TV card.

I'm too stupid to figure out the refresh rates, etc of
SDD. I'm waiting till it goes gold or the IBM version.
Right now I'll put up with rebooting.

:>BTW Wayne, what kind of sound card do you have?
:>I've been doing some work with the YADTV application
:>to turn on the "line in" connection on the sound cards
:>but I have only been able to test it on a "Vortex 1",
:>a "Crystal 4235" and an old AWE64 card. The YADTV
:>application is a "pure" MCI application and depends
:>on support for the "extended mixer" commands for
:>MCI control of the "line in" connector.

I'm still using my SoundBlaster 16 PnP from my old 
machine. Had a spare SB Pro to put in that to give
to my kids. Couldn't justify buying another card. THe
SB16 work fine with Warp anyway.

Cheers

Wayne



******************************************************
Wayne Bickell
Tokyo, Japan
wayne@tkb.att.ne.jp
******************************************************
           Posted with PMINews 2 for OS/2
  Running on OS/2 Warp 4 (UK)  + FixPak 9
******************************************************



--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: AT&T Internet Service (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: admin@contec.com.pl                               27-Nov-99 10:05:21
  To: All                                               27-Nov-99 10:30:01
Subj: Re: K6-3 at 500mhz

From: admin@contec.com.pl (Piotr Oniszczuk)

Hi,

Have You made any special steeps on Your FIC 503+ (BIOS upgr, etc) for
using K6-3 ?
Mine 503+ MoBo hasn't K6-3 listed in support CPU's :-(((

 
Hiroshima'45;   Czernobyl'87;   Windows'95 

Piotr/2
e-mail: admin@contec.com.pl

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Private (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: forkd4nisse@dtek.chalmers.se                      27-Nov-99 11:45:23
  To: All                                               27-Nov-99 10:30:01
Subj: Re: PC Week - Peter Coffee

From: Martin Nisshagen <forkd4nisse@dtek.chalmers.se>

Raphael Tennenbaum [AT&T WorldNet Services] -> comp.os.os2.misc:

 > PC Week also said OS/2 failed because it was 16 bit and Win3.1 was 32 
 > bit.
 >
 >That isn't exactly what Peter wrote. He said "Windows 3.x that exploited
the
 >32-bit 386 architecture". You can read it here complete and see for
yourself.
 >
 >Analysis: Jackson's ruling reflects serious misunderstandings
 >By Peter Coffee, PC Week Online 
 >November 5, 1999 9:23 PM ET
 >
 >http://www.zdnet.com/pcweek/stories/news/0,4153,1018027,00.html

 It's still a very strange assessment.  The degree to which

Not really strange IMO (on a technical point), but I think it's a very small
thing who IMO is perhaps not that important in the large picture.

So I don't really agree with Coffee by submitting this link, just as a proof
to my quote that he didn't say what the previous poster (incorrectly) claimed.

 OS/2 1.3 coincided with W3.x -- if it was two years, which I
 don't believe it was -- means we're talking about W3.0, and

The article doesn't mention, but in addition you had OS/2 1.0 and Win 2.1/386
for some years before that (but as I said above, I don't care too much about
that point he makes -- and OS/2 1.x was a real system who was *much* better at
running OS/2 apps than Windows/DOS ever has been at running Windows apps).

 Particularly -- if you want to talk about exploiting 32-bit
 386 architecture -- in light of how much farther ahead Warp
 2.1 was than WfW a year or two later.  

And NT 3.1 was even *more* 32-bit than OS/2 2.1 a year or two later.
 
But still -- I don't care too much about even that fact either (I care it
while running system on processors optimized for 32-bit, but not in the sense
if the DOJ was correct or not).

 I don't really wish to engage in a debate.  But one thing

I agree. It's impossible to say anything if it was a monopoly or not by such
OS technical discussions who is IMO totally irrelevant in that case.

I personally see it from a pure ideologic and philosophical level.

 sheer injustice being done to this magnificent corporation:
 Microsoft appeared before a Federal judge with a hacked
 videotape -- a piece of falsified evidence, the intent of
 which was to controvert what was by MS's own contention one
 of the (if not the) pivotal issue in the case.  It's the

That's a false myth spread by people like you and others (who perhaps does
that because you are obsessed with hating Microsoft).

For the fact behind this myth see:

http://www.moraldefense.com/Campaigns/Microsoft/Antitrust_FAQ/default.htm

 nature of an enormous case against an enormous company that

Not bigger than IBM and many other companies (if you think that's of any
relevance to if they should be treated with justice or not, which I absolutely
think not -- everyone should be treated fairly in the court *regardless* if
your a small business or a very large one -- even if it's popular among some
people to hate large companies on a general basis).

Best regards,

m a r t i n | n

-- 
Martin Nisshagen                 PGP 6.5: 0x45D423AC      K R A F T W E R K 
:)
CS/CE, Chalmers, Sweden          ICQ UIN: 689662          2 x 300A @ 450 MHz
d4nisse-at-dtek-chalmers-se      home2.pp.sbbs.se/mn     
home2.pp.sbbs.se/mn/kw

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Chalmers University of Technology, Sweden (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: forkd4nisse@dtek.chalmers.se                      27-Nov-99 11:47:11
  To: All                                               27-Nov-99 10:30:01
Subj: Re: PC Week - Peter Coffee

From: Martin Nisshagen <forkd4nisse@dtek.chalmers.se>

Bob Germer [] -> comp.os.os2.misc:

 >  sheer injustice being done to this magnificent corporation: 
 > Microsoft appeared before a Federal judge with a hacked  videotape -- a
 > piece of falsified evidence, the intent of  which was to controvert
 > what was by MS's own contention one  of the (if not the) pivotal issue
 > in the case.  It's the
 
 > That's a false myth spread by people like you and others (who perhaps
 > does that because you are obsessed with hating Microsoft).
 
 I seem to remember that Judge Penfield commented to that effect in his
 Findings of Fact. Perhaps I am wrong. In any event he certainly did
 comment on the unbelievable testimony of one William Gates, III.
 
 > For the fact behind this myth see:
 
 You didn't give any reference. Perhaps because you cannot!

http://www.moraldefense.com/Campaigns/Microsoft/Antitrust_FAQ/default.htm#Does
MS=fraud?

Question: Didn't damning evidence emerge during the trial tarnishing
Microsoft's credibility and showing their experts to be dishonest? For
example, didn't Microsoft submit a phony videotape claiming to refute Dr.
Felten's Internet Explorer "removal program"?

Answer: This is a charge??much like the alleged sabotage of Apple
QuickTime??which was later proved to be completely false but still lives on
in
the minds of the public (and some journalists) as if it were true.

Dr. Felten, a government witness, claimed to have written a program that
completely removed Internet Explorer from Windows without any negative impact
on Windows??allegedly refuting Microsoft's claim that the two products are
integrated. Microsoft replied that Felten had not in fact removed all of
Internet Explorer and that his program had indeed damaged Windows.

Microsoft sought to prove its rebuttal by showing about a dozen ways in which
either IE was still available after running Felten's program, or Windows had
been damaged by the program. Since the Judge would not allow a live
demonstration in the courtroom, Microsoft produced a videotape showing what it
said was a machine Felten's program had been run on. The videotape did show
that Internet Explorer could still be accessed quite easily, and that parts of
Windows did indeed appear to be broken.

Rather than attempt to refute the points made in the videotape demo, however,
the government attacked the credibility of the videotape. They discovered that
one computer screen in the demo had a different number of desktop icons than
another screen, showing that Microsoft had filmed two different machines to
make the demo.

The courtroom gasped and the judge was aghast, shocked that Microsoft would
doctor evidence. That was how it was reported in the press and that's how it
has been remembered ever since.

But the story wasn't over. The Microsoft witness, Jim Allchin, realized that
the demo had been made by Microsoft employees who apparently didn't understand
the difference between evidence and demonstration. To save time, they had used
two machines for the demo and edited the footage together??a common tactic
for
trade show demonstrations.

But as Mr. Allchin said on the stand, the demonstration still portrayed actual
facts. To prove this, he volunteered to work that night to make a new
videotape for the judge, using a brand new machine and in the presence of
Justice Department representatives. The judge agreed. The next day, Allchin
came back to court and showed the new videotape, which both the DOJ and Dr.
Felten had watched him make. All but one of the points Microsoft claimed in
the first videotape were demonstrated??and the only reason that point
couldn't
be shown was that it required specialized equipment which was not available on
such short notice.

So Microsoft was sloppy in presenting its evidence??but it did not lie; it
was
immediately able to prove its claims. And the government never once addressed
the fact that Microsoft had just refuted the testimony of Dr. Felten. They
merely cried foul play??and the press wrote it that way.

This incident is typical of the government's approach to this case, which has
consistently been focused on creating courtroom drama??and flashy
headlines??rather than presenting facts.

Best regards,

m a r t i n | n

-- 
Martin Nisshagen                 PGP 6.5: 0x45D423AC      K R A F T W E R K 
:)
CS/CE, Chalmers, Sweden          ICQ UIN: 689662          2 x 300A @ 450 MHz
d4nisse-at-dtek-chalmers-se      home2.pp.sbbs.se/mn     
home2.pp.sbbs.se/mn/kw

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Chalmers University of Technology, Sweden (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: nospam@savebandwidth.invalid                      27-Nov-99 03:59:18
  To: All                                               27-Nov-99 10:30:01
Subj: Re: tcl/tk for OS/2?

From: nospam@savebandwidth.invalid       (John Thompson)

In <383F1312.C9A503E5@ibm.net>, Frederick Heitkamp 
<fheitka@ibm.net> writes: 

>Is there any?
>
>My searches came up negative.

Try ftp://hobbes.nmsu.edu/pub/os2/dev/tcl

/dev/tcl:
tcl76inf.zip     419331 1999/07/29  Manual pages for Tcl7.6/Tk 4.2 
(INF-format)

tk42r2s.zip      554435 1999/07/29  Tcl7.6/Tk 4.2 for OS/2 PM, 
2nd release (source)

tk42r2x.zip      921505 1999/07/29  Tcl7.6/Tk 4.2 for OS/2 PM, 
2nd release (executables)

-John (John.Thompson@attglobal.net)

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: The Crimson Permanent Assurance (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: martin.brown@pandora.be                           27-Nov-99 11:49:05
  To: All                                               27-Nov-99 10:30:01
Subj: Re: PC Week - Peter Coffee

From: Martin Brown <martin.brown@pandora.be>

Martin Nisshagen wrote:

> Raphael Tennenbaum [AT&T WorldNet Services] -> comp.os.os2.misc:
>
>  > PC Week also said OS/2 failed because it was 16 bit and Win3.1 was 32
>  > bit.
>  >
>  >That isn't exactly what Peter wrote. He said "Windows 3.x that exploited
the
>  >32-bit 386 architecture". You can read it here complete and see for
yourself.
>  >
>  >Analysis: Jackson's ruling reflects serious misunderstandings
>  >By Peter Coffee, PC Week Online
>  >November 5, 1999 9:23 PM ET
>  >
>  >http://www.zdnet.com/pcweek/stories/news/0,4153,1018027,00.html
>
>  It's still a very strange assessment.  The degree to which
>
> Not really strange IMO (on a technical point), but I think it's a very small
> thing who IMO is perhaps not that important in the large picture.

I think it was one factor which combined with the muddled way OS/2 was
originally
launched in (delayed) combination with the dreadful PS/2 MCA machines badly
slowed
it's acceptance. People were initially confused as to whether OS/2 would run
on
non-IBM kit, and plenty of corporate sites moved to Compaq h/w rather than
accept
IBM's MCA lockin.

IBM also made life more difficult for developers using OS/2 in the early days
cf MS
Win3.
Even so OS/2 has survived in the market much better than PS/2 hardware.

> So I don't really agree with Coffee by submitting this link, just as a proof
> to my quote that he didn't say what the previous poster (incorrectly)
claimed.
>
>  OS/2 1.3 coincided with W3.x -- if it was two years, which I
>  don't believe it was -- means we're talking about W3.0, and

My recollection (which may be imperfect) was that OS/2 existed in a useful
form
earlier than any public versions of Win 3.0. But OS/2 was hampered by IBMs
insistance that it run on 286's.
386 clone PCs became the standard much faster than anyone anticipated.

> The article doesn't mention, but in addition you had OS/2 1.0 and Win
2.1/386
> for some years before that (but as I said above, I don't care too much about
> that point he makes -- and OS/2 1.x was a real system who was *much* better
at
> running OS/2 apps than Windows/DOS ever has been at running Windows apps).

Although true there was a distinct shortage of good OS/2 applications in the
early
days because of the barriers to entry and hostile developers tools. MS Windows 
got
that more nearly right.

Regards,
Martin Brown

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Nezumi (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rascho@nospam.iname.com                           27-Nov-99 13:22:21
  To: All                                               27-Nov-99 10:30:01
Subj: Java CLASSPATH

From: "Rade Popovic" <rascho@nospam.iname.com>

Hi!

Can somebody tell me what should I put in my CLASSPATH variable,
because I don't have one, and what is it for (I know Java use it but my
seem to work without it).
One other thing. When updating my Java runtime I download file called
runtime.exe. Now I have also downloaded file called os2jre.exe (from
same directory) and in readme it says "IBM(R) OS/2 WARP RUNTIME
ENVIRONMENT, JAVA(TM) TECHNOLOGY EDITION". os2jre.exe installs itself
in jre11 directory. What is the difference between those two?

TIA

Rascho
e-mail:rascho@iname.com
ICQ# 49354974

------------------------
Hal 9000: "Dave, put those Windows disks down....Dave...DAVE!"


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Dugoprsti & Co. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: nykisle@attglobal.net                             28-Nov-99 00:53:18
  To: All                                               27-Nov-99 14:20:20
Subj: motherboard cache

From: nykisle@attglobal.net

I am considering buying an AOpen AX59Pro
which has a 512k ot 1 meg cache.
How much ram will 1 meg cover.

--
-
-
- Regards
                RonN


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Global Network Services - Remote Access Mail & Ne
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: esther@bitranch.com                               27-Nov-99 14:18:08
  To: All                                               27-Nov-99 14:20:21
Subj: Re: PC Week - Peter Coffee

From: esther@bitranch.com (Esther Schindler)

On Sat, 27 Nov 1999 08:05:52, rsteiner@visi.com (Richard Steiner) 
wrote:
| Here in comp.os.os2.misc, esther@bitranch.com (Esther Schindler)
| spake unto us, saying:
| >Incidentally, Peter and I have known one another personally for at 
| >least ten years. I need your analysis of his motivations, especially 
| >when you've never so much as talked to the guy.
| 
| I questioned Peter's statement myself via direct e-mail, Esther, mainly
| because he seemed to be saying that the FoF's failure to mention the OS/2
| 1.x vs Windows 3.x time period has somehow invalidated Judge Jackson's
| entire OS/2-related argument. 
 . .
| In other words, I think Peter missed the mark with his short comment,
| and I also think his comment had the very real potential to seriously
| mislead his readers.
| 
| That, in my mind, is irresponsible journalism.

No, I'm not interested in defending Peter. You did the exact right 
thing. You wrote to him directly to say, "Huh?" and you explained your
huh-ness. If Peter was obtuse (because he got up on the wrong side of 
the bed, that day, because a copy editor shortened his original text 
without understanding it, or for any other reason -- including that he
was wrong) *he* is the person responsible for answering the issue. Not
the other people in this newsgroup.

Complain to the source. And, when deserved, offer praise to the 
source. Everything else is for your own entertainment.

(Sometimes it's hard, or impossible, to do so. To what IBM email ID 
does one offer either praise or criticism?)

--Esther

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Frontier GlobalCenter Inc. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: Thomas.Kellerer@tps-labs.com                      27-Nov-99 16:22:15
  To: All                                               27-Nov-99 14:20:21
Subj: Java 1.2 for OS/2

From: Thomas Kellerer <Thomas.Kellerer@tps-labs.com>

Does anybody know if and when IBM will release a Java 1.2 for OS/2???

Regards
Thomas

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rhinton@mediaone.net                              27-Nov-99 09:24:03
  To: All                                               27-Nov-99 14:20:21
Subj: The ATI RAge Fury Pro card

From: "Richard Hinton" <rhinton@mediaone.net>

November 28, 1999

I stopped into a computer discounter yesterday and saw this ATI Rage Fury
Pro card with 32 megs of
video ram.  I was curious if it ran in OS-2 version 4?   I  suspect it will
run in Win98, and maybe in Linux,
but not sure....
I stopped at the OS-2 device driver page and looked at thes "GRADD" drivers
which work on
the "RAGE" family of chips, among others, but don't know if that includes
the newest one...

Richard N. Hinton
rhinton@mediaone.net



--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: MediaOne Express -=- Central Region (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: zayne@omen.com.au                                 27-Nov-99 15:16:09
  To: All                                               27-Nov-99 14:20:21
Subj: Re: K6-3 at 500mhz

From: zayne@omen.com.au (Mooo)

dunmunro@direct.ca (Duncan Munro) wrote:

>I have my FIC 503+ MB and K6-3-450 (AFX 2.2v) CPU running stable at
>500mhz (5X100) at 2.4v.
>
>
>Could someone with an Athlon and\or a P3 could post results with the
>same applications?

Yes this is an interesting question.  I have noticed in the last week
or so that the K6-3 has dissapeared from most of my suppliers price
lists in favour of low end Athlons.  Are they similar in performance?
Or would a 500MHz Athlon beat a 500Mhz K6-3 by a long way?

Cheers,
Craig

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Nothing I say is my own opinion (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: cvopicka@erols.com                                27-Nov-99 10:40:08
  To: All                                               27-Nov-99 14:20:21
Subj: Re: PC Week - Peter Coffee

From: Ron Vopicka <cvopicka@erols.com>

> > I'll admit that Windows 386 multitasked DOS programs "surprisingly
> > well". We were surprised that it worked at all, knowing what Windows
> > looked like on the inside. And it DID multitask DOS programs much better
> > than it managed to do with Windows programs - which is not really saying
> > much.
> 
> That's certainly not my experience here.  Win386 wouldn't run DOS apps *at
> all* on my brand new Heath/Zenith 386/16 in 1988.  I had to go to Deskview
> to get DOS taskswitching.  As I recall, even MS was using and recommending
> Win286 at the time because Win386 just didn't work.
> 

It was simply not "ready for prime time" as Billy G. would have said. 
Come to think of it, I think that was the way he referred (refers?) to
Java... and his necessity to "protect" Windows customers from it.

Maybe he should have taken Windows off the market back then!

:-)

Ron

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rgibson@ix.netcom.com                             27-Nov-99 16:05:27
  To: All                                               27-Nov-99 14:20:21
Subj: 4.61 Questions 

From: rgibson@ix.netcom.com (Ron Gibson)

I have some questions about 4.61

1) Is it out of Beta?
2) That said are the roaches out?
3) Does the multimedia work without breaking WinOS2
4) Will it run on Warp 3, FP40?

                      email: rgibson@ix.netcom.com

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: MindSpring Enterprises (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: thaimann@dmreg.infi.net                           27-Nov-99 10:14:03
  To: All                                               27-Nov-99 14:20:21
Subj: Re: HPP different download address !!!!!

From: "Terry Haimann" <thaimann@dmreg.infi.net>

Has it been upgraded?  I am still using ver 2.1(registered) and generally
speaking I am happy with it.  I have the version that doesn't do frames.
I have used it to maintain a chess home page
"http://members.tripod.com/~dmchess/home.htm" and my online resume
"http://members.tripod.com/~dmchess/cover.htm".  My chess page needs a little
work, but most of the links are still valid.

On Fri, 26 Nov 1999 09:52:51 +0100 (CET), C.J. wrote:

>HomePage Publisher
>***************************
>
>HomePage Publisher is an integrated WYSIWYG HTML publisher and
>editor/browser. HPP enables you to create or modify any HTML pages. Easy to
>use, it does not require knowledge of HTML tags. With HPP, you will be able
>to modify pages and images directly in your document.
>
>Check it out and download the free trial version:
>http://www.btsoftware.com/os2/hpp.htm
>
>
>



--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: InfiNet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: gczerw@home.No-Spam.com                           27-Nov-99 16:38:28
  To: All                                               27-Nov-99 14:20:21
Subj: Re: Java 1.2 for OS/2

From: gczerw@home.No-Spam.com (George Czerw)

On Sat, 27 Nov 1999 15:22:30, Thomas Kellerer 
<Thomas.Kellerer@tps-labs.com> wrote:

> Does anybody know if and when IBM will release a Java 1.2 for OS/2???
> 
> Regards
> Thomas


Looks like maybe no 1.2 release, but 1.3 in 2Q2000!

Check out the following:

http://www.ibm.com/java/jdk/other/portingplans.html

George

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: @Home Network (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: jdc0014@InfoNET.st-johns.nf.ca                    27-Nov-99 17:02:22
  To: All                                               27-Nov-99 16:56:12
Subj: Re: K6-3 at 500mhz

From: jdc0014@InfoNET.st-johns.nf.ca (John Hong)

Mooo (zayne@omen.com.au) wrote:

: Yes this is an interesting question.  I have noticed in the last week
: or so that the K6-3 has dissapeared from most of my suppliers price
: lists in favour of low end Athlons.  Are they similar in performance?
: Or would a 500MHz Athlon beat a 500Mhz K6-3 by a long way?

	K6-3's are going to be eventually phased out from the looks of 
things.  AMD looks like they will make a K6-2+ which is something like 
the K6-3, but instead of a 256k cache it will only have a 128k cache.  
The reason you have never seen any AMD K6-3 500Mhz CPU's for instence is 
because AMD was afraid it would eat into their Athlon 500Mhz sales.  AMD 
is really pushing hard for the Athlon.  They may keep the K6-3 around but 
probably only for laptops.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: St. John's InfoNET (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: dunmunro@direct.ca                                27-Nov-99 18:39:09
  To: All                                               27-Nov-99 16:56:12
Subj: Re: K6-3 at 500mhz

From: dunmunro@direct.ca (Duncan Munro)

I have a FIC 503+ V1.2a and I'm using the latest bios.

Duncan


On 27 Nov 1999 10:05:42 GMT, admin@contec.com.pl (Piotr Oniszczuk)
wrote:

>Hi,
>
>Have You made any special steeps on Your FIC 503+ (BIOS upgr, etc) for
>using K6-3 ?
>Mine 503+ MoBo hasn't K6-3 listed in support CPU's :-(((
>
> 
>Hiroshima'45;   Czernobyl'87;   Windows'95 
>
>Piotr/2
>e-mail: admin@contec.com.pl

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: via Internet Direct - http://www.mydirect.com/ (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: c.k.christacopoulos.REMOVEME@dun...               27-Nov-99 18:55:28
  To: All                                               27-Nov-99 16:56:12
Subj: Re: Java CLASSPATH

Message sender: c.k.christacopoulos.REMOVEME@dundee.ac.uk

From: Charles Christacopoulos <c.k.christacopoulos.REMOVEME@dundee.ac.uk>

Rade Popovic wrote:
> 
> Hi!
> 
> Can somebody tell me what should I put in my CLASSPATH variable,
> because I don't have one, and what is it for (I know Java use it but my
> seem to work without it).
Pass.
> One other thing. When updating my Java runtime I download file called
> runtime.exe. Now I have also downloaded file called os2jre.exe (from
> same directory) and in readme it says "IBM(R) OS/2 WARP RUNTIME
> ENVIRONMENT, JAVA(TM) TECHNOLOGY EDITION". os2jre.exe installs itself
> in jre11 directory. What is the difference between those two?
I think the os2jre is the full runtime stuff.  I think runtime.exe is a
fix for the full file.

Regards
Charles



Remove REMOVE_ME to reply.
-------------------------------------------------------------------
Charles Christacopoulos, Secretary's Office, University of Dundee,
Dundee DD1 4HN, (Scotland) United Kingdom.
Tel: +44+(0)1382-344891. Fax: +44+(0)1382-201604.
http://somis.ais.dundee.ac.uk/    (runs on OS/2)
Scottish Search Maestro http://somis2.ais.dundee.ac.uk/ (runs on OS/2
too)

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: University of Dundee (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: nospamless@home.com                               27-Nov-99 20:15:17
  To: All                                               27-Nov-99 16:56:12
Subj: Re: K6-3 at 500mhz

From: "gH" <nospamless@home.com>

In <383ff568.1408176@news.omen.net.au>, on 11/27/99 
   at 03:16 PM, zayne@omen.com.au (Mooo) said:

>Yes this is an interesting question.  I have noticed in the last week or so
>that the K6-3 has dissapeared from most of my suppliers price lists in
>favour of low end Athlons.  Are they similar in performance? Or would a
>500MHz Athlon beat a 500Mhz K6-3 by a long way?

Integer Performance K6-III > K7, MHz for MHz.
Float Point Performance K7 > K6-III, by a LONG shot.

For example, SETI@Home is a very FPU intensive program, and K7 611 (550
overclocked) can finish one WU in 6.5Hr. Personally, I'm in favour of K7...
:) Much easier to overclock too... :)


-- 
===Team OS/2, Team OS/2 at Taiwan, ICE News Beta Tester. Bovine Team===
======Warped Key Crucher, And OS/2 ISP CD Project Member. TBA  #3======

     Owner of PC End User Web Site       http://www.pcenduser.com/

      Java 1.1.7 - MR/2 ICE REG#:10510 - OS/2 T-Warp Connect 4.0
                            ICQ# = 8943567

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: @Home Network Canada (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: l_luciano@da.mob                                  27-Nov-99 20:13:28
  To: All                                               27-Nov-99 16:56:12
Subj: Re: Java 1.2 for OS/2

From: l_luciano@da.mob (Stan Goodman)

On Sat, 27 Nov 1999 16:38:56, gczerw@home.No-Spam.com (George Czerw) wrote:

> On Sat, 27 Nov 1999 15:22:30, Thomas Kellerer 
> <Thomas.Kellerer@tps-labs.com> wrote:
> 
> > Does anybody know if and when IBM will release a Java 1.2 for OS/2???
> Looks like maybe no 1.2 release, but 1.3 in 2Q2000!

Is that the second quarter of the millenium?

> 
> Check out the following:
> 
> http://www.ibm.com/java/jdk/other/portingplans.html
> 
> George

-------------
Stan Goodman
Qiryat Tiv'on
Israel

E-mail sent to l_luciano@da.mob will, of course, not reach me. Sorry.
Send E-mail to: domain: hashkedim dot com, username: stan.


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Verio (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: tim.timmins@bcs.org.uk                            27-Nov-99 19:59:10
  To: All                                               27-Nov-99 16:56:12
Subj: Re: Java 1.2 for OS/2

From: Tim Timmins <tim.timmins@bcs.org.uk>

looks like the 2nd quarter of the 3rd millennium to me...


Regards,
Tim

Stan Goodman wrote:

> On Sat, 27 Nov 1999 16:38:56, gczerw@home.No-Spam.com (George Czerw) wrote:
>
> > On Sat, 27 Nov 1999 15:22:30, Thomas Kellerer
> > <Thomas.Kellerer@tps-labs.com> wrote:
> >
> > > Does anybody know if and when IBM will release a Java 1.2 for OS/2???
> > Looks like maybe no 1.2 release, but 1.3 in 2Q2000!
>
> Is that the second quarter of the millenium?
>
> >
> > Check out the following:
> >
> > http://www.ibm.com/java/jdk/other/portingplans.html
> >
> > George
>
> -------------
> Stan Goodman
> Qiryat Tiv'on
> Israel
>
> E-mail sent to l_luciano@da.mob will, of course, not reach me. Sorry.
> Send E-mail to: domain: hashkedim dot com, username: stan.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bandyo_nospam@all.wam.umd.edu                     27-Nov-99 16:35:15
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 00:25:05
Subj: Re: Internet connection

From: Sushenjit Bandyopadhyay <bandyo_nospam@all.wam.umd.edu>

Thanks John, but I don't know much about TCP/IP and I don't have a 
lan.  The only connection is dial-up to the internet.

My setup.cmd reads:

route -fh
ifconfig lo 127.0.0.1
REM ifconfig lan0 
REM ifconfig lan1 
REM ifconfig lan2 
REM ifconfig lan3 
REM ifconfig lan4 
REM ifconfig lan5 
REM ifconfig lan6 
REM ifconfig lan7 
REM ifconfig sl0  
ipgate off

thanks anyway.

Sushenjit

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Original Message <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

On 11-27-99, 8:23:05 AM, John Youells 
<jyouells@lifestream.microserve.com> wrote regarding Re: Internet 
connection:

> this might not be helpful but after having routing problems with Injoy 
on a
> Warp3 ((RED) FP 40 and some 'unusual' tcp/ip and MPTS upgrades) 
ipgating to a
> Warp 4  4.1 TCP/IP I was getting dropped connections between the 2 
machines
> after some idle time. Researched some old archive messages on the same 
problem
> and found out that I needed to rem out a line in the 
X:\MPTN\BIN\SETUP.CMD that
> the TCP/IP config puts there ( see below)

> setup.cmd
> route -fh
> REM arp -f
> ifconfig lo 127.0.0.1
> ifconfig lan0 192.168.0.10 netmask 255.255.255.0
> REM ifconfig lan1
> REM ifconfig lan2
> REM ifconfig lan3
> REM ifconfig lan4
> REM ifconfig lan5
> REM ifconfig lan6
> REM ifconfig lan7
> REM ifconfig sl0
> route add default 192.168.0.1 -netmask 255.255.255.255 -hopcount 1
> REM  REM the next line out and add -hopcount 1 to the previous line
> REM route add -net 192.168.0 192.168.0.1 -netmask 255.255.255.0 
-hopcount 1
> ipgate off

> This produces a more resonable routing table that doesn't grow with 
all sorts of
> internet routes in it ( and I don't loose connections between the warp 
3 and
> warp 4 machines now....

> this is the table now:

> [D:\]netstat -ar
>   destination             router                netmask     metric 
flags intrf

> 0                      192.168.0.1            255.255.255.255   1  
UGSP   lan0
> 127.0.0.1              127.0.0.1              255.255.255.255   0    
UH     lo
> 192.168                192.168.0.10           255.255.255.0     0    
UC   lan0
> addr 127.0.0.1 Interface 9 mask 0xff000000 broadcast 127.0.0.1
> Multicast addrs:
>  xxx.x.x.1

> addr 192.168.0.10 Interface 0 mask 0xffffff00 broadcast 192.168.0.255
> Multicast addrs:
>  xxx.x.x.1 (ISP's gateway)



> Hope it helps,


> John Youells
> LifeStream Computing



--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: University of Maryland, College Park (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bandyo_nospam@all.wam.umd.edu                     27-Nov-99 16:35:09
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 00:25:05
Subj: Re: Internet connection

From: Sushenjit Bandyopadhyay <bandyo_nospam@all.wam.umd.edu>

Thanks Lorne, I have tried using route delete option for 0.0.0.0 but 
it gives an error message like "Can't delete an existing interface" or 
some such thing.  Since the problem itself is not reproducible but it 
happens sometimes, I don't have the exact error message.

Any suggestions welcome.

Thanks

Sushenjit

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Original Message <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<

On 11-27-99, 12:07:11 AM, lsunley@mb.sympatico.ca (Lorne Sunley) wrote 
regarding Re: Internet connection:


> If there is a route you want to delete you can use
> the "route" command to delete it.

> I have no idea if this will work, but it's worth a try.

> The syntax can be displayed by typing "route -?"

> Lorne Sunley

> On Fri, 26 Nov 1999 15:03:54, Sushenjit Bandyopadhyay
> <bandyo_nospam@all.wam.umd.edu> wrote:

> > I have a similar problem with the PPP internet connection.  After a
> > few days of dialup working perfectly, one day it would stop working.
> > I think its a router problem, but I don't know how to fix it.  A
> > reboot does it, but there has to be a better way.  When the problem
> > occurs, a
> > "netstat -ar"  gives the following result:
> >
> > [E:\]netstat -ar
> >
> >   destination         router          netmask   refcnt   use  flags
> > snmp intrf
> >
> > metric
> >         default     128.8.3.105         0.0.0.0    0      110  UG
> >  0  ppp0
> >       127.0.0.1       127.0.0.1 255.255.255.255    0     5484  UH
> >  0  lo
> >     128.8.3.105     128.8.23.30 255.255.255.255    1        0  UH
> >  0  ppp0
> >
> > addr            0.0.0.0 interface 10 mask 0  broadcast
> > 0.0.0.0
> > addr        128.8.23.30 interface 10 mask ffff0000  broadcast
> > 128.8.3.105
> > addr          127.0.0.1 interface 0 mask ff000000  broadcast
> > 127.0.0.1
> >
> >
> > the fourth line with addr  0.0.0.0 gets added when the problem occurs.
> > How do I correct this?
> >
> > Thank you in advance.
> >
> > Sushenjit
> >




--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: University of Maryland, College Park (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: agi@direct.ca                                     27-Nov-99 14:07:25
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 00:25:05
Subj: Re: 4.61 Questions 

From: Alan Ianson <agi@direct.ca>

Ron Gibson wrote:

> I have some questions about 4.61
>
> 1) Is it out of Beta?

I believe it is a full release version.

> 2) That said are the roaches out?

Hehe, I haven't found any, but I've only used it for a short time. I've
installed the javainrt.exe with it and it's running like a real
charmer.. :)

> 3) Does the multimedia work without breaking WinOS2

I don't have WinOS2 myself, so I'm not sure about that.

>
> 4) Will it run on Warp 3, FP40

Yes, it runs on my 486 DX2/66 with 16 Megs running Warp 3, FP40! The
install froze up on me after it completed though, don't know if it'll do
that to you though.

 Ttyl :-),
             Al




--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: via Internet Direct - http://www.mydirect.com/ (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: tomfred@xibm.net                                  27-Nov-99 23:36:28
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 00:25:05
Subj: Re: SPAM technical question

From: Tom <tomfred@xibm.net>

On 30 Oct 1999 00:00:00 GMT, in message
<WiQtt4WDEbXf-pn2-Ld1dprEW08ee@vcn24.pm3-1.chey.wy.vcn.com>,
(Annie K.)<piquant00@uswestmail.net> wrote:
----------------------------------------------------------------------
 From: (Annie K.) <piquant00@uswestmail.net>
 Subject: Re: SPAM technical question
 Date: 30 Oct 1999 00:00:00 GMT
 Message-ID: <WiQtt4WDEbXf-pn2-Ld1dprEW08ee@vcn24.pm3-1.chey.wy.vcn.com>
 Newsgroups: comp.os.os2.misc
 
 
 
 On Fri, 29 Oct 1999 23:55:33, lifedata@xxvol.com wrote:
 
 :Is it possible to reach the abuse@ department if a spam carries only a
domain
 :number?
 
  Use nslookup.exe to determine the domain of the particular IP number.
 
 -- 
 Klaatu barada nikto
 
======================================================================
Right or wrong it's my song:



::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
Captain Nemo            He that commands the sea is at great liberty,
Submarine Nautilus      and may take as much and as little as he will.         
                                    

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: FlashNet Communications, http://www.flash.net (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: mcbrides@erols.com                                27-Nov-99 14:27:01
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 00:25:05
Subj: Re: Java 1.2 for OS/2

From: mcbrides@erols.com (Jerry McBride)

In article <pSKGC2YPsbY6-pn2-0688QFE7dGDM@cc185270-a.burl1.nj.home.com>,
gczerw@home.No-Spam.com (George Czerw) wrote:
>On Sat, 27 Nov 1999 15:22:30, Thomas Kellerer
><Thomas.Kellerer@tps-labs.com> wrote:
>
>> Does anybody know if and when IBM will release a Java 1.2 for OS/2???
>>
>> Regards
>> Thomas
>
>
>Looks like maybe no 1.2 release, but 1.3 in 2Q2000!
>
>Check out the following:
>
>http://www.ibm.com/java/jdk/other/portingplans.html
>

That and the announcement of these offerings being placed on a "pay as you go"
program... I would say that for most of us the JDK1.2 will be unavailable on
OS/2.

However, a most excellent alternative exists in the form of Linux and the JDK
1.2 from Blackdown. The combination runs quite nicely and you get access to
the
uptodate features of JDK1.2 NOW... not on IBM's schedule or billing...


--

*******************************************************************************

*            Sometimes, the BEST things in life really ARE free...           
*
*       Get a FREE copy of NetRexx 1.151 for your next java project at:      
*
*                                                                            
*
*                      GET IT NOW! WHILE IT'S STILL FREE!                    
*
*                                                                            
*
*                     http://www2.hursley.ibm.com/netrexx                    
*
*******************************************************************************


/----------------------------------------\
| From the desktop of: Jerome D. McBride |
|         mcbrides@erols.com             |
\----------------------------------------/

--

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: TEAM-NETREXX (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: jpedone_nospam@flash.net                          28-Nov-99 00:16:15
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 00:25:05
Subj: Re: call me a dope

From: jpedone_nospam@flash.net

In <dxKndd8YehcW-pn2-qv0Z7SkldBCK@cx342824-a.dt1.sdca.home.com>,
admin@hotmail.com (Edmond Dantes) writes:
>I know you can do it but I can't find it in the online docs.  I can't 
>find
>anything there anyway.
>
>How do I toggle between a full screen and windowed dos session?
>

ALT+HOME - for a full listing see the help index and look under keys.

 
J. Pedone
jpedone@flash.net
http://www.flash.net/~jpedone
 
You're throwing it all out the Windows!
But I forgot all about the Amnesia Conference!!

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: FlashNet Communications, http://www.flash.net (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rcrane@octa4.net.au                               28-Nov-99 00:50:25
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 00:25:05
Subj: Re: To Martin Nisshagen -- Re: Who runs this country?

From: rcrane@octa4.net.au (Richard A Crane)

On Fri, 12 Nov 1999 19:48:08, "Gerry Britton" 
<gbritton@!britton.dhs.org> wrote:

> Nisshagen's a twit, and has been longer than Pounelle's been a clown. Just
> kill file him, it saves bandwidth & aggravation.
> 
NO he isn't. He is very misguided (perhaps) about OS/2 but 
he gives accurate advice (until it is a matter of OS2 versus
Win NT) in these newsgroups which I am sure has helped many.
I know it has helped me.

The lawyer in me sayes that he probably has no problem with 
reproducing Pornelles article particularly as he was 
carefull to atribute it to Jerry Pornelle.
But this superficial as the horseman is wont to say 'more 
details are required".
Richard A Crane
Barrister & Solicitor
slightly altered email (anti-spamming) rcrane AT 
octa4.net.au 
OR rcrane AT attglobal.net


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Octa4 Pty Ltd (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rcrane@octa4.net.au                               28-Nov-99 00:50:18
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 00:25:05
Subj: Re: looking for mainboard recommendations

From: rcrane@octa4.net.au (Richard A Crane)

On Wed, 17 Nov 1999 12:06:21, dcasey@ibm.net (Dan Casey) 
wrote:

> Athlon (AMD K7 processors) need a patch to the OS2LDR file, also from
> Dani, and also available at hobbes, in order for OS/2 to even see more
> than 64 Mb of RAM in the system. Once that patch is applied, all of
> the ram should be recognized. I say *should* because the patch has
> only been available for about 5 days, and all reports have been
> positive, so far.
> 
This is not what has been widely reported in ngs. Only SOME 
Athlon Mother Boards have had this trouble and of those that
did it appears to be those with BIOS within a certain date 
range.
Richard A Crane
Barrister & Solicitor
slightly altered email (anti-spamming) rcrane AT 
octa4.net.au 
OR rcrane AT attglobal.net

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Octa4 Pty Ltd (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rcrane@octa4.net.au                               28-Nov-99 00:51:02
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 00:25:05
Subj: Re: How much RAM does OS/2 Warp really want?

From: rcrane@octa4.net.au (Richard A Crane)

On Sun, 14 Nov 1999 21:10:02, tom <tstreet@excel.net> wrote:

> 
> 
> Richard Steiner wrote:
> 
> > OS/2 Warp 3's sweet spot was around 16MB or so, but it would gain some
> > performance at 32MB as well.  It would boot and was usable in 8MB if
> > you used something like TSHELL (no GUI).
> 
> When memory was high priced, I had it up and
> running under 4megs with the GUI JUST FINE.
> 
> Tom Street
> 920-693-2824
[snip]
I too confess to running os/2 in less than the recommended 
memory. Yes warp 3 worked in 4 mb- with a decent swapfile 
(100 Mb as I recall) and it was slow but you knew it would 
be therefore you were surprised at how fast it 'seemed".
I have also run warp with its speech recognitioon in less 
than the IBM minimum (both ram and clock speed) and the 
major factor there seemed to be my lack of an american 
accent!!

Richard A Crane
Barrister & Solicitor
slightly altered email (anti-spamming) rcrane AT 
octa4.net.au 
OR rcrane AT attglobal.net

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Octa4 Pty Ltd (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: ames@deltrak.demon.co.uk                          28-Nov-99 00:54:13
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 00:25:05
Subj: Re: Java 1.2 for OS/2

From: ames@deltrak.demon.co.uk (Andrew Stephenson)

In article <38403818.74C4FE08@bcs.org.uk>
	   tim.timmins@bcs.org.uk "Tim Timmins" writes:

> looks like the 2nd quarter of the 3rd millennium to me...

Sooner than that, I hope.  If we have to wait until 2251-2500...
--
Andrew Stephenson

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: DNS (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: wayne@SPAM.tkb.att.ne.jp                          28-Nov-99 07:53:12
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 00:25:06
Subj: Re: 4.61 Questions 

From: "Wayne Bickell" <wayne@SPAM.tkb.att.ne.jp>

On 27 Nov 1999 16:05:54 GMT, Ron Gibson wrote:

:>
:>I have some questions about 4.61
:>
:>1) Is it out of Beta?
:>2) That said are the roaches out?
:>3) Does the multimedia work without breaking WinOS2
:>4) Will it run on Warp 3, FP40?
:>
:>                      email: rgibson@ix.netcom.com
:>

1. It's been gold for a couple of months now

2. Yes and no. It's more stable than 4.04 but I and a
     few others still have the drop a download problem

3. I don't have Win-OS2 and when I did I didn't install
    the SB drivers so can't comment

4. I hear people are running it on Warp 3 with later
     fixpaks

Cheers

Wayne

******************************************************
Wayne Bickell
Tokyo, Japan
wayne@tkb.att.ne.jp
******************************************************
           Posted with PMINews 2 for OS/2
  Running on OS/2 Warp 4 (UK)  + FixPak 9
******************************************************



--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: AT&T Internet Service (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: mschmidt@home.com                                 28-Nov-99 02:39:01
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 00:25:06
Subj: 3com Elink III pnp

From: Michael Schmidt <mschmidt@home.com>

Perhaps I've forgotten some of the basics -- I cannot get Warp 4 fp12 to
install the subject card. The driver "signs on" at boot up but it isn't
really there, rmview shows no resources being used by the card, etc..
I've tried the "recognize all hw" in the hw manager setting notebook,
nada. I don't really want to do a selective install, as that generally
trashes at least my video setup. Any suggestions?

Cheers.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: @Home Network (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: furd@alum.mit.edu                                 28-Nov-99 03:33:23
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 04:44:27
Subj: Re: 3com Elink III pnp

From: "Frank Field" <furd@alum.mit.edu>

On Sun, 28 Nov 1999 02:39:03 GMT, Michael Schmidt wrote:

>Perhaps I've forgotten some of the basics -- I cannot get Warp 4 fp12 to
>install the subject card. The driver "signs on" at boot up but it isn't
>really there, rmview shows no resources being used by the card, etc..
>I've tried the "recognize all hw" in the hw manager setting notebook,
>nada. I don't really want to do a selective install, as that generally
>trashes at least my video setup. Any suggestions?

Umm, on my machine, where I *know* the card is recognized *and* used
(viz. this message) the card doesn't appear in the hardware manager list
either..  I don't think that the 3Com drivers are compliant with the standard
that would make them visible to the hardware manager in the fashion that
you are assuming would work.  Are you sure that the drivers are loading?
In which case, your problem may have more to do with protocol configuration
instead of the card at all.....




--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: djfirth@attglobal.net                             28-Nov-99 03:37:12
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 04:44:28
Subj: Help with Fix Pack install

From: djfirth@attglobal.net

Although I am an old hand at OS/2 (2.0, 2.1, Warp 3, now Warp 4) I have never
istalled a major fix pack because the OS was always stable for my
applications. I want to bring my OS/2 box up to spec. I DL'd FP12 for Warp 4
and CSF 141. I also DL'd the latest Netscape rev. I use  DOS support and
WINOS2. Is there anuthing in these installs that I should know about? Your
guidance appreciated.

Warped since 1994 ... and still happy.

Dave
djfirth@gcfn.org

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Global Network Services - Remote Access Mail & Ne
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: suprdave@aol.comAolsucks                          28-Nov-99 03:39:00
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 04:44:28
Subj: Need OS/2 web authoring program

From: suprdave@aol.comAolsucks (SUPRDAVE)

I'm looking for suggestions for a wysiwyg OS2 HTML editing program. I want one
that's basically drag and drop with lots of features, kind of like what hotdog
pro is. I'd also like it to allow previews with web explorer. I've seen
several
programs available, but I hate to download them all to try out.  

Also, I remember seeing on a home page once a graphic that said 'Designed
with/for OS/2"  Anyone know where I could get a copy of it or of something
similar?


D.B. Young.      Team OS/2!
-->this message printed on recycled disk space<--
visit the computers of yesteryear at
http://members.aol.com/suprdave/classiccmp/museum.htm
(now accepting donations!)
Delete the obvious (Aolsucks) to reply. 

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: AOL http://www.aol.com (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rjf@yyycomasia.com                                28-Nov-99 03:56:20
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 04:44:28
Subj: Re: UMAX 1220S scanner and OS/2

From: rjf@yyycomasia.com (rj friedman)

On Sun, 21 Nov 1999 16:54:40, lyn@zolotek.com (Lyn St 
George) wrote:

I have a Umax 1200S, and found that the included card was the scsi 
equivalent of a "winmodem". My only solution was to get an Adaptec 
1505 (which has a 25pin external connector, matching the Umax) and 
then run PMSane - this works well. There was a long thread some time 
ago where some people got this UDS card to work with win/os2, but 
others couldn't - it seems that the card varied slightly. Sorry, 
there's nothing better from my experience.

Do you actually have PMSane working with a UMAX scanner? 
When I tried PMSane with my UMAX 1200S, I could not get it 
to work. At the time (app 9 or so months ago), the author of
PMSane informed me that there were problems with UMAX 
scanners and the SANE program - which prompted me to 
purchase the CFM scanning software. But, I'd still 
beinterested to find out if PMSane now works with UMAX 
scanners.


________________________________________________________

[RJ]                 OS/2 - Live it, or live with it. 
rj friedman          Team ABW              
Taipei, Taiwan       rjf@yyycomasia.com 

To send email - remove the `yyy'
________________________________________________________

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: SEEDNet News Service (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rjf@yyycomasia.com                                28-Nov-99 04:36:11
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 04:44:28
Subj: Re: PC Week - Peter Coffee

From: rjf@yyycomasia.com (rj friedman)

On Thu, 25 Nov 1999 16:43:59, Bob Germer 
<bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com> wrote:

>What are "little liver pills"?

Back in the middle of this century, a company widely advertised in the
press, on radio, and on TV "Carter's Little Liver Pills". They were
supposedly a cure-all for a variety of ailments. Changes in the laws
governing OTC (Over the Counter as opposed to prescription) medications
forced them to drop the "Liver" from the name. If I remember correctly,
more CLLP's were sold than Bayer (the leading brand in the US) aspirin
tablets.


The 'defining characteristic' of Carter's Little Liver Pills
were that they came in a little glass vial, and they were 
tiny - shaped like tiny little ball bearings - and each 
little vial had what looked like "millions" of them. Which -
in my mind, at any rate, is where the expression derives 
from.


________________________________________________________

[RJ]                 OS/2 - Live it, or live with it. 
rj friedman          Team ABW              
Taipei, Taiwan       rjf@yyycomasia.com 

To send email - remove the `yyy'
________________________________________________________

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: SEEDNet News Service (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: fritzo@humboldt.net                               27-Nov-99 21:10:02
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 04:44:28
Subj: netscape quietly quitting

From: fritzo@humboldt.net(Fritz Oppliger)

NS Navigator 4.61  cheats on downloads in a most insidious way. it quietly
quits.

I know others have seen this problem.

Is this being addressed?  which chains do I rattle?

BTW I know of Autoget etc... it's just that it won't work well on warp 3
and FAT.

I'd rather see Netscape be rock solid (HA!)(please?)
 

fritzo@humboldt.net(Fritz Oppliger) KE6VDA

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: thaimann@dmreg.infi.net                           28-Nov-99 00:25:27
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 04:44:28
Subj: ZOC & Linux

From: "Terry Haimann" <thaimann@dmreg.infi.net>

Those of you who use ZOC to telnet(secure) to a Linux box, what are the
settings that you use? How do you tell ZOC what port to use?  What encryption
algorithm do you use.  So far all I can do is ping from one machine to the
other. 


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: InfiNet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rjlapham@infinet.com                              27-Nov-99 19:50:10
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 04:44:28
Subj: Re: PC Week - Peter Coffee

From: rjlapham@infinet.com (Jerry Lapham)

In <c1.2b8.2T3Jyh$059@hamei.pacbell.net>, on 11/27/99 
   at 01:29 AM, hamei@pacbell.net said:

> When we see Mr Gates and his attorneys in jail for perjury and tampering
> with evidence we'll be beginning to see equally fair treatment

Along with Bill and Hillary?

    -Jerry
-- 
============================================================
Jerry Lapham, Monroe, OH
E-Mail: rjlapham@infinet.com
Written Saturday, November 27, 1999 - 07:50 PM (EST)
============================================================
MR/2 Ice tag:  Letterman: In a poll in the New York Post, Clinton was chosen
the 2nd most evil person this millennium, and Hillary was chosen the 6th most
evil. After hearing this, Clinton was outraged and said, "That's ridiculous,
she should be 2nd and I should be 6th."

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Voyager.Net - East Lansing, MI (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: news@fenrir.demon.co.uk                           27-Nov-99 20:29:21
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 04:44:28
Subj: Re: DCITU - Digital camera image transfer utility ??

From: "Brian Morrison" <news@fenrir.demon.co.uk>

On Sat, 27 Nov 1999 01:09:45 -0500, Steve Dunning wrote:

>Does anyone know the whereabouts of this little gem?
>
>The links I've found to it from OS2SS and others are bad.
>
>It this product still available?
>

Certainly is, look at hobbes, search for dcitu using their http front
end.

Current version is 1.8g beta, works well with my C2000Z


-- 
Brian Morrison                                       news@fenrir.demon.co.uk
               to reply, change address from 'news' to 'bdm'
 ...Grim faced, cold as fishwife's fingers, he snatched from the wall
 the sickle-sharp boar tusks he used for defacing Readers' Digest....


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: The Fool and Bladder Face-Jumping Team (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: mike@lionsgate.com                                28-Nov-99 09:57:13
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 10:27:19
Subj: Re: 3com Elink III pnp

From: mike@lionsgate.com (Mike Stephen)

In message <38409460.C9E2D32@home.com> - Michael Schmidt
<mschmidt@home.com> writes:
:>
:>Perhaps I've forgotten some of the basics -- I cannot get Warp 4 fp12 to
:>install the subject card. The driver "signs on" at boot up but it isn't
:>really there, rmview shows no resources being used by the card, etc..
:>I've tried the "recognize all hw" in the hw manager setting notebook,
:>nada. I don't really want to do a selective install, as that generally
:>trashes at least my video setup. Any suggestions?
:>
:>Cheers.



Run the setup program for the elinkIII from a dos boot (it will not
run from a dos box).  Tell the setup programme that you have no modem
(even if you do).  You can also adjust the irq and io address if you
need to at this time.  Make sure you save the settings to the card,
and voila! it works.


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: M Stephen Contracting (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: luc.vanbogaert.nospam@pandora.be                  28-Nov-99 12:15:14
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 10:27:19
Subj: Re: UMAX 1220S scanner and OS/2

From: "Luc Van Bogaert" <luc.vanbogaert.nospam@pandora.be>

On 28 Nov 1999 03:56:41 GMT, rj friedman wrote:

>Do you actually have PMSane working with a UMAX scanner? 
>When I tried PMSane with my UMAX 1200S, I could not get it 
>to work. At the time (app 9 or so months ago), the author of
>PMSane informed me that there were problems with UMAX 
>scanners and the SANE program - which prompted me to 
>purchase the CFM scanning software. But, I'd still 
>beinterested to find out if PMSane now works with UMAX 
>scanners.

I'm at the point of purchasing CFM Twain for my Umax Astra 1220S. Would you
like to share your 
experiences with and comment on CFM Twain? I've been using the VistaScan
software that came with 
the scanner under WinOS/2, but the more I'm using it, the more I'm beginning
to dislike it.

Thanks,


Luc Van Bogaert

	... Don't underestimate the power of OS/2



--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: OS/2 User Group Belgium (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: DCritel@ATTGlobal.net                             28-Nov-99 07:50:26
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 10:27:19
Subj: Re: Hauppauge  advice - Thank you.

From: Dave Critelli <DCritel@ATTGlobal.net>

Thank you everyone for your suggestions and comments.
Dave


Dave Critelli wrote:

> I was thinking about picking up a Hauppauge TV card for my PC and was
> wondering which Hauppauge cards everyone was using successfully with
> Warp?
>
> Thanks.
> Dave

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Global Network Services - Remote Access Mail & Ne
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: glen@rockyhorror.Zkaroo.co.uk                     28-Nov-99 13:22:04
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 14:37:28
Subj: Re: Help with Fix Pack install

From: glen@rockyhorror.Zkaroo.co.uk (Glen D)

On Sun, 28 Nov 1999 03:37:24, djfirth@attglobal.net wrote:

> Although I am an old hand at OS/2 (2.0, 2.1, Warp 3, now Warp 4) I have
never istalled a major fix pack because the OS was always stable for my
applications. I want to bring my OS/2 box up to spec. I DL'd FP12 for Warp 4
and CSF 141. I also DL'd the latest Netscape rev. I use  DOS support and
WINOS2. Is there anuthing in these installs that I should know about? Your
guidance appreciated.
> 
> Warped since 1994 ... and still happy.
> 
> Dave
> djfirth@gcfn.org
> 

There's also a device driver fixpak available (DDPAK001).  After FP11 
IBM removed device drivers from its fixpaks and put them in a seperate
package.

Glen D
-<remove Z from my e-mail Address>-

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: RemarQ http://www.remarQ.com (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: jhimmel@i-2000.com                                28-Nov-99 13:56:04
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 14:37:28
Subj: Re: UMAX 1220S scanner and OS/2

From: jhimmel@i-2000.com (James Himmelman)

On Sun, 28 Nov 1999 11:15:28, "Luc Van Bogaert" 
<luc.vanbogaert.nospam@pandora.be> wrote:
> I'm at the point of purchasing CFM Twain for my Umax Astra 1220S.
> Would you like to share your experiences with and comment on CFM Twain?

I use CFM Twain with my UMAX Astra 1220S, and it works great.

[[[ James Himmelman - jhimmel@i-2000.com ]]]

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com                           28-Nov-99 09:41:01
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 14:37:28
Subj: Re: Java 1.2 for OS/2

From: Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com>

On <943750467snz@deltrak.demon.co.uk>, on 11/28/99 at 12:54 AM,
   ames@deltrak.demon.co.uk (Andrew Stephenson) said:

> > looks like the 2nd quarter of the 3rd millennium to me...

> Sooner than that, I hope.  If we have to wait until 2251-2500...

Now as I understand the term "quarter" when it comes to calendars, the
term refers to a period of time of 3 months. Thus the second quarter of
the third millenium would be April, May, and June of the year 2001.



--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: bobg@Pics.com
Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 12
MR/2 Ice Registration Number 67
Aut Pax Aut Bellum
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: raphaelt@netnews.worldnet.att.net                 27-Nov-99 09:33:12
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 14:37:29
Subj: Re: PC Week - Peter Coffee

From: raphaelt@netnews.worldnet.att.net (Raphael Tennenbaum)

Martin Nisshagen <forkd4nisse@dtek.chalmers.se> wrote:
>I agree. It's impossible to say anything if it was a monopoly or not by such
>OS technical discussions who is IMO totally irrelevant in that case.
>
>I personally see it from a pure ideologic and philosophical level.

Evidently.  And without much regard for the reality of the
matter.

> sheer injustice being done to this magnificent corporation:
> Microsoft appeared before a Federal judge with a hacked
> videotape -- a piece of falsified evidence, the intent of
> which was to controvert what was by MS's own contention one
> of the (if not the) pivotal issue in the case.  It's the
>
>That's a false myth spread by people like you and others (who perhaps does
>that because you are obsessed with hating Microsoft).

Hey you know, you'd better get on the horn and call the
cops, or a doctor, or something, because this "obsession"
you speak of seems to be catching.  Already the attorneys
general of 19 states as well as the DOJ are suffering from
it. 

But when you find the mythical component of this account
from the New York Times: 

"David Boies, the Justice Department's lead lawyer in the
case, showed in court that the video showing a computer
screen was actually spliced together, presenting at least
two different machines as if it were one machine being put
through its paces. The number of icons on the desktop screen
varied at different points in the video, indicating
different programs loaded on different machines." 

...I want you to call me immediately, before anyone else,
because as a journalist I will have the scoop of the
millenium.  

The story's at 

http://search.nytimes.com/search/daily/bin/fastweb?getdoc+site+site+77348+2+wAA
A+microsoft%7Evideotape%7Etrial%7Ebrowser


-- 
Ray Tennenbaum        '99 YZF-R6
readme@ http://www.ray-field.com

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: AT&T WorldNet Services (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: raphaelt@netnews.worldnet.att.net                 28-Nov-99 09:23:16
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 14:37:29
Subj: Re: PC Week - Peter Coffee

From: raphaelt@netnews.worldnet.att.net (Raphael Tennenbaum)

Martin Nisshagen <forkd4nisse@dtek.chalmers.se> wrote:
>Microsoft sought to prove its rebuttal by showing about a dozen ways in which
>either IE was still available after running Felten's program, or Windows had
>been damaged by the program. Since the Judge would not allow a live
>demonstration in the courtroom, Microsoft produced a videotape showing what
it
>said was a machine Felten's program had been run on. The videotape did show
>that Internet Explorer could still be accessed quite easily, and that parts
of
>Windows did indeed appear to be broken.
>
>Rather than attempt to refute the points made in the videotape demo, however,
>the government attacked the credibility of the videotape. They discovered
that
>one computer screen in the demo had a different number of desktop icons than
>another screen, showing that Microsoft had filmed two different machines to
>make the demo.
>
>The courtroom gasped and the judge was aghast, shocked that Microsoft would
>doctor evidence. That was how it was reported in the press and that's how it
>has been remembered ever since.
>
>But the story wasn't over. The Microsoft witness, Jim Allchin, realized that
>the demo had been made by Microsoft employees who apparently didn't
understand
>the difference between evidence and demonstration. 

Oh sure.  And Bill didn't have sex with that girl.

To save time, they had used
>two machines for the demo and edited the footage together—a common tactic
for
>trade show demonstrations.

Yeah, it's very easy to confuse the D.C. courthouse with the
Javits Center, I've made that mistake many times. 

>But as Mr. Allchin said on the stand, the demonstration still portrayed
actual
>facts. To prove this, he volunteered to work that night to make a new
>videotape for the judge, using a brand new machine and in the presence of
>Justice Department representatives. The judge agreed. The next day, Allchin
>came back to court and showed the new videotape, which both the DOJ and Dr.
>Felten had watched him make. All but one of the points Microsoft claimed in
>the first videotape were demonstrated

"Well, Your Honor, before you charge me for contempt of
court for hiring a witness to perjure himself, let me say
that I never meant for him to actually be presenting
evidence, but a demonstration.  And while I'm speaking in my
defense, let me also point out that while maybe he did lie
about my client's whereabouts on the night of the murder, in
fact it's quite true that my client was wearing a blue suit,
that he's 6'2", and he does prefer his eggs over easy.  So
you see, he was correct regarding all but one of the matters
in question."

—and the only reason that point couldn't
>be shown was that it required specialized equipment which was not available
on
>such short notice.

Wait, how complicated was this demonstration?

Really, Mr. N, who are you kidding?  Believe this bullshit
if you want.  Do you know, maybe Bill himself does, I really
wouldn't be surprised, though I don't think it bodes well
for his company if that's the case.

And before you fall back on your "like you MS-obsessed
****s," let me say I don't give a good goddamn about MS,
really I don't, they can have all the money they want.  I've
taken the time and trouble to learn to use tools that allow
me to comfortably avoid using their product.  Unfortunately
they have risen to the power of a government agency, and
their existence amounts to a kind of tax on computer users,
since it's impossible to buy a new computer without paying
for their OS in some way or another.  So as far as being
obsessed -- not one bit, in fact most everything about MS,
from the whole suit/trial/spectacle on and up -- is a bore
and a distraction and a waste of time.  That includes the
time I waste composing responses to volunteer MS flacks who
troll the OS/2 newsgroups insulting & making generalizations
about OS/2 users, spreading dumb fairy tales about this poor
unfairly treated MS -- and then back off and redirect their
posts to *advocacy.


>So Microsoft was sloppy in presenting its evidence—but it did not lie; it
was
>immediately able to prove its claims. And the government never once addressed
>the fact that Microsoft had just refuted the testimony of Dr. Felten. They
>merely cried foul play—and the press wrote it that way.
>
>This incident is typical of the government's approach to this case, which has
>consistently been focused on creating courtroom drama—and flashy
>headlines—rather than presenting facts.



-- 
Ray Tennenbaum        '99 YZF-R6
readme@ http://www.ray-field.com

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: AT&T WorldNet Services (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: jhimmel@i-2000.com                                28-Nov-99 15:28:01
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 14:37:29
Subj: Re: Java 1.2 for OS/2

From: jhimmel@i-2000.com (James Himmelman)

On Sun, 28 Nov 1999 14:41:03, Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com> 
wrote:

> On <943750467snz@deltrak.demon.co.uk>, on 11/28/99 at 12:54 AM,
>    ames@deltrak.demon.co.uk (Andrew Stephenson) said:
> 
> > > looks like the 2nd quarter of the 3rd millennium to me...
 
> > Sooner than that, I hope.  If we have to wait until 2251-2500...

> Now as I understand the term "quarter" when it comes to calendars, the
> term refers to a period of time of 3 months. Thus the second quarter of
> the third millenium would be April, May, and June of the year 2001.

Not when someone states specifically the 2nd quarter "of the 3rd 
millennium". A quarter of a millennium is 250 years. Usually, when 
referring to a quarter, it is used in conjunction with a period of 
time - as in "1rst quarter of '99", or "2nd quarter next year". If no 
time frame is offered, one year is usually understood. The time frame 
was given above, and it is a millennium.

[[[ James Himmelman - jhimmel@i-2000.com ]]]

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: lifedata@xxvol.com                                28-Nov-99 10:26:08
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 14:37:29
Subj: Re: netscape quietly quitting

From: lifedata@xxvol.com

fritzo@humboldt.net(Fritz Oppliger) said:

>NS Navigator 4.61  cheats on downloads in a most insidious way. it quietly
>quits.

>I know others have seen this problem.

>Is this being addressed?  which chains do I rattle?

This is a problem known to the Netscapce team - or at least some of them. 
I was one of several doing tests on it for them.  It was acknowledged that
there was a problem of an "all done" signal being generated for some
undetermined reason - apparently in TCP/IP.

But I suddenly stopped hearing from anyone on it.  No word if it would be
fixed or not.  Just sudden silence.

I think it is possible that the same thing is responsible for the common
problem in which a web page will start loading then stop in "mid air."

But you can't get in touch with anybody directly any more.  You have to go
through that crazy IBM problem reporting system, and they apparently merely
send out messages that you are the only one who has ever reported the
problem so they won't touch it.  I know of problems that have been reported
by several people, but they still say no one has the problem.

Jim L
Remove XX from address to Email
Crooks and kooks will get guns regardless of laws.


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: bCandid - Powering the world's discussions - http
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com                           28-Nov-99 10:32:08
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 14:37:29
Subj: Re: Java 1.2 for OS/2

From: Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com>

On <uprsNDlpp0Dh-pn2-GY9VoPrdQ13X@localhost>, on 11/28/99 at 03:28 PM,
   jhimmel@i-2000.com (James Himmelman) said:


> Not when someone states specifically the 2nd quarter "of the 3rd 
> millennium". A quarter of a millennium is 250 years. Usually, when 
> referring to a quarter, it is used in conjunction with a period of  time
> - as in "1rst quarter of '99", or "2nd quarter next year". If no  time
> frame is offered, one year is usually understood. The time frame  was
> given above, and it is a millennium.

Sorry, but quarter when speaking of time measurement has a specific
meaning. If the person meant the second fourth he or she should have so
stated.

Quarter is a word with many meanings and must be read in context. In the
context of date measurement, quarter by itself means a 3 month period of a
calendar year. In money, it means 25 cents. In battle it means giving up.
In hearldry, it means a part of a shield. In carpentry it means part of a
beam. It also means where one lives. In military supply it means where one
gets said materiel. In navigation it stands for one forth of a fathom. In
capital punishment it means part of a body. In measurement it represents 9
inches. In football (US) it stands for one of four periods of a game.

Thus, when someone wrote second quarter of the third millenium,
intelligent people read that as the second 3 months of the year 2001. If
he or she meant otherwise, then he or she did not express himself or
herself properly.

When one uses quarter refering to time measurement, one modifies it if he
or she means other than the first three, second three, third three, or
fourth three months of a standard calendar. If one is referring to a
fiscal year, one writes fiscal quarter.

Imprecise expression is the basis of the success of lawyers.

--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: bobg@Pics.com
Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 12
MR/2 Ice Registration Number 67
Aut Pax Aut Bellum
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: wnewell@ticnet.com                                28-Nov-99 09:55:22
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 14:37:29
Subj: Re: Need OS/2 web authoring program

From: Wes Newell <wnewell@ticnet.com>


SUPRDAVE wrote:

> I'm looking for suggestions for a wysiwyg OS2 HTML editing program. I want
one
> that's basically drag and drop with lots of features, kind of like what
hotdog
> pro is. I'd also like it to allow previews with web explorer. I've seen
several
> programs available, but I hate to download them all to try out.

Have you tried Netscape Composer that comes with Communicator? I used it to
create
a couple of sites (but I'm not artistic by any means). I don't think it
supports
frames, but I jusy added them manually.


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: The Internet Connection - ticnet.com (using Airne
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: fritzo@humboldt.net                               28-Nov-99 07:50:11
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 14:37:29
Subj: Re: netscape quietly quitting

From: fritzo@humboldt.net(Fritz Oppliger)

In <38414b38$1$yvsrqngn$mr2ice@news.vol.com>, on 11/28/99 
   at 10:26 AM, lifedata@xxvol.com said:


>>NS Navigator 4.61  cheats on downloads in a most insidious way. it quietly
>>quits.

>>I know others have seen this problem.

>>Is this being addressed?  which chains do I rattle?

> you can't get in touch with anybody directly any more.  You have to
>go through that crazy IBM problem reporting system, and they apparently
>merely send out messages that you are the only one who has ever reported
>the problem so they won't touch it.  I know of problems that have been
>reported by several people, but they still say no one has the problem.

Shall we get organized then? I would like to, at the very least, add my
voice to yours - there IS a problem and it is not a trivial one IMHO. So
which part of the windmill do I tilt at?

Thanks-
 

fritzo@humboldt.net(Fritz Oppliger) KE6VDA

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: nospam_n.saxon@mindspring.com                     28-Nov-99 11:03:18
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 14:37:29
Subj: Re: UMAX 1220S scanner and OS/2

From: "Nick Saxon" <nospam_n.saxon@mindspring.com>

On 28 Nov 1999 03:56:41 GMT, rj friedman wrote:

>On Sun, 21 Nov 1999 16:54:40, lyn@zolotek.com (Lyn St 
>George) wrote:
>
> I have a Umax 1200S, and found that the included card was the scsi 
> equivalent of a "winmodem". My only solution was to get an Adaptec 
> 1505 (which has a 25pin external connector, matching the Umax) and 
> then run PMSane - this works well. There was a long thread some time 
> ago where some people got this UDS card to work with win/os2, but 
> others couldn't - it seems that the card varied slightly. Sorry, 
> there's nothing better from my experience.
>
>Do you actually have PMSane working with a UMAX scanner? 
>When I tried PMSane with my UMAX 1200S, I could not get it 
>to work. At the time (app 9 or so months ago), the author of
>PMSane informed me that there were problems with UMAX 
>scanners and the SANE program - which prompted me to 
>purchase the CFM scanning software. But, I'd still 
>beinterested to find out if PMSane now works with UMAX 
>scanners.

I've been using UMAX 1220S (BTW, you've mentioned few times 1200S in the body
and 1220S in the Subject of your posting; I'm assuming 1220S is what you do
have)
for a month, with Adaptec 2940.

It runs PMSane perfectly, but I bought also CFM Twain for it promises to run
exceptionally
well with PMView v2.0 (progressive scanning). PMView v2 is on its way,
meantime CFM Twain
native application works great.

>
>
>________________________________________________________
>
>[RJ]                 OS/2 - Live it, or live with it. 
>rj friedman          Team ABW              
>Taipei, Taiwan       rjf@yyycomasia.com 
>
>To send email - remove the `yyy'
>________________________________________________________
>

Nick Saxon


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Golde Code Development (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: nospam_n.saxon@mindspring.com                     28-Nov-99 11:08:10
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 14:37:29
Subj: Re: Need OS/2 web authoring program

From: "Nick Saxon" <nospam_n.saxon@mindspring.com>

On 28 Nov 1999 03:39:00 GMT, SUPRDAVE wrote:

>I'm looking for suggestions for a wysiwyg OS2 HTML editing program. I want
one
>that's basically drag and drop with lots of features, kind of like what
hotdog
>pro is. I'd also like it to allow previews with web explorer. I've seen
several
>programs available, but I hate to download them all to try out.  
>
>Also, I remember seeing on a home page once a graphic that said 'Designed
>with/for OS/2"  Anyone know where I could get a copy of it or of something
>similar?
>
>
>D.B. Young.      Team OS/2!
>-->this message printed on recycled disk space<--
>visit the computers of yesteryear at
>http://members.aol.com/suprdave/classiccmp/museum.htm
>(now accepting donations!)
>Delete the obvious (Aolsucks) to reply. 
>

I know people to use Home Page Publisher v2.1, a WYSIWYG HTML Editor for
OS/2.
No URL handy, sorry. I've heard its homepage's moved recently. 

Nick Saxon


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Golde Code Development (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: mwalsh1@elp.rr.com                                28-Nov-99 09:31:19
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 14:37:29
Subj: Re: DCITU - Digital camera image transfer utility ??

From: "Matt Walsh" <mwalsh1@elp.rr.com>

The author Stephane Charette has a new web site.

http://charette.dyn.tj/main_apps.html

On Sat, 27 Nov 1999 20:29:42 +0000 (GMT), Brian Morrison wrote:

>On Sat, 27 Nov 1999 01:09:45 -0500, Steve Dunning wrote:
>
>>Does anyone know the whereabouts of this little gem?
>>
>>The links I've found to it from OS2SS and others are bad.
>>
>>It this product still available?
>>
>
>Certainly is, look at hobbes, search for dcitu using their http front
>end.
>
>Current version is 1.8g beta, works well with my C2000Z
>
>
>-- 
>Brian Morrison                                       news@fenrir.demon.co.uk
>               to reply, change address from 'news' to 'bdm'
> ...Grim faced, cold as fishwife's fingers, he snatched from the wall
> the sickle-sharp boar tusks he used for defacing Readers' Digest....
>
>


Matt Walsh  	OS/2 Outpost
El Paso, TX	Computin' & Shootin' in the dust.


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Time Warner Communications, El Paso TX (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: mbatey@cixno.spamco.uk                            28-Nov-99 17:01:21
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 14:37:29
Subj: Re: Netscape Communicator 4.61 install problems

From: mbatey@cixno.spamco.uk (Maurice Batey)

X-Newsreader: ProNews/2 Version 1.50 Beta 1




On Fri, 26 Nov 1999 22:13:40, Alan Ianson <agi@direct.ca> wrote:

> Although I have the 128 bit encryption version of
> > :>2.02 I can't access my bank's site.. 

Exactly the problem I've just encountered!
(I see an unbroken key bottom left when I log on to their site.)

The bank's Web site seems to check for 'version 4'.
Is there no way 2.02 can pretend to be a version 4?

Or is installing Net. Comm. the only recourse? 

(I'm ruuning WARP 4 + FP6.)

Maurice Batey
(Change "no.spam" to "." in E-mail address.)

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: CIX - Compulink Information eXchange (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: nate@lcs.mit.edu                                  28-Nov-99 17:24:24
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 16:57:22
Subj: Re: 3com Elink III pnp

From: nate@lcs.mit.edu (Nathan Liskov)

Boot up to an os2 prompt only (use the alt-f2 keey during boot).

Run the ethernet configuration programs (available from 3com web site 
if you dont have them)

In the configuration program, take the card out of PNP mode and 
configure manually.  The config program will help in picking a 
non-conflicting interrupt.  

Make sure that you configure for the used I/O if you have more than 
rj-45 i/o.

	good luck

	Nate Liskov


On Sun, 28 Nov 1999 09:57:26, mike@lionsgate.com (Mike Stephen) wrote:

> In message <38409460.C9E2D32@home.com> - Michael Schmidt
> <mschmidt@home.com> writes:
> :>
> :>Perhaps I've forgotten some of the basics -- I cannot get Warp 4 fp12 to
> :>install the subject card. The driver "signs on" at boot up but it isn't
> :>really there, rmview shows no resources being used by the card, etc..
> :>I've tried the "recognize all hw" in the hw manager setting notebook,
> :>nada. I don't really want to do a selective install, as that generally
> :>trashes at least my video setup. Any suggestions?
> :>
> :>Cheers.
> 
> 
> 
> Run the setup program for the elinkIII from a dos boot (it will not
> run from a dos box).  Tell the setup programme that you have no modem
> (even if you do).  You can also adjust the irq and io address if you
> need to at this time.  Make sure you save the settings to the card,
> and voila! it works.
> 
> 

nate@lcs.mit.edu   http://nateliskov.ne.mediaone.net = 
http://24.128.100.70

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Road Runner (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: khamlett@dgweb.com                                28-Nov-99 17:35:17
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 16:57:22
Subj: Bind Front end?

From: khamlett@dgweb.com

A while back I saw a package for use as a front end to the
OS/2 port of Bind. Unfortunately now that I need one I can't
even recall the name much less find it. Any hints appreciated!
>>>Ken<<<
khamlett@dgweb.com


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Deja.com - Before you buy. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: mail@dontwannabesued.com                          28-Nov-99 18:21:24
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 16:57:22
Subj: Re: low level hard drive format

From: mail@dontwannabesued.com (RCW)

I once went to the Quantum web site.  They had a routine for
downloading that wrote all zeroes to the whole disk.  Supposedly it
was for removing stubborn viruses.

RCW

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: bCandid - Powering the world's discussions - http
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: ames@deltrak.demon.co.uk                          28-Nov-99 18:44:01
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 16:57:23
Subj: Re: DCITU - Digital camera image transfer utility ??

From: ames@deltrak.demon.co.uk (Andrew Stephenson)

In article <oqzsraeveqrzbapbhx.flvw5i0.pminews@fenrir.demon.co.uk>
	   news@fenrir.demon.co.uk "Brian Morrison" writes:

> [...] look at hobbes, search for dcitu using their http front
> end.
>
> Current version is 1.8g beta, works well with my C2000Z

What download speed you get to OS/2 via the RS232 serial link?
Olympus do not yet seem to have heard of recent technologies like
USB or insertable microdrives.  (And, though strictly it's OT, do
your camera batteries last long?)
--
Andrew Stephenson

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: DNS (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: ames@deltrak.demon.co.uk                          28-Nov-99 19:03:09
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 16:57:23
Subj: Re: Java 1.2 for OS/2

From: ames@deltrak.demon.co.uk (Andrew Stephenson)

In article <38413f55$1$obot$mr2ice@news.pics.com>
	   bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com "Bob Germer" writes:

> On <943750467snz@deltrak.demon.co.uk>, on 11/28/99 at 12:54 AM,
>    ames@deltrak.demon.co.uk (Andrew Stephenson) said:
>
> > > looks like the 2nd quarter of the 3rd millennium to me...
>
> > Sooner than that, I hope.  If we have to wait until 2251-2500...
>
> Now as I understand the term "quarter" when it comes to calendars, the
> term refers to a period of time of 3 months. Thus the second quarter of
> the third millenium would be April, May, and June of the year 2001.

(BTW I caught your homily on meanings of "quarter".  Interesting,
though my Concise Oxford Dic'y had not encountered the "9 inches"
one.  Is this related to "giving quarter"?  The COD has a couple
of meanings you did not list.  Such a versatile word.)

What _would_ you say if you did want to mean "the second quarter
millennium of the third millennium", without being so plonky? <g>
--
Andrew Stephenson

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: DNS (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: benbowc@tui.lincoln.ac.nz                         29-Nov-99 08:58:21
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 16:57:23
Subj: Re: Java 1.2 for OS/2

From: Craig Benbow <benbowc@tui.lincoln.ac.nz>

You can't just look at the version numbers of the JDK you must look
inside!

If you look into JDK 1.1.8 from IBM you will see almost all the features
in Suns JDK 1.2 BUT IBM are not calling it 1.2 because they don't think
it is fit to be called 1.2 yet.

I have just installed 1.1.8 from IBM with the swing extensions and it
smokes!  In comparison to Suns VM on Windows JDK & JRE 1.1.8 for OS/2 is
light years ahead in speed and stability.  Don't know about you but I am
quite happy to wait to get this level of performance.

Cheers

Craig

Thomas Kellerer wrote:

> Does anybody know if and when IBM will release a Java 1.2 for OS/2???
>
> Regards
> Thomas

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Lincoln University (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: sma.spam-not@rtd.com                              28-Nov-99 20:18:23
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 16:57:23
Subj: Re: motherboard cache

From: James Moe <sma.spam-not@rtd.com>


nykisle@attglobal.net wrote:
> 
> I am considering buying an AOpen AX59Pro
> which has a 512k ot 1 meg cache.
> How much ram will 1 meg cover.
> 
    Um, 1 Meg.
    What a larger cache means is that more things are stored in fast
SRAM, the L2 cache. It is faster to retrieve stuff from cache than from
main memory. So overall the system operates faster.
    If you mean "Does a 1 meg cache store data for main memory sizes
exceeding 64 MB?", I do not know. The cache size has nothing to do with
how the MB caches memory, and how the OS interacts with the BIOS to
recognize memory extent.


-- 

sma at rtd dot com
Remove ".spam-not" for email

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Sohnen-Moe Associates, Inc (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: afjbell@onlink.net                                28-Nov-99 15:05:17
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 16:57:23
Subj: Re: Need OS/2 web authoring program

From: "Alex Bell" <afjbell@onlink.net>

On Sun, 28 Nov 1999 11:08:20 -0500 (EST), Nick Saxon wrote:

>On 28 Nov 1999 03:39:00 GMT, SUPRDAVE wrote:
>
>>I'm looking for suggestions for a wysiwyg OS2 HTML editing program. I want
one
>>that's basically drag and drop with lots of features, kind of like what
hotdog
>>pro is. I'd also like it to allow previews with web explorer. I've seen
several
>>programs available, but I hate to download them all to try out.  
>>

I use and strongly recommend Webwriter/2, which is now freeware.  Look for
Webwrite.zip

Regards, Alex


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Ontario Northland--ONLink (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: nemo@union.edu                                    28-Nov-99 14:23:19
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 16:57:23
Subj: lost sound w/ cdrw install

From: nemo@union.edu

Greetings!

I just installed a Rico CDRW and I don't know if this is connected, I've
lost sound, whether system or through the CD. 

I'm working my way through possibilities that are obvious to me like
checking orientation of cables, looking for irq conflicts although that
gets me to my question.

Aside from putting in the cable wrong, is it possible for the CDRW to
conflict with resources for the soundcard? 

I'm using SCSI and I'm still not sure I've got the jumpers set right on
the CDRW. My Tekram assigned it ID #3 although the ambiguous little schema
on the top of the drive implies it can't be set higher than ID #2. 

So, I'm fishing for tips. I guess even obvious suggestions would be
helpful since it's not obvious what's obvious.

Ricoh SCSI CDRW (not terminated; Tekram reports ID #3)
Genius Soundmaker PCI soundcard
ZIP, 2 HD'S, Seagate Tape all on SCSI

F.

-----------------------------------------------------------
      Felmon John Davis		
     davisf@union.edu	|  davisf@capital.net     
     Union College /  Schenectady, NY
     - insert standard doxastic disclaimers -
     OS/2 - ma kauft koi katz em sack 
-----------------------------------------------------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Logical Net (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: sma.spam-not@rtd.com                              28-Nov-99 20:26:17
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 16:57:23
Subj: Re: low level hard drive format

From: James Moe <sma.spam-not@rtd.com>


Daniel wrote:
> 
> ahoy,
>         Is there such at thing as a os/2 program for doing a low level
format
> of a hard disk?

    Use fdisk to delete all the partitions. Then use "format c: /l". The
/l is a "long format" which reads and writes to everywhere on the disk
looking for bad blocks. Teh default file system is FAT.

-- 

sma at rtd dot com
Remove ".spam-not" for email

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Sohnen-Moe Associates, Inc (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: sma.spam-not@rtd.com                              28-Nov-99 20:49:11
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 16:57:23
Subj: Re: ZOC & Linux

From: James Moe <sma.spam-not@rtd.com>


Terry Haimann wrote:
> 
> Those of you who use ZOC to telnet(secure) to a Linux box, what are the
> settings that you use? How do you tell ZOC what port to use?  What
encryption
> algorithm do you use.  So far all I can do is ping from one machine to the
> other.
>
    Telnet is not a secure protocol. In fact it is wide open.
    Perhaps you are thinking of SSH (Secure SHell)? Linux must be
running an ssh server for it to work.


-- 

sma at rtd dot com
Remove ".spam-not" for email

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Sohnen-Moe Associates, Inc (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: sma.spam-not@rtd.com                              28-Nov-99 21:00:14
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 16:57:23
Subj: Re: netscape quietly quitting

From: James Moe <sma.spam-not@rtd.com>


Fritz Oppliger wrote:
> 
> NS Navigator 4.61  cheats on downloads in a most insidious way. it quietly
> quits.
> 
> I know others have seen this problem.
> 
> Is this being addressed?  which chains do I rattle?
> 
    The only site that I have seen the shows this problem is IBM's. I
have had multiple downloads running from other sites without a problem.
In general I have found that mid-afternoon (MST) seems to be the best
time for IBM downloads. I have seen then quiet termination using a T1
connection to the Internet as well as a modem connection. Generally I
use FTP directly or WGET if I do not have a choice between FTP and HTTP
in Navigator; HTTP seems to be more reliable in this respect.
    There were some discussions about this, then silence after the GA
release. I get the impression it is a problem with the AIX operating
system's FTPD server, or whatever acts in that capacity (like part of a
web server). 

-- 

sma at rtd dot com
Remove ".spam-not" for email

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Sohnen-Moe Associates, Inc (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: sma.spam-not@rtd.com                              28-Nov-99 21:02:19
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 16:57:23
Subj: New modem list

From: James Moe <sma.spam-not@rtd.com>

Hello,
    Does anyone know where I can find a current modem init string list?
It used to be known as MODEM.IAK. The list I have is rather dated and
does not have *any* 56K modems listed.


-- 

sma at rtd dot com
Remove ".spam-not" for email

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Sohnen-Moe Associates, Inc (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rjfreem@ibm.net                                   23-Nov-99 09:22:05
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 19:47:01
Subj: Re: Pmmerge variations

From: rjfreem@ibm.net

In <AOl_3.14317$ss3.535330@typhoon.nyroc.rr.com>, on 11/23/99 
   at 01:08 AM, cotroneo@stny.rr.com said:

>In <newraerzbirguvfunpbzay.fllqw40.pminews@news.hacom.nl>, "Arjen Meijer"
><arjen@removethis.hacom.nl> writes: >On Sun, 21 Nov 1999 14:57:50 -0500
>(EST), /2 User wrote:
>>

I downloaded the file yesturday and isntalled on two machines. So far no
problems. The zip file may have been corrupted during the download.
RJF


>>:>Where can I get the latest Pmmerge.dll? That has been my most famous error
>>:>messages so far and sometimes even locked up WPS.
>>
>>Where did you find the 11-20-99 version?
>>testcase.bolder.ibm.com under /ps/fromibm/os2. 
>>
>>A very good pmmerge.dll version can be downloaded from:
>>ftp://protein.bio.msu.su/pub/os2/fixes/pmr00052.zip
>>
>>Arjen
>>
>>
>>

>The zip file on that site is corrupt.

>Keith Cotroneo
>cotroneo@stny.rr.com


-- 
-----------------------------------------------------------
rjfreem@ibm.net
-----------------------------------------------------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Global Network Services - Remote Access Mail & Ne
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: jhimmel@i-2000.com                                28-Nov-99 22:16:02
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 19:47:01
Subj: Re: Java 1.2 for OS/2

From: jhimmel@i-2000.com (James Himmelman)

On Sun, 28 Nov 1999 15:32:16, Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com> 
wrote:
> On <uprsNDlpp0Dh-pn2-GY9VoPrdQ13X@localhost>, on 11/28/99 at 03:28 PM,
>    jhimmel@i-2000.com (James Himmelman) said:

> > Not when someone states specifically the 2nd quarter "of the 3rd 
> > millennium". A quarter of a millennium is 250 years. Usually, when 
> > referring to a quarter, it is used in conjunction with a period of  time
> > - as in "1rst quarter of '99", or "2nd quarter next year". If no  time
> > frame is offered, one year is usually understood. The time frame  was
> > given above, and it is a millennium.

> Sorry, but quarter when speaking of time measurement has a specific
> meaning. If the person meant the second fourth he or she should have so
> stated.

So if I said to you "It's been that way for the last quarter of a 
century" (very common usage), you would think it's been that way for 
the last 3 months?
 
> Quarter is a word with many meanings and must be read in context. In the
> context of date measurement, quarter by itself means a 3 month period of a
> calendar year.

Right, but he did not use "quarter" by itself. He said the second 
quarter of the next millennium.

> Thus, when someone wrote second quarter of the third millenium,
> intelligent people read that as the second 3 months of the year 2001.

No, intelligent people know that a quarter of a millennium is 250 yrs.

> he or she meant otherwise, then he or she did not express himself or
> herself properly. 
> When one uses quarter refering to time measurement, one modifies it if he
> or she means other than the first three, second three, third three, or
> fourth three months of a standard calendar. If one is referring to a
> fiscal year, one writes fiscal quarter.

Exactly, and since he modified it with the word "millennium", it is 
reasonable to assume quarter is dividing the millennium into 4 equal 
parts. If he did not intend to divide the millennium, than he should 
have simply said the 2nd quarter of next year. The fact that he 
specifically said "millennium" instead of "next year" could indicate 
that he specifically did NOT want to imply only 3 months. You will 
have to admit that, at the very least, his wording is open to 
interpretation. Either interpretation could be supported by common 
language usage and meanings.

Just because the use of the word "quarter" as a 3 month time frame is 
common usage, it does NOT mean that the word can't be used to mean 
other periods of time. If someone states that "it's been that way for 
the last quarter of this millennium", I would assume that he meant the
last 250 yrs, simply because he specifically chose NOT to say the much
clearer "it's been that way for the last quarter of this year" - or 
even "It's been that way for the last quarter". He went out of his way
to implicate "millennium" as the period that quarter was defining. 
"Quarter of a century" is commonly understood as one forth of 100 yrs,
and "Quarter of a millennium" can be understood to mean one forth of 
1000 yrs, even to "intelligent" people.

Just like if you said to someone "I'll give you a quarter of my weeks 
pay", he will most likely NOT be thinking 25 cents, even though you 
were talking about money.

[[[ James Himmelman - jhimmel@i-2000.com ]]]

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: glen@rockyhorror.Zkaroo.co.uk                     28-Nov-99 22:44:19
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 19:47:01
Subj: Re: Java CLASSPATH

From: glen@rockyhorror.Zkaroo.co.uk (Glen D)

On Sat, 27 Nov 1999 12:22:43, "Rade Popovic" <rascho@nospam.iname.com>
wrote:

> Hi!
> 
> Can somebody tell me what should I put in my CLASSPATH variable,
> because I don't have one, and what is it for (I know Java use it but my
> seem to work without it).
> One other thing. When updating my Java runtime I download file called
> runtime.exe. Now I have also downloaded file called os2jre.exe (from
> same directory) and in readme it says "IBM(R) OS/2 WARP RUNTIME
> ENVIRONMENT, JAVA(TM) TECHNOLOGY EDITION". os2jre.exe installs itself
> in jre11 directory. What is the difference between those two?
> 
> TIA
> 
> Rascho
> e-mail:rascho@iname.com
> ICQ# 49354974
> 
> ------------------------
> Hal 9000: "Dave, put those Windows disks down....Dave...DAVE!"
> 
> 
I recommend  you get the runtime from IBM's Software Choice site 
(http://techsupport.services.ibm.com/asd-bin/doc/en_us/catalog.htm).  
The file is JAVAINRT.EXE and comes with its own installer.


Glen D
-<remove Z from my e-mail Address>-

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: RemarQ http://www.remarQ.com (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: lifedata@xxvol.com                                28-Nov-99 18:46:19
  To: All                                               28-Nov-99 21:13:18
Subj: Re: netscape quietly quitting

From: lifedata@xxvol.com

fritzo@humboldt.net(Fritz Oppliger) said:

>Shall we get organized then? I would like to, at the very least, add my
>voice to yours - there IS a problem and it is not a trivial one IMHO. So
>which part of the windmill do I tilt at?

They've made it difficult to complain.  It's a matter of getting people to
go through the process.  To get your start you can go to:

ftp://ftp.software.ibm.com/ps/defect_submission/problem.txt

to get the instructions.

Jim L
Remove XX from address to Email
Crooks and kooks will get guns regardless of laws.


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: bCandid - Powering the world's discussions - http
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: whonea@codenet.net                                28-Nov-99 18:35:27
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 03:35:22
Subj: Re: low level hard drive format

From: whonea@codenet.net (Will Honea)

On Sat, 27 Nov 1999 00:22:25, "Daniel" <whishIcould@dontlikespam.com> 
wrote:

> thanks, I'll give /newmbr a try!   and even though it was not my original
> reason to try to do a lowlevel format, I discovered I have a virus on my
mbr.
>  Mcafee said that it found a NYB virus on my mbr and boot sector.   Would it
> have anything to do with just getting over a fight with Corel Linux over my
> mbr?   That is corel decided to stick it's stuff their so I had to run lilo
> -v I think, to get boot manager back.

That sucker is a PITA!  My son brought it in on a 'new' hard drive he 
wanted me to set up and it caused all sorts of crap - especially in 
that it blocks partition table updates.  Let McAfee clean the virus 
and tou should be OK.  I  used an older copy of McAfee from a DOS boot
disk and it got everything straightened out - but make 2 passes with 
the scanner.

Will Honea <whonea@codenet.net>

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: sdgreen.msn@attcanada.net                         29-Nov-99 04:49:02
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 03:35:22
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: "Stephen Green" <sdgreen.msn@attcanada.net>

The poor guy would probably be contravening some WTO law against single
sourcing in one state !!!


"Bob Germer" <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com> wrote in message
news:383d3aa9$5$obot$mr2ice@news.pics.com...
> On <zozo83o366.8n.uno@sage.40th.com>, on 11/24/99 at 04:05 PM,
>    uno@40th.com (uno@40th.com) said:
>
>
> > Also perfectly legal here.  There are anti-discrimination laws on the
> > books here, so I -can't- not sell to you based on, say, your race|color.
> > However, if, say, you're just way too fat, I -can- refuse to sell you
> > more cookies.  Basically, over here, anything that isn't expressly
> > against the law is perfectly legal.
>
> Tell that to the restaurant owner in Philadelphia who were fined because
> they refused service to a blind couple because they had guide dogs. Tell
> that to the merchant in Philadelphia who was fined because he refused to
> sell condoms to gays.
>
> The courts more and more extend anti-discrimination statutes based on
> "legislative intent" rather than the specific wording in the written law.
>
> And as far as price discrimination goes, a merchant operating entirely
> within one state apparently is not covered by the Federal law covering
> companies engaged in interstate commerce. However, the Supreme Court of
> the US has expanded the meaning of interstate commerce so far as to make
> anyone in business subject, even Pizza parlors since the ingredients they
> use were made out of state.
>
> About the only way a pizza parlor would be exempt from Federal regulation
> today would be if he built his store out of wood from trees grown in New
> Jersey and bricks he made himself from local mud baked in a New Jersey
> cave using New Jersey grown wood for the fire, raised his own wheat,
> tomatoes, and whatever else goes into his sauce, raised his own cows
> purely on New Jersey pasture and made his own cheese, got his salt from
> drying New Jersey saltwater, etc. He wouldn't be able to use boxes, would
> have to have a wood fired oven since electricity and gas are interstate
> activities, and make his own wooden spatulas, spoons, etc.
>
> Even then he would be in trouble since undoubtedly his wood burning oven
> would be in violation of EPA rules against air pollution. For good or ill,
> the concept of a purely state matter has been all but eliminated by a
> combination of congressional acts and court rulings.
>
> --
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------
> Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: bobg@Pics.com
> Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 12
> MR/2 Ice Registration Number 67
> Aut Pax Aut Bellum
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------------------
>
>


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: larso@commodore.                                  29-Nov-99 08:21:02
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 10:04:15
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg)

As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw Jerry Prather write:
> (Lars P Ormberg) writes:

> :>"Open to the public" is a farce.  A person's property should only be open
to
> :>whomever they want it to be open for...likewise, only received by those
who
> :>wish to receive it.
> 
> Being a rock hard conservative, politically, I'd like to agree
> with you.  But we have this little problem with laws and
> government.  Until we manage to get out from under the burden of
> an overweaning government, we have to live with those laws.
> 
> The problem with M$ is that they are not living by those laws. 
> M$ _is_ forcing me to "eat at their restaurant". 

How?  Does MS send people to your home, tie up your family, hold a match
over a gas canister, and force you to sign on the dotted line for Windows
2000?

-- 
Lars P. Ormberg     ICQ#:8827066
mailto:larso@ualberta.ca
The University of Lars:   http://www.ualberta.ca/~larso/

"The way you're bathed in light, reminds me of that night
God laid me down into your rose garden of trust and I was
swept away with nothin' left to say some helpless fool
yeah I was lost in a swoon of peace you're all I need to
find so when the time is right come to me sweetly, come
to me come to me..love will lead us, alright.  love will
lead us, she will lead us.  can you hear the dolphin's
cry?  see the road rise up to meet us its in the air we
breathe tonight love will lead us, she will lead us"
                            -Live, "The Dolphin's Cry"

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: PowerSurfr - High Speed Internet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: larso@commodore.                                  29-Nov-99 08:22:06
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 10:04:15
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg)

As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw Bennie Nelson write:
> Jerry Prather wrote:

> > The problem with M$ is that they are not living by those laws.
> > M$ _is_ forcing me to "eat at their restaurant".  I have to buy
> > their fried chicken/windows even though I immediately do a Format
> > C: when I get home.   ...and just try to get your money back when
> > you tell them that you don't want it!  This is what is in
> > restraint of trade - I don't have a choice!
> 
> The main problem is being obscured by examples that do not apply.  MS
> is a MONOPOLY.

No, it isn't.

> When a business becomes a monopoly

Unless government gives it a hand, a business cannot become a monopoly.

> the media; all of the utterances from the MS PR Machine are meant to
> obfuscate these truths as specified in Judge Jackson's Findings of
> Fact:

The finding of fact is comprised of fiction.

-- 
Lars P. Ormberg     ICQ#:8827066
mailto:larso@ualberta.ca
The University of Lars:   http://www.ualberta.ca/~larso/

"The way you're bathed in light, reminds me of that night
God laid me down into your rose garden of trust and I was
swept away with nothin' left to say some helpless fool
yeah I was lost in a swoon of peace you're all I need to
find so when the time is right come to me sweetly, come
to me come to me..love will lead us, alright.  love will
lead us, she will lead us.  can you hear the dolphin's
cry?  see the road rise up to meet us its in the air we
breathe tonight love will lead us, she will lead us"
                            -Live, "The Dolphin's Cry"

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: PowerSurfr - High Speed Internet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: larso@commodore.                                  29-Nov-99 08:22:17
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 10:04:15
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg)

As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw Bob Germer write:
> On <81f1ih$ojn$5@dagger.ab.videon.ca>, on 11/23/99 at 09:39 PM,
>    larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) said:
> 
> > "Open to the public" is a farce.  A person's property should only be
> > open to whomever they want it to be open for...likewise, only received
> > by those who wish to receive it.
> 
> You may consider it a farce. It is the law of the land in the United
> States.

Yes.  So much for "home of the free".

-- 
Lars P. Ormberg     ICQ#:8827066
mailto:larso@ualberta.ca
The University of Lars:   http://www.ualberta.ca/~larso/

"The way you're bathed in light, reminds me of that night
God laid me down into your rose garden of trust and I was
swept away with nothin' left to say some helpless fool
yeah I was lost in a swoon of peace you're all I need to
find so when the time is right come to me sweetly, come
to me come to me..love will lead us, alright.  love will
lead us, she will lead us.  can you hear the dolphin's
cry?  see the road rise up to meet us its in the air we
breathe tonight love will lead us, she will lead us"
                            -Live, "The Dolphin's Cry"

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: PowerSurfr - High Speed Internet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: fisa@jet.uk                                       29-Nov-99 08:51:02
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 10:04:15
Subj: QUESTION: OBJECTDESKTOP ON WSEB?

From: filippo sartori <fisa@jet.uk>

HI
I tried to install Object Desktop 2.0 on Workspace for e-business.
I failed. Did anybody succeeded?
Is it incompatible?

Regards

Filippo Sartori

Please mail me also.

Thanks


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: UUNET WorldCom server (post doesn't reflect views
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: domi@kenavo.NOSPAM.fi                             29-Nov-99 07:07:03
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 10:04:15
Subj: Re: Bind Front end?

From: domi@kenavo.NOSPAM.fi (Dominique Pivard)

On Sun, 28 Nov 1999 17:35:34, khamlett@dgweb.com wrote:

> A while back I saw a package for use as a front end to the
> OS/2 port of Bind. Unfortunately now that I need one I can't
> even recall the name much less find it. Any hints appreciated!

Hmm, I'm not aware of any. Maybe you meant ServerConfig/2, but AFAIK 
it's a front end to configure Apache, IPS and IBM Firewall.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: None!! (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: radu_trm@yahoo.com                                29-Nov-99 10:45:27
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 10:04:15
Subj: Re: The ATI RAge Fury Pro card

From: radu <radu_trm@yahoo.com>

This is from ATI's page:
"Technical Support has been informed by ATI Marketing that there are no plans
to develop Rage 128 drivers for OS/2.
The standard VGA driver provided with OS/2 itself should be installed when
using a Rage 128 based product."

ScitechSoft (http://www.scitechsoft.com/sdd_hrdw_os2.html) have support for
Rage 128 chip. You have to "try and buy" from Scitech or wait for IBM to
release the light version of the driver from Scitech (read more on this at
http://www.scitechsoft.com/in_press22.html )

In linux the card will only work with a X server from SUSE, not included in
the
std 3.3.5 distribution. As Holger Veit (the man who ported XFree86 to OS/2)
says, it will be included in 3.3.6. If it works with 3.3.6 standard distrib in
Linux, it will work with XFree86/2, too.

Richard Hinton wrote:

> November 28, 1999
>
> I stopped into a computer discounter yesterday and saw this ATI Rage Fury
> Pro card with 32 megs of
> video ram.  I was curious if it ran in OS-2 version 4?   I  suspect it will
> run in Win98, and maybe in Linux,
> but not sure....
> I stopped at the OS-2 device driver page and looked at thes "GRADD" drivers
> which work on
> the "RAGE" family of chips, among others, but don't know if that includes
> the newest one...
>
> Richard N. Hinton
> rhinton@mediaone.net

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: EUnet Romania (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: glend@nospam.direct.ca                            29-Nov-99 01:46:24
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 10:04:16
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: Glenn Davies <glend@nospam.direct.ca>

On 29 Nov 1999 08:22:12 GMT, larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) wrote:

>As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw Bennie Nelson write:
>> Jerry Prather wrote:
>
>> > The problem with M$ is that they are not living by those laws.
>> > M$ _is_ forcing me to "eat at their restaurant".  I have to buy
>> > their fried chicken/windows even though I immediately do a Format
>> > C: when I get home.   ...and just try to get your money back when
>> > you tell them that you don't want it!  This is what is in
>> > restraint of trade - I don't have a choice!
>> 
>> The main problem is being obscured by examples that do not apply.  MS
>> is a MONOPOLY.
>
>No, it isn't.

It has been ruled to be an monopoly under US law. Which doesn't mean
it is illegal.

>
>> When a business becomes a monopoly
>
>Unless government gives it a hand, a business cannot become a monopoly.

Time to sign up for some buisness and economic classes for next term.
Business's can become a monopoly even in non-regulated industries -
visit a small town and look around sometime. 

>
>> the media; all of the utterances from the MS PR Machine are meant to
>> obfuscate these truths as specified in Judge Jackson's Findings of
>> Fact:
>
>The finding of fact is comprised of fiction.

As if you have even read it let alone understand it. Your previous
posts show that you know very little about the history of the computer
industry.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: via Internet Direct - http://www.mydirect.com/ (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: jknott@ibm.net                                    29-Nov-99 05:50:11
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 10:04:16
Subj: Re: low level hard drive format

From: jknott@ibm.net (James Knott)

In article <38418FF3.5D46AD80@rtd.com>,
James Moe <sma.spam-not@rtd.com> wrote:
>
>
>Daniel wrote:
>> 
>> ahoy,
>>         Is there such at thing as a os/2 program for doing a low level
format
>> of a hard disk?
>
>    Use fdisk to delete all the partitions. Then use "format c: /l". The
>/l is a "long format" which reads and writes to everywhere on the disk
>looking for bad blocks. Teh default file system is FAT.

That is not a low level format.  Also, how do you run format, if you 
haven't created any partitions to format?

-- 
E-mail jknott@ca.ibm.com
_________________________________________________________________________
The above opinions are my own and not those of ISM Corp., a subsidiary of
IBM Canada Ltd.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Global Network Services - Remote Access Mail & Ne
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: csaba_r@my-deja.com                               29-Nov-99 11:25:05
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 10:04:16
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: csaba_r@my-deja.com (Csaba Raduly)

larso@ualberta.ca (Lars P Ormberg) wrote in
<81td1g$9gr$1@dagger.ab.videon.ca>: 

>As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw Jerry Prather write:
>> (Lars P Ormberg) writes:
>
>> :>"Open to the public" is a farce.  A person's property should only be
>> :>open to whomever they want it to be open for...likewise, only
>> :>received by those who wish to receive it.
>> 
>> Being a rock hard conservative, politically, I'd like to agree
>> with you.  But we have this little problem with laws and
>> government.  Until we manage to get out from under the burden of
>> an overweaning government, we have to live with those laws.
>> 
>> The problem with M$ is that they are not living by those laws. 
>> M$ _is_ forcing me to "eat at their restaurant". 
>
>How?  Does MS send people to your home, tie up your family, hold a match
>over a gas canister, and force you to sign on the dotted line for
>Windows 2000?
>

No, but they say to the PC vendors: preload WinWhatever on EVERY machine 
you sell, OR ELSE we won't give you WinWhatever OEM licenses and you'll be 
out of business in no time.

If that isn't An Offer They Can't Refuse in the Don Vito Corleone style, 
then I don't know what is.

And of course PC bendors preload WinWhatever on every PC they sell, and you 
have to pay for it regardless of what you run on that machine (Linux, Be, 
OS/2, Solaris, FreeDOS, ...)

Csaba
-- 
Csaba Raduly,    Software Developer (OS/2),    Sophos Anti-Virus
mailto:csaba.raduly@sophos.com            http://www.sophos.com/
US Support +1 888 SOPHOS 9            UK Support +44 1235 559933
Life is complex, with real and imaginary parts.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: SOPHOS Plc (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com                           29-Nov-99 07:10:14
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 10:04:16
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com>

On <81td3k$9gr$2@dagger.ab.videon.ca>, on 11/29/99 at 08:22 AM,
   larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) said:

> > The main problem is being obscured by examples that do not apply.  MS
> > is a MONOPOLY.

> No, it isn't.

What are you smoking, snorting, or shooting? The U.S. Courts have
determined that MS is a monopoly.

> > When a business becomes a monopoly

> Unless government gives it a hand, a business cannot become a monopoly.

Again the question. The U.S. Government does not establish monopolies.

> > the media; all of the utterances from the MS PR Machine are meant to
> > obfuscate these truths as specified in Judge Jackson's Findings of
> > Fact:

> The finding of fact is comprised of fiction.

You are really stoned out. The finding of fact is the reasoned judgement
of a United States District Court Judge. The facts he cites are derived
from testimony given live before him.


--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: bobg@Pics.com
Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 12
MR/2 Ice Registration Number 67
Aut Pax Aut Bellum
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com                           29-Nov-99 07:13:08
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 10:04:16
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com>

On <81td4a$9gr$3@dagger.ab.videon.ca>, on 11/29/99 at 08:22 AM,
   larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) said:

> > > "Open to the public" is a farce.  A person's property should only be
> > > open to whomever they want it to be open for...likewise, only received
> > > by those who wish to receive it.
> > 
> > You may consider it a farce. It is the law of the land in the United
> > States.

> Yes.  So much for "home of the free".

You are the type of absolute insane idiot who gives Canadians a bad name.
We in the United States have more freedom than even you do. We also
respect the rights of our many minorities by requiring owners of
businesses to serve all comers regardless of race, color, creed, national
origin, marital status, etc.

One does not have to open his home to the public. The owner of a building
with less than 4 apartments may discriminate in choosing tenants so long
as the owner occupies a portion of the building.

If your country allows discrimination in public accomodations, then it is
not a free country for minorities. Your freedom requires you to only use
French on signs, in display windows, etc. in Quebec.

No American is forced to pay taxes to support an unelected head of state
who lives 3,000 miles away and only sets foot in the country every decade
or less.

And no American is required to pay for sub-standard, second rate,
government run health care whether or not he or she is willing to accept
it. There are towns from the Atlantic to the Pacific along the US-Canadian
border where US doctors are making millions of dollars a year from
Canadians who are willing to pay them for services they supposedly already
paid the Canadian government for. Medical offices are the principal
commercial activity of many small border towns. In some cases, there are
more doctors' offices than residents of the towns. 

So no one cuckholded to a Royal Family of adulterers who is forced to pay
for sub-standard health service in a country where he cannot use his
native language has any right to denigrate the United States.

--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: bobg@Pics.com
Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 12
MR/2 Ice Registration Number 67
Aut Pax Aut Bellum
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: prather@infi.net                                  29-Nov-99 12:48:00
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 10:04:16
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: prather@infi.net (Jerry Prather)

In message <81td1g$9gr$1@dagger.ab.videon.ca> - larso@commodore.
(Lars P Ormberg) writes:
:>
:>As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw Jerry Prather write:
:>> (Lars P Ormberg) writes:
:>
:>> :>"Open to the public" is a farce.  A person's property should only be
open to
:>> :>whomever they want it to be open for...likewise, only received by those
who
:>> :>wish to receive it.
:>> 
:>> Being a rock hard conservative, politically, I'd like to agree
:>> with you.  But we have this little problem with laws and
:>> government.  Until we manage to get out from under the burden of
:>> an overweaning government, we have to live with those laws.
:>> 
:>> The problem with M$ is that they are not living by those laws. 
:>> M$ _is_ forcing me to "eat at their restaurant". 
:>
:>How?  Does MS send people to your home, tie up your family, hold a match
:>over a gas canister, and force you to sign on the dotted line for Windows
:>2000?

Lars, I was going to respond to this with a flame that you should
have read the rest of my post before replying so knee-jerkily,
but in reading other people's responses, I found that I didn't
have to.  Your logic flaws have been well pointed out - or is it
your source of income that is being identified????


Jerry Prather                    prather@infi.net

"Many religions are worth dying for; no religion is worth killing
for."
					- Me (circa 1998)

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: infi.net (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: cocke@catherders.com                              29-Nov-99 06:26:05
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 10:04:16
Subj: Re: QUESTION: OBJECTDESKTOP ON WSEB?

From: Michael W. Cocke <cocke@catherders.com>

What's "Workspace for e-business"?  If you meant "Warp Server for 
E-Business", I've installed OD 2.0 on it.  It doesn't work real well - 
there's a real nifty way to crash a WSeB system dead in it (use Object 
Navigator) - but most of it works.  Stardock doesn't want to hear about 
it, so I don't want to hear about Stardock anymore.




On Mon, 29 Nov 1999 08:51:05 +0000, filippo sartori wrote:

>HI
>I tried to install Object Desktop 2.0 on Workspace for e-business.
>I failed. Did anybody succeeded?
>Is it incompatible?
>
>Regards
>
>Filippo Sartori
>
>Please mail me also.
>
>Thanks
>
>
>

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Please note:  My Email and web page addresses are changing in January
2000.
                     The new email address is cocke@catherders.com   
                      The web page is at http://www.catherders.com

                    Because network administration is like herding cats.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------



--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: UseNet Server, Inc.  http://www.usenetserver.com 
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: thaimann@dmreg.infi.net                           29-Nov-99 06:34:24
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 10:04:16
Subj: Re: ZOC & Linux

From: "Terry Haimann" <thaimann@dmreg.infi.net>

I'm sorry, I meant to say secure shell.  The thing is I'm not quite sure if
it is running telnet and I just can't connect or if it is running ssh and the
connection is being refused.  I looked at the etc/services file and found
some lines with telnet in them:

telnet		23/tcp
rtelnet		107/tcp
rtelnet		107/udp

Thx for your assistance,		Terry

On Sun, 28 Nov 1999 20:49:23 GMT, James Moe wrote:

>
>
>Terry Haimann wrote:
>> 
>> Those of you who use ZOC to telnet(secure) to a Linux box, what are the
>> settings that you use? How do you tell ZOC what port to use?  What
encryption
>> algorithm do you use.  So far all I can do is ping from one machine to the
>> other.
>>
>    Telnet is not a secure protocol. In fact it is wide open.
>    Perhaps you are thinking of SSH (Secure SHell)? Linux must be
>running an ssh server for it to work.
>
>
>-- 
>
>sma at rtd dot com
>Remove ".spam-not" for email



--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: InfiNet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: DLaRue@NetSRQ.Com                                 29-Nov-99 12:37:15
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 10:04:16
Subj: Re: DCITU - Digital camera image transfer utility ??

From: DLaRue@NetSRQ.Com (David LaRue)

  Andrew,

  The unregistered DCITU is limited to 9600 baud.  The registered version is
limited by the factors of your Camera and PC combination.  The highest speed
on the transfer rate menu is 230,400 baud.  I can reliably use that setting 
between my Kodak DC265 and P-III 500Mhz machine.  The DC260 and my 486DX2 66
was limited to about 115K baud.  I think the registration is $30.  It was well 
worth
it to me.  I've since moved on to PCMCIA but still use DCITU for serial
support
at times.  You could also write the author at charette@writeme.com and see
if he has a reported best speed for the camera.

  Enjoy,

  David LaRue

In <943814643snz@deltrak.demon.co.uk>, ames@deltrak.demon.co.uk (Andrew
Stephenson) writes:
>In article <oqzsraeveqrzbapbhx.flvw5i0.pminews@fenrir.demon.co.uk>
>	   news@fenrir.demon.co.uk "Brian Morrison" writes:
>
>> [...] look at hobbes, search for dcitu using their http front
>> end.
>>
>> Current version is 1.8g beta, works well with my C2000Z
>
>What download speed you get to OS/2 via the RS232 serial link?
>Olympus do not yet seem to have heard of recent technologies like
>USB or insertable microdrives.  (And, though strictly it's OT, do
>your camera batteries last long?)
>--
>Andrew Stephenson
>

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: bCandid - Powering the world's discussions - http
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rjf@yyycomasia.com                                29-Nov-99 12:40:27
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 10:04:16
Subj: Re: UMAX 1220S scanner and OS/2

From: rjf@yyycomasia.com (rj friedman)

On Sun, 28 Nov 1999 11:15:28, "Luc Van Bogaert" 
<luc.vanbogaert.nospam@pandora.be> wrote:

I'm at the point of purchasing CFM Twain for my Umax Astra 1220S. Would you
like to share your 
experiences with and comment on CFM Twain?

I'm really quite happy with it - I use it in conjunction 
with PMView, and they really work well together. After 
scanning into PMView I find I have to correct the gamma - 
almost always by a factor of +2 - and once I do that, the 
results are excellent.



________________________________________________________

[RJ]                 OS/2 - Live it, or live with it. 
rj friedman          Team ABW              
Taipei, Taiwan       rjf@yyycomasia.com 

To send email - remove the `yyy'
________________________________________________________

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: SEEDNet News Service (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rjf@yyycomasia.com                                29-Nov-99 12:46:25
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 10:04:16
Subj: Re: UMAX 1220S scanner and OS/2

From: rjf@yyycomasia.com (rj friedman)

On Sun, 28 Nov 1999 16:03:37, "Nick Saxon" 
<nospam_n.saxon@mindspring.com> wrote:

I've been using UMAX 1220S (BTW, you've mentioned few times 1200S in the body
and 1220S in the Subject of your posting; I'm assuming 1220S is what you do
have)...

Actually - even though the subject is 1220, I was responding
with my experience with the 1200, which is what I have. I 
don't think the they are all that much different -  just one
is a little newer model (but what do I know).


It runs PMSane perfectly...

Hmmm... Maybe they got the problem worked out with the newer
versions of PMSane - I'll have to give it another look. 
Thanks for the info.


 but I bought also CFM Twain for it promises to run
exceptionally
well with PMView v2.0 (progressive scanning). PMView v2 is on its way,
meantime CFM Twain
native application works great.

I've been using the betas of the upcoming release of PMView 
v2.0, and it works very, very, nicely with CFM.


________________________________________________________

[RJ]                 OS/2 - Live it, or live with it. 
rj friedman          Team ABW              
Taipei, Taiwan       rjf@yyycomasia.com 

To send email - remove the `yyy'
________________________________________________________

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: SEEDNet News Service (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: mcbrides@erols.com                                29-Nov-99 07:09:12
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 10:04:16
Subj: Re: rawrite error message

From: mcbrides@erols.com (Jerry McBride)

In article <c1.2b8.2T3KGv$05A@hamei.pacbell.net>, hamei@pacbell.net wrote:

-- snip --

>
>there's also an "rawrite2" that is linked from the Apple page for
>downloading NeXT drivers. It worked fine in an OS/2 DOS window
>to create two NeXT floppy images, and has some improvements
>over earlier rawrites.
>
>sorry I don't have the URL at hand, but try www.apple.com, head
>for the NeXT information, the additional device drivers diskette
>download page has a link. I believe it will work with 2.88 floppies
>as well.
>

Also... I used rawrite from COL 2.3 distribution cdrom to create the install
and modules floppy while in dos session under OS/2... worked perfectly. I can
send you a copy if you like. Just ask.


--

*******************************************************************************

*            Sometimes, the BEST things in life really ARE free...           
*
*       Get a FREE copy of NetRexx 1.151 for your next java project at:      
*
*                                                                            
*
*                      GET IT NOW! WHILE IT'S STILL FREE!                    
*
*                                                                            
*
*                     http://www2.hursley.ibm.com/netrexx                    
*
*******************************************************************************


/----------------------------------------\
| From the desktop of: Jerome D. McBride |
|         mcbrides@erols.com             |
\----------------------------------------/

--

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: TEAM-NETREXX (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: larso@commodore.                                  29-Nov-99 17:16:04
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 16:52:20
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg)

As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw Bob Germer write:
> On <81td3k$9gr$2@dagger.ab.videon.ca>, on 11/29/99 at 08:22 AM,
>    larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) said:
> 
> > > The main problem is being obscured by examples that do not apply.  MS
> > > is a MONOPOLY.
> 
> > No, it isn't.
> 
> What are you smoking, snorting, or shooting? The U.S. Courts have
> determined that MS is a monopoly.

Yes, they have.  Now, what does that mean?  It doesn't mean that Microsoft
is devoid of competition.  Do you have another definition of a monopoly?
Say, a business which is winning a competition?

> > > When a business becomes a monopoly
> 
> > Unless government gives it a hand, a business cannot become a monopoly.
> 
> Again the question. The U.S. Government does not establish monopolies.

Right now, there are 3 examples that come to mind of monopolies I live under:

- Cable television.  Under the CRTC, Edmonton has 2 cable companies.  One is
only allowed to sell on the east side of town, the other only on the west

- Telephone service.  While I can choose any long distance provider, I can
only have one local phone service.  Anything else is illegal.

- Health care.  I am only allowed to use one health care system, the
government one.  It is illegal to be serviced by a hospital not
government-administered.

None of these can exist without the government.  I can think of no
monopolies I live under not involving government.

> > The finding of fact is comprised of fiction.
> 
> You are really stoned out. The finding of fact is the reasoned judgement
> of a United States District Court Judge.

Applying a set of laws that have no validity in real life, or any rational
basis.

-- 
Lars P. Ormberg     ICQ#:8827066
mailto:larso@ualberta.ca
The University of Lars:   http://www.ualberta.ca/~larso/

"The way you're bathed in light, reminds me of that night
God laid me down into your rose garden of trust and I was
swept away with nothin' left to say some helpless fool
yeah I was lost in a swoon of peace you're all I need to
find so when the time is right come to me sweetly, come
to me come to me..love will lead us, alright.  love will
lead us, she will lead us.  can you hear the dolphin's
cry?  see the road rise up to meet us its in the air we
breathe tonight love will lead us, she will lead us"
                            -Live, "The Dolphin's Cry"

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: PowerSurfr - High Speed Internet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: siberREMOVETHIS@sympatico.ca                      29-Nov-99 17:29:11
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 16:52:20
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: siberREMOVETHIS@sympatico.ca (E. Barry Bruyea)

On Mon, 29 Nov 99 14:30:53 GMT, ames@deltrak.demon.co.uk (Andrew
Stephenson) wrote:

>In article <3842703d$3$obot$mr2ice@news.pics.com>
>	   bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com "Bob Germer" writes:
>
>> [...]
>>
>> No American is forced to pay taxes to support an unelected head
>> of state who lives 3,000 miles away and only sets foot in the
>> country every decade or less.


And neither are Canadians.  And no Canadian would ever be forced to
pay for a Head of State (the president) whose cost on a per capita
basis is about 10 times what the bill is for residents of Canada.  The
cost of the American  'palace', palace guard and all the surrounding
accoutrements makes the monarchy pale by comparison.  The Brits have a
much better deal.
EBB

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Sympatico (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: larso@commodore.                                  29-Nov-99 17:46:01
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 16:52:20
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg)

As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw Bob Germer write:
>    larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) said:

> > > You may consider it a farce. It is the law of the land in the United
> > > States.
> 
> > Yes.  So much for "home of the free".
> 
> You are the type of absolute insane idiot who gives Canadians a bad name.
> We in the United States have more freedom than even you do.

So your defense that anti-trust laws in America erode freedoms is that other
countries have it worse?

By that standard, Canadians should be happy they don't live in Cuba, Cubans
happy that they don't live in China...

>                                                                 We also
> respect the rights of our many minorities by requiring owners of
> businesses to serve all comers regardless of race, color, creed, national
> origin, marital status, etc.

By "requiring" you remove the right of an owner to sell to whoever whenever
despite how upsetting the owner's choices may be.

And you give someone else the right to force another to sell something when
they would not otherwise.

> And no American is required to pay for sub-standard, second rate,
> government run health care whether or not he or she is willing to accept
> it.

Actually, 56% of U.S. health care costs come from government.

-- 
Lars P. Ormberg     ICQ#:8827066
mailto:larso@ualberta.ca
The University of Lars:   http://www.ualberta.ca/~larso/

"The way you're bathed in light, reminds me of that night
God laid me down into your rose garden of trust and I was
swept away with nothin' left to say some helpless fool
yeah I was lost in a swoon of peace you're all I need to
find so when the time is right come to me sweetly, come
to me come to me..love will lead us, alright.  love will
lead us, she will lead us.  can you hear the dolphin's
cry?  see the road rise up to meet us its in the air we
breathe tonight love will lead us, she will lead us"
                            -Live, "The Dolphin's Cry"

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: PowerSurfr - High Speed Internet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: l_luciano@da.mob                                  29-Nov-99 18:30:23
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 16:52:20
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: l_luciano@da.mob (Stan Goodman)

On Mon, 29 Nov 1999 08:22:34, larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) wrote:

> As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw Bob Germer write:
> > On <81f1ih$ojn$5@dagger.ab.videon.ca>, on 11/23/99 at 09:39 PM,
> >    larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) said:
> > 
> > > "Open to the public" is a farce.  A person's property should only be
> > > open to whomever they want it to be open for...likewise, only received
> > > by those who wish to receive it.
> > 
> > You may consider it a farce. It is the law of the land in the United
> > States.
> 
> Yes.  So much for "home of the free".

No, that is what keeps it the home of the free. Had it not been for 
anti-trust legislation, the United States would have been a fiefdom of the 
likes of John D. Rockefeller and Andrew Carnegie. 

-------------
Stan Goodman
Qiryat Tiv'on
Israel

E-mail sent to l_luciano@da.mob will, of course, not reach me. Sorry.
Send E-mail to: domain: hashkedim dot com, username: stan.


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Verio (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: l_luciano@da.mob                                  29-Nov-99 18:30:21
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 16:52:20
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: l_luciano@da.mob (Stan Goodman)

On Mon, 29 Nov 1999 09:46:49, Glenn Davies <glend@nospam.direct.ca> wrote:

> On 29 Nov 1999 08:22:12 GMT, larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) wrote:
> 
> >As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw Bennie Nelson write:
> >> Jerry Prather wrote:
> >
> >> > The problem with M$ is that they are not living by those laws.
> >> > M$ _is_ forcing me to "eat at their restaurant".  I have to buy
> >> > their fried chicken/windows even though I immediately do a Format
> >> > C: when I get home.   ...and just try to get your money back when
> >> > you tell them that you don't want it!  This is what is in
> >> > restraint of trade - I don't have a choice!
> >> 
> >> The main problem is being obscured by examples that do not apply.  MS
> >> is a MONOPOLY.
> >
> >No, it isn't.
> 
> It has been ruled to be an monopoly under US law. Which doesn't mean
> it is illegal.
> 
> >
> >> When a business becomes a monopoly
> >
> >Unless government gives it a hand, a business cannot become a monopoly.
> 
> Time to sign up for some buisness and economic classes for next term.
> Business's can become a monopoly even in non-regulated industries -
> visit a small town and look around sometime. 
> 
> >
> >> the media; all of the utterances from the MS PR Machine are meant to
> >> obfuscate these truths as specified in Judge Jackson's Findings of
> >> Fact:
> >
> >The finding of fact is comprised of fiction.
> 
> As if you have even read it let alone understand it. Your previous
> posts show that you know very little about the history of the computer
> industry.

Or economics; or law; or history.

-------------
Stan Goodman
Qiryat Tiv'on
Israel

E-mail sent to l_luciano@da.mob will, of course, not reach me. Sorry.
Send E-mail to: domain: hashkedim dot com, username: stan.


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Verio (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: jamesg@my-deja.com                                29-Nov-99 13:32:00
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 16:52:20
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: James Goneaux <jamesg@my-deja.com>

On Mon, 29 Nov 1999 18:30:46 GMT, l_luciano@da.mob (Stan Goodman)
wrote:

>On Mon, 29 Nov 1999 08:22:34, larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) wrote:
>
>> As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw Bob Germer write:
>> > On <81f1ih$ojn$5@dagger.ab.videon.ca>, on 11/23/99 at 09:39 PM,
>> >    larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) said:
>> > 
>> > > "Open to the public" is a farce.  A person's property should only be
>> > > open to whomever they want it to be open for...likewise, only received
>> > > by those who wish to receive it.
>> > 
>> > You may consider it a farce. It is the law of the land in the United
>> > States.
>> 
>> Yes.  So much for "home of the free".
>
>No, that is what keeps it the home of the free. Had it not been for 
>anti-trust legislation, the United States would have been a fiefdom of the 
>likes of John D. Rockefeller and Andrew Carnegie. 

Either of whom, incidently, were far wealthier (as a % of American GDP
than Gates ever will be.

James Goneaux

--------------------------------------------------------------
"The future is already here. It's just unevenly distributed." 
William Gibson

jamesg@my-deja.com

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Government of Ontario (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: siberREMOVETHIS@sympatico.ca                      29-Nov-99 19:07:24
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 16:52:20
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: siberREMOVETHIS@sympatico.ca (E. Barry Bruyea)

On Mon, 29 Nov 1999 13:32:01 -0500, James Goneaux <jamesg@my-deja.com>
wrote:

>On Mon, 29 Nov 1999 18:30:46 GMT, l_luciano@da.mob (Stan Goodman)
>wrote:
>
>>On Mon, 29 Nov 1999 08:22:34, larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) wrote:
>>
>>> As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw Bob Germer write:
>>> > On <81f1ih$ojn$5@dagger.ab.videon.ca>, on 11/23/99 at 09:39 PM,
>>> >    larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) said:
>>> > 
>>> > > "Open to the public" is a farce.  A person's property should only be
>>> > > open to whomever they want it to be open for...likewise, only received
>>> > > by those who wish to receive it.
>>> > 
>>> > You may consider it a farce. It is the law of the land in the United
>>> > States.
>>> 
>>> Yes.  So much for "home of the free".
>>
>>No, that is what keeps it the home of the free. Had it not been for 
>>anti-trust legislation, the United States would have been a fiefdom of the 
>>likes of John D. Rockefeller and Andrew Carnegie. 
>
>Either of whom, incidently, were far wealthier (as a % of American GDP
>than Gates ever will be.
>
>James Goneaux


And far more important, they, and past 'super-rich' were considerably
more liquid than Gates, or many others who are on Forbes list.  An
important consideration.  Gates status as the leader of the pack could
change tomorrow morning if the MS balloon burst.  Rockerfeller,
Mellon, Dupont and Carnegie et all would hardly have hiccuped, as
being from the generation they were, cash and specie were their
personal measurment of wealth, so they kept lots of it within reach.
EBB

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Sympatico (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: steve53_remove_this@earthlink.net                 29-Nov-99 10:55:03
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 16:52:20
Subj: Re: QUESTION: OBJECTDESKTOP ON WSEB?

From: steve53_remove_this@earthlink.net

In <81uaa1$89011@imsp212.netvigator.com>, on 11/30/99 
   at 12:40 AM, "Kelvin Tsang" <ktkelvin@yahoo.com> said:

>You mean the Warp Server for e-business ?
>I am using it with OD 2.0, just follow the
>installation instruction, and it works fine
>here. (Except the Drive Navigator, it sometimes
>cause WPS freeze, so I removed this feature now).

Also, don't install Object Advisor during a fresh install.  You need to
selective install it later.

HTH,

Steven



--
-------------------------------------------------------------------
Steven Levine <steve53removethis@earthlink.net>  MR2/ICE 2.01 #10183
Warp4/FP11
-------------------------------------------------------------------


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: EarthLink Network, Inc. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: zayne@omen.com.au                                 29-Nov-99 17:00:25
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 16:52:21
Subj: Re: K6-3 at 500mhz

From: zayne@omen.com.au (Mooo)

jdc0014@InfoNET.st-johns.nf.ca (John Hong) wrote:

>	K6-3's are going to be eventually phased out from the looks of 
>things.  AMD looks like they will make a K6-2+ which is something like 
>the K6-3, but instead of a 256k cache it will only have a 128k cache.  
>The reason you have never seen any AMD K6-3 500Mhz CPU's for instence is 
>because AMD was afraid it would eat into their Athlon 500Mhz sales.  AMD 
>is really pushing hard for the Athlon.  They may keep the K6-3 around but 
>probably only for laptops.
>

Which will effectively mean the end of Socket 7 I think.  I have not
seen a new Cyrix in ages, though I know they are still sold, I just
wonder to whom?

Craig

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Nothing I say is my own opinion (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: djohnson@isomedia.com                             29-Nov-99 09:53:00
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 16:52:21
Subj: Re: Sound Cards and OS/2 (Creative PCI 128?)

From: "David T. Johnson" <djohnson@isomedia.com>


Jim Danvers wrote:
> 
> Thanks for the response Tom...
> 
> I'm becoming increasingly frustrated with the OS (OS/2) in general.  :( 
It's to
> bad too - I ran it back "in the day" when bbs's and FidoNet were the way
that
> computer geeks communicated and it was a superb platform for the hardware
and
> software that was available at the time.  Now...   I have twice the
processing
> power, 8 times the hard disk space and memory, yet I can't get it (OS/2) to
run
> all of my periphals (or even install in some cases) with the PC's that I
have
> around here,

The OS/2 v3 blue spine is pretty dated.  But...you can still install it
and use it if you are willing to do a fair bit of work to update the
installation disks for new disk drives and controllers, apply fixpacks
for TCP/IP, device drivers, and OS/2 base install, and then diligently
search for hardware drivers and compatible hardware.  Everyone has to
make their own decision as to the value to making this sort of effort. 
My own experience is that Windows 9x installs are easier to do but when
you get all done with the install you are left with...Windows.  The time
you save in the initial Win9x OS install is likely to be expended many,
many times in effort to deal with subsequent software issues.  By way of
example, one nasty habit that Win9x apps have is writing numerous DLLs
to the Windows/system directory where they eventually create conflicts
and problems requiring complete reinstallation of the OS (Win9x users
call this a 'clean install.')  If you go to uninstall one of these Win9x
apps, it will likely interrogate you frequently during the uninstall
asking if you want to delete such-and-such shared .DLL file.  And the
answers are not easy.  Delete the wrong file and you can break other
apps.  Never delete and your Window/system directory fills up quickly
with garbage.  My opinion is that Windows needs about 10 hours of
maintenance for every 1 hour expended on OS/2 maintenance, all other
things being equal.  And this is being kind to Windows.

Unfortunately, as others pointed out, there are no OS/2 drivers for a
Creative PCI 128.  OS/2 PCI sound drivers do exist for Aureal Vortex 1
cards, ESS Solo 1 cards, C-media, and Crystal-based cards.  


> and unfortunately the outlook for it continues to spiral downward.
> On the other side of the coin though, the MS product (9x-NT) all install and 
run
> with all of my hardware with a minimal of issue.  {sigh}  I'm spec'ing out a 
new
> PC - guess that I'm just going to have to take my time, do some research on
ALL
> of the peripherals that I would like to use with it, and ensure that
everything
> that I choose will work with Linux & OS/2 - Win compatibility is a no
brainer -
> you ~know~ it'll work.
> 
> -=- J.D. -=-
> 
> tom wrote:
> 
> > Jim Danvers wrote:
> >
> > > Hi guys...
> > >
> > > I just installed Warp 3 (blue spine) and am trying (hoping) to get audio
> > > running on this box - it has a Creative Labs Sound Blaster PCI 128 card
in
> > > it and I have not been able to locate any info on getting it running as
> > > yet.  I'm dual booting this box @present w/Win95 and the audio card
works
> > > fine.
> > >
> > > Anyone have any pointers or suggestions?
> > >
> > > Thanks in advance....
> > >
> > > -=- J.D. -=-
> >
> > Good luck, unless it comes with OS/2 drivers you are
> > out of luck.  There are very few PCI devices that
> > comes with them.
> >
> > Tom Street
> > 920-693-2824
> >
> >    S E M C O
> >          Street Electric Manufacturing Company
> >       Mfg. of the QuadJoy mouse for quadriplegics
> >       and people with high mobility impairments.
> >
> >          see it at  http://www.quadjoy.com

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: nospam@nowhere.com                                29-Nov-99 17:36:06
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 16:52:21
Subj: Re: delay starting an app from startup group?

From: nospam@nowhere.com  (Steve Myers)

Write a little REXX exec that pauses for, say, 5 minutes, and then
starts the application --

/* REXX */
say 'Starting pause for 1 whole minute'
call RxFuncAdd 'SysSleep', 'RexxUtil', 'SysSleep'
call SysSleep 60
/* Insert command line to start the application here, taken from the */
/* Application start parameters  */

In <s453b1m7mvm48@corp.supernews.com>, "Kerry Lord" <klord@bhbt.com> writes:
>Is there a way to delay an application from starting in the startup group?
>
>We have an OS/2 Warp3 that reboots itself every night and we also have a
>backup agent program that needs to be loaded so the OS/2 box can be backed
>up.
>
>I've put the back up agent software into the Startup Group, but since
>another application is still loading the back up software can't load until
>about a minute later.  Since this happens at midnight, no one is around to
>start the back up program.
>
>Any ideas?
>
>Thanks!
>
>--
>=============================================
>Bar Harbor Banking and Trust
>Kerry Lord - IT Engineer
>82 Main Street
>Bar Harbor,  Maine 04609
>(800) 237-9601 x2309
>
>
>


-- Steve Myers

The E-mail addresses in this message are private property.  Any use of them
to  send  unsolicited  E-mail  messages  of  a  commerical  nature  will be
considered trespassing,  and the originator of the message will be  sued in
small claims court in Camden County,  New Jersey,  for the  maximum penalty
allowed by law.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: djohnson@isomedia.com                             29-Nov-99 10:05:20
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 16:52:21
Subj: Re: Help with Fix Pack install

From: "David T. Johnson" <djohnson@isomedia.com>


djfirth@attglobal.net wrote:
> 
> Although I am an old hand at OS/2 (2.0, 2.1, Warp 3, now Warp 4) I have
never istalled a major fix pack because the OS was always stable for my
applications. I want to bring my OS/2 box up to spec. I DL'd FP12 for Warp 4
and CSF 141. I also DL'd the latest Netscape rev. I use  DOS support and
WINOS2. Is there anuthing in these installs that I should know about? Your
guidance appreciated.

The fixpack level 12 for OS/2 v4 adds a lot of extra functionality for
OS/2 v4 that I think you will enjoy.  An OS/2 .INI editor (REGEDIT2),
GRADD capability, faster and better PM function, advanced power
management for ATX systems, MMOS2 improvements, and Y2K updating are
some things that come to mind.  Device driver fixpack 1 improves many
other things uncluding printer functioning with bidirectional ports,
timers, power management, IDE disk function, etc.

Get OS/2 v4 fixpack 12 at:

ftp://service.boulder.ibm.com/ps/products/os2/fixes/v4warp/english-us/xr_m012/

Get device driver fixpack 1 at:

ftp://service.boulder.ibm.com/ps/products/os2/fixes/DDPak/xr_d001/

If you use IDE disk drivers, I would also highly recommend replacing the
IBM1s506.ADD driver with the DANIS506.ADD driver available on Hobbes at:

http://hobbes.nmsu.edu/pub/os2/system/drivers/storage/danis506.zip


> 
> Warped since 1994 ... and still happy.
> 
> Dave
> djfirth@gcfn.org

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: letoured@nospam.net                               29-Nov-99 14:19:08
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 16:52:21
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: letoured@nospam.net

>Does Microsoft send people to force you to buy their products?  Which gun
>is being placed at your skull?
>Or is it a matter of Microsoft "forcing you" to buy the product by
>providing a valued product at an affordable rate?

Where do you get this nonsense from?  If you read the Findings of Fact, as
you claim to have done, you either do not understand US law and how
markets are controlled or you read it with a viewer that only lets you the
MS approved lines.  -- My PDF copy has 206 pages. How many are in yours?

BTW, do you think the US DOJ antitrust action against IBM that essentially
allowed MS have a market share was a good thing or bad thing?  -- I can't
wait for your answer.

_____________
Ed Letourneau <letoured@sover.net>

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: bCandid - Powering the world's discussions - http
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: esther@bitranch.com                               29-Nov-99 19:31:24
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 16:52:21
Subj: Re: delay starting an app from startup group?

From: esther@bitranch.com (Esther Schindler)

Oh how COOL!

I see that others have already given you an answer to your technical 
query, but as a longtime Bar Harbor Bank customer, I'm delighted to 
see that you're using OS/2 in some manner.

(I lived on Deer Isle for almost 7 years, and I still have BHB&T 
accounts.)

--Esther

On Mon, 29 Nov 1999 14:26:24, "Kerry Lord" <klord@bhbt.com> wrote:

| Is there a way to delay an application from starting in the startup group?
| 
| We have an OS/2 Warp3 that reboots itself every night and we also have a
| backup agent program that needs to be loaded so the OS/2 box can be backed
| up.
| 
| I've put the back up agent software into the Startup Group, but since
| another application is still loading the back up software can't load until
| about a minute later.  Since this happens at midnight, no one is around to
| start the back up program.
| 
| Any ideas?
| 
| Thanks!
| 
| --
| =============================================
| Bar Harbor Banking and Trust
| Kerry Lord - IT Engineer
| 82 Main Street
| Bar Harbor,  Maine 04609
| (800) 237-9601 x2309
| 
| 
| 


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Frontier GlobalCenter Inc. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: doug.bissett"at"attglobal.net                     29-Nov-99 19:34:00
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 16:52:21
Subj: Re: New modem list

From: doug.bissett"at"attglobal.net (Doug Bissett)

On Sun, 28 Nov 1999 21:02:39, James Moe <sma.spam-not@rtd.com> wrote:

> Hello,
>     Does anyone know where I can find a current modem init string list?
> It used to be known as MODEM.IAK. The list I have is rather dated and
> does not have *any* 56K modems listed.
> -- 
> sma at rtd dot com
> Remove ".spam-not" for email

AFAIK, that thing has not been updated for years. Your best bet, is to
take the closest  modem, and change the init strings to whatever is 
suggested for your current modem. I know that a 3COM (US Robotics) 56K
Sportster modem works with the 14.4K Sportster settings. Describe your
modem, and someone can, probably, suggest a good init string to use.

I hope this helps...
******************************
From the PC of Doug Bissett
doug.bissett at attglobal.net
The " at " must be changed to "@"
******************************

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Global Network Services - Remote Access Mail & Ne
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: jdc0014@InfoNET.st-johns.nf.ca                    29-Nov-99 19:39:28
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 16:52:21
Subj: Re: K6-3 at 500mhz

From: jdc0014@InfoNET.st-johns.nf.ca (John Hong)

Mooo (zayne@omen.com.au) wrote:

: Which will effectively mean the end of Socket 7 I think.  I have not
: seen a new Cyrix in ages, though I know they are still sold, I just
: wonder to whom?

	Cyrix was bought out by VIA (whom also bought out the WinChip 
division from IDT).  Socket 7 is pretty much dead in terms of future 
upgradability, but I wouldn't look at it with doom or gloom.  I say bravo 
for AMD and Cyrix for going against the grain and sticking things out 
with socket 7 whose live really lasted much longer than Intel ever had 
imagined.
	Cyrix under the guise of VIA will be putting out a socket 370 
processor, BTW.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: St. John's InfoNET (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: l_luciano@da.mob                                  29-Nov-99 21:46:21
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 20:08:14
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: l_luciano@da.mob (Stan Goodman)

On Mon, 29 Nov 1999 19:07:48, siberREMOVETHIS@sympatico.ca (E. Barry 
Bruyea) wrote:

> On Mon, 29 Nov 1999 13:32:01 -0500, James Goneaux <jamesg@my-deja.com>
> wrote:
> 
> >On Mon, 29 Nov 1999 18:30:46 GMT, l_luciano@da.mob (Stan Goodman)
> >wrote:
> >
> >>On Mon, 29 Nov 1999 08:22:34, larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) wrote:
> >>
> >>> As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw Bob Germer write:
> >>> > On <81f1ih$ojn$5@dagger.ab.videon.ca>, on 11/23/99 at 09:39 PM,
> >>> >    larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) said:
> >>> > 
> >>> > > "Open to the public" is a farce.  A person's property should only be
> >>> > > open to whomever they want it to be open for...likewise, only
received
> >>> > > by those who wish to receive it.
> >>> > 
> >>> > You may consider it a farce. It is the law of the land in the United
> >>> > States.
> >>> 
> >>> Yes.  So much for "home of the free".
> >>
> >>No, that is what keeps it the home of the free. Had it not been for 
> >>anti-trust legislation, the United States would have been a fiefdom of the 

> >>likes of John D. Rockefeller and Andrew Carnegie. 
> >
> >Either of whom, incidently, were far wealthier (as a % of American GDP
> >than Gates ever will be.
> >
> >James Goneaux
> 
> 
> And far more important, they, and past 'super-rich' were considerably
> more liquid than Gates, or many others who are on Forbes list.  An
> important consideration.  Gates status as the leader of the pack could
> change tomorrow morning if the MS balloon burst.  Rockerfeller,
> Mellon, Dupont and Carnegie et all would hardly have hiccuped, as
> being from the generation they were, cash and specie were their
> personal measurment of wealth, so they kept lots of it within reach.

And all this is relevant to the fact that Microsoft is a monopoly? And 
relevant to the two OS/2 newsgroups on the distribution?

-------------
Stan Goodman
Qiryat Tiv'on
Israel

E-mail sent to l_luciano@da.mob will, of course, not reach me. Sorry.
Send E-mail to: domain: hashkedim dot com, username: stan.


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Verio (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: jvarela@mind-spring.com                           29-Nov-99 22:40:22
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 20:08:15
Subj: Re: Java 1.2 for OS/2

From: jvarela@mind-spring.com (John Varela)

On Mon, 29 Nov 1999 13:17:02, Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com> 
wrote:

> On <uprsNDlpp0Dh-pn2-Pv32CUGl0Rf8@localhost>, on 11/28/99 at 10:16 PM,
>    jhimmel@i-2000.com (James Himmelman) said:

> > So if I said to you "It's been that way for the last quarter of a 
> > century" (very common usage), you would think it's been that way for 
> > the last 3 months?
> 
> Common usage? Not really. Very open to misinterpretation.

Disagree.  If he said, "last quarter of THE century" then it might 
mean Oct-Nov-Dec 2000, but if he said "the last quarter of A century" 
or "the last quarter-century" then he's gotta mean 25 years.
 
--
John "which 25 is another question" Varela
to e-mail, remove - between mind and spring

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: MindSpring Enterprises (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: jack.troughton@nospam.videotron.ca                30-Nov-99 00:00:17
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 21:21:09
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: jack.troughton@nospam.videotron.ca (Jack Troughton)

On Mon, 29 Nov 1999 12:13:17, Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com> 
wrote:

If your country allows discrimination in public accomodations, then it is
not a free country for minorities. Your freedom requires you to only use
French on signs, in display windows, etc. in Quebec.
 
Bob, quick note. English is permitted on signs in Quebec.  However, 
all commercial signs must have french predominant on the sign. You are
allowed to have an english translation, but it must be smaller than 
the french version of whatever it is you want to say on the sign.

I moved here from Ontario two and a half years ago and for me, it's 
not really a big deal.  They certainly do not prevent anyone from 
posting things in english, but they do want to see french everywhere 
because things written in public contribute a lot to the overall 
literacy of a culture.

French numbers are declining; their current birthrate is less than 
replacement.  They're working on just keeping it going here.  I for 
one do not begrudge them that. I've had a very good time here; it 
would be a shame to see the culture disappear.

Simple fact: I live in Montreal and I see english all over the place 
here.

I had already decided to keep my mouth shut in this thread, but well, 
you know, national pride and all that; I couldn't let that one slide 
by. I don't particularly feel like arguing politics. It's clear to me 
already that you two are never ever going to agree on anything.

Of course, if you two just want to scrap, then go ahead, by all means.
 It might be fun to watch.

Beaming into this one from os2.advocacy; for those of you out west: 
this could get entertaining!

<starts handing out the asbestos suits to the other onlookers>

Jack Troughton   ICQ:7494149
http://jakesplace.dhs.org
jack.troughton at videotron.ca
jake at jakesplace.dhs.org
Montral PQ Canada

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: mbatey@cixno.spamco.uk                            29-Nov-99 23:28:27
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 21:21:09
Subj: Re: Netscape Communicator 4.61 install problems

From: mbatey@cixno.spamco.uk (Maurice Batey)

On Mon, 29 Nov 1999 05:55:51, jack.troughton@nospam.videotron.ca (Jack
Troughton) wrote:

>  try placing a -3 in 
> the Parameters field of the program object. 

I already do, and can connect to some banking systems. But this one 
seems to check for V.4, and changing the '3' to '4' did not have the 
desired effect.

Where can one download Net.Com. 4.61 from, please?
(Does Net.Com. include a Netscape Navigator, or has it simply been 
renamed?)

Maurice Batey 
(Change "no.spam" to "." in E-mail address.)

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: CIX - Compulink Information eXchange (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: lsunley@mb.sympatico.ca                           29-Nov-99 23:37:01
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 21:21:09
Subj: Re: Netscape Communicator 4.61 install problems

From: lsunley@mb.sympatico.ca (Lorne Sunley)

On Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:28:55, mbatey@cixno.spamco.uk (Maurice Batey) 
wrote:

> On Mon, 29 Nov 1999 05:55:51, jack.troughton@nospam.videotron.ca (Jack
> Troughton) wrote:
> 
> >  try placing a -3 in 
> > the Parameters field of the program object. 
> 
> I already do, and can connect to some banking systems. But this one 
> seems to check for V.4, and changing the '3' to '4' did not have the 
> desired effect.
> 
> Where can one download Net.Com. 4.61 from, please?
> (Does Net.Com. include a Netscape Navigator, or has it simply been 
> renamed?)
> 
> Maurice Batey 
> (Change "no.spam" to "." in E-mail address.)
> 

You can download Netscape 4.04 and 4.61 from
the IBM web site

URL http://www-4.ibm.com/software/os/warp/swchoice/

You will only be able to get at the "low security" one
if you access the site from the UK. You can go to
the Fortify web site to obain a patch which will 
provide the "high security" encryption

URL http://www.fortify.net/

--

Lorne Sunley

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: MBnet Networking Inc. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: cdelanoy@ualberta.ca                              29-Nov-99 23:42:04
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 21:21:09
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: Chris J Delanoy <cdelanoy@ualberta.ca>

  prather@infi.net (Jerry Prather) wrote:

> :>> The problem with M$ is that they are not living by those laws.
> :>> M$ _is_ forcing me to "eat at their restaurant".

> Lars, I was going to respond to this with a flame that you should
> have read the rest of my post before replying so knee-jerkily,
> but in reading other people's responses, I found that I didn't
> have to.  Your logic flaws have been well pointed out - or is it
> your source of income that is being identified????

Jerry, if you believe you are forced to "eat Microsoft", as it were,
then I propose the following experiment which will show you the
difference between production and force:  For the next year, don't
buy or use any Microsoft products whatsoever.  That is, send the
alleged "robber barron" Bill Gates no money whatsoever.  At the
same time, send no money to the government.  That is, don't pay
your taxes for the same period.

Then wait.  Then see who comes after you for your money, and with
what weapons.  Perhaps then you'll see what force is and why
neither Microsoft nor any other private enterprise has any such
power.

Chris J Delanoy


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Deja.com - Before you buy. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: cdelanoy@ualberta.ca                              29-Nov-99 23:42:01
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 21:21:09
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: Chris J Delanoy <cdelanoy@ualberta.ca>

  prather@infi.net (Jerry Prather) wrote:

> :>> The problem with M$ is that they are not living by those laws.
> :>> M$ _is_ forcing me to "eat at their restaurant".

> Lars, I was going to respond to this with a flame that you should
> have read the rest of my post before replying so knee-jerkily,
> but in reading other people's responses, I found that I didn't
> have to.  Your logic flaws have been well pointed out - or is it
> your source of income that is being identified????

Jerry, if you believe you are forced to "eat Microsoft", as it were,
then I propose the following experiment which will show you the
difference between production of force:  For the next year, don't
buy or use any Microsoft products whatsoever.  That is, send the
alleged "robber barron" Bill Gates no money whatsoever.  At the
same time, send no money to the government.  That is, don't pay
your taxes for the same period.

Then wait.  Then see who comes after you for your money, and with
what weapons.  Perhaps then you'll see what force is and why
neither Microsoft nor any other private enterprise has any such
power.

Chris J Delanoy


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Deja.com - Before you buy. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: cdelanoy@ualberta.ca                              29-Nov-99 23:51:27
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 21:21:09
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: Chris J Delanoy <cdelanoy@ualberta.ca>

 letoured@nospam.net wrote:

> > Does Microsoft send people to force you to buy their products?
> > Which gun is being placed at your skull?

> > Or is it a matter of Microsoft "forcing you" to buy the product
> > by providing a valued product at an affordable rate?

> Where do you get this nonsense from?  If you read the Findings of
> Fact, as you claim to have done, you either do not understand US
> law and how markets are controlled

The US anti-trust laws are deliberately designed as so to be
impossible to be objectively understood.  They are ex-post-facto,
arbitrary, and entirely open-ended, and any "findings of fact"
made under them do not necessarily bear any resemblance to reality
(ie - to actual FACTS).

As for how markets run, it is you who obviously has no idea.  The
only monopolies (ie - companies against which competition is
impossible and which can therefore set prices independently of the
market) that have existed have been created and maintained by
acts of government.  No coervice monopoly has ever and can ever
be created on the free market - and Microsoft (which is not a
monopoly) is no exception.

> BTW, do you think the US DOJ antitrust action against IBM that
> essentially allowed MS have a market share was a good thing or
> bad thing?  -- I can't wait for your answer.

IBM lost it's market dominance before the persecution against it
by the US government was even half-completed.  The idea that
anti-trust jihads by Justice bureaucats have increased competition
is an absolute joke.  On the contrary, more than any other single
law, the Sherman Anti-Trust Act and it's successors have set the
standard in -destroying- competition.

Chris J Delanoy


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Deja.com - Before you buy. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: nemo@union.edu                                    29-Nov-99 18:41:05
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 21:21:09
Subj: problem w/ cdrw

From: nemo@union.edu

Ricoh is installed and I'm trying to get the RSJ software running. (I am
aware of cdrecorder/2 but I would like to try to get the RSJ stuff working
first, especially since I've paid perfectly good shekels for it!) 

I know the equipment is ok because I booted to the 'dark side', installed
the EZ CD Creator software from Adaptec and got a perfectly good burn of a
directory which I can now read in OS/2, no problem.

However, whenever I try to open the "cd recorder" icon in RSJ, I get,
"can't open drive [CDR:], Make sure the drive is ready and not used by
another applicaiton."

Bear in mind, for now the cdrw has to be the only cdrom in the system. It
is set as drive K:. I've dropped cdfs from config.sys but that hasn't
helped much. How do I set up the cdrw to be my one and only?

The pdf manual is uninformative and I've found nothing so far on deja.com.
(altavista really stinks these days, what's going on with that?)

Thanks all!

F.


-----------------------------------------------------------
      Felmon John Davis		
     davisf@union.edu	|  davisf@capital.net     
     Union College /  Schenectady, NY
     - insert standard doxastic disclaimers -
     OS/2 - ma kauft koi katz em sack 
-----------------------------------------------------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Logical Net (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: letoured@nospam.net                               29-Nov-99 19:37:08
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 21:21:10
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: letoured@nospam.net

Chris J Delanoy <cdelanoy@ualberta.ca> said:

>The US anti-trust laws are deliberately designed as so to be impossible
>to be objectively understood.  They are ex-post-facto, arbitrary, and
>entirely open-ended, and any "findings of fact" made under them do not
>necessarily bear any resemblance to reality (ie - to actual FACTS).

Baloney. They can be understood by those with knowledge of markets and
mutilative practices, and others who don't work for or kneel before MS.

>As for how markets run, it is you who obviously has no idea.  The only
>monopolies (ie - companies against which competition is impossible and
>which can therefore set prices independently of the market) that have
>existed have been created and maintained by acts of government.  No
>coervice monopoly has ever and can ever be created on the free market -
>and Microsoft (which is not a monopoly) is no exception.

Baloney again.  You did okay until you got the part about a monopoly has
to be created by the government.  And companies which are permitted
(licensed if you will) to function as a so-called monopoly are permitted
because it is deemed necessary to the public good and regulated for the
public good.  

-- BTW, Gates was saying he should be permitted to have monopoly back in
the early 80s for the public good, but without any regulation or
requirements for performance or a warranty.  Its the same argument he
gives us now.  


>> BTW, do you think the US DOJ antitrust action against IBM that
>> essentially allowed MS have a market share was a good thing or
>> bad thing?  -- I can't wait for your answer.

>IBM lost it's market dominance before the persecution against it by the
>US government was even half-completed.  The idea that anti-trust jihads
>by Justice bureaucats have increased competition is an absolute joke.  On
>the contrary, more than any other single law, the Sherman Anti-Trust Act
>and it's successors have set the standard in -destroying- competition.

If your premise was valid, then explain to all of us what happened when
IBM was required to publish Apis and not pre-announce products. Match that
with reality and explain how it had no effect on IBM or competition. Opps,
you can't you already said the action changed the behavior of IBM.  

But if you want to try, please go ahead. I'm sure you will show us that
your reasoning is a joke and I need the laugh.


_____________
Ed Letourneau <letoured@sover.net>

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: bCandid - Powering the world's discussions - http
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: jhimmel@i-2000.com                                30-Nov-99 01:10:22
  To: All                                               29-Nov-99 21:21:10
Subj: Re: Java 1.2 for OS/2

From: jhimmel@i-2000.com (James Himmelman)

On Mon, 29 Nov 1999 13:17:02, Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com> 
wrote:

> On <uprsNDlpp0Dh-pn2-Pv32CUGl0Rf8@localhost>, on 11/28/99 at 10:16 PM,
>    jhimmel@i-2000.com (James Himmelman) said:
> 
> > > Sorry, but quarter when speaking of time measurement has a specific
> > > meaning. If the person meant the second fourth he or she should have so
> > > stated.
 
> > So if I said to you "It's been that way for the last quarter of a 
> > century" (very common usage), you would think it's been that way for 
> > the last 3 months?

> Common usage? Not really. Very open to misinterpretation.

Ah ha - so now you agree. And yes, very common. Where have you been?
  
> > > Quarter is a word with many meanings and must be read in context. In the
> > > context of date measurement, quarter by itself means a 3 month period of 
a
> > > calendar year.

> > Right, but he did not use "quarter" by itself. He said the second 
> > quarter of the next millennium.
 
> Which to me and most businessmen means April, May, and June of 2001.

Not according to my own unscientific impromptu survey. Take your own 
survey.
Ask them if they would take - "The first quarter of the 3rd 
millennium" to mean the first 3 months or the first 250yrs. My results
were 5 for 5 in favor of the first 250yrs, but try it for yourself. I 
asked a construction contractor, a retired manager of the New York 
Stock Exchange, an architect, a manager at a department store, and a 
retired manager of one of the biggest printing companies in the 
country.

Give it a try - my little survey has me curious as to what your 
results might be. According to you, none of the people I asked are 
"intelligent". That part of your post is the most interesting of all.

> > > Thus, when someone wrote second quarter of the third millenium,
> > > intelligent people read that as the second 3 months of the year 2001.
> 
> > No, intelligent people know that a quarter of a millennium is 250 yrs.
> 
> > > he or she meant otherwise, then he or she did not express himself or
> > > herself properly. 
> > > When one uses quarter refering to time measurement, one modifies it if
he
> > > or she means other than the first three, second three, third three, or
> > > fourth three months of a standard calendar. If one is referring to a
> > > fiscal year, one writes fiscal quarter.
> 
> > Exactly, and since he modified it with the word "millennium", it is 
> > reasonable to assume quarter is dividing the millennium into 4 equal 
> 
> It is just as reasonable to read it as I did.

Now we are getting somewhere.

> > parts. If he did not intend to divide the millennium, than he should 
> > have simply said the 2nd quarter of next year. 
> 
> That would be April, May, and June of 2000, not 2001. For your
> information, the next millenium begins on January 1, 2001. The last year
> of the Second Millenium is 2000. The millenium and century do not change
> in on January 1, 2000. They change on January 1, 2001.

You seem to have missed the point - or was that intentional?

> > Just because the use of the word "quarter" as a 3 month time frame is 
> > common usage, it does NOT mean that the word can't be used to mean 
> > other periods of time. If someone states that "it's been that way for 
> > the last quarter of this millennium", I would assume that he meant the
> 
> Since we are still in the current millenium, the meaning would be more
> apparent as the last 250 or so years. But when one is speaking of a time
> not yet arrived, then my interpretation is the correct one.

Wrong. So now it changes if it is "time yet arrived"? You are making 
this up as you go along at this point - or else point me to the source
of that information. Both interpretations could be supported. Yours is
no more "correct" than mine. Mine is well supported by all the 
dictionaries I checked.

> > last 250 yrs, simply because he specifically chose NOT to say the much
> > clearer "it's been that way for the last quarter of this year" - or 
> > even "It's been that way for the last quarter". He went out of his way
> > to implicate "millennium" as the period that quarter was defining. 
> > "Quarter of a century" is commonly understood as one forth of 100 yrs,
> > and "Quarter of a millennium" can be understood to mean one forth of 
> > 1000 yrs, even to "intelligent" people.
> 
> Quarter of *a* millenium would be 250 years. First quarter of the next
> millenium would be January, February, March of 2001.

That could be debated, and the dictionary would support my argument.

> > Just like if you said to someone "I'll give you a quarter of my weeks 
> > pay", he will most likely NOT be thinking 25 cents, even though you 
> > were talking about money.
> 
> However, if I said I will give you the first quarter of my next week's
> (proper spelling BTW)

Yes, pardon me for missing the '. I don't generally pick on spelling 
in news groups, BTW.

> pay you would have no right to expect more than 25
> cents.
> 
> A quarter is a fourth part. First (second, third, fourth) quarter when
> referring to time and without specific contrary information is a 3 month
> period.

Right, while in this case, "millennium" could be considered specific 
contrary information.

> Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: bobg@Pics.com

[[[ James Himmelman - jhimmel@i-2000.com ]]]

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: christian.hennecke@ruhr-uni-boch...               30-Nov-99 02:06:21
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 03:28:13
Subj: Re: Motherboard recommendations...

Message sender: christian.hennecke@ruhr-uni-bochum.de

From: Christian Hennecke <christian.hennecke@ruhr-uni-bochum.de>

Allen Cogbill schrieb:
> I have a 3-yr old DFI motherboard running OS/2 Warp 4 FP8, Win95, WinNT, and
> RedHat Linux. It works quite well. However, I'm considering upgrading the MB
> in order to run some apps; the current 64 Mb memory, 166-MHz Pentium II
> setup does not meet the minimum hardware requirements for a couple of WinXX
> apps that I'd like to use!
> 
> I'd appreciate any suggestions for boards that will run OS/2 well, as this
> is the OS that I almost always use. The Win95 is just for my kids.

Well, first you have to decide which architecture you'd like: AMD K6,
K7, Intel Pentium II/III or Celeron.

I myself have bought a Tyan Trinity ATX Board three months ago. It runs
very well with an AMD K6-2 here. Another choice would be the boards from
FIC which are also very reliable, the VA-503+ (AT) and PA-2013 (ATX).
Whatever board you buy, choose one with a VIA chipset, since others are
said to have problems with supporting AGP and the needed current for
some graphics cards.
However the Socket 7 boards are not very upgradable. The K6-3 450 will
be pretty much the end of the line, since AMD will probably not come up
with a 500 or 550 MHz version to avoid competition with the Athlon 500.
Who knows what the K6-2+ will bring?
If you are considering another Intel CPU then go for a BX board. The BX
chipset has better memory access performance. My father is running OS/2
on a Siemens D-1107 w/ Intel PII-400 with no problems, but I guess it's
hard to get in the US.

Christian Hennecke
-- 
Keep passing the open windows! ("The Hotel New Hampshire", John Irving)

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: not organized (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: jack.troughton@nospam.videotron.ca                30-Nov-99 01:25:08
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 03:28:13
Subj: Re: Netscape Communicator 4.61 install problems

From: jack.troughton@nospam.videotron.ca (Jack Troughton)

On Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:37:03, lsunley@mb.sympatico.ca (Lorne Sunley) 
wrote:

On Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:28:55, mbatey@cixno.spamco.uk (Maurice Batey) 
wrote:

> On Mon, 29 Nov 1999 05:55:51, jack.troughton@nospam.videotron.ca (Jack
> Troughton) wrote:
> 
> >  try placing a -3 in 
> > the Parameters field of the program object. 
> 
> I already do, and can connect to some banking systems. But this one 
> seems to check for V.4, and changing the '3' to '4' did not have the 
> desired effect.
> 
> Where can one download Net.Com. 4.61 from, please?
> (Does Net.Com. include a Netscape Navigator, or has it simply been 
> renamed?)
> 
> Maurice Batey 
> (Change "no.spam" to "." in E-mail address.)
> 

You can download Netscape 4.04 and 4.61 from
the IBM web site

URL http://www-4.ibm.com/software/os/warp/swchoice/

You will only be able to get at the "low security" one
if you access the site from the UK. You can go to
the Fortify web site to obain a patch which will 
provide the "high security" encryption

URL http://www.fortify.net/


Beat me to the punch, Lorne:)

Jack Troughton   ICQ:7494149
http://jakesplace.dhs.org
jack.troughton at videotron.ca
jake at jakesplace.dhs.org
Montral PQ Canada

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: mckinnis@attglobal.net                            30-Nov-99 01:59:25
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 03:28:13
Subj: Re: delay starting an app from startup group?

From: mckinnis@attglobal.net (Chuck McKinnis)

You might want to look at the Rexx Auto Start utility.  It can really 
be tailored to start things when you want them to start.  Go to Hobbes
and search for rxast142.zip.

On Mon, 29 Nov 1999 14:26:24, "Kerry Lord" <klord@bhbt.com> wrote:

> Is there a way to delay an application from starting in the startup group?
> 
> We have an OS/2 Warp3 that reboots itself every night and we also have a
> backup agent program that needs to be loaded so the OS/2 box can be backed
> up.
> 
> I've put the back up agent software into the Startup Group, but since
> another application is still loading the back up software can't load until
> about a minute later.  Since this happens at midnight, no one is around to
> start the back up program.
> 
> Any ideas?
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> --
> =============================================
> Bar Harbor Banking and Trust
> Kerry Lord - IT Engineer
> 82 Main Street
> Bar Harbor,  Maine 04609
> (800) 237-9601 x2309
> 
> 
> 

Chuck McKinnis
IBM Senior Systems Engineer (retired)

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Global Network Services - Remote Access Mail & Ne
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: abeagley@optonline.net                            30-Nov-99 02:16:18
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 03:28:13
Subj: Re: Hauppauge  advice - Thank you.

From: Alan Beagley <abeagley@optonline.net>

I have a WinTV Model 401 card as well, but I understand that there may
be many variations "under the skin" between one card and another of the
same model.

Do you get sound when you select a different "connector" from the TV
drop-down menu of the WTV app? I find that I get sound when I select
"Ext 1" -- but then I get no picture. By trial and error, I discovered
that I can get soudn accompanying the picture if I go to the MMOS2
subdirectory and execute the command
	
	vxpvar wcast 1 s2_amux 1

then answer "y" to make the change.

It is possible, however, that in a different system a differenct change
will be necessary.

Alan


Argent wrote:
> 
> I just purchased/installed the Model 401 (TV/DBX/Radio). Works OK.
> 
> The TV app that comes with the drivers (WTV) seems to give me the best
picture.
> but sound never comes on until I open the Multimedia Setup and access the
setup
> page.Then, when I open the Remote, sound disappears. YADTV always pops up
with
> the picture partially outside the window and is off-center after re-sizing
or
> moving the window around. It also has cyan and red striping in the picture.
> StWTV is OK, but I can't seem to get it to recognize the channel region
file.
>

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Optimum Online (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: ames@deltrak.demon.co.uk                          30-Nov-99 02:24:08
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 03:28:13
Subj: Re: problem w/ cdrw

From: ames@deltrak.demon.co.uk (Andrew Stephenson)

In article <38430f4c$1$qnivfs$mr2ice@news.logical.net> nemo@union.edu  writes:

> [...]
>
> However, whenever I try to open the "cd recorder" icon in RSJ, I get,
> "can't open drive [CDR:], Make sure the drive is ready and not used by
> another applicaiton."
>
> Bear in mind, for now the cdrw has to be the only cdrom in the system. It
> is set as drive K:. I've dropped cdfs from config.sys but that hasn't
> helped much. How do I set up the cdrw to be my one and only?

We did have a brief discussion of a closely related problem, not
long ago.  Since then, testing some of the suggestions given at
that time, I have found that it pays to set up the CD-RW exactly
as RSJ want it set up: use LOCKCDR, etc.

One mistake I found very easy to make is not to understand that
the two ways of accessing the drive are completely separate and
should not be mixed.  Either use CDView or CD Writer Control, not
both at once.  CD View is for dragging and dropping pre-defined
tracks, such as when creating audio CDs.  CD Writer Control does
for PM _some_ of what the older CLI commands do.  I now prefer to
use the CLI and start with CDATTACH (qv).  Once you have attached
a drive, you can then give normal COPY/DIR/&c commands.  Even DEL
seems to be available.

Another detail which seems to matter is, after you have loaded up
a blank CD for writing, FORMAT seems to help -- although I admit
I am still hazy on this.

There is also the undocumented procedure for erasing CD-RWs which
refuse to attach.  See Deja.com: seek keyword "trackcpy" (sic!).
--
Andrew Stephenson

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: DNS (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: jfarrug@erols.com                                 29-Nov-99 21:49:19
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 03:28:13
Subj: AssocEdit does'nt change jpg association to PMView

From: Joe Farruggio <jfarrug@erols.com>

HI
I have a pentium II system using os2 ver4 fixpak 12 and object desktop
ver 2 with fixpak 1. I have tried to associate my jpg files to Pmview
ver 2.00 Beta 16129
using AssocEdit ver 2.1 . The jpg files still open using image viewer.
I have
evan changed the menu selection in the properties page to use Pmview
under the "Open as" menu. Once i close the menu selection it reverts
back
to image viewer.

I next tried using the program "prmgfix" which is supposed to fix this
problem. Some jpg files then opened in PMView but most did not. The ones
that didn't where photos which had been converted to jpg files from
film.

I then tried to use the setdefv command which is native to OS2 and is
recommended in the PMView documentation as a fix for this problem. This
did absolutely nothing.

IF  anyone has any insight into this problem, i would dearly love to
hear about any proposed solution. TIA
--
 Joe Farruggio

 ICQ #13668583
 jfarrug@erols.com


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: admin@hotmail.com                                 30-Nov-99 02:50:09
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 03:28:13
Subj: Font Editor?

From: admin@hotmail.com (Edmond Dantes)

I'm looking for a font editor.  Is there a native one?
Edmond Dantes
phydeaux(the 'at' thing)home.com

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: @Home Network (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: sma.spam-not@rtd.com                              30-Nov-99 04:54:14
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 03:28:13
Subj: Re: netscape quietly quitting

From: James Moe <sma.spam-not@rtd.com>


Richard A Crane wrote:
> 
> >     The only site that I have seen the shows this problem is IBM's. .
> > [ ... ]
> > --
> >
>
> I too have only had a problem with Netscape and IBM sites.
> However my memory seems to insidiously disappear whilst
> running Netscape 4.6.

     I must amend my statement. Today I had a couple of downloads quit
in the middle. And it was not from IBM's site. I guess I was just
(un?)lucky before.

-- 

sma at rtd dot com
Remove ".spam-not" for email

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Sohnen-Moe Associates, Inc (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: sma.spam-not@rtd.com                              30-Nov-99 04:45:05
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 03:28:13
Subj: Re: ZOC & Linux

From: James Moe <sma.spam-not@rtd.com>


Terry Haimann wrote:
> 
> Those of you who use ZOC to telnet(secure) to a Linux box, what are the
> settings that you use? How do you tell ZOC what port to use?  What
encryption
> algorithm do you use.  So far all I can do is ping from one machine to the
> other.

     I looked into this further. You are basically SOL. The american
versio of ZOC does not have the secure shell (ssh) option because of our
idiotic import/export restrictions regarding ordnance and encryption.
     Even if you have the ssh option, linux does not have the ssh
server. At least not the Red Hat distribution.

-- 

sma at rtd dot com
Remove ".spam-not" for email

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Sohnen-Moe Associates, Inc (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: djohnson@isomedia.com                             29-Nov-99 20:51:18
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 03:28:13
Subj: Re: Motherboard recommendations...

From: "David T. Johnson" <djohnson@isomedia.com>

Christian Hennecke wrote:
> 
> Allen Cogbill schrieb:
> > I have a 3-yr old DFI motherboard running OS/2 Warp 4 FP8, Win95, WinNT,
and
> > RedHat Linux. It works quite well. However, I'm considering upgrading the
MB
> > in order to run some apps; the current 64 Mb memory, 166-MHz Pentium II
> > setup does not meet the minimum hardware requirements for a couple of
WinXX
> > apps that I'd like to use!
> >
> > I'd appreciate any suggestions for boards that will run OS/2 well, as this
> > is the OS that I almost always use. The Win95 is just for my kids.
> 
> Well, first you have to decide which architecture you'd like: AMD K6,
> K7, Intel Pentium II/III or Celeron.
> 
> I myself have bought a Tyan Trinity ATX Board three months ago. It runs
> very well with an AMD K6-2 here. Another choice would be the boards from
> FIC which are also very reliable, the VA-503+ (AT) and PA-2013 (ATX).
> Whatever board you buy, choose one with a VIA chipset, since others are
> said to have problems with supporting AGP and the needed current for
> some graphics cards.
> However the Socket 7 boards are not very upgradable. The K6-3 450 will
> be pretty much the end of the line, since AMD will probably not come up
> with a 500 or 550 MHz version to avoid competition with the Athlon 500.

I used an ASUS P5A-B with the ALi Aladdin V chipset with OS/2 with no
problems.  It had a Matrox Millenium G200 AGP video that worked well. 
AMD just today announced a K6-2 533 Mhz processor.  But my
recommendation would be an ASUS K7M ATX Athlon motherboard.

> Who knows what the K6-2+ will bring?
> If you are considering another Intel CPU then go for a BX board. The BX
> chipset has better memory access performance. My father is running OS/2
> on a Siemens D-1107 w/ Intel PII-400 with no problems, but I guess it's
> hard to get in the US.
> 
> Christian Hennecke
> --
> Keep passing the open windows! ("The Hotel New Hampshire", John Irving)

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: itang@hkjc.org.hk                                 30-Nov-99 14:21:29
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 03:28:14
Subj: fix pack installaton

From: "Ivan Tang" <itang@hkjc.org.hk>

Dear all,
I am trying to install an OS2 fix pack in the computers in our LAN. In order
to minimize the possible interpution to our users, I am using
the unattended mode and a response file to install the fix pack.

My question is: At the end of the installation, it prompts the users
to enter ctrl-alt-del to restart the computer. After rebooting
the PC, the fix pack installation program, fservice.exe, is still running. I
just wonder how to make this fservice.exe to terminated by
itself?  I have read books about the CID installation, and found
that there is a key word "RebootRequired" could make the PC to restart
itself by adding it into the response file, but the
response file comes with the fix pack  did not allow me to add such
word, what have I done wrong?

Thanks in advance,

Victor
email: victor.hw.tang@hkjc.org.hk



--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: The Hong Kong Jockey Club (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: lifedata@xxvol.com                                30-Nov-99 00:26:19
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 03:28:14
Subj: Re: netscape quietly quitting

From: lifedata@xxvol.com

James Moe <sma.spam-not@rtd.com> said:

>> I too have only had a problem with Netscape and IBM sites.

>I must amend my statement. Today I had a couple of downloads quit in
>the middle. And it was not from IBM's site. I guess I was just (un?)lucky
>before.

As I said, it is definitely a known problem, and they have tracked it to a
problem in TCP/IP in which a false "end of download" signal gets generated
from somewhere.

Jim L
Remove XX from address to Email
Crooks and kooks will get guns regardless of laws.


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: bCandid - Powering the world's discussions - http
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: JNiffen@IBM.Net                                   29-Nov-99 23:20:12
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 03:28:14
Subj: Re: Help with Building AMD Athalon Based OS/2 System (Round 2)

From: JNiffen <JNiffen@IBM.Net>

Jim Davie wrote:
> 
> UPDATE:  Thanks to everyone that posted a reply to the newsgroups or my
> email on this query for compatibility help with OS/2 Warp 4.
> 
> Based on your feedback, I've updated the list.  The only component I'm not
> sure of is the Creative Labs Sound Blaster Live! Value sound card.  If
> anyone knows for certain if this card is supported under Warp, please let me
> know.  I'm not too concerned since I have another PC with a SB AWE32 which I
> can swap out with the SB Live! card.
> 
> Any yeah or na to anything listed below would be greatly appreciated!!
> 
> Asus K7M Athalon motherboard
> AMD 500 or 550 Athalon CPU
> Athalon Heatsink/CPU Cooler w/Ball Bearing Fan
> Micron 128MB SDRAM - Cas2, 6 layer PCB
> In-Win EN7237 Case with Powerman 300 Watt power supply
> Alps 3.5" 1.44MB Floppy Drive
> Matrox G400 AGP Video with 32MB
> Creative Labs Sound Blaster Live! Value
> IBM Deskstar 22GXP (13GB Ultra 66)
> 3Com Fast Etherlink XL (3C905TX)
> Toshiba 40X ATAPI EIDE CD-Rom Drive
> 
> Thanks!
When I did a project for a medical company a few years ago.  We
discovered that the 3 Com 905B would drop file transferes, after the
first 30 megs or so.  Ever since, I don't trust 3 Com.  Take a look at
the IBM line of ethernet.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Global Network Services - Remote Access Mail & Ne
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: timhowe@iname.com                                 29-Nov-99 21:44:17
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 03:28:14
Subj: Re: Motherboard recommendations...

From: Timothy Howe <timhowe@iname.com>

When I need a motherboard for almost anything, I go to www.epox.com.  Never a
problem with OS/2 and many of their boards are OS/2 certified.  They have also
won several awards from several different places including Anandtech.  Most of
their boards can be purchased from www.paragoncomp.com

Tim

Allen Cogbill wrote:

> I have a 3-yr old DFI motherboard running OS/2 Warp 4 FP8, Win95, WinNT, and
> RedHat Linux. It works quite well. However, I'm considering upgrading the MB
> in order to run some apps; the current 64 Mb memory, 166-MHz Pentium II
> setup does not meet the minimum hardware requirements for a couple of WinXX
> apps that I'd like to use!
>
> I'd appreciate any suggestions for boards that will run OS/2 well, as this
> is the OS that I almost always use. The Win95 is just for my kids.
>
> Allen Cogbill

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Prodigy Internet http://www.prodigy.com (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: tsipple@us.iNoSPAMbm.com                          30-Nov-99 00:07:16
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 03:28:14
Subj: Re: Oracle 8 available for OS/2?

From: Timothy Sipples <tsipple@us.iNoSPAMbm.com>

John Poltorak wrote:
> >Oracle 8.1.5 Enterprise Edition for OS/2 is listed as available on one
> >single page all across the Oracle Web sites, namely, "Platform
> >Availability" table. It is there for almost one year now. Absolutely no
> >any other mentioning of Oracle 8 for OS/2 anywhere else on Oracle sites.
> >Even IBM OS/2 platform as a whole was removed from a list of supported
> >platforms some time ago. Oracle did not answer to my numerous e-mail
> >enquiries about Oracle 8 for OS/2 availability either. I assume this
> >"Platform Availability" note was a typing error of the person who prepared
> >this particular web page :((.
> Maybe if sufficient people ask for v8 they will produce one.
> I recently got an offer of an upgrade from v7.3 which I haven't replied to
> yet. I'd like to ask them what they have available as an upgrade option and
> whether they would be prepared to provide a free copy of NT.
> As far as I can see my only available upgrade path is from Oracle to DB2.

IBM's DB2 UDB is the premier database for OS/2 Warp users.  In certain cases
there are "trade-in" licenses available at a discount when migrating from
competing databases.

Try www.ibm.com/software/db2 for more information.

-- 
Timothy Sipples
IBM Network Computing Software
Chicago, Illinois
Web: http://www.satdirect.com/aviation

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: IBM Network Computing Software (Chicago) (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: news@fenrir.demon.co.uk                           29-Nov-99 08:36:12
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 03:28:14
Subj: Re: DCITU - Digital camera image transfer utility ??

From: "Brian Morrison" <news@fenrir.demon.co.uk>

On Sun, 28 Nov 99 18:44:03 GMT, Andrew Stephenson wrote:

>What download speed you get to OS/2 via the RS232 serial link?

I use the camera at 230400 bps. This started working at about 1.8e
beta, Stephane had to tweak a few things in his code.

>Olympus do not yet seem to have heard of recent technologies like
>USB or insertable microdrives.  (And, though strictly it's OT, do
>your camera batteries last long?)

Well, USB would be no use because I can't see Olympus or anyone else
providing the correct USB driver for OS/2, sadly. As for batteries, I
use Olympus 1450mAh NiMH batteries, I get quite reasonable life from
them, in that they will last a whole day as long as I don't leave the
LCD on all the time.


-- 
Brian Morrison                                       news@fenrir.demon.co.uk
               to reply, change address from 'news' to 'bdm'
 ...Grim faced, cold as fishwife's fingers, he snatched from the wall
 the sickle-sharp boar tusks he used for defacing Readers' Digest....


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: The Fool and Bladder Face-Jumping Team (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: Thomas.Kellerer@tps-labs.com                      30-Nov-99 08:31:27
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 05:19:05
Subj: Re: Java 1.2 for OS/2

From: Thomas Kellerer <Thomas.Kellerer@tps-labs.com>

Craig,

some things I have noticed, but I still have some programs (e.g. some of
the examples of Thinking In Java, 2nd edition) which will not compile. 

Cheers
Thomas


Craig Benbow wrote:
> 
> You can't just look at the version numbers of the JDK you must look
> inside!
> 
> If you look into JDK 1.1.8 from IBM you will see almost all the features
> in Suns JDK 1.2 BUT IBM are not calling it 1.2 because they don't think
> it is fit to be called 1.2 yet.
> 
> I have just installed 1.1.8 from IBM with the swing extensions and it
> smokes!  In comparison to Suns VM on Windows JDK & JRE 1.1.8 for OS/2 is
> light years ahead in speed and stability.  Don't know about you but I am
> quite happy to wait to get this level of performance.
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Craig
> 
> Thomas Kellerer wrote:
> 
> > Does anybody know if and when IBM will release a Java 1.2 for OS/2???
> >
> > Regards
> > Thomas

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: nemo@union.edu                                    30-Nov-99 01:42:21
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 05:19:05
Subj: Re: problem w/ cdrw

From: nemo@union.edu

In <943928657snz@deltrak.demon.co.uk>, on 11/30/99 
   at 02:24 AM, ames@deltrak.demon.co.uk (Andrew Stephenson) said:

>> Bear in mind, for now the cdrw has to be the only cdrom in the system. It
>> is set as drive K:. I've dropped cdfs from config.sys but that hasn't
>> helped much. How do I set up the cdrw to be my one and only?

>We did have a brief discussion of a closely related problem, not long
>ago.  Since then, testing some of the suggestions given at that time, I
>have found that it pays to set up the CD-RW exactly as RSJ want it set
>up: use LOCKCDR, etc.

Lot's of good info in your message but this stands out. I've been advised
to rem this line out. I've got to try all the permutations so in it goes
again and I'll try another reboot.

F.

-----------------------------------------------------------
      Felmon John Davis		
     davisf@union.edu	|  davisf@capital.net     
     Union College /  Schenectady, NY
     - insert standard doxastic disclaimers -
     OS/2 - ma kauft koi katz em sack 
-----------------------------------------------------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Logical Net (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: Thomas.Kellerer@tps-labs.com                      30-Nov-99 08:48:09
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 05:19:05
Subj: Re: New modem list

From: Thomas Kellerer <Thomas.Kellerer@tps-labs.com>

With most of the modern modems you do not need any initialization. They
will negotiate everything with the other side, and choose the best
settings based on the line quality and the capabilities. 

If you took one of the "Standard modem" entries and remove all the init
stuff except maybe for a AT&F (to reset the modem) everything should
work fine.

Thomas

James Moe wrote:
> 
> Hello,
>     Does anyone know where I can find a current modem init string list?
> It used to be known as MODEM.IAK. The list I have is rather dated and
> does not have *any* 56K modems listed.
> 
> --
> 
> sma at rtd dot com
> Remove ".spam-not" for email

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: cbzh@my-deja.com                                  30-Nov-99 08:35:05
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 05:19:05
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: cbzh@my-deja.com

In article <81uc0f$nuh$2@dagger.ab.videon.ca>,
  larso@ualberta.ca wrote:
> As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw Jerry Prather write:
> > (Lars P Ormberg) writes:
>
> > :>How?  Does MS send people to your home, tie up your family, hold a
match
> > :>over a gas canister, and force you to sign on the dotted line for
Windows
> > :>2000?
> >
> > Lars, I was going to respond to this with a flame that you should
> > have read the rest of my post before replying so knee-jerkily,
>
> I did read it.
>
> Does Microsoft send people to force you to buy their products?  Which
gun is
> being placed at your skull?
>
> Or is it a matter of Microsoft "forcing you" to buy the product by
providing
> a valued product at an affordable rate?

Oh, that's it: I am 100% convinced now!

So I must have _willingly_ bought the two never used and never needed -
but surely paid for! - Win95 licenses I still have somewhere around,
because there was actually no gun around anywhere??!

I still cannot see why I should have spent money for these licenses, but
maybe I still wanted them unconsciously?? Or it was in a moment that I
felt some kind of pity with poor Billy boy and I just wanted to make a
free donation for him???

Still not understanding my motivation thus - but it was sure no monopoly
power that was forcing me - "because monopolies are always imposed by
governments" (never contradict the Ormberg dogma!), and our government
sure would have allowed selling computers without Windows licenses!!!

Cornelis Bockemhl
<cbockem@datacomm.ch>

>
> --
> Lars P. Ormberg     ICQ#:8827066
> mailto:larso@ualberta.ca
> The University of Lars:   http://www.ualberta.ca/~larso/
>
> "The way you're bathed in light, reminds me of that night
> God laid me down into your rose garden of trust and I was
> swept away with nothin' left to say some helpless fool
> yeah I was lost in a swoon of peace you're all I need to
> find so when the time is right come to me sweetly, come
> to me come to me..love will lead us, alright.  love will
> lead us, she will lead us.  can you hear the dolphin's
> cry?  see the road rise up to meet us its in the air we
> breathe tonight love will lead us, she will lead us"
>                             -Live, "The Dolphin's Cry"
>


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Deja.com - Before you buy. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: tholenantispam@hawaii.edu                         30-Nov-99 09:16:20
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 10:24:19
Subj: font search

From: tholenantispam@hawaii.edu (Dave Tholen)

I'm looking for a font that extends the encircled numbers found in the
WingDings font provided with Warp 4.

ASCII 139 to 149 in WingDings contains the numbers 0 through 10, inside
a filled circle.  Does anyone know of a font that provides the same, but
for the numbers 11 and higher?  I don't know how high I ultimately might
want to go, but up to 19 would probably handle most, if not all, of the
cases I have in mind.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: IFA B-111 (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rsteiner@visi.com                                 30-Nov-99 02:49:24
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 10:24:19
Subj: Re: PC Week - Peter Coffee

From: rsteiner@visi.com (Richard Steiner)

Here in comp.os.os2.misc, esther@bitranch.com (Esther Schindler)
spake unto us, saying:

>Complain to the source. And, when deserved, offer praise to the 
>source. Everything else is for your own entertainment.

While I agree that the first two should be done above all (if you have
a problem with someone's viewpoint, is is most effective to let them
know politely but directly), I disagree with your last phrase.

Sometimes it's interesting (*not* just entertaining) to see who might
have the same opinion you do about something, to see who might have a
different but equally strong opinion, to find out *why* people have the
opinions that they do, and maybe even to learn a thing or two.

Since you apparently know/knew Peter, I was hoping for some insight, or
at the very least in your own opinions about the relevance of the things
he was talking about.

If you don't want to play, tho, that's fine with me.  :-)

>(Sometimes it's hard, or impossible, to do so. To what IBM email ID 
>does one offer either praise or criticism?)

Yes, that is a difficult problem, particularly when the IBM contacts I
still know are not the ones responsible for current events (and most of
the ones I used to know are no longer with IBM at all).

-- 
   -Rich Steiner  >>>--->  rsteiner@visi.com  >>>---> Bloomington, MN
     OS/2 + BeOS + Linux + Solaris + Win95 + WinNT4 + FreeBSD + DOS
      + VMWare + Fusion + vMac + Executor = PC Hobbyist Heaven! :-)
              Programming is an art form that fights back.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: FIELDATA FORTRAN ENTHUSIASTS CLUB (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: jknott@ibm.net                                    30-Nov-99 05:54:17
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 10:24:19
Subj: Re: delay starting an app from startup group?

From: jknott@ibm.net (James Knott)

In article <s453b1m7mvm48@corp.supernews.com>,
"Kerry Lord" <klord@bhbt.com> wrote:
>Is there a way to delay an application from starting in the startup group?
>
>We have an OS/2 Warp3 that reboots itself every night and we also have a
>backup agent program that needs to be loaded so the OS/2 box can be backed
>up.
>
>I've put the back up agent software into the Startup Group, but since
>another application is still loading the back up software can't load until
>about a minute later.  Since this happens at midnight, no one is around to
>start the back up program.

Does your backup program have a scheduler?  If so, just set it to run 
at 12:05.  If the program can be started from a command line, you can 
use any scheduler utility or rexx cmd file to start it later.  There 
is even a REXX command (syssleep) just for this type of need.

-- 
E-mail jknott@ca.ibm.com
_________________________________________________________________________
The above opinions are my own and not those of ISM Corp., a subsidiary of
IBM Canada Ltd.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Global Network Services - Remote Access Mail & Ne
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: csaba_r@my-deja.com                               30-Nov-99 11:27:22
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 10:24:19
Subj: Re: Help with Building AMD Athalon Based OS/2 System (Round 2)

From: csaba_r@my-deja.com (Csaba Raduly)

JNiffen@ibm.net (JNiffen) wrote in <38435088.6174@IBM.Net>:

>Jim Davie wrote:
>> 
>> UPDATE:  Thanks to everyone that posted a reply to the newsgroups or
>> my email on this query for compatibility help with OS/2 Warp 4.
>> 
>> Based on your feedback, I've updated the list.  The only component I'm
>> not sure of is the Creative Labs Sound Blaster Live! Value sound card.
>>  If anyone knows for certain if this card is supported under Warp,
>> please let me know.  I'm not too concerned since I have another PC
>> with a SB AWE32 which I can swap out with the SB Live! card.
>> 
>> Any yeah or na to anything listed below would be greatly appreciated!!
>> 

As thing are now, The SB Live Value is a no-no.
AWE32 was the last with OS/2 support (maybe AWE64 in beta, never official)
Creative recently published the (Linux) sources for SB Live driver.
It still doesn't support MIDI (AFAIK). And it will be a heck of a task to 
adapt the sources for OS/2

[snip]

>When I did a project for a medical company a few years ago.  We
>discovered that the 3 Com 905B would drop file transferes, after the
>first 30 megs or so.  Ever since, I don't trust 3 Com.  Take a look at
>the IBM line of ethernet.
>
Strange. Our company oses 3Com 3C906B cards almost exclusively.
I've sent 90+ MB files across without problems. Even has OS/2 drivers :-)

Csaba
-- 
-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- 
Version 3.1
GCS/MU d- s:- a30 C++$ UL+ P+>+++ L++ E- W+ N++ o? K? w++>$ O++$ M-
V- PS PE Y PGP- t+ 5 X++ R* tv++ b++ DI+++ D++ G- e+++ h-- r-- !y+
-----END GEEK CODE BLOCK----- 

Csaba Raduly,    Software Developer (OS/2),    Sophos Anti-Virus
mailto:csaba.raduly@sophos.com            http://www.sophos.com/
US Support +1 888 SOPHOS 9            UK Support +44 1235 559933
Life is complex, with real and imaginary parts.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: SOPHOS Plc (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com                           29-Nov-99 08:17:01
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 11:23:02
Subj: Re: Java 1.2 for OS/2

From: Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com>

On <uprsNDlpp0Dh-pn2-Pv32CUGl0Rf8@localhost>, on 11/28/99 at 10:16 PM,
   jhimmel@i-2000.com (James Himmelman) said:

> > Sorry, but quarter when speaking of time measurement has a specific
> > meaning. If the person meant the second fourth he or she should have so
> > stated.

> So if I said to you "It's been that way for the last quarter of a 
> century" (very common usage), you would think it's been that way for 
> the last 3 months?

Common usage? Not really. Very open to misinterpretation.

>  
> > Quarter is a word with many meanings and must be read in context. In the
> > context of date measurement, quarter by itself means a 3 month period of a
> > calendar year.

> Right, but he did not use "quarter" by itself. He said the second 
> quarter of the next millennium.

Which to me and most businessmen means April, May, and June of 2001.

> > Thus, when someone wrote second quarter of the third millenium,
> > intelligent people read that as the second 3 months of the year 2001.

> No, intelligent people know that a quarter of a millennium is 250 yrs.

> > he or she meant otherwise, then he or she did not express himself or
> > herself properly. 
> > When one uses quarter refering to time measurement, one modifies it if he
> > or she means other than the first three, second three, third three, or
> > fourth three months of a standard calendar. If one is referring to a
> > fiscal year, one writes fiscal quarter.

> Exactly, and since he modified it with the word "millennium", it is 
> reasonable to assume quarter is dividing the millennium into 4 equal 

It is just as reasonable to read it as I did.

> parts. If he did not intend to divide the millennium, than he should 
> have simply said the 2nd quarter of next year. 

That would be April, May, and June of 2000, not 2001. For your
information, the next millenium begins on January 1, 2001. The last year
of the Second Millenium is 2000. The millenium and century do not change
in on January 1, 2000. They change on January 1, 2001.

> Just because the use of the word "quarter" as a 3 month time frame is 
> common usage, it does NOT mean that the word can't be used to mean 
> other periods of time. If someone states that "it's been that way for 
> the last quarter of this millennium", I would assume that he meant the

Since we are still in the current millenium, the meaning would be more
apparent as the last 250 or so years. But when one is speaking of a time
not yet arrived, then my interpretation is the correct one.

> last 250 yrs, simply because he specifically chose NOT to say the much
> clearer "it's been that way for the last quarter of this year" - or 
> even "It's been that way for the last quarter". He went out of his way
> to implicate "millennium" as the period that quarter was defining. 
> "Quarter of a century" is commonly understood as one forth of 100 yrs,
> and "Quarter of a millennium" can be understood to mean one forth of 
> 1000 yrs, even to "intelligent" people.

Quarter of *a* millenium would be 250 years. First quarter of the next
millenium would be January, February, March of 2001.

> Just like if you said to someone "I'll give you a quarter of my weeks 
> pay", he will most likely NOT be thinking 25 cents, even though you 
> were talking about money.

However, if I said I will give you the first quarter of my next week's
(proper spelling BTW) pay you would have no right to expect more than 25
cents.

A quarter is a fourth part. First (second, third, fourth) quarter when
referring to time and without specific contrary information is a 3 month
period.


--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: bobg@Pics.com
Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 12
MR/2 Ice Registration Number 67
Aut Pax Aut Bellum
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com                           29-Nov-99 08:26:03
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 11:23:02
Subj: Re: Java 1.2 for OS/2

From: Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com>

On <943815799snz@deltrak.demon.co.uk>, on 11/28/99 at 07:03 PM,
   ames@deltrak.demon.co.uk (Andrew Stephenson) said:

> >
> > Now as I understand the term "quarter" when it comes to calendars, the
> > term refers to a period of time of 3 months. Thus the second quarter of
> > the third millenium would be April, May, and June of the year 2001.

> (BTW I caught your homily on meanings of "quarter".  Interesting, though
> my Concise Oxford Dic'y had not encountered the "9 inches" one.  Is this
> related to "giving quarter"?  The COD has a couple of meanings you did
> not list.  Such a versatile word.)

No, giving quarter to a foe refers to providing shelter. The 9 inches is a
British usage where things are more often referred to in yards rather than
feet as we do here. If one travels in Britain, they see signs saying
things like "Exeter exit 1200 yards" where we would see Exeter exit 1/4
mile or 1000 feet or some such.

> What _would_ you say if you did want to mean "the second quarter
> millennium of the third millennium", without being so plonky? <g> --
> Andrew Stephenson

Next quarter millenium would concisely reflect the meaning.

--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: bobg@Pics.com
Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 12
MR/2 Ice Registration Number 67
Aut Pax Aut Bellum
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: klord@bhbt.com                                    29-Nov-99 09:20:29
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 11:23:02
Subj: ps2 mouse support?

From: "Kerry Lord" <klord@bhbt.com>

PS2 mouse support?

We have OS/2 Warp3 and need to get the mouse to work, but since the vendor
put it on a new PC with PS2 mouse, we haven't been able to use it.  Then
vendor said sorry can't do, because of IRQ conflicts..

Is this true or is there a way around this?

Thanks!

--



--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: klord@bhbt.com                                    29-Nov-99 09:26:12
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 11:23:02
Subj: delay starting an app from startup group?

From: "Kerry Lord" <klord@bhbt.com>

Is there a way to delay an application from starting in the startup group?

We have an OS/2 Warp3 that reboots itself every night and we also have a
backup agent program that needs to be loaded so the OS/2 box can be backed
up.

I've put the back up agent software into the Startup Group, but since
another application is still loading the back up software can't load until
about a minute later.  Since this happens at midnight, no one is around to
start the back up program.

Any ideas?

Thanks!

--
=============================================
Bar Harbor Banking and Trust
Kerry Lord - IT Engineer
82 Main Street
Bar Harbor,  Maine 04609
(800) 237-9601 x2309



--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: jspepper@my-deja.com                              29-Nov-99 14:25:03
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 11:23:02
Subj: Replacement Disks

From: jspepper@my-deja.com

I just purchased OS/2 Warp 3 from eBay.  Disk #1 is unusable.
Does IBM offer replacement disks?  Would someone be willing
to make me a disk image of their disk #1.

aTdHvAaNnKcSe,

--
Jeff


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Deja.com - Before you buy. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: lsunley@mb.sympatico.ca                           29-Nov-99 15:03:13
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 11:23:02
Subj: Re: ps2 mouse support?

From: lsunley@mb.sympatico.ca (Lorne Sunley)

On Mon, 29 Nov 1999 14:20:58, "Kerry Lord" <klord@bhbt.com> wrote:

> PS2 mouse support?
> 
> We have OS/2 Warp3 and need to get the mouse to work, but since the vendor
> put it on a new PC with PS2 mouse, we haven't been able to use it.  Then
> vendor said sorry can't do, because of IRQ conflicts..
> 
> Is this true or is there a way around this?

The vendor's statement could be true. The PS2 mouse port
is set to IRQ 12. If you have some other device that is also
on IRQ 12 the mouse would not work correctly.

Of course you could just change the IRQ of the device
that generates the conflict.

Was the Warp 3 install using a serial mouse before?

In that case there might be some setting that is keeping
it from looking for the mouse on the PS2 port.
There are three statements that load the default mouse
drivers in OS/2

DEVICE=C:\OS2\MDOS\VMOUSE.SYS
DEVICE=C:\OS2\BOOT\POINTDD.SYS
DEVICE=C:\OS2\BOOT\MOUSE.SYS

Installations that had a serial mouse may have qualifiers
on these statements. 


--

Lorne Sunley

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: MBnet Networking Inc. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: lsunley@mb.sympatico.ca                           29-Nov-99 15:05:16
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 11:23:02
Subj: Re: Replacement Disks

From: lsunley@mb.sympatico.ca (Lorne Sunley)

On Mon, 29 Nov 1999 14:25:07, jspepper@my-deja.com wrote:

> I just purchased OS/2 Warp 3 from eBay.  Disk #1 is unusable.
> Does IBM offer replacement disks?  Would someone be willing
> to make me a disk image of their disk #1.
> 

If you got a CD-ROM with Warp 3 you can generate a new
diskette from the CD by running the CDINST command or
batch file. It's in the root directory of the CD.

--

Lorne Sunley

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: MBnet Networking Inc. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: ames@deltrak.demon.co.uk                          29-Nov-99 14:30:26
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 11:23:03
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: ames@deltrak.demon.co.uk (Andrew Stephenson)

In article <3842703d$3$obot$mr2ice@news.pics.com>
	   bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com "Bob Germer" writes:

> [...]
>
> No American is forced to pay taxes to support an unelected head
> of state who lives 3,000 miles away and only sets foot in the
> country every decade or less.
>
> [...]

Sorry to stop you in mid-flow, Bob.  If it's Queen Liz 2 of the
Windsors we're discussing, the way I heard it is, we in the UK
pay for her upkeep (and that of her sprogs) and the rest of the
Commonwealth are allowed to borrow her, essentially free, over
the weekends.  A smart move on their part, I've always thought.

If it's otherwise, then yes I suppose I'd be a tad vexed too.

But look at it this way: the Windsors are prepared to do those
dirty jobs we commoners won't touch: read out hours of boring
speeches; shake hands with innumerable scumbag foreign leaders
(along with the nice ones, of course); oversee horse breeding;
help keep down the grouse population; house-sit those draughty
old palaces; test ickky recipes;...  Hey, it's not easy.  Dare
say they even have to be nice to King Billy when he comes round.
--
Andrew Stephenson

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: DNS (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: larso@commodore.                                  29-Nov-99 17:04:27
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 11:23:03
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg)

As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw Csaba Raduly write:
> larso@ualberta.ca (Lars P Ormberg) wrote in

> >> The problem with M$ is that they are not living by those laws. 
> >> M$ _is_ forcing me to "eat at their restaurant". 
> >
> >How?  Does MS send people to your home, tie up your family, hold a match
> >over a gas canister, and force you to sign on the dotted line for
> >Windows 2000?
> 
> No, but they say to the PC vendors: preload WinWhatever on EVERY machine 
> you sell, OR ELSE we won't give you WinWhatever OEM licenses and you'll be 
> out of business in no time.

Okay, so in other words you don't think it should be legal for Microsoft to
be involved in a contract?

-- 
Lars P. Ormberg     ICQ#:8827066
mailto:larso@ualberta.ca
The University of Lars:   http://www.ualberta.ca/~larso/

"The way you're bathed in light, reminds me of that night
God laid me down into your rose garden of trust and I was
swept away with nothin' left to say some helpless fool
yeah I was lost in a swoon of peace you're all I need to
find so when the time is right come to me sweetly, come
to me come to me..love will lead us, alright.  love will
lead us, she will lead us.  can you hear the dolphin's
cry?  see the road rise up to meet us its in the air we
breathe tonight love will lead us, she will lead us"
                            -Live, "The Dolphin's Cry"

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: PowerSurfr - High Speed Internet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: larso@commodore.                                  29-Nov-99 17:09:17
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 11:23:03
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg)

As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw Jerry Prather write:
> (Lars P Ormberg) writes:

> :>How?  Does MS send people to your home, tie up your family, hold a match
> :>over a gas canister, and force you to sign on the dotted line for Windows
> :>2000?
> 
> Lars, I was going to respond to this with a flame that you should
> have read the rest of my post before replying so knee-jerkily,

I did read it.

Does Microsoft send people to force you to buy their products?  Which gun is
being placed at your skull?

Or is it a matter of Microsoft "forcing you" to buy the product by providing
a valued product at an affordable rate?

-- 
Lars P. Ormberg     ICQ#:8827066
mailto:larso@ualberta.ca
The University of Lars:   http://www.ualberta.ca/~larso/

"The way you're bathed in light, reminds me of that night
God laid me down into your rose garden of trust and I was
swept away with nothin' left to say some helpless fool
yeah I was lost in a swoon of peace you're all I need to
find so when the time is right come to me sweetly, come
to me come to me..love will lead us, alright.  love will
lead us, she will lead us.  can you hear the dolphin's
cry?  see the road rise up to meet us its in the air we
breathe tonight love will lead us, she will lead us"
                            -Live, "The Dolphin's Cry"

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: PowerSurfr - High Speed Internet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: larso@commodore.                                  29-Nov-99 17:12:01
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 11:23:03
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg)

As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw Glenn Davies write:
> On 29 Nov 1999 08:22:12 GMT, larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) wrote:

> >> The main problem is being obscured by examples that do not apply.  MS
> >> is a MONOPOLY.
> >
> >No, it isn't.
> 
> It has been ruled to be an monopoly under US law.

Well, being "ruled a monopoly under US Law" doesn't make it a monopoly.

> >> When a business becomes a monopoly
> >
> >Unless government gives it a hand, a business cannot become a monopoly.
> 
> Time to sign up for some buisness and economic classes for next term.

Time to ask a simple question: how does this monopoly keep a competitor from
forming.  All that is needed is a mechanism.

> >The finding of fact is comprised of fiction.
> 
> As if you have even read it let alone understand it.

Read, understood, almost puked.

-- 
Lars P. Ormberg     ICQ#:8827066
mailto:larso@ualberta.ca
The University of Lars:   http://www.ualberta.ca/~larso/

"The way you're bathed in light, reminds me of that night
God laid me down into your rose garden of trust and I was
swept away with nothin' left to say some helpless fool
yeah I was lost in a swoon of peace you're all I need to
find so when the time is right come to me sweetly, come
to me come to me..love will lead us, alright.  love will
lead us, she will lead us.  can you hear the dolphin's
cry?  see the road rise up to meet us its in the air we
breathe tonight love will lead us, she will lead us"
                            -Live, "The Dolphin's Cry"

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: PowerSurfr - High Speed Internet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: ktkelvin@yahoo.com                                30-Nov-99 00:40:28
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 11:23:03
Subj: Re: QUESTION: OBJECTDESKTOP ON WSEB?

From: "Kelvin Tsang" <ktkelvin@yahoo.com>

You mean the Warp Server for e-business ?
I am using it with OD 2.0, just follow the
installation instruction, and it works fine
here. (Except the Drive Navigator, it sometimes
cause WPS freeze, so I removed this feature now).

Kelvin
--
#-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-#
Hong Kong OS/2 User Group
http://www.os2.org.hk
news://news.freeforum.org/comp.os.os2
#-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-#



filippo sartori <fisa@jet.uk> wrote in message
news:38423E79.52EC5175@jet.uk...
> HI
> I tried to install Object Desktop 2.0 on Workspace for e-business.
> I failed. Did anybody succeeded?
> Is it incompatible?
>
> Regards
>
> Filippo Sartori
>
> Please mail me also.
>
> Thanks



--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Still an OS/2 fan ! (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rcrane@octa4.net.au                               29-Nov-99 16:25:05
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 11:23:03
Subj: Re: netscape quietly quitting

From: rcrane@octa4.net.au (Richard A Crane)

On Sun, 28 Nov 1999 21:00:29, James Moe 
<sma.spam-not@rtd.com> wrote:

> 
> 
> Fritz Oppliger wrote:
> > 
> > NS Navigator 4.61  cheats on downloads in a most insidious way. it quietly
> > quits.
> > 
> > I know others have seen this problem.
> > 
> > Is this being addressed?  which chains do I rattle?
> > 
>     The only site that I have seen the shows this problem is IBM's. I
> have had multiple downloads running from other sites without a problem.
> In general I have found that mid-afternoon (MST) seems to be the best
> time for IBM downloads. I have seen then quiet termination using a T1
> connection to the Internet as well as a modem connection. Generally I
> use FTP directly or WGET if I do not have a choice between FTP and HTTP
> in Navigator; HTTP seems to be more reliable in this respect.
>     There were some discussions about this, then silence after the GA
> release. I get the impression it is a problem with the AIX operating
> system's FTPD server, or whatever acts in that capacity (like part of a
> web server). 
> 
> -- 
> 
> sma at rtd dot com
> Remove ".spam-not" for email
I too have only had a problem with Netscape and IBM sites.
However my memory seems to insidiously disappear whilst 
running Netscape 4.6.
I note that I've seen posts from 2 of the IBM netscape team 
on comp.os.os2.bugs recently hence the ading of it to this 
thread.
Richard A Crane
Barrister & Solicitor
slightly altered email (anti-spamming) rcrane AT 
octa4.net.au 
OR rcrane AT attglobal.net

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Octa4 Pty Ltd (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: ffitz@my-deja.com                                 29-Nov-99 15:29:27
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 11:23:03
Subj: Re: The ATI RAge Fury Pro card

From: ffitz@my-deja.com

If you search hard enough on deja.com, you'll see a long
history of posts about the ATI Rage Pro with OS/2.  I
have a Dell with the ATI Rage Pro chipset on the mother-
board.  For most applications, the GRADD drivers will
work fine, but there are some specific cases which will
result in black rectangles instead of some graphic
images.  One case is the toolbar icons of IBM Visual C++
Visual Builder.  There are some non-GRADD drivers out
there, but I never could get them to work at all.  Even
in plain VGA mode, the black rectangle problem will occur.

YMMV.

In article <lLS%3.1669$2a.128625@elnws01>,
  "Richard Hinton" <rhinton@mediaone.net> wrote:
> November 28, 1999
>
> I stopped into a computer discounter yesterday and saw this ATI Rage
Fury
> Pro card with 32 megs of
> video ram.  I was curious if it ran in OS-2 version 4?   I  suspect
it will
> run in Win98, and maybe in Linux,
> but not sure....
> I stopped at the OS-2 device driver page and looked at thes "GRADD"
drivers
> which work on
> the "RAGE" family of chips, among others, but don't know if that
includes
> the newest one...
>
> Richard N. Hinton
> rhinton@mediaone.net
>
>


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Deja.com - Before you buy. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: ames@deltrak.demon.co.uk                          29-Nov-99 15:07:06
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 11:23:03
Subj: Re: Java 1.2 for OS/2

From: ames@deltrak.demon.co.uk (Andrew Stephenson)

In article <38427fa2$10$obot$mr2ice@news.pics.com>
	   bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com "Bob Germer" writes:

> On <943815799snz@deltrak.demon.co.uk>, on 11/28/99 at 07:03 PM,
>    ames@deltrak.demon.co.uk (Andrew Stephenson) said:
>
> [...]  The 9 inches is a British usage where things are more
> often referred to in yards rather than feet as we do here. If
> one travels in Britain, they see signs saying things like
> "Exeter exit 1200 yards" where we would see Exeter exit 1/4
> mile or 1000 feet or some such.

As a Brit, resident in the UK, may I raise a quizzical eyebrow at
that information?  I cannot recall anyone ever using "quarter" to
mean 9 inches here.  Life might have been much more interesting
if they had.  (Or, er, did I just flunk a Deadpan Humo(u)r Test?
Never can tell with you yanks: Windows _was_ a joke -- right?)

"Yards", alas, slipped off our road signs some time ago.  Barring
the odd pre-Flood holdover, it's all miles (or fractions), with
here and there a few metres, or no distance given at all.  To be
doubly sure, I checked this with the Traffic Division of my local
big police station.  A sergeant could think of no cases of yards.
I fear that one has had it.  :-(

OTOH, we Brits are a funny old crowd.  So perhaps there is still
some tiny island, whose daily life is one long Ealing comedy and
where it makes sense to write yards on those motorway signs.  :-)
--
Andrew Stephenson

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: DNS (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: sma.spam-not@rtd.com                              29-Nov-99 15:44:07
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 11:23:03
Subj: Re: delay starting an app from startup group?

From: James Moe <sma.spam-not@rtd.com>


Kerry Lord wrote:
> 
> Is there a way to delay an application from starting in the startup group?
> 
> We have an OS/2 Warp3 that reboots itself every night and we also have a
> backup agent program that needs to be loaded so the OS/2 box can be backed
> up.
> [ ... ]

1. Move the important startup programs into STARTUP.CMD. That way
everything runs sequentially whereas programs are run concurrently from
the startup folder. The backup program would be the last thing in the
script to start.


2. You can use a rexx script that is called from the startup group. It
would have this in it:

/*
	Call and register the REXX extended functions.
*/
	if RxFuncQuery('SysLoadFuncs') then do
	    call RxFuncAdd 'SysLoadFuncs', 'RexxUtil', 'SysLoadFuncs'
	    call SysLoadFuncs
	 end

	syssleep SECS_TO_WAIT;
	'my_backup_program';


-- 

sma at rtd dot com
Remove ".spam-not" for email

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Sohnen-Moe Associates, Inc (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: sma.spam-not@rtd.com                              29-Nov-99 15:55:04
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 11:23:03
Subj: Re: ZOC & Linux

From: James Moe <sma.spam-not@rtd.com>


Terry Haimann wrote:
> 
> I'm sorry, I meant to say secure shell.  The thing is I'm not quite sure if
> it is running telnet and I just can't connect or if it is running ssh and
the
> connection is being refused.  I looked at the etc/services file and found
> some lines with telnet in them:
> 
> telnet          23/tcp
> rtelnet         107/tcp
> rtelnet         107/udp
> 
    Unfortunately I do not know anymore than that. I have never used it.
    Can you telnet to the linux system? If so, the connection is not the
problem.

-- 

sma at rtd dot com
Remove ".spam-not" for email

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Sohnen-Moe Associates, Inc (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rcrane@octa4.net.au                               29-Nov-99 16:25:04
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 11:23:03
Subj: Re: Java 1.2 for OS/2

From: rcrane@octa4.net.au (Richard A Crane)

On Sun, 28 Nov 1999 15:32:16, Bob Germer 
<bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com> wrote:
[snipped mucho stuff some giving USA examples]
> Thus, when someone wrote second quarter of the third millenium,
> intelligent people read that as the second 3 months of the year 2001. If
> he or she meant otherwise, then he or she did not express himself or
> herself properly.
> 
No Bob, to many people the reference to a quarter with the 
reference to a millenium would be taken as a reference to a 
quarter of 1000 years.
I suspect this may be one those differences between USof An 
and English (particularly as she is spoke in the colonies).
Richard A Crane
Barrister & Solicitor
slightly altered email (anti-spamming) rcrane AT 
octa4.net.au 
OR rcrane AT attglobal.net

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Octa4 Pty Ltd (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: sma.spam-not@rtd.com                              29-Nov-99 15:49:26
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 11:23:03
Subj: Re: ps2 mouse support?

From: James Moe <sma.spam-not@rtd.com>


Kerry Lord wrote:
> 
> PS2 mouse support?
> 
> We have OS/2 Warp3 and need to get the mouse to work, but since the vendor
> put it on a new PC with PS2 mouse, we haven't been able to use it.  Then
> vendor said sorry can't do, because of IRQ conflicts..
> 
> Is this true or is there a way around this?
> 
    It's hard to imagine what would need IRQ 12 so adamantly that it
could not be re-assigned. The ps/2 support uses irq 12 as the standard
interrupt.
    Sometimes ps/2 support must be enabled in the BIOS.

    If the vendor cannot release irq 12, your only other choice is to
use one of the serial ports for mouse input. Ps/2-to-comport connector
adapters are commonplace. Your vendor should have suggested this itself.
It does not sound like a very helpful vendor.

-- 

sma at rtd dot com
Remove ".spam-not" for email

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Sohnen-Moe Associates, Inc (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: ahc@lanl.gov                                      29-Nov-99 08:50:08
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 11:23:03
Subj: Motherboard recommendations...

From: "Allen Cogbill" <ahc@lanl.gov>

I have a 3-yr old DFI motherboard running OS/2 Warp 4 FP8, Win95, WinNT, and 
RedHat Linux. It works quite well. However, I'm considering upgrading the MB 
in order to run some apps; the current 64 Mb memory, 166-MHz Pentium II 
setup does not meet the minimum hardware requirements for a couple of WinXX 
apps that I'd like to use!

I'd appreciate any suggestions for boards that will run OS/2 well, as this 
is the OS that I almost always use. The Win95 is just for my kids.

Allen Cogbill



--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Los Alamos National Laboratory (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rjf@yyycomasia.com                                29-Nov-99 15:50:20
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 11:23:03
Subj: Re: PC Week - Peter Coffee

From: rjf@yyycomasia.com (rj friedman)

On Sun, 28 Nov 1999 14:23:33, 
raphaelt@netnews.worldnet.att.net (Raphael Tennenbaum) 
wrote:

Martin Nisshagen <forkd4nisse@dtek.chalmers.se> wrote:
>...The Microsoft witness, Jim Allchin, realized that
>the demo had been made by Microsoft employees who apparently didn't
understand
>the difference between evidence and demonstration. 

Oh sure.  And Bill didn't have sex with that girl.

Isn't it amazing how these MS loving warhogs will go to no 
ends of sophistry in order to defend a pack of liars who 
thought they could get away with presenting falsified 
evidence in a federal court. They are lucky that the judge 
didn't throw their sorry butts into jail for perjury.




________________________________________________________

[RJ]                 OS/2 - Live it, or live with it. 
rj friedman          Team ABW              
Taipei, Taiwan       rjf@yyycomasia.com 

To send email - remove the `yyy'
________________________________________________________

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: SEEDNet News Service (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: cvopicka@erols.com                                29-Nov-99 11:28:17
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 11:23:03
Subj: WinOS2 .dll file in Wart 4.0

From: Ron Vopicka <cvopicka@erols.com>

I've run into an interesting (not really) Win 3.1 bug in a program I
receive that is updated on a quarterly schedule.  The latest update has
some problems.  I have determined that the same program which will run
under Win98 does NOT have the problem.  Obviously, something changed.

In casting about for some way to keep from being forced into W98, I have
started to wonder if my dlls on winos2\system are the most current and
hopefully most bug-free

I have looked thru the fix pack fixes and not seen anything significant
that directly indicates any dll changes (but they could be hidden).  So
I have started wondering about the safety/advisability of updating using
any of the genuine MS Win 3.1 .dlls (assmuming there are any updates). 
Now I know that SOME windows support was changed to fit 3.1 into OS/2,
but for years now I have never wondered which programs might be
updatable and which MUST NOT BE.

Before I go thru the unbelievable hassle of trying to find out it there
are any MS .dlls that might even be candidates for updating, I wonder if
anyone else has made an attempt in this direction?

Lest someone suggest I go back to the older, working program, I'm afraid
that it has been cleverly implemented in such a way that I would soon
strangle in my own data update file volume... and the program knows
where the updates start and where the data on CD ends... so sadly, this
doesn't seem to be an option.

My problem could be even worse, it may be an update of Access 2.0 that
is internal to the supplied program, in which case I am (or rather OS/2
is) dead.

Ron

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: jspepper@my-deja.com                              29-Nov-99 16:43:28
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 11:23:03
Subj: Re: Replacement Disks

From: jspepper@my-deja.com

> If you got a CD-ROM with Warp 3 you can generate a new
> diskette from the CD by running the CDINST command or
> batch file. It's in the root directory of the CD.

Unfortunately, I only have the diskette version.  Would you be willing
to make make me a disk (I'm willing to pay), or send me the
"disk-making" executable from the cd?  Please?

I didn't know there was a cd version ... I'm thinking about buying it
on eBay.

--
Jeff


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Deja.com - Before you buy. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: argent@aol.com                                    29-Nov-99 16:54:10
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 11:23:03
Subj: Re: Hauppauge  advice - Thank you.

From: argent@aol.com (Argent)

I just purchased/installed the Model 401 (TV/DBX/Radio). Works OK.

The TV app that comes with the drivers (WTV) seems to give me the best
picture.
but sound never comes on until I open the Multimedia Setup and access the
setup
page.Then, when I open the Remote, sound disappears. YADTV always pops up with
the picture partially outside the window and is off-center after re-sizing or
moving the window around. It also has cyan and red striping in the picture.
StWTV is OK, but I can't seem to get it to recognize the channel region file.

BTW, I've got a Millenium II card using the v2.31 drivers. I guess this means
the TV drivers use DIVE to draw the picture which slows down some functions
(like mouse movements-- & I've got a PII-233). I can't seem to get the IBM
GRADD v0.8 to work on my system and while SDD seems OK on my system, for the
most part, they're still beta. You'll also need a free IRQ.

All in all, though, it sure is nice to be able to watch TV while doing other
things! We can only hope the drivers and apps continue to evolve. Hope this
helps!

>Dave Critelli wrote:
>
>> I was thinking about picking up a Hauppauge TV card for my PC and was
>> wondering which Hauppauge cards everyone was using successfully with
>> Warp?


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: AOL http://www.aol.com (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com                           30-Nov-99 08:56:23
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 14:39:12
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com>

On <JqnCCXS3fWdc-pn2-o0NNSsWojvjg@jakesplace.dhs.org>, on 11/30/99 at
12:00 AM,
   jack.troughton@nospam.videotron.ca (Jack Troughton) said:

> I moved here from Ontario two and a half years ago and for me, it's  not
> really a big deal.  They certainly do not prevent anyone from  posting
> things in english, but they do want to see french everywhere  because
> things written in public contribute a lot to the overall  literacy of a
> culture.

The Attorney General of Quebec prosecuted the mayor and fire chief of a
town in southern Quebec near the US border because the refused to have
their new fire truck's sign repainted to use French when a new census
showed that there were 2 more Francophones in the town than Anglophones.

That is not a free country.

--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: bobg@Pics.com
Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 12
MR/2 Ice Registration Number 67
Aut Pax Aut Bellum
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: Roland.Pinches@pmail.net                          30-Nov-99 14:57:25
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 14:39:12
Subj: RC5DES setup

From: "Roland Pinches" <Roland.Pinches@pmail.net>

Hi,

I'm hoping someone can help me out here.
My machine is a dual PII 400MHz system with WSeB and simply stated, it's not
doing much most of the time! I used to run the RC5DES program on my machine
at work (with a direct connection to the Internet) but since I'm not working
at the moment I thought I'd try and run it on my machine at home, however,
since I live in the UK, I have to pay for my time online :-(

I have InJoy 2.3 (Extended registration) so I have Dial-on-demand, and can
even get it working, trouble is, the RC5DES client seems to keep the
connection open and never allows InJoy to time out and hangup ie: I'm going
to have an expensive phone bill if I carry on like this :(

Can anyone suggest how to setup InJoy and RC5DES so that after a couple of
minutes idle time, the connection will close?

Seems a shame to waste all this processing power...

Cheers, Roly.


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com                           30-Nov-99 08:25:22
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 14:39:12
Subj: Re: delay starting an app from startup group?

From: Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com>

On <s453b1m7mvm48@corp.supernews.com>, on 11/29/99 at 09:26 AM,
   "Kerry Lord" <klord@bhbt.com> said:

> Is there a way to delay an application from starting in the startup
> group?

> We have an OS/2 Warp3 that reboots itself every night and we also have a
> backup agent program that needs to be loaded so the OS/2 box can be
> backed up.

> I've put the back up agent software into the Startup Group, but since
> another application is still loading the back up software can't load
> until about a minute later.  Since this happens at midnight, no one is
> around to start the back up program.

> Any ideas?

Assuming your backup program has command line interface available (can be
run from an OS/2 window via entering the proper command to do what you
want) you can replace cmd.exe with 4os2.exe and in the startup.cmd file
put the command string following a line which says

delay xx

where xx is the number of seconds you want startup.cmd to wait before
loading the backup command.

4OS2 is available on the web as a 30 day demo from JP Software.
Registration is less than $80 for both 4OS2 and 4DOS. I have used them for
years with only one slight, very slight problem - Lotus Smartsuite for
OS/2 won't install unless one runs cmd.exe in the install window before
running setup.

4OS2 has many more features than CMD.EXE. For instance, you can customize
the Function Keys for use in OS/2 or DOS full screen or windowed sessions.
F12 here works just like typing exit and hitting return to close the
session. It can display the session in colors, etc., etc., etc. You can
create aliases for long cli strings you'd otherwise have to type. It will
display all the commands you have entered since bootup in ANY OS/2 session
and you can edit them to make changes. It is a much enhanced DOSKEY.



> --
> =============================================
> Bar Harbor Banking and Trust
> Kerry Lord - IT Engineer
> 82 Main Street
> Bar Harbor,  Maine 04609
> (800) 237-9601 x2309





--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: bobg@Pics.com
Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 12
MR/2 Ice Registration Number 67
Aut Pax Aut Bellum
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com                           30-Nov-99 08:34:00
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 14:39:12
Subj: Re: Java 1.2 for OS/2

From: Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com>

On <uprsNDlpp0Dh-pn2-3SlVlK2XxRb7@f01-207-41-174-32.i-2000.net>, on
11/30/99 at 01:10 AM,
   jhimmel@i-2000.com (James Himmelman) said:

> Ask them if they would take - "The first quarter of the 3rd  millennium"
> to mean the first 3 months or the first 250yrs. My results were 5 for 5
> in favor of the first 250yrs, but try it for yourself. I  asked a
> construction contractor, a retired manager of the New York  Stock
> Exchange, an architect, a manager at a department store, and a  retired
> manager of one of the biggest printing companies in the  country.

I had my wife who is teaching a course at our local community college on
investment strategies ask the question of the 23 students in her class.
The results were 14 for the second three months of 2001, 5 for the first
three months of 2000, and 4 for the first 250 years of the third
millenium.



--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: bobg@Pics.com
Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 12
MR/2 Ice Registration Number 67
Aut Pax Aut Bellum
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: christian.hennecke@ruhr-uni-boch...               30-Nov-99 14:42:03
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 14:39:12
Subj: Re: Motherboard recommendations...

Message sender: christian.hennecke@ruhr-uni-bochum.de

From: Christian Hennecke <christian.hennecke@ruhr-uni-bochum.de>

"David T. Johnson" schrieb:

> I used an ASUS P5A-B with the ALi Aladdin V chipset with OS/2 with no
> problems.  It had a Matrox Millenium G200 AGP video that worked well.
> AMD just today announced a K6-2 533 Mhz processor.  But my
> recommendation would be an ASUS K7M ATX Athlon motherboard.

I don't know if ASUS would be a good choice in case of Athlon MBs. AFAIK
there won't be much of the good support they usually provide.

Christian Hennecke
-- 
Keep passing the open windows! ("The Hotel New Hampshire", John Irving)

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: not organized (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com                           30-Nov-99 08:37:23
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 14:39:12
Subj: Re: Java 1.2 for OS/2

From: Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com>

On <HN2tEbdbtdhk-pn2-tySBFO5pZf7B@localhost>, on 11/29/99 at 04:25 PM,
   rcrane@octa4.net.au (Richard A Crane) said:

> > Thus, when someone wrote second quarter of the third millenium,
> > intelligent people read that as the second 3 months of the year 2001. If
> > he or she meant otherwise, then he or she did not express himself or
> > herself properly.
> > 
> No Bob, to many people the reference to a quarter with the  reference to
> a millenium would be taken as a reference to a  quarter of 1000 years.
> I suspect this may be one those differences between USof An  and English
> (particularly as she is spoke in the colonies). 

Perhaps in Australia or Britain people aren't bombarded with newscasts
about companies, the economy, etc. as they are here. Quarter here is well
understood as a reference to a 3 month period. One virtually cannot watch
a national network newscast without someone referring to this or that
quarter regarding interest rates, the economy, company results or plans,
release dates for Windows XX, etc.

Now I realize that in the United States we have the highest percentage of
participation in investments in the world. Perhaps our citizens have
become more sophisticated than elsewhere in the English speaking world.

As I stated in another message in this thread, my other half teaches a
course in investment strategies at our local community college (2 year
college which offers only an Associates degree as opposed to a typical 4
year college which offers Bachelor's and Master's degrees or a university
which also confers Doctoral degrees). Her students overwhelming choose the
fiscal quarter option on a written test. I should point out that more than
half the students are either working mothers or housewives. One of the men
in the class is a carpenter, another an elevator (lift in BE) installer,
etc.

Most working people here have some sort of investment plan, retirement
plan, savings plan, etc. offered by employers. Even more have 401K or
similar self administered retirement plans where they make investment
decisions. By some estimates as many as 40% of all Americans of working
age are involved in some way with the stock market, many via mutual funds,
on line investment accounts, etc. With the recent passage of a change in
the law, banks will also be offering depositors the option of buying and
selling stock at the local branch or on line.

> Richard A Crane Barrister & Solicitor

As I stated in this thread, lack of precision in writing is the lifeblood
of lawyers.

--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: bobg@Pics.com
Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 12
MR/2 Ice Registration Number 67
Aut Pax Aut Bellum
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com                           30-Nov-99 08:48:13
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 14:39:12
Subj: Re: Java 1.2 for OS/2

From: Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com>

On <943888033snz@deltrak.demon.co.uk>, on 11/29/99 at 03:07 PM,
   ames@deltrak.demon.co.uk (Andrew Stephenson) said:


> "Yards", alas, slipped off our road signs some time ago.  Barring the
> odd pre-Flood holdover, it's all miles (or fractions), with here and
> there a few metres, or no distance given at all.  To be doubly sure, I
> checked this with the Traffic Division of my local big police station. 
> A sergeant could think of no cases of yards. I fear that one has had it. 
> :-(

Well, in 1995 I saw signs on one of the A routes leading out of Heathrow
referring to an exit for some town or village. I saw many in Scotland
between Athol and Inverness on secondary roads.

Here in the US about the only use for yard is for measuring cloth and
square yards for measuring carpet and some non-tile type floor coverings.
Tile, roofing, etc. are measured in square feet for some reason. It makes
comparing tile and carpeting for a room rather difficult for some people.
My daughter couldn't understand that tile at $2.00 per square foot was
more expensive than vinyl at $12 per square yard. She said, "But Dad, 3
times 2 is 6." I had to remind her of her third grade arithmetic class and
that she had to multiply by 9.

What's really scary about this is that she helps my grandson with his 3rd
grade arithmetic homework. I have noticed an increase in frequency of
calls from Donnie about that subject, thankfully.


--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: bobg@Pics.com
Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 12
MR/2 Ice Registration Number 67
Aut Pax Aut Bellum
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com                           30-Nov-99 08:59:11
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 14:39:12
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com>

On <81v30h$bcg$1@nnrp1.deja.com>, on 11/29/99 at 11:42 PM,
   Chris J Delanoy <cdelanoy@ualberta.ca> said:

> Jerry, if you believe you are forced to "eat Microsoft", as it were,
> then I propose the following experiment which will show you the
> difference between production and force:  For the next year, don't buy
> or use any Microsoft products whatsoever.  That is, send the alleged
> "robber barron" Bill Gates no money whatsoever.  At the same time, send
> no money to the government.  That is, don't pay your taxes for the same
> period.

> Then wait.  Then see who comes after you for your money, and with what
> weapons.  Perhaps then you'll see what force is and why neither
> Microsoft nor any other private enterprise has any such power.

What an assinine analogy. It is preposterous! You are comparing oranges
and lima beans.

If I do not wish to enrich Mr. Gates and his illegal monopoly, I cannot
buy a Toshiba, IBM, Dell, Gateway, etc., etc. notebook computer because
they are only sold with Windows 98 for which I have no use nor desire to
buy. Therefore, I have only two choices, - support a thief or do without.

If I want to expand my business or my clients do with most name brand
computers, I and they must pay for Windows whether we wish to use it or
not. Thus my clients and I are forced to support someone we have no wish
to support. That, sir, is force.

At one time, licensed monopolies controlled our telephone systems here in
the US. Now, I have a choice of both local and long distance carriers.
Rates have come down and continue to decline. Services such as call
waiting, call forwarding, caller ID, unlisted and unpublished numbers,
etc. are either free or half of what they were just a few years ago. In
terms of constant dollars (money adjusted for inflation) I currently pay
less than half of what I did for the same levels of service I did in 1989.
For my business lines, I pay less than a third of what it cost in 1989.

I have a choice of electric suppliers now and my rates have gone down 15%
in the past 3 months. In 1980, it cost me $2,400 1980 dollars for heat,
light, and hot water for my the home I lived in then. I live in a much
larger home now, I have four computers, three printers, three external
modems, and two scanners running 24/7 of which I had none in 1980. I have
11 5 watt electric candles in our windows which are on timers and are on
for an average of 8 hours a day, 365 days a year now. I have lamps in our
living room and bedroom on timers which I did not have in 1980. My outside
lights are on timers or light or motion sensing switches where only the
front lantern was used in 1980. I have 2 electric garage door openers
which I did not have in 1980. My current utility bills for the last 12
months have totalled $2654. In terms of constant dollars, my rates have
gone down by more than half due to competition.

Yesterday, satellite TV companies gained the authority to carry channels
formerly reserved for cable TV monopolies. I anticipate my TV costs will
plummet now that Garden State Cable has lost its monopoly. BTW, when the
government got out of the rate setting business for Cable TV, my rates
increased 44% in three years. That is why our government opened up "must
carry channels" to the satellite operators. Because the monopolies were
gouging the public.

Conversely, my water rates have more than quadrupled in the past 6 years
and the monopoly providing the water is asking that the rates be doubled
next year. My quarterly water bills in 1994 totalled $120 which included
about $30 spent on watering the lawn. This year, with absolutely NO
irrigation use whatsoever, the total is $396. The rate payers are
organizing to hire an attorney and attempt to force the Board of Public
Utilities which has rubber stamped every rate increase request to roll
those rates back rather than grant another increase. Failing that, we
intend to file suit to force the company into bankruptcy since our rates
are more than double those in surrounding communities served by either
municipal water authorities or other private companies. Since our local
company was bought out by a larger company and now pays that larger
company more than twice what some municipal water authorities pay for
water from the parent, we believe we have a very strong case. We may also
sue the BPU since it has consistently refused to recognize that Mount
Holly Water Company is a wholly owned subsidiary of the larger company by
saying that it does not have the authority to regulate what Mt. Holly must
pay for water beyond the capacity of its own wells.

I have a choice, of course. I can shut off the water and do without
eating, bathing, brusing teeth, etc. However, that choice is no more
reasonable than being forced to pay Gates or do without a needed computer.

--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: bobg@Pics.com
Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 12
MR/2 Ice Registration Number 67
Aut Pax Aut Bellum
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com                           30-Nov-99 09:27:14
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 14:39:12
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com>

On <38431c3e$1$yrgbherq$mr2ice@news.sover.net>, on 11/29/99 at 07:37 PM,
   letoured@nospam.net said:

> Chris J Delanoy <cdelanoy@ualberta.ca> said:

> >The US anti-trust laws are deliberately designed as so to be impossible
> >to be objectively understood.  They are ex-post-facto, arbitrary, and
> >entirely open-ended, and any "findings of fact" made under them do not
> >necessarily bear any resemblance to reality (ie - to actual FACTS).

> Baloney. They can be understood by those with knowledge of markets and
> mutilative practices, and others who don't work for or kneel before MS.

Well said, Ed. Well said. Let's take Mr. Lemming Delanoy's stupid claims
one by one.

The anti-trust laws in the United States date from the 19th Century. In
fact, the Sherman act predated the founding of MicroSoft by more than 75
years. Moreover, ex post facto prohibitions in our Constitution refer only
to criminal law, not civil law.

Arbitrary? That issue was addressed by the United States Supreme Court 60
years before Billy Boy was born in the Standard Oil cases of the first
decade of the current century.

Open-ended? I have no concept of what the little mental midget has in
mind. All laws are open to interpretation by the courts which frequently
extends provisions in some cases and limits them in others. This is the
nature of our system.

Findings of fact bear no resemblance to reality? Only a truly ignorant
asshole or a lawyer for the defendant deliberately milking his client for
more fees could argue that Judge Jackson had no basis in reality for his
findings of fact. Unless one believes that all the witnesses for the
government were lying and that MS employees were telling the whole truth,
his findings of fact are irrefutable. Only a totally insane lemming could
make the claim that Gates was open, honest, and forthcoming in his
testimony.

> >As for how markets run, it is you who obviously has no idea.  The only
> >monopolies (ie - companies against which competition is impossible and
> >which can therefore set prices independently of the market) that have
> >existed have been created and maintained by acts of government.  No
> >coervice monopoly has ever and can ever be created on the free market -
> >and Microsoft (which is not a monopoly) is no exception.

> Baloney again.  You did okay until you got the part about a monopoly has
> to be created by the government.  And companies which are permitted
> (licensed if you will) to function as a so-called monopoly are permitted
> because it is deemed necessary to the public good and regulated for the
> public good.  

Here I disagree with you a bit Ed. Standard Oil was a monopoly created
because there were no laws to prevent Rockefeller from becoming virtually
the sole supplier of oil in the US. Everyone who tried to compete with him
found his costs for transportation raised and raised until he was forced
into bankruptcy or to sell to Standard for well below the true value of
the company. The same was true of Carnegie and steel. The same was true of
Gould et al and the railroads. A trust was just another name for a
conspiracy of so-called competitors to control markets and prices. It was
the reaction of the government which led to the passage of the Sherman Act
in the latter part of the 19th Century.

> -- BTW, Gates was saying he should be permitted to have monopoly back in
> the early 80s for the public good, but without any regulation or
> requirements for performance or a warranty.  Its the same argument he
> gives us now.  

Gates statements from the foundation of MicroSoft to the present date,
Nov. 30, 1999, show him to be a meglomaniac who wants to rule the world.
He truly believes he and he alone knows what is best for all mankind and
is above any law or question. He is a madman.

> >> BTW, do you think the US DOJ antitrust action against IBM that
> >> essentially allowed MS have a market share was a good thing or
> >> bad thing?  -- I can't wait for your answer.

> >IBM lost it's market dominance before the persecution against it by the
> >US government was even half-completed.  The idea that anti-trust jihads
> >by Justice bureaucats have increased competition is an absolute joke.  On
> >the contrary, more than any other single law, the Sherman Anti-Trust Act
> >and it's successors have set the standard in -destroying- competition.

> If your premise was valid, then explain to all of us what happened when
> IBM was required to publish Apis and not pre-announce products. Match
> that with reality and explain how it had no effect on IBM or
> competition. Opps, you can't you already said the action changed the
> behavior of IBM.  

Ed, I agree. Let's look at the little moron's claims one by one again.

IBM lost its market dominance before the government's actions? Obviously
the village idiot who posted that claim has no knowledge of history,
cannot read a balance sheet, and is just as insane as Gates. When IBM was
first brought to the bar by DOJ it was over machine accounting. The
government claimed that IBM had more than 90% of the market for accounting
machines and thus was a monopoly. IBM claimed that machine accounting was
not a market that all methods of accounting were the market. Attorney
General Clark, Sr. (both DOJ suits were filed by an Attorney General of
the US named Clark. The earlier was the father of the later one) refused
to accept this absurd argument as did the Judge in the Federal District
Court in Manhatten and IBM was forced to settle which it did and still it
operates under this consent agreement. Among other remedies, IBM was
forced to allow competitors to license some patents, was forced to offer
the machines for sale, etc. The second suit, filed by Clark, Jr. claimed
IBM had a monopoly in computers. At the time the computer industry was
referred to as Snow White (IBM) and the Seven Dwarfs (Remington-Rand, DEC,
Cray, and 4 others I forget). Again, IBM was unable to defend itself
creditably and settled. In that settlement, IBM was forced to unbundle the
hardware, software, and service. It was forced to make reparations to Cray
by giving it money and a whole line of computers. It was forced to provide
source code, etc. to third party software vendors so they could compete
with IBM. While the economics of mainframe computerland were and are such
that IBM has no real competition to this day, we would not have companies
like Computer Associates which is the world's second largest software
vendor behind IBM and ahead of MS.

It is time that the lemmings learn what they are talking about. The PC
marketplace is not the entire industry. It is a small but significant
fraction of the computer marketplace. But just as machine accounting was a
small but significant part of the accounting marketplace in 1952, one
company which dominates a signficant segment must be reined in. 

Anti-trust jihads have destroyed competition? On a ten mile trip last
evening I passed gasoline stations selling Texaco, Sunoco, Exxon, Mobil,
and Coastal gasoline as well as nine stations selling unbranded gasoline.
Before the Sherman Act was enforced against Rockefeller, there was one
brand. Yep, the Sherman Act really destroyed competition. HUGE BELLY
LAUGH.

> But if you want to try, please go ahead. I'm sure you will show us that
> your reasoning is a joke and I need the laugh.

There is one other bit of history the lemmings need to learn and
understand relavtive to the DOJ and PC's. Had it not been for the DOJ
action regarding ISV's for its mainframes, IBM would never have produced
an open architecture for its PC. It would never have hired a MS to provide
the operating system. Remember, the Clark, Jr. suit was filed on January
19 or 20th of 1969, literally hours before the end of the Johnson
administration. The settlement didn't come until the mid to late 1970's by
which time IBM had settled numerous suits by aggrieved third parties to
avoid being put in the situation MS finds itself in today. It bit the
bullet and agreed without ever being humiliated by a finding of fact so
harmful to its case as MS faces today. IBM was treading very, very
carefully in the late 70's as DOJ was closely scrutinizing its every move.
So, it made the decision not to produce a proprietary machine and not to
produce the operating system. This opened the doors for MicroSoft, Lotus,
WordPerfect, WordStar, Volkswriter, Borland, and literally hundreds of
other software vendors. It made possible US Robotics, 3Com, Hayes, Epson,
Hewlett Packard, Seagage, Quantum, and hundreds of other companies making
billions of dollars in the PC marketplace.

The lemmings need to learn one fact of capitalist economics as well. They
need to learn that profits breed competition and excessive profits breed
ruinous competition. Many of the hardware and software vendors who failed
failed for that reason. Gates knew and understood that. His attempts to
circumvent the anti-trust laws were and are a deliberate attempt to
circumvent one of the most basic verities of economics.

--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: bobg@Pics.com
Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 12
MR/2 Ice Registration Number 67
Aut Pax Aut Bellum
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: fegehrke@worldnet.att.net                         30-Nov-99 17:48:09
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 19:49:24
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: Forrest Gehrke <fegehrke@worldnet.att.net>

Bob Germer wrote:
> 
> The Attorney General of Quebec prosecuted the mayor and fire chief of a
> town in southern Quebec near the US border because the refused to have
> their new fire truck's sign repainted to use French when a new census
> showed that there were 2 more Francophones in the town than Anglophones.
> 
> That is not a free country.
> 

An interesting sidelight to all this: The Wall Street Journal 
reported a listing of economic freedom by country which was
jointly done by WSJ and the Heritage Foundation.
The ranking of economically Free countries:

  1. HongKong
  2. Singapore
  3. New Zealand
  4. Bahrain
     Luxembourg
     U.S.
  7. Ireland
  8. Australia
     Switzerland
     U.K.

Under Mostly Free the list starts off with:

  11. Canada.
//

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: AT&T WorldNet Services (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: jeffnik@autobahn.mb.ca                            30-Nov-99 22:57:14
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 19:49:24
Subj: Re: RC5DES setup

From: jeffnik@autobahn.mb.ca (J. Robinson)

On Tue, 30 Nov 1999 14:57:50, "Roland Pinches" 
<Roland.Pinches@pmail.net> wrote:

> Hi,
> 
> I'm hoping someone can help me out here.
> My machine is a dual PII 400MHz system with WSeB and simply stated, it's not
> doing much most of the time! I used to run the RC5DES program on my machine
> at work (with a direct connection to the Internet) but since I'm not working
> at the moment I thought I'd try and run it on my machine at home, however,
> since I live in the UK, I have to pay for my time online :-(
> 
> I have InJoy 2.3 (Extended registration) so I have Dial-on-demand, and can
> even get it working, trouble is, the RC5DES client seems to keep the
> connection open and never allows InJoy to time out and hangup ie: I'm going
> to have an expensive phone bill if I carry on like this :(
> 
> Can anyone suggest how to setup InJoy and RC5DES so that after a couple of
> minutes idle time, the connection will close?
> 
> Seems a shame to waste all this processing power...
> 
> Cheers, Roly.
> 
> 

Not exactly the answer you wanted for your setup, I'm sure, but I 
offer this idea as an alternative until the Injoy solution is solved.

One location that I'm at, I don't have a 'net connection but still do 
the RC5 crunching.  At the end of all the blocks, I simply exit the 
RC5 program.  You can then attach the buff-out.rc5 file to an E-mail 
and send it to flush@distributed.net (it has to be MIME encoded to 
work correctly, I believe).  You'll got a response back from 
distributed.net telling you if it was successful or not.

Then, you can send a second E-mail, this time to 
fetch@distributed.net, with the body containing the line 
'numblocks=100' (or how-ever many blocks you want).  I grab a high 
number of blocks so I don't have to do this whole E-mail bit too 
often, but can still leave the computer happily crunching away in the 
meantime.  It works well for me.

Not a solution, but certainly an option.


Jeff.
----------------
Whatza JamochaMUD?  http://jamochamud.onestepcomm.com
Or other stuff: http://www.onestepcomm.com/~jeffnik

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: MBnet Networking Inc. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: marco.shaw@nbtel.nb.ca                            30-Nov-99 21:33:11
  To: All                                               30-Nov-99 19:49:24
Subj: OS/2 install problem

From: "Marco Shaw" <marco.shaw@nbtel.nb.ca>

Going through the install, it comes to the fdisk section.  I get an error
stating "the partition table could be corrupted", and then I'm not able to
continue.

Is there some kind of low-level format tool that I could use to clean the
drive with?  The BIOS doesn't seem to have a format option.  DOS works fine
on this Western Digital 6GB, but no luck with OS/2...

It was previously installed on this system, I just decided to repartition
the drives, but that screwed up everything.

Marco


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: NBTel Internet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: abstewa@attglobal.net                             30-Nov-99 18:41:03
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 00:35:05
Subj: Re: www.lotus.com

From: Alon Stewart <abstewa@attglobal.net>

It must be something in your browser settings, I have NS 4.61 and OS/2 and I
can access
both sites you mentioned with no problem on 28.8 modem.  I have seen very few
sites
that I can not get, unless they have weird plugins required.

John Poltorak wrote:

> Does anyone else have any problem connecting to Lotus' web site?
>
> I can never get the home page loaded up if I go to the company's home page,
> although if I try  http://www.lotus.com/smartsuiteos2, I get:
>
> Transfer interrupted!
>
> 0 -->
>
>                                              Welcome to
www.lotus.com/smartsuiteos2
>                                                         (non-frame version)
>
> This is using Netscape v4.6. If I try Lynx, I get:
>
> HTTP/1.1 200 Document follows
>
> There seem to be **sssssoooo**** many sites I can't access, www.palm.com,
> for example....
> Would this problem be related to me running Netscape under OS/2, or is there
> something in my config which can be changed. I can't help feeling there is a
> MS IIS blocker out there somewhere preventing my access.
>
> --
> John

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Global Network Services - Remote Access Mail & Ne
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rr14@yahoo.com                                    30-Nov-99 22:44:24
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 00:35:05
Subj: Re: OS/2 install problem

From: rr14@yahoo.com (me)

marco.shaw@nbtel.nb.ca (Marco Shaw) wrote in
<CoX04.8$rS4.311@sodalite.nbnet.nb.ca>: 

>Going through the install, it comes to the fdisk section.  I get an
>error stating "the partition table could be corrupted", and then I'm not
>able to continue.
>
>Is there some kind of low-level format tool that I could use to clean
>the drive with?  The BIOS doesn't seem to have a format option.  DOS
>works fine on this Western Digital 6GB, but no luck with OS/2...
>
>It was previously installed on this system, I just decided to
>repartition the drives, but that screwed up everything.
>
>Marco
>
>
>

Hello Marco...
Had same problem, went to Western Digital website got their disk repair
utility and everything went fine.  If you have problems finding it then
ask in the newsgroup on their web site and they point you to it pretty 
quick...(they responded to me in underan hour) ...

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Your Company (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: tholenantispam@hawaii.edu                         01-Dec-99 00:07:15
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 00:35:05
Subj: Re: font search

From: tholenantispam@hawaii.edu (Dave Tholen)

Thomas Kellerer writes:

>> I'm looking for a font that extends the encircled numbers found in the
>> WingDings font provided with Warp 4.
>> 
>> ASCII 139 to 149 in WingDings contains the numbers 0 through 10, inside
>> a filled circle.  Does anyone know of a font that provides the same, but
>> for the numbers 11 and higher?  I don't know how high I ultimately might
>> want to go, but up to 19 would probably handle most, if not all, of the
>> cases I have in mind.

> If you have time searching for it, you could scan the ATM fonts
> available at LEO:
>
> http://www.leo.org/pub/comp/os/os2/leo/atmfonts/index.html

Thanks; I'm already aware of that site.  If only there was a list of
glyphs included in each file and a font preview via web browser!  It
would take a lot of time to download and install them all, then look
at each, one at a time.  So I thought I'd check for the collective
knowledge of readers first.

> At first glance there is one font called dingbats which might be a
> "clone" of the Zapf Dingbats font. Perhaps that one has what you want:
>
> ftp://ftp.leo.org/pub/comp/os/os2/leo/atmfonts/d/dingbats.zip

Well, if it's a one-for-one clone, then it won't go any higher than 10,
just like WingDings.  ASCII 202 to 211 have 1 through 10 (no zero, unlike
WingDings).  I have the Zapf Dingbats font.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: IFA B-111 (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: tholenantispam@hawaii.edu                         01-Dec-99 00:11:01
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 00:35:05
Subj: Re: font search

From: tholenantispam@hawaii.edu (Dave Tholen)

Andrew Stephenson writes:

>> I'm looking for a font that extends the encircled numbers found
>> in the WingDings font provided with Warp 4.
>>
>> [...]

> Monotype sells two fonts resembling WingDings' circled numbers:
>	Circle Frame		Black lines + enclosing circles
>	Circle Frame Reversed	Ditto, but white-on-solid-black
>
> They also sell:
>	Square Frame		As Circle but with boxes
>	Square Frame Reversed	Ditto, but white-on-black

Sounds like just what I'm looking for.  Do they provide the
necessary files for OS/2, or would I need to run them through
the PFM to AFM converter?

I'd like to search through the freely downloadable fonts first,
however.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: IFA B-111 (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: DLaRue@NetSRQ.Com                                 01-Dec-99 00:38:21
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 00:35:05
Subj: Re: Motherboard recommendations...

From: DLaRue@NetSRQ.Com (David LaRue)

  Allen,

  I updated last year to a DFI P2XBL/S.  I run SCSI, no IDE, OS/2 and linux. 
There
is a DOS partition that has never been booted to.  DFI certifies the board for
Microsoft products... but whenever I catch one is gets permanantly archived.
The P2XBL/S is solid and fast.
 
  Good luck with whatever you choose,

  David

In <nupynaytbi.flyp3t2.pminews@newshost.lanl.gov>, "Allen Cogbill"
<ahc@lanl.gov> writes:
>I have a 3-yr old DFI motherboard running OS/2 Warp 4 FP8, Win95, WinNT, and 
>RedHat Linux. It works quite well. However, I'm considering upgrading the MB 
>in order to run some apps; the current 64 Mb memory, 166-MHz Pentium II 
>setup does not meet the minimum hardware requirements for a couple of WinXX 
>apps that I'd like to use!
>
>I'd appreciate any suggestions for boards that will run OS/2 well, as this 
>is the OS that I almost always use. The Win95 is just for my kids.
>
>Allen Cogbill
>
>
>

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: bCandid - Powering the world's discussions - http
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: cdelanoy@ualberta.ca                              01-Dec-99 00:30:04
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 00:35:05
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: Chris J Delanoy <cdelanoy@ualberta.ca>

 letoured@nospam.net wrote:

> > The US anti-trust laws are deliberately designed as so to be
> > impossible to be objectively understood.  They are ex-post-facto,
> > arbitrary, and entirely open-ended, and any "findings of fact"
> > made under them do not necessarily bear any resemblance to
> > reality (ie - to actual FACTS).

> Baloney. They can be understood by those with knowledge of markets

Explain how markets can create "monopolies" which can SIMULTANEOUSLY
charge prices that are too high AND too low - which are among the
so-called "facts" cited by Judge Jackson.

The creation of coercive monopoly is not possible in a free
market - neither in theory, nor ever in history.

> And companies which are permitted (licensed if you will) to
> function as a so-called monopoly are permitted because it is
> deemed necessary to the public good

Nothing that any government has done has ever been for the ACTUAL
good of the public.

> -- BTW, Gates was saying he should be permitted to have monopoly
> back in the early 80s for the public good, but without any
> regulation or requirements for performance or a warranty.

He didn't get any such franchise from any government.  And he
therefore has no monopoly powers whatsoever.  If you don't believe
me, then there's a simple experiment you can conduct:  stop buying
Microsoft products, and stop paying taxes.  Then wait and see who
comes after you for your money and with what weapons.

That's the distinction between production and force.

Chris J Delanoy


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Deja.com - Before you buy. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: jhimmel@i-2000.com                                01-Dec-99 00:49:18
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 00:35:05
Subj: Re: Java 1.2 for OS/2

From: jhimmel@i-2000.com (James Himmelman)

On Tue, 30 Nov 1999 13:34:00, Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com> 
wrote:

> On <uprsNDlpp0Dh-pn2-3SlVlK2XxRb7@f01-207-41-174-32.i-2000.net>, on
> 11/30/99 at 01:10 AM,
>    jhimmel@i-2000.com (James Himmelman) said:
> 
> > Ask them if they would take - "The first quarter of the 3rd  millennium"
> > to mean the first 3 months or the first 250yrs. My results were 5 for 5
> > in favor of the first 250yrs, but try it for yourself. I  asked a
> > construction contractor, a retired manager of the New York  Stock
> > Exchange, an architect, a manager at a department store, and a  retired
> > manager of one of the biggest printing companies in the  country.
> 
> I had my wife who is teaching a course at our local community college on
> investment strategies ask the question of the 23 students in her class.
> The results were 14 for the second three months of 2001, 5 for the first
> three months of 2000, and 4 for the first 250 years of the third
> millenium.

Interesting results, but not too surprising considering the nature of 
the class.

[[[ James Himmelman - jhimmel@i-2000.com ]]]

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: cdelanoy@ualberta.ca                              01-Dec-99 00:44:24
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 00:35:05
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: Chris J Delanoy <cdelanoy@ualberta.ca>

 Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com> wrote:

> > Then wait.  Then see who comes after you for your money, and
> > with what weapons.  Perhaps then you'll see what force is and
> > why neither Microsoft nor any other private enterprise has any
> > such power.

> What an assinine analogy. It is preposterous!

And yet completely correct.

> If I do not wish to enrich Mr. Gates and his illegal monopoly, I
> cannot buy a Toshiba, IBM, Dell, Gateway, etc., etc. notebook
> computer because they are only sold with Windows 98 for which I
> have no use nor desire to buy.

Then buy from another company that doesn't supply Windows 98.
Not hard to do.

> If I want to expand my business or my clients do with most name
> brand computers, I and they must pay for Windows whether we wish
> to use it or not. Thus my clients and I are forced to support
> someone we have no wish to support. That, sir, is force.

No, sir, it is not - and for precisely the reason I gave above.
Bill Gates does not have the power to force a single computer
manufacturer or customer to buy anything.

> At one time, licensed monopolies controlled our telephone systems
> here in the US.

Yes - all by ACTS OF GOVERNMENT.  That is the only way for a
true monopoly to exist - and the telephone monopolies that existed
in the US (and STILL exist in local phone service here in Canada)
are stellar examples of this.

> Now, I have a choice of both local and long distance carriers.
> Rates have come down and continue to decline.

Of course - this is how the free market works.  In fact the entire
history of the free market in action can be summed up in the words
"everything is cheaper".

I'm cutting out the rest of your post to save bandwidth, but I'll
definitely compliment you on your great assessment of the evils
of government interference in the economy - which is precisely how
telephone and utility companies maintained their immoral,
indefensible monopolies for decades.  THESE are the examples of
true (ie - coercive) monopolies against which competition is
IMPOSSIBLE.  And Microsoft is NOT one of them!

> However, that choice is no more reasonable than being forced to
> pay Gates or do without a needed computer.

> Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 12
  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Bob, you'd be a touch more credible in claiming that you're forced
against your will to use Windows if you didn't end your message by
telling us explicitly that you do NOT use it.  You look rather
silly saying that you have no choice when, lo and behold, you
HAVE made a different choice.

Chris J Delanoy


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Deja.com - Before you buy. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: lifedata@xxvol.com                                30-Nov-99 19:25:11
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 00:35:05
Subj: Switching drives - how?

From: lifedata@xxvol.com

How can I change my second physical hard drive to first?

I unplugged the first drive and made the hardware changes to jumpers, etc. 
My OS/2 boot partition is on this drive and when I set it up I put a
primary partition on the beginning so it could hold the boot manager when I
moved it.

But when I booted it up, it still had the same drive letter and the C:
drive and it's partitions were just not there.  I'm back in my original
configuration now.  What do I need to do to get this drive in first
position?

Jim L
Remove XX from address to Email
Crooks and kooks will get guns regardless of laws.


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: bCandid - Powering the world's discussions - http
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com                           30-Nov-99 11:29:05
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 00:35:05
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com>

On <yHQxxE9f8dqd-pn2-TGeHUK95dkkG@POBLANO>, on 11/29/99 at 06:30 PM,
   l_luciano@da.mob (Stan Goodman) said:

> > > You may consider it a farce. It is the law of the land in the United
> > > States.
> > 
> > Yes.  So much for "home of the free".

> No, that is what keeps it the home of the free. Had it not been for 
> anti-trust legislation, the United States would have been a fiefdom of
> the  likes of John D. Rockefeller and Andrew Carnegie. 

Not to mention the Mellons, Vanderbilts, Cassats, etc. who controlled the
railroads.

> -------------
> Stan Goodman
> Qiryat Tiv'on
> Israel

> E-mail sent to l_luciano@da.mob will, of course, not reach me. Sorry.
> Send E-mail to: domain: hashkedim dot com, username: stan.




--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: bobg@Pics.com
Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 12
MR/2 Ice Registration Number 67
Aut Pax Aut Bellum
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rgibson@ix.netcom.com                             30-Nov-99 15:59:03
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 00:35:05
Subj: Re: Netscape Communicator 4.61 install problems

From: rgibson@ix.netcom.com (Ron Gibson)

On Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:37:03, lsunley@mb.sympatico.ca (Lorne Sunley) 
wrote:

> > Where can one download Net.Com. 4.61 from, please?
> > (Does Net.Com. include a Netscape Navigator, or has it simply been 
> > renamed?)

> You can download Netscape 4.04 and 4.61 from
> the IBM web site
 
> URL http://www-4.ibm.com/software/os/warp/swchoice/
 
> You will only be able to get at the "low security" one
> if you access the site from the UK. You can go to
> the Fortify web site to obain a patch which will 
> provide the "high security" encryption

I forgot to ask.  Does one need to remove your old 4.04 installation
before installing 4.61.  I remember some problems in the past
installation over other versions...

                      email: rgibson@ix.netcom.com

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: MindSpring Enterprises (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rodsmith@adsl-151-203-46-57.bell...               30-Nov-99 16:04:21
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 00:35:05
Subj: Re: ZOC & Linux

Message sender: rodsmith@adsl-151-203-46-57.bellatlantic.net

From: rodsmith@adsl-151-203-46-57.bellatlantic.net (Rod Smith)

[Posted and mailed]

In article <38435654.6CB2B283@rtd.com>,
	James Moe <sma.spam-not@rtd.com> writes:
> 
>      I looked into this further. You are basically SOL. The american
> versio of ZOC does not have the secure shell (ssh) option because of our
> idiotic import/export restrictions regarding ordnance and encryption.

Actually, that's not the problem. It has to do with US patent law. SSH
uses certain algorithms that are patented in the US. ZOC's implementation
of those algorithms is done using a library that doesn't bear the
patent-holder's stamp of approval. Therefore, it violates US patent law to
import ZOC's SSH module into the US. The rest of the civilized world
doesn't recognize the patent on these algorithms, and so there are no
patent law problems with ZOC's SSH elsewhere. (Some countries, such as
France and Russia, do outlaw strong encryption, and so SSH is illegal
there, if I understand correctly.)

US restrictions on the export of encryption technology apply only to its
EXPORT, not its import. I certainly agree that the law's pretty lame on
this matter, and it can prevent the export of SSH from the US, but it's
not to blame for US users being unable to use ZOC's SSH.

>      Even if you have the ssh option, linux does not have the ssh
> server. At least not the Red Hat distribution.

It's not standard with most (any?) distribution because of the export
restrictions. You can get SSH servers from a variety of sites, though
(mostly outside the US).

-- 
Rod Smith       smithrod@bellatlantic.net
http://members.bellatlantic.net/~smithrod
Author of books on Linux networking & WordPerfect for Linux

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rgibson@ix.netcom.com                             30-Nov-99 16:07:20
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 00:35:05
Subj: Re: The ATI RAge Fury Pro card

From: rgibson@ix.netcom.com (Ron Gibson)

On Mon, 29 Nov 1999 15:29:55, ffitz@my-deja.com wrote:

> If you search hard enough on deja.com, you'll see a long
> history of posts about the ATI Rage Pro with OS/2.  I
> have a Dell with the ATI Rage Pro chipset on the mother-
> board.  For most applications, the GRADD drivers will
> work fine, but there are some specific cases which will
> result in black rectangles instead of some graphic
> images.  One case is the toolbar icons of IBM Visual C++
> Visual Builder.  There are some non-GRADD drivers out
> there, but I never could get them to work at all.  Even
> in plain VGA mode, the black rectangle problem will occur.

You also really need to take your card out and identify exactly which
chipset and possibly BIOS is on the card.  This can be done with
information from ATI's web site.  They actually have nice pictures of
their various chipsets and detailed instructions on what identifying
numbers are important.

While drivers exist for ATI Rage mine is a ATI Rage Pro 3D and no
support. I know. I just tried the ATI Rage drivers on Hobbes.


                      email: rgibson@ix.netcom.com



--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: MindSpring Enterprises (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rgibson@ix.netcom.com                             30-Nov-99 16:07:20
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 00:35:05
Subj: Re: New modem list

From: rgibson@ix.netcom.com (Ron Gibson)

On Mon, 29 Nov 1999 19:34:00, doug.bissett"at"attglobal.net (Doug Bissett)
wrote:

> AFAIK, that thing has not been updated for years. Your best bet, is to
> take the closest  modem, and change the init strings to whatever is 
> suggested for your current modem. I know that a 3COM (US Robotics) 56K
> Sportster modem works with the 14.4K Sportster settings. Describe your
> modem, and someone can, probably, suggest a good init string to use.

There is one update I found but it predates most V90 modems.

Latest greatest was 33.6 

                      email: rgibson@ix.netcom.com

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: MindSpring Enterprises (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rgibson@ix.netcom.com                             30-Nov-99 16:07:19
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 00:35:05
Subj: Re: netscape quietly quitting

From: rgibson@ix.netcom.com (Ron Gibson)

On Sun, 28 Nov 1999 21:00:29, James Moe <sma.spam-not@rtd.com> wrote:
 
> > NS Navigator 4.61  cheats on downloads in a most insidious way. it quietly
> > quits.
 
> > I know others have seen this problem.
 
> > Is this being addressed?  which chains do I rattle?
 
>     The only site that I have seen the shows this problem is IBM's. I
> have had multiple downloads running from other sites without a problem.
> In general I have found that mid-afternoon (MST) seems to be the best

I've seen it on a few differnt sites under heavy load to my best
recollection.

                      email: rgibson@ix.netcom.com

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: MindSpring Enterprises (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: ames@deltrak.demon.co.uk                          30-Nov-99 16:03:28
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 00:35:05
Subj: Re: font search

From: ames@deltrak.demon.co.uk (Andrew Stephenson)

In article <8204lp$686$1@news.hawaii.edu>
	   tholenantispam@hawaii.edu "Dave Tholen" writes:

> I'm looking for a font that extends the encircled numbers found
> in the WingDings font provided with Warp 4.
>
> [...]

Monotype sells two fonts resembling WingDings' circled numbers:
	Circle Frame		Black lines + enclosing circles
	Circle Frame Reversed	Ditto, but white-on-solid-black

They also sell:
	Square Frame		As Circle but with boxes
	Square Frame Reversed	Ditto, but white-on-black

String these together in various ways.

Monotype UK have a Web site, http://www.monotypeuk.com, which
will redirect you to a more local site.  You can pay by credit
card and download (they say).

HOWEVER (and this was where my relationship with MT's salesdroid
cooled) the price varies according to your address.  He claimed
they even block access to out-of-region callers with the "wrong"
address.  Same product.  Different price.  (Less in the US than
the UK (UKP22 per font) whence the product comes, BTW.)  He was
unable to say much to my assertion this would occasion pointless
aggravation amongst customers and that most would soon find ways
around it.  The concepts "Monotype" and "electronic marketing" do
not belong together, is my experience.  Great products, though.

This info is fresh off the phone (MT's free number) and has not
been tested yet.  If it's all baloney, just thank the salesdroid.
Anyhow, HTH, FWIW.
--
Andrew Stephenson

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: DNS (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: csaba_r@my-deja.com                               30-Nov-99 15:58:24
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 00:35:05
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: csaba_r@my-deja.com (Csaba Raduly)

bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com (Bob Germer) wrote in
<3843de52$6$obot$mr2ice@news.pics.com>: 

>On <81v30h$bcg$1@nnrp1.deja.com>, on 11/29/99 at 11:42 PM,
>   Chris J Delanoy <cdelanoy@ualberta.ca> said:
>
[Da Big Snip]
>
>I have a choice, of course. I can shut off the water and do without
>eating, bathing, brusing teeth, etc. However, that choice is no more
>reasonable than being forced to pay Gates or do without a needed
>computer. 
>

Well said !
Csaba

-- 
-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK----- 
Version 3.1
GCS/MU d- s:- a30 C++$ UL+ P+>+++ L++ E- W+ N++ o? K? w++>$ O++$ M-
V- PS PE Y PGP- t+ 5 X++ R* tv++ b++ DI+++ D++ G- e+++ h-- r-- !y+
-----END GEEK CODE BLOCK----- 

Csaba Raduly,    Software Developer (OS/2),    Sophos Anti-Virus
mailto:csaba.raduly@sophos.com            http://www.sophos.com/
US Support +1 888 SOPHOS 9            UK Support +44 1235 559933
Life is complex, with real and imaginary parts.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: SOPHOS Plc (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: lsunley@mb.sympatico.ca                           30-Nov-99 16:28:09
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 00:35:05
Subj: Re: Netscape Communicator 4.61 install problems

From: lsunley@mb.sympatico.ca (Lorne Sunley)

On Tue, 30 Nov 1999 15:59:07, rgibson@ix.netcom.com (Ron Gibson) 
wrote:

> On Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:37:03, lsunley@mb.sympatico.ca (Lorne Sunley) 
> wrote:
> 
> > > Where can one download Net.Com. 4.61 from, please?
> > > (Does Net.Com. include a Netscape Navigator, or has it simply been 
> > > renamed?)
> 
> > You can download Netscape 4.04 and 4.61 from
> > the IBM web site
>  
> > URL http://www-4.ibm.com/software/os/warp/swchoice/
>  
> > You will only be able to get at the "low security" one
> > if you access the site from the UK. You can go to
> > the Fortify web site to obain a patch which will 
> > provide the "high security" encryption
> 
> I forgot to ask.  Does one need to remove your old 4.04 installation
> before installing 4.61.  I remember some problems in the past
> installation over other versions...
> 

When it was in beta I had 4.61 running beside 4.04 (using different
directories for the program of course) and it worked OK. Once 4.61 
went GA I removed 4.04 (and 4.61 beta) before installing 4.61.

When you install 4.61 it will pick up your user profile from 4.04
and use it. The profile is left on the disk after you de-install
4.04 using the "Installation Utility".

If you install 4.61 to another directory, leaving 4.04 installed
4.61 will use the 4.04 user profile. 

WARNING - the user profile is left in the 4.04 directory tree and 
used in place by 4.61. If you de-install 4.04 at a later time and
delete the directory tree for 4.04 you will delete the user profile
that 4.61 is using.

--

Lorne Sunley

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: MBnet Networking Inc. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: djohnson@isomedia.com                             30-Nov-99 09:00:25
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 00:35:05
Subj: Re: Motherboard recommendations...

From: "David T. Johnson" <djohnson@isomedia.com>


Christian Hennecke wrote:
> 
> "David T. Johnson" schrieb:
> 
> > I used an ASUS P5A-B with the ALi Aladdin V chipset with OS/2 with no
> > problems.  It had a Matrox Millenium G200 AGP video that worked well.
> > AMD just today announced a K6-2 533 Mhz processor.  But my
> > recommendation would be an ASUS K7M ATX Athlon motherboard.
> 
> I don't know if ASUS would be a good choice in case of Athlon MBs. AFAIK
> there won't be much of the good support they usually provide.

Well, actually, they're providing their usual level of support...just
very quietly.  You can download the latest BIOSs and flash utility at:

ftp://ftp.asus.com.tw/pub/ASUS/mb/slota/

Product information and specifications are at:

http://www.asus.com.tw/products/motherboard/slota/k7m/index.html

I have used an ASUS K7M v1.04 Athlon motherboard for several weeks now. 
(I am writing this with it.)  The K7M works very well with OS/2 and I
don't have any complaints.  I think ASUS (and other manufacturers) are
going to be much stronger in their support for Athlon in the next few
weeks.  Intel's power over ASUS and others is fading fast.  Intel has
simply made too many mistakes:  rambus, chipset problems, OEM relations,
itanium, PIII serial no., vaporware product releases, etc.  And the
Athlon is an excellent product.  Intel makes some pretty good products
but they have had it too easy for the last three years and they have
made some very bad user-unfriendly decisions.  It's great to see AMD
show Intel how to do it.  Competition means better products, more
choices, better efficiency, and lower prices, IMO.
\

> 
> --
> Keep passing the open windows! ("The Hotel New Hampshire", John Irving)

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: skrise@attglobal.net                              30-Nov-99 12:47:24
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 00:35:06
Subj: Re: RC5DES setup

From: skrise@attglobal.net

Roland Pinches wrote:
> I have InJoy 2.3 (Extended registration) so I have Dial-on-demand, 
> and can even get it working, trouble is, the RC5DES client seems to 
> keep the connection open and never allows InJoy to time out and hangup 
> ie: I'm going to have an expensive phone bill if I carry on like this 
> 
> Can anyone suggest how to setup InJoy and RC5DES so that after a 
> couple of minutes idle time, the connection will close?

Off the top of my head it sounds as though you have the incorrect
"Modem Detection Method" selected under your "Communication Options"
on the config menu.

Using Injoy DoD, I think you need to have this set to "Normal Mode"
so that it will only send out a request for a TCP/IP connection when
the buffers are empty.

You will likely get more indepth (and accurate) information by
subscribing to the RC5/DES and Injoy mailing lists.

The RC5/DES list:
http://mailer.falcon-net.net:8080/guest/RemoteListSummary/rc5os2

The Injoy list:
Well, I can't find the URL for subscribing to the Injoy list, but
if you goto http://www.fx.dk/injoy/faq.html and
http://www.fx.dk/injoy/oaq.html you'll get some Injoy Q&A lists.

Steven

-- 
Abstainer: a weak person who yields
           to the temptation of denying himself a pleasure.
           ... Ambrose Bierce

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Chains of Protein (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: Thomas.Kellerer@tps-labs.com                      30-Nov-99 20:06:25
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 00:35:06
Subj: Re: font search

From: Thomas Kellerer <Thomas.Kellerer@tps-labs.com>

If you have time searching for it, you could scan the ATM fonts
available at LEO:

http://www.leo.org/pub/comp/os/os2/leo/atmfonts/index.html

At first glance there is one font called dingbats which might be a
"clone" of the Zapf Dingbats font. Perhaps that one has what you want:

ftp://ftp.leo.org/pub/comp/os/os2/leo/atmfonts/d/dingbats.zip

Cheers
Thomas


Dave Tholen wrote:
> 
> I'm looking for a font that extends the encircled numbers found in the
> WingDings font provided with Warp 4.
> 
> ASCII 139 to 149 in WingDings contains the numbers 0 through 10, inside
> a filled circle.  Does anyone know of a font that provides the same, but
> for the numbers 11 and higher?  I don't know how high I ultimately might
> want to go, but up to 19 would probably handle most, if not all, of the
> cases I have in mind.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: greywolf@onlink.net                               30-Nov-99 12:56:18
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 00:35:06
Subj: Re: New modem list

From: "Wolf Kirchmeir" <greywolf@onlink.net>

OOPS, I postred without writing anything -- maybe that was a Good Thing  :-)

If you are on ibm.net / attglobal.net, you can get the latest list through
Updates. If not, maybe a freindly soul will e-mail you the latest list. Try
me.

On 29 Nov 1999 19:34:00 GMT, Doug Bissett wrote:

=>On Sun, 28 Nov 1999 21:02:39, James Moe <sma.spam-not@rtd.com> wrote:
=>
=>> Hello,
=>>     Does anyone know where I can find a current modem init string list?
=>> It used to be known as MODEM.IAK. The list I have is rather dated and
=>> does not have *any* 56K modems listed.
=>> -- 
=>> sma at rtd dot com
=>> Remove ".spam-not" for email
=>
=>AFAIK, that thing has not been updated for years. Your best bet, is to
=>take the closest  modem, and change the init strings to whatever is 
=>suggested for your current modem. I know that a 3COM (US Robotics) 56K
=>Sportster modem works with the 14.4K Sportster settings. Describe your
=>modem, and someone can, probably, suggest a good init string to use.
=>
=>I hope this helps...
=>******************************
=>From the PC of Doug Bissett
=>doug.bissett at attglobal.net
=>The " at " must be changed to "@"
=>******************************



--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: NSMS (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: hxbitte@my-deja.com                               30-Nov-99 20:36:15
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 00:35:06
Subj: Warp4 installation on Toshiba Tecra

From: hxbitte@my-deja.com

I have a Toshiba Tecra 700CT which had OS2-3 running on it.  I needed to
upgrade to warp4 due to Y2K and our company policy. When I went through
the installation the first part works fine, but after the boot a single
color screen with a small box at the bottom says building objects (I
think I remember correctly) appears. After a few momments the activity
stops and nothing more happens. If I then reboot it looks like the
systems goes to the same point but with an hour glass then, nothing
happens.  The system is boot mgr driven and has Win 95 with OS2.


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Deja.com - Before you buy. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: cjhrph@mindspring.com                             30-Nov-99 20:47:14
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:06
Subj: Re: fix pack installaton

From: Christopher J Houle <cjhrph@mindspring.com>

Ivan Tang wrote:

>
>
> My question is: At the end of the installation, it prompts the users
> to enter ctrl-alt-del to restart the computer.

A typical day with OS/2

> After rebooting
> the PC, the fix pack installation program, fservice.exe, is still running. I
> just wonder how to make this fservice.exe to terminated by
> itself?  I have read books about the CID installation, and found
> that there is a key word "RebootRequired"

Im not suprised


        what have I done wrong?

You purchased OS/2

>
> Thanks in advance,

Thank IBM

>
>
> Victor
> email: victor.hw.tang@hkjc.org.hk

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: MindSpring Enterprises (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: dmunro@sfu.ca                                     30-Nov-99 18:33:14
  To: djohnson@isomedia.com                             01-Dec-99 17:09:06
Subj: Re: Motherboard recommendations...

To: "David T. Johnson" <djohnson@isomedia.com>
From: Duncan Munro <dmunro@sfu.ca>

Would you be able to run sysbench 094e on your athlon system and post 
the results?

thanks

Duncan Munro
dmunro@sfu.ca


David T. Johnson wrote:
> 
> Christian Hennecke wrote:
> >
> > "David T. Johnson" schrieb:
> >
> > > I used an ASUS P5A-B with the ALi Aladdin V chipset with OS/2 with no
> > > problems.  It had a Matrox Millenium G200 AGP video that worked well.
> > > AMD just today announced a K6-2 533 Mhz processor.  But my
> > > recommendation would be an ASUS K7M ATX Athlon motherboard.
> >
> > I don't know if ASUS would be a good choice in case of Athlon MBs. AFAIK
> > there won't be much of the good support they usually provide.
> 
> Well, actually, they're providing their usual level of support...just
> very quietly.  You can download the latest BIOSs and flash utility at:
> 
> ftp://ftp.asus.com.tw/pub/ASUS/mb/slota/
> 
> Product information and specifications are at:
> 
> http://www.asus.com.tw/products/motherboard/slota/k7m/index.html
> 
> I have used an ASUS K7M v1.04 Athlon motherboard for several weeks now.
> (I am writing this with it.)  The K7M works very well with OS/2 and I
> don't have any complaints.  I think ASUS (and other manufacturers) are
> going to be much stronger in their support for Athlon in the next few
> weeks.  Intel's power over ASUS and others is fading fast.  Intel has
> simply made too many mistakes:  rambus, chipset problems, OEM relations,
> itanium, PIII serial no., vaporware product releases, etc.  And the
> Athlon is an excellent product.  Intel makes some pretty good products
> but they have had it too easy for the last three years and they have
> made some very bad user-unfriendly decisions.  It's great to see AMD
> show Intel how to do it.  Competition means better products, more
> choices, better efficiency, and lower prices, IMO.
> \
> 
> >
> > --
> > Keep passing the open windows! ("The Hotel New Hampshire", John Irving)

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: SFU SAR (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: stumblebum@wasted.blort                           30-Nov-99 20:20:09
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:06
Subj: Re: low level hard drive format

From: stumblebum@wasted.blort (Mike Trettel)

On Mon, 29 Nov 1999 10:50:23, jknott@ibm.net (James Knott) wrote:

> In article <38418FF3.5D46AD80@rtd.com>,
> James Moe <sma.spam-not@rtd.com> wrote:
> >
> >
> >Daniel wrote:
> >> 
> >> ahoy,
> >>         Is there such at thing as a os/2 program for doing a low level
format
> >> of a hard disk?

(Piggyback..)  Not that I'm aware of, but you don't need it anyway-see
below.

 >
> >    Use fdisk to delete all the partitions. Then use "format c: /l". The
> >/l is a "long format" which reads and writes to everywhere on the disk
> >looking for bad blocks. Teh default file system is FAT.
> 
> That is not a low level format.  Also, how do you run format, if you 
> haven't created any partitions to format?

Any relatively modern bios running off a motherboard, or a decent SCSI
adapter will contain a low level format routine.  That's why it's a 
"low level" format-it's done by the hardware, and not the software.  
Contrary to whatever you may have heard, a low level format will not 
hurt a modern hard drive in the slightest.  All it's doing is 
initializing the surface of the hard drive on a block by block 
routine-this is a very handy method of wiping out a corrupted 
partition table and/or a boot sector virus.  If you've ever moved a 
SCSI drive from a Mac over to a PC, a low level format is just about 
required to reinitialize the drive for use under the PC due to the 
entirely differing fashion in which Macs use hard drives.  The same is
true for most of the *BSD Unixen-for example FreeBSD can use the 
entire contents of a hard drive (including the first 512K block) such 
that there is no partition table or boot sector for a more "doslike" 
OS such as OS/2 to use, much less understand.  Trying to run OS/2's 
fdisk on a FreeBSD hard drive will result in an error stating that the
partition table is corrupted.

The thing to do, then, is to use the motherboard's bios to low level 
format an EIDE drive, or to use the SCSI adapter's bios to low level 
format a SCSI drive, then fdisk and format the drive under OS/2.  Most
boot sector virii and screwed up LILO installs can be purged by a 
plain dos bootdisk and the "fdisk /mbr" command, so try that first.  
If that doesn't work, then nuke it with a low level format.  
> 
> -- 
> E-mail jknott@ca.ibm.com
> _________________________________________________________________________
> The above opinions are my own and not those of ISM Corp., a subsidiary of
> IBM Canada Ltd.

Mike Trettel		trettel (shift 2) fred (small dot) net

Death to spammers, and so forth.  Fix the reply line to mail me.  
Sorry.

System uptime is 0 days 02:16 hours (en).

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Twinco, Inc. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: jackw@attglobal.net                               30-Nov-99 21:17:28
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:06
Subj: OS/2 Warp vs 2gig Jaz

From: "Jack Weaver" <jackw@attglobal.net>

Is there anyway to run a 2 gigabyte Jaz drive under OS/2 Warp 4?

Jack Weaver				TROPICON XVIII -  Nov 19-21, 1999
South Florida Science Fiction Society	Guest of Honor:  Mike Resnick
http://sfsfs.org				Visit TROPICON's Homepage at
http://fanac.org				http://sfsfs.org/Tropicon


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Global Network Services - Remote Access Mail & Ne
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: forkd4nisse@dtek.chalmers.se                      01-Dec-99 02:25:13
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:06
Subj: Re: PC Week - Peter Coffee

From: Martin Nisshagen <forkd4nisse@dtek.chalmers.se>

Raphael Tennenbaum [AT&T WorldNet Services] -> comp.os.os2.misc:

 Oh sure.  And Bill didn't have sex with that girl.

 Yeah, it's very easy to confuse the D.C. courthouse with the
 Javits Center, I've made that mistake many times. 

 me to comfortably avoid using their product.  Unfortunately
 they have risen to the power of a government agency, and
 their existence amounts to a kind of tax on computer users,

If you obviously can't even see such basic difference, so I fail to see how
meaningful it's to participate in any serious discussions with you.

 since it's impossible to buy a new computer without paying
 for their OS in some way or another.  So as far as being

This is a false statement, but that doesn't perhaps matter (truth isn't
important as long as you bash Microsoft).

 obsessed -- not one bit, in fact most everything about MS,

Sure.

 troll the OS/2 newsgroups insulting & making generalizations

You call everyone who doesn't agree with the political correct (at least for
this group) anti-MS chant for "troll"?

It's OK to discuss this things as long as you say the same as everyone else in
this group (or at least most of them), but not otherwise if you don't agree?

Raphael, that's a very nice way to treat others and respect their views.

Sorry, I won't buy into your suggested censorship, and will continue to state
my own opinions (who as matter of fact, if you would bother to check, isn't
the same as either Microsoft or Bill Gates himself) even if I disagree with
any comments posted by another poster (or even a majority of them).

If you can't stand to read anyone who doesn't agree with you or the DOJ, you
are free to filter me out if you want (easy to do in any modern news reader).

 about OS/2 users, spreading dumb fairy tales about this poor

So now you call any argument who you doesn't agree with for "fairy tales"?

 unfairly treated MS -- and then back off and redirect their
 posts to *advocacy.

I still think a more proper forum for discussions such as this one is the
*.advocacy groups (at least better than this group) but since I got so
strongly criticized for that I haven't dared to change the discussions to that
forum any more.

Best regards,

m a r t i n | n

-- 
Martin Nisshagen                 PGP 6.5: 0x45D423AC      K R A F T W E R K 
:)
CS/CE, Chalmers, Sweden          ICQ UIN: 689662          2 x 300A @ 450 MHz
d4nisse-at-dtek-chalmers-se      home2.pp.sbbs.se/mn     
home2.pp.sbbs.se/mn/kw

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Chalmers University of Technology, Sweden (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: ames@deltrak.demon.co.uk                          01-Dec-99 02:16:19
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:06
Subj: Re: font search

From: ames@deltrak.demon.co.uk (Andrew Stephenson)

In article <821p2n$d28$6@news.hawaii.edu>
	   tholenantispam@hawaii.edu "Dave Tholen" writes:

> [[ re fonts from Monotype ]]
> Sounds like just what I'm looking for.  Do they provide the
> necessary files for OS/2, or would I need to run them through
> the PFM to AFM converter?

Since my previous posting, I have been to MT's site.  First, the
quoted price for the fonts you sought is shown as UKP20, not 22.
Second, AFAIR they said the format was Adobe.  Whichever format
it is, MT usually provide everything you need.  (And, of course,
OS/2 takes Truetype as well.)  Third, you can call up a page for
each font and see the full symbol set on-line.

> I'd like to search through the freely downloadable fonts first,
> however.

Understandable.
--
Andrew Stephenson

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: DNS (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: mckinnis@attglobal.net                            01-Dec-99 01:41:20
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:06
Subj: Re: AssocEdit does'nt change jpg association to PMView

From: mckinnis@attglobal.net (Chuck McKinnis)

Did you take a trip thru ->System Setup->Multimedia Setup to make sure
no one in there has decided that jpg is something they would like to 
operate on?

On Tue, 30 Nov 1999 02:49:39, Joe Farruggio <jfarrug@erols.com> wrote:

> HI
> I have a pentium II system using os2 ver4 fixpak 12 and object desktop
> ver 2 with fixpak 1. I have tried to associate my jpg files to Pmview
> ver 2.00 Beta 16129
> using AssocEdit ver 2.1 . The jpg files still open using image viewer.
> I have
> evan changed the menu selection in the properties page to use Pmview
> under the "Open as" menu. Once i close the menu selection it reverts
> back
> to image viewer.
> 
> I next tried using the program "prmgfix" which is supposed to fix this
> problem. Some jpg files then opened in PMView but most did not. The ones
> that didn't where photos which had been converted to jpg files from
> film.
> 
> I then tried to use the setdefv command which is native to OS2 and is
> recommended in the PMView documentation as a fix for this problem. This
> did absolutely nothing.
> 
> IF  anyone has any insight into this problem, i would dearly love to
> hear about any proposed solution. TIA
> --
>  Joe Farruggio
> 
>  ICQ #13668583
>  jfarrug@erols.com
> 
> 

Chuck McKinnis
IBM Senior Systems Engineer (retired)

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Global Network Services - Remote Access Mail & Ne
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: tholenantispam@hawaii.edu                         01-Dec-99 03:06:10
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:06
Subj: Re: font search

From: tholenantispam@hawaii.edu (Dave Tholen)

Andrew Stephenson writes:

>> [[ re fonts from Monotype ]]
>> Sounds like just what I'm looking for.  Do they provide the
>> necessary files for OS/2, or would I need to run them through
>> the PFM to AFM converter?

> Since my previous posting, I have been to MT's site.

So have I.  I didn't find them in the obvious location.  They have
them listed alphabetically, but the only fonts with names that
began with "Cir" were "Circus" and "Cirrus".  No "Circle Frame"
listed.  So I must be looking in the wrong place.  Do they have a
separate category for collections of symbols, rather than character
sets?  I tried their search engine, but it didn't find a hit on
"Circle Frame".

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: IFA B-111 (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: hunters@sapphire.indstate.edu                     01-Dec-99 02:32:07
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:06
Subj: Re: OS/2 install problem

From: hunters@sapphire.indstate.edu

In article <CoX04.8$rS4.311@sodalite.nbnet.nb.ca>,
  "Marco Shaw" <marco.shaw@nbtel.nb.ca> wrote:

> Going through the install, it comes to the fdisk section.  I get an
> error stating "the partition table could be corrupted", and then I'm
> not able to continue.

Do you have the >4.3GB drive fix applied?

ftp://ftp.software.ibm.com/ps/products/os2/os2ddpak/idedasd.exe
Unzip this, and follow all the instructions in the docs. Good luck!

--
-Steven Hunter                *OS/2 Warp 4 * |But on the other hand...|
hunters@sapphire.indstate.edu *AMD K6-2 400* |There's 5 more fingers. |


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Deja.com - Before you buy. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: sma.spam-not@rtd.com                              01-Dec-99 03:46:15
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:06
Subj: Re: OS/2 Warp vs 2gig Jaz

From: James Moe <sma.spam-not@rtd.com>


Jack Weaver wrote:
> 
> Is there anyway to run a 2 gigabyte Jaz drive under OS/2 Warp 4?
> 
    <sigh> Details?

    Parallel Port : no
    ATA/AIAPI/IDE : yes, with latest ibm1s506.add driver, or
danis506.add.
    SCSI          : yes

-- 

sma at rtd dot com
Remove ".spam-not" for email

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Sohnen-Moe Associates, Inc (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: sma.spam-not@rtd.com                              01-Dec-99 03:44:08
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:06
Subj: Re: WinOS2 .dll file in Wart 4.0

From: James Moe <sma.spam-not@rtd.com>


Ron Vopicka wrote:
> 
> I've run into an interesting (not really) Win 3.1 bug in a program I
> receive that is updated on a quarterly schedule.  The latest update has
> some problems.  I have determined that the same program which will run
> under Win98 does NOT have the problem.  Obviously, something changed.
> 
    What kind of problems?

> In casting about for some way to keep from being forced into W98, I have
> started to wonder if my dlls on winos2\system are the most current and
> hopefully most bug-free
> 
    It depends. What is the last fixpak you installed. The current one
is fp12.

> I have looked thru the fix pack fixes and not seen anything significant
> that directly indicates any dll changes (but they could be hidden).  So
> I have started wondering about the safety/advisability of updating using
> any of the genuine MS Win 3.1 .dlls (assmuming there are any updates).
> Now I know that SOME windows support was changed to fit 3.1 into OS/2,
> but for years now I have never wondered which programs might be
> updatable and which MUST NOT BE.
> 
    None of the system DLLs can be replaced with the original MS
versions. winos2 has been heavily modified to run properly and in os/2.
Much of the shoddy and inconsistent coding has been replaced over the
years and updatesas well as integration with os/2.

> Before I go thru the unbelievable hassle of trying to find out it there
> are any MS .dlls that might even be candidates for updating, I wonder if
> anyone else has made an attempt in this direction?
> 
    This is not to say you cannot try replacing winos2 DLLs with earlier
versions. I have done this myself to fix a problem a fixpak caused. Four
fixpaks later the problem was corrected.
    Does your program have DLLs? Maybe try using an earlier rev on
those.


-- 

sma at rtd dot com
Remove ".spam-not" for email

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Sohnen-Moe Associates, Inc (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: sma.spam-not@rtd.com                              01-Dec-99 03:57:22
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:06
Subj: Re: Switching drives - how?

From: James Moe <sma.spam-not@rtd.com>


lifedata@xxvol.com wrote:
> 
> How can I change my second physical hard drive to first?
> 
> I unplugged the first drive and made the hardware changes to jumpers, etc.
> My OS/2 boot partition is on this drive and when I set it up I put a
> primary partition on the beginning so it could hold the boot manager when I
> moved it.
> 
> But when I booted it up, it still had the same drive letter and the C:
> drive and it's partitions were just not there.  I'm back in my original
> configuration now.  What do I need to do to get this drive in first
> position?
> 
    Your best bet is to back everything up (one backup set per drive),
re-configure your drives, re-partition, format, and restore. This might
work.
    There may be dependencies in the os/2 image that expect to find
things on certain drives that will not be so when the drive letters
change around.
    I went through something like this a few years ago. After much
gnashing of teeth, I ended up doing the above. And I still had problems
for a while. I have become quite dogmatic in how I set up systems now:
system(s) on c:, programs on d:, data on e: and up. (Although a
maintenance partition after the system disk/partition would have smart
to do.)


-- 

sma at rtd dot com
Remove ".spam-not" for email

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Sohnen-Moe Associates, Inc (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: wrook@walkabout.org                               30-Nov-99 23:54:14
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:06
Subj: Re: Can I still buy OS/2 Warp Connect v3.0 ?

From: Wilson Rook <wrook@walkabout.org>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
--------------DBDF6E7CF6F0A9717C692C11
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

This is true as of about May of this year.  Check ebay and search for os/2 and
os2.  While this is not
a relable source you can get the software at a song.  If you need 500 copies
-- you'll only get 1 or 2 at
a time off ebay.

Also, no more service packs for os/2 Warp 3.

Wilson Rook
(former Warp 3 user, I have very happy with Warp 4.41)

Tony Haley wrote:

> Help!
>
> We are being told by our supplier that we cannot buy OS/2 Warp Connect v3.0
> (Blue spine, IBM P/N 07H9910) anymore.
>
> We have to use this version.
>
> Can anyone help point me in the direction of a reliable supplier who can
> deliver this?
>
> All advice appreciated.
>
> Thanks in advance,
>
> Tony Haley
> Blue Chip Technology Ltd
> UK

--------------DBDF6E7CF6F0A9717C692C11
Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii;
 name="wrook.vcf"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Description: Card for Wilson Rook
Content-Disposition: attachment;
 filename="wrook.vcf"

begin:vcard 
n:Rook;Wilson (Bill)
tel;fax:(231) 861-2680
tel;work:(231) 861-2615
x-mozilla-html:FALSE
adr:;;4708 First Street, P.O. Box 37;New Era;MI;49446-0037;USA
version:2.1
email;internet:wrook@walkabout.org
fn:Bill Rook
end:vcard

--------------DBDF6E7CF6F0A9717C692C11--

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Internet Walkabout, Inc. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: wrook@walkabout.org                               30-Nov-99 23:56:10
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:06
Subj: Re: PC Week - Peter Coffee

From: Wilson Rook <wrook@walkabout.org>

This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
--------------0C4B4C4F955E94F61764DADA
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit

What about OS/2 and other misc OS/2 subjects?

Martin Nisshagen wrote:

> Raphael Tennenbaum [AT&T WorldNet Services] -> comp.os.os2.misc:
>
>  Oh sure.  And Bill didn't have sex with that girl.
>
>  Yeah, it's very easy to confuse the D.C. courthouse with the
>  Javits Center, I've made that mistake many times.
>
>  me to comfortably avoid using their product.  Unfortunately
>  they have risen to the power of a government agency, and
>  their existence amounts to a kind of tax on computer users,
>
> If you obviously can't even see such basic difference, so I fail to see how
> meaningful it's to participate in any serious discussions with you.
>
>  since it's impossible to buy a new computer without paying
>  for their OS in some way or another.  So as far as being
>
> This is a false statement, but that doesn't perhaps matter (truth isn't
> important as long as you bash Microsoft).
>
>  obsessed -- not one bit, in fact most everything about MS,
>
> Sure.
>
>  troll the OS/2 newsgroups insulting & making generalizations
>
> You call everyone who doesn't agree with the political correct (at least for
> this group) anti-MS chant for "troll"?
>
> It's OK to discuss this things as long as you say the same as everyone else
in
> this group (or at least most of them), but not otherwise if you don't agree?
>
> Raphael, that's a very nice way to treat others and respect their views.
>
> Sorry, I won't buy into your suggested censorship, and will continue to
state
> my own opinions (who as matter of fact, if you would bother to check, isn't
> the same as either Microsoft or Bill Gates himself) even if I disagree with
> any comments posted by another poster (or even a majority of them).
>
> If you can't stand to read anyone who doesn't agree with you or the DOJ, you
> are free to filter me out if you want (easy to do in any modern news
reader).
>
>  about OS/2 users, spreading dumb fairy tales about this poor
>
> So now you call any argument who you doesn't agree with for "fairy tales"?
>
>  unfairly treated MS -- and then back off and redirect their
>  posts to *advocacy.
>
> I still think a more proper forum for discussions such as this one is the
> *.advocacy groups (at least better than this group) but since I got so
> strongly criticized for that I haven't dared to change the discussions to
that
> forum any more.
>
> Best regards,
>
> m a r t i n | n
>
> --
> Martin Nisshagen                 PGP 6.5: 0x45D423AC      K R A F T W E R K  
:)
> CS/CE, Chalmers, Sweden          ICQ UIN: 689662          2 x 300A @ 450 MHz
> d4nisse-at-dtek-chalmers-se      home2.pp.sbbs.se/mn     
home2.pp.sbbs.se/mn/kw

--------------0C4B4C4F955E94F61764DADA
Content-Type: text/x-vcard; charset=us-ascii;
 name="wrook.vcf"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Content-Description: Card for Wilson Rook
Content-Disposition: attachment;
 filename="wrook.vcf"

begin:vcard 
n:Rook;Wilson (Bill)
tel;fax:(231) 861-2680
tel;work:(231) 861-2615
x-mozilla-html:FALSE
adr:;;4708 First Street, P.O. Box 37;New Era;MI;49446-0037;USA
version:2.1
email;internet:wrook@walkabout.org
fn:Bill Rook
end:vcard

--------------0C4B4C4F955E94F61764DADA--

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Internet Walkabout, Inc. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: Trevor-Hemsley@dial.pipex.com                     30-Nov-99 21:20:15
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:07
Subj: Re: RC5DES setup

From: "Trevor Hemsley" <Trevor-Hemsley@dial.pipex.com>

On Tue, 30 Nov 1999 14:57:50 +0000 (GMT), Roland Pinches wrote:

->Can anyone suggest how to setup InJoy and RC5DES so that after a couple of
->minutes idle time, the connection will close?
->
->Seems a shame to waste all this processing power...

RC5DES should close the connection after about 45 seconds (can't remember
the timeout value). Whatever it is that's doing this it isn't that.
Perhaps you should look at running a perproxy on your own machine.


Trevor Hemsley, London, UK
(Trevor-Hemsley@dial.pipex.com or 75704.2477@compuserve.com)



--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: UUNET WorldCom server (post doesn't reflect views
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: jr_fox@earthlink.net                              30-Nov-99 20:08:07
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:07
Subj: Re: <None>

From: "J. R. Fox" <jr_fox@earthlink.net>

Fritz Oppliger wrote:

> hello all-
>
> is there an easy way to link two os/2 boxes? as in Laplink, or Norton
> Commander link? (warp3 red+BP)
>
> thanks-
> fritz
>
>
> fritzo@humboldt.net(Fritz Oppliger) KE6VDA

I have never had occasion to try it, have only heard of it, but there is
a freeware pkg. from
Jan Van Wijk  called  LPTOOL that purports to be a LAPLINK for OS/2.

Go to   http://www.fsys.demon.nl/

Hope this helps.

<jf>



--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: EarthLink Network, Inc. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: larso@commodore.                                  01-Dec-99 07:43:20
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:07
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg)

As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw letoured@nospam.net write:
> >Does Microsoft send people to force you to buy their products?  Which gun
> >is being placed at your skull?
> >Or is it a matter of Microsoft "forcing you" to buy the product by
> >providing a valued product at an affordable rate?
> 
> Where do you get this nonsense from?

From an attempt to determine the mechanism Microsoft used to force this poor
man into giving them money.

>                                    If you read the Findings of Fact, as
> you claim to have done, you either do not understand US law and how
> markets are controlled

US law and how markets are controlled are directly opposed to one another.

> BTW, do you think the US DOJ antitrust action against IBM that essentially
> allowed MS have a market share was a good thing or bad thing?

The quarter century trial against IBM was a sham.  But I'm hardly going to
punish Microsoft for an improper DOJ action.

-- 
Lars P. Ormberg     ICQ#:8827066
mailto:larso@ualberta.ca
The University of Lars:   http://www.ualberta.ca/~larso/

"The way you're bathed in light, reminds me of that night
God laid me down into your rose garden of trust and I was
swept away with nothin' left to say some helpless fool
yeah I was lost in a swoon of peace you're all I need to
find so when the time is right come to me sweetly, come
to me come to me..love will lead us, alright.  love will
lead us, she will lead us.  can you hear the dolphin's
cry?  see the road rise up to meet us its in the air we
breathe tonight love will lead us, she will lead us"
                            -Live, "The Dolphin's Cry"

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: PowerSurfr - High Speed Internet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: larso@commodore.                                  01-Dec-99 07:23:03
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:07
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg)

As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw cbzh@my-deja.com write:
>   larso@ualberta.ca wrote:

> > Does Microsoft send people to force you to buy their products?  Which gun
is
> > being placed at your skull?
> >
> > Or is it a matter of Microsoft "forcing you" to buy the product by
providing
> > a valued product at an affordable rate?
> 
> Oh, that's it: I am 100% convinced now!
> 
> So I must have _willingly_ bought the two never used and never needed -
> but surely paid for! - Win95 licenses I still have somewhere around,
> because there was actually no gun around anywhere??!

Well, through what mechanism did Microsoft force you to purchase the
product?  Where was your free choice removed?  Was your free choice removed
at the point where you wanted to usurp the free choices of others?

> I still cannot see why I should have spent money for these licenses, but
> maybe I still wanted them unconsciously?? Or it was in a moment that I
> felt some kind of pity with poor Billy boy and I just wanted to make a
> free donation for him???

Well, why did you pay the fucking money?

> Still not understanding my motivation thus - but it was sure no monopoly
> power that was forcing me - "because monopolies are always imposed by
> governments" (never contradict the Ormberg dogma!), and our government
> sure would have allowed selling computers without Windows licenses!!!

You can sell a computer without Windows licences.

I helped a friend set such a machine up less than a week ago.

--
Lars P. Ormberg     ICQ#:8827066
mailto:larso@ualberta.ca
The University of Lars:   http://www.ualberta.ca/~larso/

"The way you're bathed in light, reminds me of that night
God laid me down into your rose garden of trust and I was
swept away with nothin' left to say some helpless fool
yeah I was lost in a swoon of peace you're all I need to
find so when the time is right come to me sweetly, come
to me come to me..love will lead us, alright.  love will
lead us, she will lead us.  can you hear the dolphin's
cry?  see the road rise up to meet us its in the air we
breathe tonight love will lead us, she will lead us"
                            -Live, "The Dolphin's Cry"

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: PowerSurfr - High Speed Internet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: herbert.kaminski@t-online.de                      01-Dec-99 00:00:08
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:07
Subj: Re: problem w/ cdrw

From: Herbert Kaminski <herbert.kaminski@t-online.de>

nemo@union.edu wrote:
[...]
> However, whenever I try to open the "cd recorder" icon in RSJ, I get,
> "can't open drive [CDR:], Make sure the drive is ready and not used by
> another applicaiton."

Well, in my CONFIG.SYS, I have:

REM *** RSJ CD-Writer File System ***
BASEDEV=LOCKCDR.FLT
DEVICE=E:\CDWFS\RSJSCSI.SYS
IFS=E:\CDWFS\CDWFS.IFS
RUN=E:\CDWFS\CDWFSD.EXE -p "h:/TRACKS" -c50000 -b4096 -t2 -i3 -s4

and you should have similar lines too. And, don't forget to
set the SCSI controller to 'no synch transfer' for the SCSI ID 
of the CDRW.

> The pdf manual is uninformative and I've found nothing so far on deja.com.

Did you ever try their web pages at www.rsj.de? Or their newsgroups
at news.rsj.de? I never had to try it, but I am quite sure they
answer questions by e-mail.

>      OS/2 - ma kauft koi katz em sack

..and no CDRW either ;-)

cu
  Herbert

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: T-Online (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: larso@commodore.                                  01-Dec-99 07:47:09
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:07
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg)

As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw letoured@nospam.net write:
> Chris J Delanoy <cdelanoy@ualberta.ca> said:
> 
> >The US anti-trust laws are deliberately designed as so to be impossible
> >to be objectively understood.  They are ex-post-facto, arbitrary, and
> >entirely open-ended, and any "findings of fact" made under them do not
> >necessarily bear any resemblance to reality (ie - to actual FACTS).
> 
> Baloney. They can be understood by those with knowledge of markets and
> mutilative practices

Mutilative practises being bad, eh?

The alternative, "give your competitor a helping hand" practises are the
good ones, right?

> >As for how markets run, it is you who obviously has no idea.  The only
> >monopolies (ie - companies against which competition is impossible and
> >which can therefore set prices independently of the market) that have
> >existed have been created and maintained by acts of government.  No
> >coervice monopoly has ever and can ever be created on the free market -
> >and Microsoft (which is not a monopoly) is no exception.
> 
> Baloney again.  You did okay until you got the part about a monopoly has
> to be created by the government.

Then surely you can provide an example of a company that is alone in its
marketplace, where the government didn't assist them through law.

>                                        And companies which are permitted
> (licensed if you will) to function as a so-called monopoly are permitted
> because it is deemed necessary to the public good and regulated for the
> public good.  

Then why does the public benefit so much from the deregulation?

> -- BTW, Gates was saying he should be permitted to have monopoly back in
> the early 80s for the public good, but without any regulation or
> requirements for performance or a warranty.  Its the same argument he
> gives us now.  

When did he ask for government assistance?

If he never did, then he sounds no different than EVERY OTHER BUSINESSMAN on
the face of this earth.

-- 
Lars P. Ormberg     ICQ#:8827066
mailto:larso@ualberta.ca
The University of Lars:   http://www.ualberta.ca/~larso/

"The way you're bathed in light, reminds me of that night
God laid me down into your rose garden of trust and I was
swept away with nothin' left to say some helpless fool
yeah I was lost in a swoon of peace you're all I need to
find so when the time is right come to me sweetly, come
to me come to me..love will lead us, alright.  love will
lead us, she will lead us.  can you hear the dolphin's
cry?  see the road rise up to meet us its in the air we
breathe tonight love will lead us, she will lead us"
                            -Live, "The Dolphin's Cry"

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: PowerSurfr - High Speed Internet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: cbzh@my-deja.com                                  01-Dec-99 08:20:17
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:07
Subj: Re: AssocEdit does'nt change jpg association to PMView

From: cbzh@my-deja.com

In article <38433B43.EBFE4E02@erols.com>,
  Joe Farruggio <jfarrug@erols.com> wrote:
> HI
> I have a pentium II system using os2 ver4 fixpak 12 and object desktop
> ver 2 with fixpak 1. I have tried to associate my jpg files to Pmview
> ver 2.00 Beta 16129
> using AssocEdit ver 2.1 . The jpg files still open using image viewer.
> I have
> evan changed the menu selection in the properties page to use Pmview
> under the "Open as" menu. Once i close the menu selection it reverts
> back
> to image viewer.
>
> I next tried using the program "prmgfix" which is supposed to fix this
> problem. Some jpg files then opened in PMView but most did not. The
ones
> that didn't where photos which had been converted to jpg files from
> film.
>
> I then tried to use the setdefv command which is native to OS2 and is
> recommended in the PMView documentation as a fix for this problem.
This
> did absolutely nothing.
>

Maybe not helpful because you know it already, but I had some trouble
with setdefv in the beginning: You have to use exactly the right
parameters, otherwise it does just nothing! (The point is well that I am
writing this now at a WinNT computer (at work...) so I might give you a
false advice now in detail, so check it out!)

- You need to give just any (even non-existing) _complete filename_ of
the type you want to change  as a parameter, i.e. blabla.jpg, but not
*.jpg, .jpg, jpg or whatever

- You need to give the _title_ of the _program object_ you want to
start, and I think you have to enclose it in "" (double quotes)

Just my 2 cents...

Cornelis Bockemhl <cbockem@datacomm.ch>

> IF  anyone has any insight into this problem, i would dearly love to
> hear about any proposed solution. TIA
> --
>  Joe Farruggio
>
>  ICQ #13668583
>  jfarrug@erols.com
>
>


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Deja.com - Before you buy. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: cbzh@my-deja.com                                  01-Dec-99 08:45:19
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:07
Subj: Re: font search

From: cbzh@my-deja.com

In article <8204lp$686$1@news.hawaii.edu>,
  tholenantispam@hawaii.edu wrote:
> I'm looking for a font that extends the encircled numbers found in the
> WingDings font provided with Warp 4.
>
> ASCII 139 to 149 in WingDings contains the numbers 0 through 10,
inside
> a filled circle.  Does anyone know of a font that provides the same,
but
> for the numbers 11 and higher?  I don't know how high I ultimately
might
> want to go, but up to 19 would probably handle most, if not all, of
the
> cases I have in mind.
>

If you want it for free and do not like to try all the many possible
fonts you find (which takes some time...) you still have the "do it
yourself" option: I created the special astronomy fonts I use in my PmAs
program package (see http://www.datacomm.ch/cobo) with Corel Draw 5 for
Win3 (running under WinOS2). This is less complicated than you would
expect, and if you only intend to put equal circles around numbers it
could even be just a matter of copy and paste, starting with a font that
has already 1-10.

If you already have the program (or others??) you may be faster than
trying around that way!

Cornelis Bockemhl <cbockem@datacomm.ch>


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Deja.com - Before you buy. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: cbzh@my-deja.com                                  01-Dec-99 09:09:06
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:07
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: cbzh@my-deja.com

Great: Here you have the 3 main dogmas that are the core of all postings
by Chris Delanoy and Lars Ormberg nicely together:

In article <821q6h$aoe$1@nnrp1.deja.com>,
  Chris J Delanoy <cdelanoy@ualberta.ca> wrote:
>
[...]

This is #1:

> Nothing that any government has done has ever been for the ACTUAL
> good of the public.
>
[...]

This is #2:

> He didn't get any such franchise from any government.  And he
> therefore has no monopoly powers whatsoever.

I.e.: Monopoly = government, otherwise it is no monopoly!

Finally #3:

> [...] Then wait and see who
> comes after you for your money and with what weapons.
>

I.e.: Physical weapons are needed to maintain a monopoly!

In some heads these are stronger than ANY argument or fact in the world,
so please stop contradicting them!! It is so simple: JUST AGREE AND YOU
WILL BE HAPPY!!! And then stop thinking at this point!

Cornelis Bockemhl

PS: Warning: If you happen to own any M$ products you never needed or
intended to buy: Rather check your mental health state before you
contradict the above dogmas; you could find out that the world is a bit
more complicated otherwise!


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Deja.com - Before you buy. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bnc@webone.com.au                                 01-Dec-99 21:36:18
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:07
Subj: Re: AssocEdit does'nt change jpg association to PMView

From: bnc@webone.com.au

In <822lo6$t73$1@nnrp1.deja.com>, cbzh@my-deja.com writes:
>In article <38433B43.EBFE4E02@erols.com>,
>  Joe Farruggio <jfarrug@erols.com> wrote:
>> HI
>> I have a pentium II system using os2 ver4 fixpak 12 and object desktop
>> ver 2 with fixpak 1. I have tried to associate my jpg files to Pmview
>> ver 2.00 Beta 16129
>> using AssocEdit ver 2.1 . The jpg files still open using image viewer.
>> I have
>> evan changed the menu selection in the properties page to use Pmview
>> under the "Open as" menu. Once i close the menu selection it reverts
>> back
>> to image viewer.
>>
>> I next tried using the program "prmgfix" which is supposed to fix this
>> problem. Some jpg files then opened in PMView but most did not. The
>ones
>> that didn't where photos which had been converted to jpg files from
>> film.
>>
>> I then tried to use the setdefv command which is native to OS2 and is
>> recommended in the PMView documentation as a fix for this problem.
>This
>> did absolutely nothing.
>>
>
>Maybe not helpful because you know it already, but I had some trouble
>with setdefv in the beginning: You have to use exactly the right
>parameters, otherwise it does just nothing! (The point is well that I am
>writing this now at a WinNT computer (at work...) so I might give you a
>false advice now in detail, so check it out!)
>
>- You need to give just any (even non-existing) _complete filename_ of
>the type you want to change  as a parameter, i.e. blabla.jpg, but not
>*.jpg, .jpg, jpg or whatever
>
>- You need to give the _title_ of the _program object_ you want to
>start, and I think you have to enclose it in "" (double quotes)
>
>Just my 2 cents...
>
>Cornelis Bockemhl <cbockem@datacomm.ch>
>
Certainly was helpfull. I had changed my associations using ASSOCEDIT, but it
would still
pick up the default as IMAGE.

Ran the SETDEFV as below and now it will pick whatever the default is set to
in the properties.

Brian

Usage:
   setdefv "<view name>" <file name>

Where:
   <view name> is the name of the view as it appears in the
               context menu for the object. For convenience,
               spaces or control characters such as carriage
               returns, line feeds, or tabs may be omitted.
               For example "Icon<cr><lf>Editor" may be
               specified as "Icon Editor"
   <file name> is the name of a file belonging to the class
               for which you are setting the default view.
               It is not necessary that this file exist.

Example:
   To set the default viewer for bitmap files to the OS/2
   icon editor you would execute:
   setdefv "Icon Editor" temp.bmp

[C:\]setdefv "Galleria" f:\01b00080.jpg
creating f:\01b00080.jpg
Default view successfully set.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Web One Internet http://webone.com.au (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: idawson@montupetuk.co.uk                          01-Dec-99 11:50:05
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:08
Subj: OS2 Dual Boot Installation Problem

From: "Ian Dawson" <idawson@montupetuk.co.uk>

Hi,
    I have a Toshiba Satellite S300CDT (with 2.1Gb - 80Mb RAM) currently
running
Win 98.  I want to install OS2 as a dual boot option.

After inserting the OS2 Installation Disk, an OS2 symbol appears and after
about
30 seconds of disk churning, the machine reboots and starts the whole
process again.

Any Ideas on whats wrong and how to fix them....

Thanks.


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: pvolsted@image.dk                                 01-Dec-99 11:38:26
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:08
Subj: Re: RC5DES setup

From: peter volsted <pvolsted@image.dk>

hi



> On Tue, 30 Nov 1999 14:57:50 +0000 (GMT), Roland Pinches wrote:
>
> ->Can anyone suggest how to setup InJoy and RC5DES so that after a couple of
> ->minutes idle time, the connection will close?
> ->
> ->Seems a shame to waste all this processing power...
>

I have made a 'manual' instance of InJoy thus:
Open InJoy.  Click on New. Name for ex. Def Org and Save.
Open your DOD-InJoy and without making changes Save as Default.
Click on New. Name for ex. Manual - in the DOD-section remove the x's and then
Save.

When time to update, start your manual InJoy, then stop Rc5DES with Ctl-C, and
give the command: RC5DES -update. Then restart RC5DES and stop InJoy.
It usually lasts around 22 seconds in my case.

good luck

peter


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: pdrumm@dwave.net                                  01-Dec-99 11:25:08
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:08
Subj: Re: Netscape Communicator 4.61 install problems

From: pdrumm@dwave.net (Peter Drumm)

In message
<eleS4DQ3N6dS-pn2-hSd5ojMzUxdQ@user-38lc0nq.dialup.mindspring.com> -
rgibson@ix.netcom.com (Ron Gibson) writes:
:->
:->I forgot to ask.  Does one need to remove your old 4.04 installation
:->before installing 4.61.  I remember some problems in the past
:->installation over other versions...

I have NS/2 v 2.02, 4.04, and 4.61 all installed in different dirs and
they all work fine. Installing over the top of an older version isn't
recommended.

Custom machining; Tool & Cutter grinding
Peter Drumm, Wausau WI  <pdrumm@dwave.net> 
<http://home.dwave.net/~pdrumm>
Cyrix6x86/300 MII, OS/2 Warp 4, Linux

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rjf@yyycomasia.com                                01-Dec-99 11:50:23
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:08
Subj: Re: AssocEdit does'nt change jpg association to PMView

From: rjf@yyycomasia.com (rj friedman)

On Tue, 30 Nov 1999 02:49:39, Joe Farruggio 
<jfarrug@erols.com> wrote:

...I have tried to associate my jpg files to Pmview
ver 2.00 Beta 16129 using AssocEdit ver 2.1 .
The jpg files still open using image viewer...

PMView beta for ver 2.00 handles jpg files for me. When you 
installed, did you get the screen where it had the list of 
files that it would open? I kept all of them. Maybe you 
missed something there. Also, did you post this question to 
the beta newslist? I don't recall seeing it there. Seems to 
me that you would get a lot better answer from there.




________________________________________________________

[RJ]                 OS/2 - Live it, or live with it. 
rj friedman          Team ABW              
Taipei, Taiwan       rjf@yyycomasia.com 

To send email - remove the `yyy'
________________________________________________________

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: SEEDNet News Service (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: cocke@catherders.com                              01-Dec-99 07:47:27
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:08
Subj: Re: OS/2 Warp vs 2gig Jaz

From: Michael W. Cocke <cocke@catherders.com>

On Wed, 01 Dec 1999 03:46:31 GMT, James Moe wrote:


Correction:

>
>
>Jack Weaver wrote:
>> 
>> Is there anyway to run a 2 gigabyte Jaz drive under OS/2 Warp 4?
>> 
>    <sigh> Details?
>
>    Parallel Port : no
 
 Parallel Port : Yes

>    ATA/AIAPI/IDE : yes, with latest ibm1s506.add driver, or
>danis506.add.
>    SCSI          : yes
>
>-- 
>
>sma at rtd dot com
>Remove ".spam-not" for email
>

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Please note:  My Email and web page addresses are changing in January
2000.
                     The new email address is cocke@catherders.com   
                      The web page is at http://www.catherders.com

                    Because network administration is like herding cats.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------



--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: UseNet Server, Inc.  http://www.usenetserver.com 
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: raphaelt@netnews.worldnet.att.net                 30-Nov-99 23:35:08
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:08
Subj: Re: PC Week - Peter Coffee

From: raphaelt@netnews.worldnet.att.net (Raphael Tennenbaum)

Martin Nisshagen <forkd4nisse@dtek.chalmers.se> wrote:

>Raphael Tennenbaum [AT&T WorldNet Services] -> comp.os.os2.misc:
>
> Oh sure.  And Bill didn't have sex with that girl.
>
> Yeah, it's very easy to confuse the D.C. courthouse with the
> Javits Center, I've made that mistake many times. 
>
> me to comfortably avoid using their product.  Unfortunately
> they have risen to the power of a government agency, and
> their existence amounts to a kind of tax on computer users,
>
>If you obviously can't even see such basic difference, so I fail to see how
>meaningful it's to participate in any serious discussions with you.

Martin, you asserted that MS didn't present false evidence,
i.e., a doctored videotape.  You produced someone's flimsy
apologia, a crippled account asserting that the evidence
wasn't meant as evidence but a demonstration -- and then
went on to say, but the demonstration was 3/4s true.  *That*
is the issue.  If you can concoct a standard of judicial
conduct which permits 1) truth measured by a quantitative
standard and not as a purely qualitative one, and 2) allows
for "mistakes" such as confusing an antitrust defense with a
trade show presentation, then I'm sure there are several
executives in Redmond who'll fund your ascent to a US
District Court bench.  Thankfully that's nowhere near the
standard of evidence we have in the real world.  It's
unacceptable behavior for lawyers, and more to the point,
unacceptable, crooked, and cynical behavior on *anyone's*
part.  Microsoft isn't above the law.  But this kind of
conduct is one more ringing indication that far from being
tortured by MS-haters and anachronistic antitrust
regulations, Microsoft is well aware of what it's done at
every step of the way.

That was the issue you raised, and it's been dealt with. 
And I'm sorry that it doesn't fit in with your scenario of
MS-as-victim which you (and MS) now seem so intent upon
playing out.  But the fact is that people who break the law
and then falsify evidence in court are not victims, no
matter how wealthy they are, or how many dopes they get to
fashion flimsy alibis for them.

> since it's impossible to buy a new computer without paying
> for their OS in some way or another.  So as far as being
>
>This is a false statement, but that doesn't perhaps matter (truth isn't
>important as long as you bash Microsoft).

But of course it's true.  In any case, it's but one of
countless distortions of the personal computing industry
which MS has fomented.

> obsessed -- not one bit, in fact most everything about MS,
>
>Sure.
>
> troll the OS/2 newsgroups insulting & making generalizations
>
>You call everyone who doesn't agree with the political correct (at least for
>this group) anti-MS chant for "troll"?

If I frequented the Windoze newsgroups and mixed in some
casual insulting generalizations about people who prefer to
use Windoze software along with my general knowledge of
computers, I would be expected to be referred to as a troll.

>It's OK to discuss this things as long as you say the same as everyone else
in
>this group (or at least most of them), but not otherwise if you don't agree?

Martin I hate to hurt your feelings but MS was wrong to lie
in court, and you haven't shown they didn't.

>Raphael, that's a very nice way to treat others and respect their views.
>
>Sorry, I won't buy into your suggested censorship, and will continue to state
>my own opinions (who as matter of fact, if you would bother to check, isn't
>the same as either Microsoft or Bill Gates himself) even if I disagree with
>any comments posted by another poster (or even a majority of them).

Martin, when you have worthwhile things to write about
computers, I enjoy reading them.  When you insult OS/2 users
with generalizations about them (us), I don't take it very
well.  When you extol the myriad virtues of MS products I
roll my eyes.  But when you defend MS's fraudulent conduct
with a piece of blather, you are insulting my intelligence. 
Perhaps you'll understand my feeling this way.  But if it
wasn't intended, then perhaps you'll understand how I feel
you should be alerted to the specious nature of this
"reasoning."  And perhaps also understand that I am not the
one who is MS-obsessed, you are.

>
>If you can't stand to read anyone who doesn't agree with you or the DOJ, you
>are free to filter me out if you want (easy to do in any modern news reader).
>
> about OS/2 users, spreading dumb fairy tales about this poor
>
>So now you call any argument who you doesn't agree with for "fairy tales"?

There is such a thing as an honest mistake.  That videotape
was neither honest, nor a mistake, and to assert otherwise
is, yes, attempt to spread a fairy tale.

And Martin, to be honest, I have enough respect for you that
I don't think you really believe that drivel you quoted has
a grain of truth in it.


-- 
Ray Tennenbaum        '99 YZF-R6
readme@ http://www.ray-field.com

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: AT&T WorldNet Services (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bv@opera.no                                       01-Dec-99 13:56:26
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:08
Subj: Re: font search

From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Bj=F8rn?= Vermo <bv@opera.no>

Andrew Stephenson wrote:
> 

> quoted price for the fonts you sought is shown as UKP20, not 22.

What is the exchange rate of Ukrainian currency these days?

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rcrane@octa4.net.au                               01-Dec-99 14:42:10
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:08
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: rcrane@octa4.net.au (Richard A Crane)

On Tue, 30 Nov 1999 17:48:19, Forrest Gehrke 
<fegehrke@worldnet.att.net> wrote:

> 
> An interesting sidelight to all this: The Wall Street Journal 
> reported a listing of economic freedom by country which was
> jointly done by WSJ and the Heritage Foundation.
> The ranking of economically Free countries:
> 
>   1. HongKong
>   2. Singapore
>   3. New Zealand
>   4. Bahrain
>      Luxembourg
>      U.S.
>   7. Ireland
>   8. Australia
>      Switzerland
>      U.K.
> 
> Under Mostly Free the list starts off with:
> 
>   11. Canada.
> //
I recomend that anyone who believes that Hong Kong or 
Singapore are free countries try tangling with their legal 
systems when opposing the governments! Or read Geoffrey 
Robertson's book.
Richard A Crane
Barrister & Solicitor
slightly altered email (anti-spamming) rcrane AT 
octa4.net.au 
OR rcrane AT attglobal.net

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Octa4 Pty Ltd (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rcrane@octa4.net.au                               01-Dec-99 14:42:10
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:08
Subj: Re: IBM Support for os/2

From: rcrane@octa4.net.au (Richard A Crane)

On Tue, 30 Nov 1999 15:25:12, Bob Germer 
<bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com> wrote in part:

> I would think that someone at IBM Australia would be able to provide you
> with information on International Assist.  When one wants information, one
> gives the operator who answers the call his/her name, company if
> applicable, address, phone number, and fax number. Then they contact you
> with the information as I understand it.
> 
Bob,
Thanks for the reply I've only quoted the bit of it here to 
illustrate IBM's deficiencies (as I see it).

I have contacted IBM Australia on a number of occasions 
(starting with os/2 2.1) over time they have gone from very 
helpful to helpful when you found the right person to less 
than helpful to nonresponsive.
Most recently 2x telephone calls and 1x email enquiring 
about WSeB unreturned and unacknowledged - and all I want to
know is the AUS$ price of it (WSeB's existence (and of 
course price) was not even on the IBM Australia website as 
an IBM product!  Which leads me to the sad conclusion that 
they aren't even interested in OS/2 for anybody (OK I have 
to accept that IBM has decided that they don't want to push 
it to SOHO or small users- I am not happy about that 
either). But I would have thought that their interest level 
would at least be up to allowing me to make a internal (to 
my country) call to find out about a product they sell.
FWIW I called their national line number today (like other 
big corps and Government they no longer let you call the 
local branch you have to go through a switsth network first)
after talking to a person (eventually) I still don't even 
know if I can get software choice (or how much it will cost 
me!).
My general mood was not improved by spending what seemed to 
be an exessive amount of time trying to find the IBM site 
that has all the y2k fixes for all parts of OS/2 Warp (base 
system fix packs, device driver packs, TCP/IP fix packs, are
there do I need MPTS fix packs? or anything else for the 
stuff that to me was all part of the OS)
PS can anyone post a comprehensible list of what 
upgrades/what install order are needed to convert a stand 
alone but using the internet, Warp 4 system needs to ensure 
y2k compliance?
Richard A Crane
Barrister & Solicitor
slightly altered email (anti-spamming) rcrane AT 
octa4.net.au 
OR rcrane AT attglobal.net
This response was deliberately Xposted to comp.os.os2.misc

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Octa4 Pty Ltd (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rcrane@octa4.net.au                               01-Dec-99 14:42:09
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:08
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: rcrane@octa4.net.au (Richard A Crane)

On Tue, 30 Nov 1999 13:56:47, Bob Germer 
<bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com> wrote in part:

> The Attorney General of Quebec prosecuted the mayor and fire chief of a
> town in southern Quebec near the US border because the refused to have
> their new fire truck's sign repainted to use French when a new census
> showed that there were 2 more Francophones in the town than Anglophones.
>  
> That is not a free country.
>  
I'm sorry but I cannot see the connection between an illegal
act (which seems trivial) and whether or not a country is 
free (leaving aside the vexed question of "what does that 
mean?") A free democracy (yes I know that's introducing yet 
another possibly conflating concept) ought be able to 
introduce even silly laws (and I look at where I live for 
examples of that!) if it wants to.
Some newsgroups trimmed from this response.

Richard A Crane
Barrister & Solicitor
slightly altered email (anti-spamming) rcrane AT 
octa4.net.au 
OR rcrane AT attglobal.net

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Octa4 Pty Ltd (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: AsbjornPettersen@dualog.no                        01-Dec-99 15:36:15
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:08
Subj: Re: OS2 Dual Boot Installation Problem

From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Asbj=F8rn?= Pettersen <AsbjornPettersen@dualog.no>


Ian Dawson wrote:

> Hi,
>     I have a Toshiba Satellite S300CDT (with 2.1Gb - 80Mb RAM) currently
> running
> Win 98.  I want to install OS2 as a dual boot option.
>
> After inserting the OS2 Installation Disk, an OS2 symbol appears and after
> about
> 30 seconds of disk churning, the machine reboots and starts the whole
> process again.
>
> Any Ideas on whats wrong and how to fix them....
>
> Thanks.

OS/2 work on my CDS300 with boot manager (OS/2 and linux)
I found a OS/2 FAQ for my laptop and i'm sure that there was one for 300CDT
too.
Try to search for it on web.

I'll guess that you problem is caused by the CDROM or "VGA card".

Good luck
Asbjoern



--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Telenor Online Public Access (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: lsunley@mb.sympatico.ca                           01-Dec-99 14:49:20
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:08
Subj: Re: OS2 Dual Boot Installation Problem

From: lsunley@mb.sympatico.ca (Lorne Sunley)

On Wed, 1 Dec 1999 11:50:10, "Ian Dawson" <idawson@montupetuk.co.uk> 
wrote:

> Hi,
>     I have a Toshiba Satellite S300CDT (with 2.1Gb - 80Mb RAM) currently
> running
> Win 98.  I want to install OS2 as a dual boot option.
> 
> After inserting the OS2 Installation Disk, an OS2 symbol appears and after
> about
> 30 seconds of disk churning, the machine reboots and starts the whole
> process again.
> 
> Any Ideas on whats wrong and how to fix them....

If you are trying to use "dual boot" meaning that the OS/2
code is in the same partition as Windows 98, this probably
won't work given that Win 98 is probably using a FAT32 or
FAT32X partition type which OS/2 cannot read.

The only reliable way is to use "boot manager" which
will require that you re-partition your disk drive to obtain
another partition that can be used to install OS/2

--

Lorne Sunley

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: MBnet Networking Inc. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bv@opera.no                                       01-Dec-99 14:17:15
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:08
Subj: Re: Replacement Disks

From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Bj=F8rn?= Vermo <bv@opera.no>

jspepper@my-deja.com wrote:
> 
> 
> Unfortunately, I only have the diskette version.  Would you be willing
> to make make me a disk (I'm willing to pay), or send me the
> "disk-making" executable from the cd?  Please?
> 
I have seen updated diskette images for boot diskettes on one of the
IBM websites.
You might try to snoop around
http://service5.boulder.ibm.com/pspfixpk.nsf/ to see if
you can find anything.

Of course Warp 3 is out of service, but fixes are still available
for MUCH older IBM software
as long as they do not need to waste manpower on it.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rgibson@ix.netcom.com                             01-Dec-99 13:26:12
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:08
Subj: Re: Netscape Communicator 4.61 install problems

From: rgibson@ix.netcom.com (Ron Gibson)

On Wed, 1 Dec 1999 11:25:16, pdrumm@dwave.net (Peter Drumm) wrote:

> I have NS/2 v 2.02, 4.04, and 4.61 all installed in different dirs and
> they all work fine. Installing over the top of an older version isn't
> recommended.

I finally got around to it last night and even though I removed 4.04
with the un-install utility, and did a checkini/c to remove ini
references it still wanted to use my 4.04 profile.  I hid it on another
drive and rebooted.  Tried again and it actually recreated what I'd
moved!  This is what I was referring to.  Finally got it going.

What I was actually hoping for is to get real player going.

Crap.  No go.  I thought maybe I need a Netscape install in my version
of WinOS2, Windows installed on a HPFS with the red spline (windowless)
version of Warp 3, FP40.  The lowest version I could find was 4.08 for
Windows (damn Netscape used to archive older versions but they aren't
there anymore).  Trying to install them caused a trap every time under
OS/2.  So I tricked the machine by copying my OS/2 Windows from J drive
to L drive.  Booted Windows/DOS and set the path under dos to point to

j:/windows 

although L under OS/2, this became J due to the 2 HPFS partitions that 
DOS can't see. 

This keeps from having to manually edit so many ini files.  Installed
the damn thing and moved it back. 

Well now every time I try to load this Win version of Netscape it locks
up requiring Watch Cat to kill the Netscape app.

Brother.  What a frigging hassle.  I've been a true blue OS/2'r since
OS/2 2.1 but my patient is wearing thin. 

And of course Real Player, version 5 refuses to work still.  I thought
the app was failing because it lacked some obscure windows
file/information but that apparently is not it.  It's Real Player itself
on my system.

                      email: rgibson@ix.netcom.com

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: MindSpring Enterprises (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bv@opera.no                                       01-Dec-99 14:26:22
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:08
Subj: Re: ps2 mouse support?

From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Bj=F8rn?= Vermo <bv@opera.no>

Kerry Lord wrote:
> 
> PS2 mouse support?
> 
> We have OS/2 Warp3 and need to get the mouse to work, but since the vendor
> put it on a new PC with PS2 mouse, we haven't been able to use it.  Then
> vendor said sorry can't do, because of IRQ conflicts..
> 
> Is this true or is there a way around this?

It is not always trivial to move OS/2 from one computer to another
without
doing a new install. From the beginning, it was not really possible
in principle.
Newer versions are much less touchy about the hardware, but in any
case the
PS/2 mouse is very well supported. 

If your old setup had a serial mouse, the DEVICE-statements were set
to make
it use a comm port. This is no longer needed with a PS/2 mouse.
Check that your CONFIG.SYS contains

DEVICE=D:\OS2\BOOT\POINTDD.SYS
DEVICE=D:\OS2\BOOT\MOUSE.SYS
DEVICE=D:\OS2\MDOS\VMOUSE.SYS

with drives and paths as appropriate for your system.
Agood place to have them is just before the line with COM.SYS, just
for clarity.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: prather@infi.net                                  01-Dec-99 13:35:07
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:08
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: prather@infi.net (Jerry Prather)

In message <821r1v$bet$1@nnrp1.deja.com> - Chris J Delanoy
<cdelanoy@ualberta.ca> writes:
:>
:> Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com> wrote:
:>> Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 12
:>  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
:>Bob, you'd be a touch more credible in claiming that you're forced
:>against your will to use Windows if you didn't end your message by
:>telling us explicitly that you do NOT use it.  You look rather
:>silly saying that you have no choice when, lo and behold, you
:>HAVE made a different choice.
:>
:>Chris J Delanoy

Mr. Delanoy, 

I, like Mr. Germer, run OS/2.  That is my choice.  This past year
I bought a new notebook computer.  The primary factor in choosing
which one to buy was whether the notebook computer was fully
compatible with OS/2.  The best I could find was an IBM Thinkpad
- and even then it came with a WinModem which I had to replace
with a PCMCIA real modem in order to get 56K speed.  All
Thinkpads came with Windows98 pre-installed.  I could _not_ order
a Thinkpad without a Win98 installation.  I could get OS/2
preinstalled and could have elected to have Win98 removed by an
OS/2 reseller, but I _still_ had to pay for Win98.  I paid the
lower price (which included the fee for the Win98 license) and
installed OS/2 myself.

That, sir, is force.  That is prima facie(sp?) evidence of the
existance of a coercive monolopy.  They didn't have to come with
a gun.  I just had to say that I didn't want to buy a computer! 
That was the only way I could have avoided the Gates tax.  You
need to pull your head out of whatever dark place it is in and
have a look at the real world.

Jerry Prather                    prather@infi.net

"Many religions are worth dying for; no religion is worth killing
for."
					- Me (circa 1998)

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: infi.net (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: letoured@nospam.net                               01-Dec-99 08:45:16
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:08
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: letoured@nospam.net

Chris J Delanoy <cdelanoy@ualberta.ca> said:

>> > The US anti-trust laws are deliberately designed as so to be
>> > impossible to be objectively understood.  They are ex-post-facto,
>> > arbitrary, and entirely open-ended, and any "findings of fact"
>> > made under them do not necessarily bear any resemblance to
>> > reality (ie - to actual FACTS).

>> Baloney. They can be understood by those with knowledge of markets

>Explain how markets can create "monopolies" which can SIMULTANEOUSLY
>charge prices that are too high AND too low - which are among the
>so-called "facts" cited by Judge Jackson.

Its in the Findings of Fact. The price is higher then it needs to be for
the public, and either too low for companies that don't sell anything but
Windows, or Wincrap is not sold to them at all.


>The creation of coercive monopoly is not possible in a free
>market - neither in theory, nor ever in history.

Are you trying to tell us there has never been a monoply or there has
never been a free market?

>> And companies which are permitted (licensed if you will) to
>> function as a so-called monopoly are permitted because it is
>> deemed necessary to the public good

>Nothing that any government has done has ever been for the ACTUAL good of
>the public.

This statement tells us where you are coming from. Here in the US we
generally consider people who think like this to be nut jobs, so you might
want to revise your thoughts before we are sure.


>> -- BTW, Gates was saying he should be permitted to have monopoly
>> back in the early 80s for the public good, but without any
>> regulation or requirements for performance or a warranty.

>He didn't get any such franchise from any government.  And he therefore
>has no monopoly powers whatsoever.  If you don't believe me, then there's
>a simple experiment you can conduct:  stop buying Microsoft products, and
>stop paying taxes.  Then wait and see who comes after you for your money
>and with what weapons.

So this is your proof that there is free market and no monoply!   E.g., If
there is no use or threat of force there is a free market? Is this what
you are trying to tell us?


_____________
Ed Letourneau <letoured@sover.net>

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: bCandid - Powering the world's discussions - http
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bv@opera.no                                       01-Dec-99 15:06:18
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:08
Subj: Re: Java 1.2 for OS/2

From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Bj=F8rn?= Vermo <bv@opera.no>

Bob Germer wrote:
> 
> Now I realize that in the United States we have the highest percentage of
> participation in investments in the world. Perhaps our citizens have
> become more sophisticated than elsewhere in the English speaking world.
> 
Or, more likely, less sophisticated. US companies are, after all,
notorious for
their short-sightedness (long term meaning beyond the next quarterly
results,
as the saying goes).

Since I am not a native English speaker, I can (leaning on the
authority of G. B. Shaw)
claim superiour knowledge about the language. The construct "quarter
of" has a very
distinct meaning, namely "one of four equally big parts of". You may
use "quarter" in many
other, derived, meanings, but not "quarter of". 

This whole problem does obviously arise only because English lacks a
separate word
for a three-month period aligned on whole multiples of three from
the start of the year
(or even for the 15-minute periods we divide an hour into). Many
other languages have
dedicated words for this purpose instead of overloading one
general-purpose word.

By the way, my wife is supervising the consolidation of accounting
information for
a multinational corporation. Fiscal quarters are quite well known in
our household.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From:  JeanMichel.Dossogne@advalvas.be                  01-Dec-99 11:27:18
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:08
Subj: taskbar for connect

From: "Jean-Michel Dossogne" < JeanMichel.Dossogne@advalvas.be>

Hello All.

for my Warp 3 Connect machine, I search for a way to get a taskbar like the
one
from my warp 4 machine. Any tip?
thanks!

Jean-Michel
http://home.freegates.be/doggys-club
+++++++++++++++++
+ Doggy's Internet Gateway - +32-71-666292 - V34+ & X75
+ Disclaimer: Les articles n'engagent QUE leurs auteurs, pas la passerelle

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: souriez! (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bv@opera.no                                       01-Dec-99 15:42:29
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:08
Subj: Re: motherboard cache

From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Bj=F8rn?= Vermo <bv@opera.no>

James Moe wrote:
> 
> nykisle@attglobal.net wrote:
> >
> > I am considering buying an AOpen AX59Pro
> > which has a 512k ot 1 meg cache.
> > How much ram will 1 meg cover.
> >
>     Um, 1 Meg.
>     What a larger cache means is that more things are stored in fast
> SRAM, the L2 cache. It is faster to retrieve stuff from cache than from
> main memory. So overall the system operates faster.

Of course, this is more important with slow memory (like EDO on a
66MHz bus)
than fast (like PC-133 SDRAM).

I do not know what is inside an AOpen AX59Pro. My new AOpen has an 
EPoX EP-6VBA motherboard with a VIA Apollo chipset. It is usually
the 
chipset which limits how much RAM you can cache. At least my pretty
but not very detailed manual claims that I can use up to 768MB
SDRAM.
As it now stands, it works quite well running OS/2 with 128MB.

Does anybody know if it is possible to get any kind of use of the
integrated
AC97 PCI Audio under OS/2? I do not really need much - "business
audio"
will do.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rcrane@octa4.net.au                               01-Dec-99 14:42:11
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:08
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: rcrane@octa4.net.au (Richard A Crane)

On Wed, 1 Dec 1999 00:30:09, Chris J Delanoy 
<cdelanoy@ualberta.ca> wrote:

> The creation of coercive monopoly is not possible in a free
> market - neither in theory, nor ever in history.
> 
Does this Qualify Chris J Delany as the "Oxymoron of the 
Year"
monopolies in the free market !!!
Excuse me while I laugh at the thought.
Richard A Crane
Barrister & Solicitor
slightly altered email (anti-spamming) rcrane AT 
octa4.net.au 
OR rcrane AT attglobal.net

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Octa4 Pty Ltd (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rcrane@octa4.net.au                               01-Dec-99 14:42:15
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:08
Subj: Now totally OT Was Re: Java 1.2 for OS/2

From: rcrane@octa4.net.au (Richard A Crane)

On Tue, 30 Nov 1999 13:37:47, Bob Germer 
<bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com> wrote:

 Perhaps our citizens have
> become more sophisticated than elsewhere in the English speaking world.
> 
I do hope that was tongue in cheek. 
> As I stated in this thread, lack of precision in writing is the lifeblood
> of lawyers.
Missed that but I disagree "lack of precision is the 
lifeblood of lawyers"!:)

Richard A Crane
Barrister & Solicitor
slightly altered email (anti-spamming) rcrane AT 
octa4.net.au 
OR rcrane AT attglobal.net

PS 1 lawyer in a country town will starve - 2 will live very
comfortably!

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Octa4 Pty Ltd (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rcrane@octa4.net.au                               01-Dec-99 14:42:13
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:08
Subj: Re: Can I still buy OS/2 Warp Connect v3.0 ?

From: rcrane@octa4.net.au (Richard A Crane)

On Wed, 1 Dec 1999 04:54:29, Wilson Rook 
<wrook@walkabout.org> wrote:

> This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
> 
> Content-Description: Card for Wilson Rook
> -------Begin Encoded File-------
> Encoded filename: wrook.vcf
> Decoded path: file:///H:\OCTA4\wrook.vcf
> Encoding type: 7-Bit
> File size: 0KB
> --------End Encoded File--------
> 
 Please stop posting these to non-binary newsgroups.
Richard A Crane
Barrister & Solicitor
slightly altered email (anti-spamming) rcrane AT 
octa4.net.au 
OR rcrane AT attglobal.net

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Octa4 Pty Ltd (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rcrane@octa4.net.au                               01-Dec-99 14:42:13
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:08
Subj: Message for wilson Rook Was Re: PC Week - Peter Coffee

From: rcrane@octa4.net.au (Richard A Crane)

On Wed, 1 Dec 1999 04:56:21, Wilson Rook 
<wrook@walkabout.org> wrote:

> This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
> Content-Description: Card for Wilson Rook
> -------Begin Encoded File-------
> Encoded filename: wrook.vcf
> Decoded path: file:///H:\OCTA4\wrook~1.vcf
> Encoding type: 7-Bit
> File size: 0KB
> --------End Encoded File--------
> 
Please stop posting this to non-binary groups
Richard A Crane
Barrister & Solicitor
slightly altered email (anti-spamming) rcrane AT 
octa4.net.au 
OR rcrane AT attglobal.net

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Octa4 Pty Ltd (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: alex@eddie.cis.uoguelph.ca                        01-Dec-99 15:01:06
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:08
Subj: Re: Font Editor?

From: alex@eddie.cis.uoguelph.ca (Alex Taylor)

On Tue, 30 Nov 1999 02:50:18 GMT, Edmond Dantes <admin@hotmail.com> wrote:
> I'm looking for a font editor.  Is there a native one?
> Edmond Dantes
> phydeaux(the 'at' thing)home.com

The Developer's Toolkit includes one.  I haven't really tried using it,
though. 


-- 
-----------------------------------------------------------------
 Alex Taylor                  BA - CIS - University of Guelph
 alex@eddie.cis.uoguelph.ca   http://eddie.cis.uoguelph.ca/~alex
-----------------------------------------------------------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: @Home Network Canada (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rcrane@octa4.net.au                               01-Dec-99 14:42:17
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:08
Subj: Re: New modem list

From: rcrane@octa4.net.au (Richard A Crane)

On Tue, 30 Nov 1999 16:07:40, rgibson@ix.netcom.com (Ron 
Gibson) wrote:

> On Mon, 29 Nov 1999 19:34:00, doug.bissett"at"attglobal.net (Doug Bissett)
> wrote:
> 
> > AFAIK, that thing has not been updated for years. Your best bet, is to
> > take the closest  modem, and change the init strings to whatever is 
> > suggested for your current modem. I know that a 3COM (US Robotics) 56K
> > Sportster modem works with the 14.4K Sportster settings. Describe your
> > modem, and someone can, probably, suggest a good init string to use.
> 
> There is one update I found but it predates most V90 modems.
> 
> Latest greatest was 33.6 
> 
>                       email: rgibson@ix.netcom.com
> 
Use the IBM Dialler to connect and it can be set to download
the latest phone and modem lists - if you can't do that 
email me I'll send them to you.
Richard A Crane
Barrister & Solicitor
slightly altered email (anti-spamming) rcrane AT 
octa4.net.au 
OR rcrane AT attglobal.net

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Octa4 Pty Ltd (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: uno@40th.com                                      01-Dec-99 15:17:16
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:08
Subj: Re: IBM Support for os/2

From: uno@40th.com (uno@40th.com)

Richard A Crane? (rcrane@octa4.net.au?) wrote (1 Dec 1999 14:42:21 GMT):
>PS can anyone post a comprehensible list of what 
>upgrades/what install order are needed to convert a stand 
>alone but using the internet, Warp 4 system needs to ensure

http://207.46.131.137

But, as you've found out, the fat lady sung even down there a long, long
time ago.  This will get you what you need, but probably not what you
want.





--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Yanaguana (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: mirage@iae.nl                                     01-Dec-99 16:34:11
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:08
Subj: Re: IBM Support for os/2

From: Mirage Media <mirage@iae.nl>

Richard,
Check out http://www.mensys.nl/indexuk.html
It's a Dutch company and has a cd of various Fixpacks, Netscape
Communicator, Acrobat Reader, Java 1.1.8, etc. It's dirt cheap, only
$11.47US....I think it's a great bargain. It'll certain save you money
on downloads :^)

Corey 
Mirage Media
Nuenen, The Netherlands

Fine Art Nudes Kyoto
http://web.kyoto-inet.or.jp/people/photos/gallery/C_SHADOW/index.html

Richard A Crane wrote:
> 
> On Tue, 30 Nov 1999 15:25:12, Bob Germer
> <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com> wrote in part:
> 
> > I would think that someone at IBM Australia would be able to provide you
> > with information on International Assist.  When one wants information, one
> > gives the operator who answers the call his/her name, company if
> > applicable, address, phone number, and fax number. Then they contact you
> > with the information as I understand it.
> >
> Bob,
> Thanks for the reply I've only quoted the bit of it here to
> illustrate IBM's deficiencies (as I see it).
> 
> I have contacted IBM Australia on a number of occasions
> (starting with os/2 2.1) over time they have gone from very
> helpful to helpful when you found the right person to less
> than helpful to nonresponsive.
> Most recently 2x telephone calls and 1x email enquiring
> about WSeB unreturned and unacknowledged - and all I want to
> know is the AUS$ price of it (WSeB's existence (and of
> course price) was not even on the IBM Australia website as
> an IBM product!  Which leads me to the sad conclusion that
> they aren't even interested in OS/2 for anybody (OK I have
> to accept that IBM has decided that they don't want to push
> it to SOHO or small users- I am not happy about that
> either). But I would have thought that their interest level
> would at least be up to allowing me to make a internal (to
> my country) call to find out about a product they sell.
> FWIW I called their national line number today (like other
> big corps and Government they no longer let you call the
> local branch you have to go through a switsth network first)
> after talking to a person (eventually) I still don't even
> know if I can get software choice (or how much it will cost
> me!).
> My general mood was not improved by spending what seemed to
> be an exessive amount of time trying to find the IBM site
> that has all the y2k fixes for all parts of OS/2 Warp (base
> system fix packs, device driver packs, TCP/IP fix packs, are
> there do I need MPTS fix packs? or anything else for the
> stuff that to me was all part of the OS)
> PS can anyone post a comprehensible list of what
> upgrades/what install order are needed to convert a stand
> alone but using the internet, Warp 4 system needs to ensure
> y2k compliance?
> Richard A Crane
> Barrister & Solicitor
> slightly altered email (anti-spamming) rcrane AT
> octa4.net.au
> OR rcrane AT attglobal.net


> This response was deliberately Xposted to comp.os.os2.misc

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Mirage Media (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: thomas@billert.de                                 01-Dec-99 17:01:08
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:08
Subj: Re: IBM Support for os/2

From: thomas@billert.de (Thomas Billert)

Hi Richard,

On 1 Dec 1999 14:42:21 GMT, Richard A Crane wrote in 
comp.os.os2.misc:

>PS can anyone post a comprehensible list of what 
>upgrades/what install order are needed to convert a stand 
>alone but using the internet, Warp 4 system needs to ensure 
>y2k compliance?
>

have a look at http://www.warpupdates.de/

regards, Billy.
-- 
Thomas Billert using OS/2 Warp 4   *   OS/2-Usergroup Jena und Umgebung:
thomas@billert.de                  *     http://www.uni-jena.de/
http://www.billert.de              *              ~c5thbi/os2jena.html
PGP key available on my website

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: tipu996@my-deja.com                               01-Dec-99 15:12:03
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:08
Subj: DeskJet 2500C driver

From: tipu996@my-deja.com

Hi there,

Does anyone know where I can get a driver for the HP DeskJet 2500C so it
can allow me to select the paper tray?

The driver I have from IBM's site does not allow me to select the paper
tray. We have a tray with A3 paper and another with A4.

Is there a work around to the current driver to make it print from tray
1, 2 or 3? Note that the printer is on a network and so we're printing
through the built in print server on the printer via the LAN.

Any help appreciated.

Thanks,
Tipu


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Deja.com - Before you buy. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: siberREMOVETHIS@sympatico.ca                      01-Dec-99 15:21:08
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:08
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: siberREMOVETHIS@sympatico.ca (E. Barry Bruyea)

On 1 Dec 1999 13:35:14 GMT, prather@infi.net (Jerry Prather) wrote:

>In message <821r1v$bet$1@nnrp1.deja.com> - Chris J Delanoy
><cdelanoy@ualberta.ca> writes:
>:>
>:> Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com> wrote:
>:>> Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 12
>:>  ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>:>Bob, you'd be a touch more credible in claiming that you're forced
>:>against your will to use Windows if you didn't end your message by
>:>telling us explicitly that you do NOT use it.  You look rather
>:>silly saying that you have no choice when, lo and behold, you
>:>HAVE made a different choice.
>:>
>:>Chris J Delanoy
>
>Mr. Delanoy, 
>
>I, like Mr. Germer, run OS/2.  That is my choice.  This past year
>I bought a new notebook computer.  The primary factor in choosing
>which one to buy was whether the notebook computer was fully
>compatible with OS/2.  The best I could find was an IBM Thinkpad
>- and even then it came with a WinModem which I had to replace
>with a PCMCIA real modem in order to get 56K speed.  All
>Thinkpads came with Windows98 pre-installed.  I could _not_ order
>a Thinkpad without a Win98 installation.  I could get OS/2
>preinstalled and could have elected to have Win98 removed by an
>OS/2 reseller, but I _still_ had to pay for Win98.  I paid the
>lower price (which included the fee for the Win98 license) and
>installed OS/2 myself.

And if you ordered a Chevy from General Motors, and told the dealer
you wanted a Bosch Alternator, guess what?  You'd still have to pay
for the Delco Alternator the car came with.  The dealer is not going
to take the hit for the cost of the OE.  Your compaint falls under the
'Gee Whiz' category.


>
>That, sir, is force.  That is prima facie(sp?) evidence of the
>existance of a coercive monolopy.  They didn't have to come with
>a gun.  I just had to say that I didn't want to buy a computer! 
>That was the only way I could have avoided the Gates tax.  You
>need to pull your head out of whatever dark place it is in and
>have a look at the real world.
>
>Jerry Prather                    prather@infi.net
>
>"Many religions are worth dying for; no religion is worth killing
>for."
>					- Me (circa 1998)
>

EBB

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Sympatico (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bv@opera.no                                       01-Dec-99 16:28:15
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:08
Subj: Re: OS2, NT or Linux

From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Bj=F8rn?= Vermo <bv@opera.no>

Richard Steiner wrote:
> 
> 
> I'd advise you to take a serious look at a less extremist Linux desktop
> environment like KDE or WindowMaker before passing any sort of judgement
> on the general performance of the Linux desktop as a whole.  What you
> are seeing is an extreme case, and it can be made MUCH faster.
> 
I run KDE on it now - a very nice environment, but nowhere near the
functionality of WPS. Speed is fair, but not impressive.

> 
> I do think that OS/2 is faster on the same hardware than Linux is, even
> if you boot the two into text-mode only.

That depends on whether you run any multithreaded software.
Linux programs are faster under Linux than when ported to OS/2 by
EMX.
Non-trivial native OS/2 VIO programs are far from easy to port to
Linux.
Comparing is not really easy. If you need real-time, QNX will beat
both anyway.

But whatever tests I managed to make demonstrated that the
performance
of Linux on weak hardware only is impressive if you compare to
Windows or
a heavy-duty UNIX like Solaris. OS/2 and Linux are in the same camp,
performance-wise.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: sma.spam-not@rtd.com                              01-Dec-99 15:47:02
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:08
Subj: Re: OS/2 Warp vs 2gig Jaz

From: James Moe <sma.spam-not@rtd.com>


"Michael W. Cocke" wrote:
> 
> On Wed, 01 Dec 1999 03:46:31 GMT, James Moe wrote:
> 
> >>
> >> Is there anyway to run a 2 gigabyte Jaz drive under OS/2 Warp 4?
> >>
> >    <sigh> Details?
> >
> >    Parallel Port : no
> 
>  Parallel Port : Yes
> 
    Really? Did Iomega make a driver for the JAZ drive and parallel
port?

-- 

sma at rtd dot com
Remove ".spam-not" for email

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Sohnen-Moe Associates, Inc (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bstephan@redshift.com                             01-Dec-99 08:20:14
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:08
Subj: Re: taskbar for connect

From: bstephan@redshift.com

In <0000a112.doggy.bbs@meuhspam.easynet.be>, on 12/01/99 
   at 11:27 AM, "Jean-Michel Dossogne" <
JeanMichel.Dossogne@advalvas.be> said:

>for my Warp 3 Connect machine, I search for a way to get a
>taskbar like the one from my warp 4 machine. Any tip?
>thanks!

One I like is a shareware program called FileBar. I don't
know if it is still available or where it can be found.

-- 
-----------------------------------------------------------
Bob Stephan bstephan@redshift.com or BobStephan@compuserve.com
  Happily using OS/2 Warp on the Central California Coast.
   http://www.redshift.com/~bstephan
-----------------------------------------------------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bstephan@redshift.com                             01-Dec-99 08:30:01
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 17:09:08
Subj: Re: <None>

From: bstephan@redshift.com

Fritz Oppliger wrote:

>> is there an easy way to link two os/2 boxes? as in Laplink, or Norton
>> Commander link? (warp3 red+BP)

Warp Connect and Warp 4 come with parallel port networking
included. I've never used it, but it is there.

-- 
-----------------------------------------------------------
Bob Stephan bstephan@redshift.com or BobStephan@compuserve.com
  Happily using OS/2 Warp on the Central California Coast.
   http://www.redshift.com/~bstephan
-----------------------------------------------------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rime.saad@natrel.ca                               01-Dec-99 13:51:06
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 20:37:29
Subj: How do I install fixpack 11 ?

From: Rime Saad <rime.saad@natrel.ca>

Hello

How do I install fixpack 11 ?  I downloaded the fixpack from the IBM FTP
site, and the file had the extention ".sh".  I do not know how to
install such a file

Thank you

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Nortel (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: ames@deltrak.demon.co.uk                          01-Dec-99 17:14:06
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 20:38:00
Subj: Re: font search

From: ames@deltrak.demon.co.uk (Andrew Stephenson)

In article <8223bc$lqf$1@news.hawaii.edu>
	   tholenantispam@hawaii.edu "Dave Tholen" writes:

> Andrew Stephenson writes:
>
> >> [[ re fonts from Monotype ]]
> >> Sounds like just what I'm looking for.  Do they provide the
> >> necessary files for OS/2, or would I need to run them through
> >> the PFM to AFM converter?
>
> > Since my previous posting, I have been to MT's site.
>
> So have I.  I didn't find them in the obvious location.  [...]

I had to dig for them too.  If one clicks on the mass of letters,
ones does not seem to find them.  Maybe I lacked the patience to
let the pages load, laboriously, a few names to a page.  Instead
I used the "search" button...  I forget what names I looked for.
Probably simple variants on "circle" and "frame".  It was a busy
time.  Once they appeared, they were grouped with the ideographs,
such as "Sport".
--
Andrew Stephenson

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: DNS (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: ames@deltrak.demon.co.uk                          01-Dec-99 17:16:05
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 20:38:00
Subj: Re: font search

From: ames@deltrak.demon.co.uk (Andrew Stephenson)

In article <38451B15.33F9E4D5@opera.no>
	   bv@opera.no "=?iso-8859-1?Q?Bj=F8rn?= Vermo" writes:

> Andrew Stephenson wrote:
> >
> > quoted price for the fonts you sought is shown as UKP20, not
> > 22.
>
> What is the exchange rate of Ukrainian currency these days?

Oh, okay, should have said "GBP". <g> So, would "UKP20" be cheap?
--
Andrew Stephenson

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: DNS (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: doug.bissett"at"attglobal.net                     01-Dec-99 17:10:23
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 20:38:00
Subj: Re: New modem list

From: doug.bissett"at"attglobal.net (Doug Bissett)

On Tue, 30 Nov 1999 12:56:36, "Wolf Kirchmeir" <greywolf@onlink.net> 
wrote:

> OOPS, I postred without writing anything -- maybe that was a Good Thing  :-)
> 
> If you are on ibm.net / attglobal.net, you can get the latest list through
> Updates. If not, maybe a freindly soul will e-mail you the latest list. Try
> me.
> 

I believe the poster was looking for the MODEM.IAK file, which is used
with DOIP. The IBM/ATT dialer does get the updated stuff automatically
(in a file called MODEM.DAT, I think,  which is not even close to 
being the same as MODEM.IAK-> it is binary, not ASCII for starters), 
DOIP does not get any updated lists of any kind, automatically, and I 
have not seen any updates to that file, for years.

I do have a file called MODEM.LST, dated Thu Jun 13 14:46:45 1996, 
which is, probably, a left over file from an old version of the IBM 
dialer. There are no "new" modems listed in it either.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Global Network Services - Remote Access Mail & Ne
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: jfarrug@erols.com                                 01-Dec-99 13:31:22
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 20:38:00
Subj: Re: AssocEdit does'nt change jpg association to PMView

From: Joe Farruggio <jfarrug@erols.com>


rj friedman wrote:

> On Tue, 30 Nov 1999 02:49:39, Joe Farruggio
> <jfarrug@erols.com> wrote:
>
> ...I have tried to associate my jpg files to Pmview
> ver 2.00 Beta 16129 using AssocEdit ver 2.1 .
> The jpg files still open using image viewer...
>
> PMView beta for ver 2.00 handles jpg files for me. When you
> installed, did you get the screen where it had the list of
> files that it would open? I kept all of them. Maybe you
> missed something there. Also, did you post this question to
> the beta newslist? I don't recall seeing it there. Seems to
> me that you would get a lot better answer from there.
>
> ________________________________________________________
>
> [RJ]                 OS/2 - Live it, or live with it.
> rj friedman          Team ABW
> Taipei, Taiwan       rjf@yyycomasia.com
>
> To send email - remove the `yyy'
> ________________________________________________________

When i installed PMView, i left all of the list of files selected.
Thanks for the hint on the beta newslist.


--
 Joe Farruggio

 ICQ #13668583
 jfarrug@erols.com


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: possum@fred.net                                   01-Dec-99 19:02:01
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 20:38:00
Subj: TCP/IP 4.2.1 Settings notebook?

From: possum@fred.net (Mike Trettel)

I just installed TCP/IP 4.2.1 from the WSeB Client Connect cd onto my
Warp 4 machine (upgrading from TCP/IP 4.0) and somehow have ended up
without working configuration objects.  The desktop objects in the OS/2
System Folder point to a rexx script called tcpcfg2.cmd, but this file
is nowhere to be found on my system.  I'm also missing the
tcpcfg2r.cmd, tcpcfg2d.cmd, and the admin_pw.cmd scripts.  I suppose
these scripts are used to fire up some sort of Java configuration tool,
but that's a guess on my part.  Anyone else run across this?


-- 
===========
Mike Trettel    trettel (Shift 2) fred (dinky little round thing) net

I don't buy from spammers.  No exceptions.  Fix the reply line to mail me.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: gbierman@fnmail.com                               01-Dec-99 13:38:27
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 20:38:00
Subj: digital cameras

From: Grant Bierman <gbierman@fnmail.com>

We are thinking of maybe getting a digital camera if it is cheap enough,
and of course works with OS/2. Any suggestion/urls that I can look into?


------------------[ Web Master/Author For Hire ]-----------------
Grant Bierman <gbierman@fnmail.com> 
-------------------------[ Random Insert ]-----------------------
If you get TOO bored, you can....
        Give your goldfish a perm
------------------------[ ICQ: 22733875 ]------------------------
                      - Yatara.dyndns.org -
                   *All Mail Filtered For Spam*



--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: UseNet Server, Inc.  http://www.usenetserver.com 
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: jdesmaraNOjdSPAM@novanthealth.or...               01-Dec-99 10:48:07
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 20:38:00
Subj: Road Runner and Warp

Message sender: jdesmaraNOjdSPAM@novanthealth.org.invalid

From: John Desmarais <jdesmaraNOjdSPAM@novanthealth.org.invalid>

Hey, is anybody here using Time Warner's Road Runner cable system as
their ISP in either Ohio or North Carolina?  I'm trying to find out how
difficult it will be to set up before I start spending money.

I specify Ohio and NC because some of Road Runner's regions have done
away with their authentication system, but NC Triad Region (where I
live) hasn't.  The NC-Triad branch is new, so I doubt I'll find anyone
using OS/2 with it, but they use the same connection manager has the
Northern Ohio region (which also has not done away with the DEC
authentication system they use).

-=>John Desmarais


* Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet's Discussion Network *
The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet - Free!

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: http://www.remarq.com: The World's Usenet/Discuss
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: seg@NOSPAM-us.ibm.com                             01-Dec-99 14:06:00
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 20:38:00
Subj: Re: Road Runner and Warp

From: "Scott E. Garfinkle" <seg@NOSPAM-us.ibm.com>

go look at http://larkin.nuclearwinter.com/rros2 -- look for the info on
setting up the daemon, etc. We had the authentication turned on here until
recently in Austin and it worked fine. You need a reasonable recent (<2 yrs
old) level of MPTS.


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: NCSD OS/2 Service (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: jvarela@mind-spring.com                           01-Dec-99 20:45:01
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 20:38:00
Subj: Re: New modem list

From: jvarela@mind-spring.com (John Varela)

On Tue, 30 Nov 1999 07:48:18, Thomas Kellerer 
<Thomas.Kellerer@tps-labs.com> wrote:

> With most of the modern modems you do not need any initialization. They
> will negotiate everything with the other side, and choose the best
> settings based on the line quality and the capabilities.

That's my experience with a 3COM V.90 internal.  The only init string 
I use is ATL0, which quiets the modem speaker.

Incidentally, all the modem commands are defined on the CDROM that 
came with the modem.

--
John Varela
to e-mail, remove - between mind and spring

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: MindSpring Enterprises (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: martin.brown@pandora.be                           01-Dec-99 20:28:01
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 20:38:00
Subj: Re: IBM Support for os/2

From: Martin Brown <martin.brown@pandora.be>

Thomas Billert wrote:

> Hi Richard,
>
> On 1 Dec 1999 14:42:21 GMT, Richard A Crane wrote in
> comp.os.os2.misc:
>
> >PS can anyone post a comprehensible list of what
> >upgrades/what install order are needed to convert a stand
> >alone but using the internet, Warp 4 system needs to ensure
> >y2k compliance?
>
> have a look at http://www.warpupdates.de/

Ooops !!!

While trying to retrieve the URL: http://www.warpupdates.de/
The following error was encountered:

    ERROR 205 -- DNS name lookup failure. Please contact your system
administrator.

It works about as well as some of the IBM links :(

Regards,
Martin Brown

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Nezumi (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: aldel@attglobal.net                               01-Dec-99 17:21:05
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 20:38:00
Subj: Re: IBM Support for os/2

From: aldel@attglobal.net (ALDEL)

In <384576C3.1C304F42@pandora.be>, on 12/01/99 
   at 08:28 PM, Martin Brown <martin.brown@pandora.be> said:


>Thomas Billert wrote:

>> Hi Richard,
>>
>> On 1 Dec 1999 14:42:21 GMT, Richard A Crane wrote in
>> comp.os.os2.misc:
>>
>> >PS can anyone post a comprehensible list of what
>> >upgrades/what install order are needed to convert a stand
>> >alone but using the internet, Warp 4 system needs to ensure
>> >y2k compliance?
>>
>> have a look at http://www.warpupdates.de/

>Ooops !!!

>While trying to retrieve the URL: http://www.warpupdates.de/ The
>following error was encountered:

>    ERROR 205 -- DNS name lookup failure. Please contact your system
>administrator.

>It works about as well as some of the IBM links :(

>Regards,
>Martin Brown

It works OK here!

-- 
-----------------------------------------------------------
aldel@attglobal.net (ALDEL)
-----------------------------------------------------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Global Network Services - Remote Access Mail & Ne
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: pjohann@c2i.net                                   01-Dec-99 20:15:19
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 20:38:00
Subj: No network path

From: "Per E. Johannessen" <pjohann@c2i.net>

I've installed Warp 4, MPTS and File and Print on
three machines. Have created a variety of shared
resources
without any problems.
Problems starts when I try to create a connection
from one
PC to resources which I know are available on the
other PC.
The window for available resources remain blank,
except
for the resources defined on the local machine.
Have got error message SYS0053 No network path,
and also
Error 0, YNARI, which I don't know what means.
When the machines ran Warp Connect I didn't have
these
problems.
Any suggestions welcome.


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Tele2 Norway AS Public Access (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: jdesmaraNOjdSPAM@novanthealth.or...               01-Dec-99 12:42:09
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 20:38:00
Subj: Re: Road Runner and Warp

Message sender: jdesmaraNOjdSPAM@novanthealth.org.invalid

From: John Desmarais <jdesmaraNOjdSPAM@novanthealth.org.invalid>

In article <frthfvozpbz.fm2t210.pminews@rtpnews.raleigh.ibm.com>,
"Scott E. Garfinkle" <seg@NOSPAM-us.ibm.com> wrote:
> go look at http://larkin.nuclearwinter.com/rros2 -- look for the
> info on
> setting up the daemon, etc. We had the authentication turned on
> here until
> recently in Austin and it worked fine. You need a reasonable
> recent (<2 yrs
> old) level of MPTS.

Hmmm... Looks like te project has been mostly abandoned - the site is
still up, but it looks like it hasn't been updated in the last year and
a half; and the dialer that supports Digital's authentication system
(which I'm pretty sure is what RR NC uses) is still listed as
"experimental" and also hasn't been updated in a year and half.  Anyone
have any experience with it?

If Road Runner didn't charge so much as a setup fee, I'd just have the
mess installed and start playing with it hoping for the best - but I
hate shelling out close to $200 (setup + first month) for something I
might not get working.

-=>John Desmarais



* Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet's Discussion Network *
The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet - Free!

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: http://www.remarq.com: The World's Usenet/Discuss
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: thomas@billert.de                                 01-Dec-99 23:00:08
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 21:37:12
Subj: Re: IBM Support for os/2

From: thomas@billert.de (Thomas Billert)

On Wed, 01 Dec 1999 20:28:03 +0100, Martin Brown wrote in 
comp.os.os2.misc:

>While trying to retrieve the URL: http://www.warpupdates.de/
>The following error was encountered:
>
>    ERROR 205 -- DNS name lookup failure. Please contact your system
>administrator.
>

no idea, must be a problem on your side. It works fine here.

regards, Billy.
-- 
Thomas Billert using OS/2 Warp 4   *   OS/2-Usergroup Jena und Umgebung:
thomas@billert.de                  *     http://www.uni-jena.de/
http://www.billert.de              *              ~c5thbi/os2jena.html
PGP key available on my website

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: josco@sea.monterey.edu                            01-Dec-99 15:47:15
  To: rime.saad@natrel.ca                               01-Dec-99 21:37:12
Subj: Re: How do I install fixpack 11 ?

To: Rime Saad <rime.saad@natrel.ca>
From: josco <josco@sea.monterey.edu>

http://www.gt-online.com/~bri/fix.html
http://members.iquest.net/~dcasey/
(links above document how I came to this web page below)

http://www.os2voice.org/ez-reference/fixpak.html I followed the directions
for an install off my hard drive, not floppy disks which takes too long
while this went quickly.  It was easy. I installed FP11. 

The fixpack files came from this ftp site. 
ftp://service.software.ibm.com/ps/products/os2/fixes/v4warp/english-us/xr_m011/


My advice is to be sure to at least run chkdsk prior to the install to be
sure not to have any disk errors.  I have my system boot with the HPFS
automatically checking my drives.  It seems easier than booting off the
floppies and running chkdsk.  You can modify the CONFIG.SYS file line
where the cache is installed. You add '+' signs in front of all cached
disks i.e. +c+d+e

OS/2 Help will give you the correct symantics -- search help for "cache" 
to see the exact syntax.  "Help cache"

After the system is okay and running you can edit and remove the forced
chkdsk if that slows down boot time. 

-- joseph

On Wed, 1 Dec 1999, Rime Saad wrote:

> Hello
> 
> How do I install fixpack 11 ?  I downloaded the fixpack from the IBM FTP
> site, and the file had the extention ".sh".  I do not know how to
> install such a file
> 
> Thank you
> 
> 

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: CSUnet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: Trevor-Hemsley@dial.pipex.com                     01-Dec-99 20:21:21
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 21:37:12
Subj: Re: OS2 Dual Boot Installation Problem

From: "Trevor Hemsley" <Trevor-Hemsley@dial.pipex.com>

On Wed, 1 Dec 1999 11:50:10 -0000, Ian Dawson wrote:

->Hi,
->    I have a Toshiba Satellite S300CDT (with 2.1Gb - 80Mb RAM) currently
->running
->Win 98.  I want to install OS2 as a dual boot option.
->
->After inserting the OS2 Installation Disk, an OS2 symbol appears and after
->about
->30 seconds of disk churning, the machine reboots and starts the whole
->process again.
->
->Any Ideas on whats wrong and how to fix them....

On the first diskette? Try making a new one from the CD using CDINST.BAT
and use that instead - maybe the disk is corrupt.


Trevor Hemsley, London, UK
(Trevor-Hemsley@dial.pipex.com or 75704.2477@compuserve.com)



--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: UUNET WorldCom server (post doesn't reflect views
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rgibson@ix.netcom.com                             01-Dec-99 22:39:03
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 21:37:13
Subj: Re: New modem list

From: rgibson@ix.netcom.com (Ron Gibson)

On Wed, 1 Dec 1999 17:10:46, doug.bissett"at"attglobal.net (Doug Bissett) 
wrote:

> I believe the poster was looking for the MODEM.IAK file, which is used
> with DOIP. The IBM/ATT dialer does get the updated stuff automatically
> (in a file called MODEM.DAT, I think,  which is not even close to 
> being the same as MODEM.IAK-> it is binary, not ASCII for starters), 
> DOIP does not get any updated lists of any kind, automatically, and I 
> have not seen any updates to that file, for years.
 
> I do have a file called MODEM.LST, dated Thu Jun 13 14:46:45 1996, 
> which is, probably, a left over file from an old version of the IBM 
> dialer. There are no "new" modems listed in it either.

That's correct. I use DOIP.

                      email: rgibson@ix.netcom.com

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: MindSpring Enterprises (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: cdelanoy@ualberta.ca                              01-Dec-99 23:20:13
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 21:37:13
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: Chris J Delanoy <cdelanoy@ualberta.ca>

 letoured@nospam.net wrote:

> >> > The US anti-trust laws are deliberately designed as so to be
> >> > impossible to be objectively understood.  They are ex-post-facto,
> >> > arbitrary, and entirely open-ended, and any "findings of fact"
> >> > made under them do not necessarily bear any resemblance to
> >> > reality (ie - to actual FACTS).

> >Explain how markets can create "monopolies" which can SIMULTANEOUSLY
> >charge prices that are too high AND too low - which are among the
> >so-called "facts" cited by Judge Jackson.

> Its in the Findings of Fact.

Yes, it is - which is precisely why I said that the "facts" in the
Findings of Fact do not pertain to reality.

> The price is higher then it needs to be for the public, and either
> too low for companies that don't sell anything but Windows, or
> Wincrap is not sold to them at all.

Which is the demonstration of what I said above:  namely that
anti-trust laws are ex-post facto and arbitrary (and therefore
unjust and tyrannical).  They permit the prosecution of ANY
BUSINESS PRACTICE WHATSOEVER and of ANY PRICE WHATSOEVER.

The idea that a price can be SIMULTANEOUSLY too high and too low
is the demonstration of the never-never land that one must occupy
in order to justify anti-trust laws.

> >The creation of coercive monopoly is not possible in a free
> >market - neither in theory, nor ever in history.

> Are you trying to tell us there has never been a monoply or
> there has never been a free market?

There have been many, many monopolies - and every one of them has
been created and maintained by acts of government.  Examples are
manyfold:  telephone companies, utility companies, cable
companies, railways, the post office, etc.  The only way for
any monopoly (ie - a company against which competition is
impossible and which can therefore demand any price whatsoever)
to exist to be granted it's exclusive privilege or franchise by
a government.

No COERCIVE monopoly has ever existed without such government
franchise.

> > He didn't get any such franchise from any government.  And he
> > therefore has no monopoly powers whatsoever.  If you don't
> > believe me, then there's a simple experiment you can conduct:
> > stop buying Microsoft products, and stop paying taxes.  Then
> > wait and see who comes after you for your money and with what
> > weapons.

> So this is your proof that there is free market and no monoply!
> E.g., If there is no use or threat of force there is a free market?

The free market is a system of voluntary trade to mutual benefit -
which means the absense of the initiation of force or fraud, yes.

And the -only- institution capable of legally initiating force
against you is the government.  Bill Gates can not;  he has no
power over you and can not force anybody to do anything.  Again,
if you don't believe me, then conduct the above experiment - perhaps
then you'll know what force really is.

Chris J Delanoy


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Deja.com - Before you buy. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: cdelanoy@ualberta.ca                              01-Dec-99 23:33:09
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 21:37:13
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: Chris J Delanoy <cdelanoy@ualberta.ca>

 prather@infi.net (Jerry Prather) wrote:

> That, sir, is force.

Your inability to shop around is not evidence of force.  Force
means coercion - and I'll be delighted to read your explanation
of how, precisely, you were coerced against your will to make
this transaction (ie - What would the physical consequences have
been if you hadn't made it?  Imprisonment?)

> I just had to say that I didn't want to buy a computer!
> That was the only way I could have avoided the Gates tax.

Even if every computer manufacturer on earth had a deal to
sell Windows (which isn't true and never could be), it would
still not be force because nothing would ever preclude any
manufacturer from changing its mind or any new supplier from
entering the market.

Your problem is that the great majority of people happen to
want to buy Windows at this particular time - which means you
don't agree with the CHOICE they are making.  It isn't choice
or competition that you want (because such exists already):
you want them to make the choice that you WANT them to make,
which is something they just aren't doing.

And the fact that you have the abusive persecutors in the
US Justice Department on your side does not make you right.

Chris J Delanoy


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Deja.com - Before you buy. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rgibson@ix.netcom.com                             01-Dec-99 22:52:02
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 21:37:13
Subj: Re: New modem list

From: rgibson@ix.netcom.com (Ron Gibson)

On Wed, 1 Dec 1999 20:45:02, jvarela@mind-spring.com (John Varela) wrote:

> > With most of the modern modems you do not need any initialization. They
> > will negotiate everything with the other side, and choose the best
> > settings based on the line quality and the capabilities.
 
> That's my experience with a 3COM V.90 internal.  The only init string 
> I use is ATL0, which quiets the modem speaker.
 
> Incidentally, all the modem commands are defined on the CDROM that 
> came with the modem.

Actually you can tweak performance a bit.  IMO, the ideal connection is
V90 ARQ.  You don't need compression on large downloads of compressed
files as they are already compressed.  Graphics compression rates are
very low. 

Also with 3COM modems AT$, AT&$ and ATS$ will give you all the modem
commands when invoked from a comm app such as ZOC, Telix, Qmodem, etc.

                      email: rgibson@ix.netcom.com

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: MindSpring Enterprises (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: mbatey@cixno.spamco.uk                            01-Dec-99 23:25:29
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 21:37:13
Subj: Re: Netscape Communicator 4.61 install problems

From: mbatey@cixno.spamco.uk (Maurice Batey)

On Tue, 30 Nov 1999 16:28:19, lsunley@mb.sympatico.ca (Lorne Sunley) 
wrote:

> When you install 4.61 it will pick up your user profile from 4.04
> and use it. 

Thanks, Lorne. Will 4.61 pick up my 2.02 Bookmarks etc.?
(If not, how does one migrate them?)

Is 4.6.1 simply a later version than 4.04?

Maurice Batey
(Change "no.spam" to "." in E-mail address.)

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: CIX - Compulink Information eXchange (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: mwalsh1@elp.rr.com                                01-Dec-99 17:41:06
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 21:37:13
Subj: Re: digital cameras

From: "Matt Walsh" <mwalsh1@elp.rr.com>

Get the dictu file from Hobbes.
or from Stephan at  http://charette.dyn.tj/main_apps.html

On Wed, 01 Dec 1999 13:38:54 -0600, Grant Bierman wrote:

>We are thinking of maybe getting a digital camera if it is cheap enough,
>and of course works with OS/2. Any suggestion/urls that I can look into?
>
>
>------------------[ Web Master/Author For Hire ]-----------------
>Grant Bierman <gbierman@fnmail.com> 
>-------------------------[ Random Insert ]-----------------------
>If you get TOO bored, you can....
>        Give your goldfish a perm
>------------------------[ ICQ: 22733875 ]------------------------
>                      - Yatara.dyndns.org -
>                   *All Mail Filtered For Spam*
>
>
>


Matt Walsh  	OS/2 Outpost
El Paso, TX	Computin' & Shootin' in the dust.


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Time Warner Communications, El Paso TX (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: mwalsh1@elp.rr.com                                01-Dec-99 17:42:12
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 21:37:13
Subj: Re: Road Runner and Warp

From: "Matt Walsh" <mwalsh1@elp.rr.com>

Check: http://Larkin.NuclearWinter.com/rros2/

On Wed, 01 Dec 1999 10:48:14 -0800, John Desmarais wrote:

>Hey, is anybody here using Time Warner's Road Runner cable system as
>their ISP in either Ohio or North Carolina?  I'm trying to find out how
>difficult it will be to set up before I start spending money.
>
>I specify Ohio and NC because some of Road Runner's regions have done
>away with their authentication system, but NC Triad Region (where I
>live) hasn't.  The NC-Triad branch is new, so I doubt I'll find anyone
>using OS/2 with it, but they use the same connection manager has the
>Northern Ohio region (which also has not done away with the DEC
>authentication system they use).
>
>-=>John Desmarais
>
>
>* Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet's Discussion Network *
>The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet - Free!
>


Matt Walsh  	OS/2 Outpost
El Paso, TX	Computin' & Shootin' in the dust.


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Time Warner Communications, El Paso TX (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: mwalsh1@elp.rr.com                                01-Dec-99 17:44:17
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 21:37:13
Subj: Re: Road Runner and Warp

From: "Matt Walsh" <mwalsh1@elp.rr.com>

The drivers work for login with Dhcp and under emx.  Our RR just got rid of
login and so I don't need them any more, but it's worth it and you can usually
get a free install on sale at times.

On Wed, 01 Dec 1999 12:42:18 -0800, John Desmarais wrote:

>In article <frthfvozpbz.fm2t210.pminews@rtpnews.raleigh.ibm.com>,
>"Scott E. Garfinkle" <seg@NOSPAM-us.ibm.com> wrote:
>> go look at http://larkin.nuclearwinter.com/rros2 -- look for the
>> info on
>> setting up the daemon, etc. We had the authentication turned on
>> here until
>> recently in Austin and it worked fine. You need a reasonable
>> recent (<2 yrs
>> old) level of MPTS.
>
>Hmmm... Looks like te project has been mostly abandoned - the site is
>still up, but it looks like it hasn't been updated in the last year and
>a half; and the dialer that supports Digital's authentication system
>(which I'm pretty sure is what RR NC uses) is still listed as
>"experimental" and also hasn't been updated in a year and half.  Anyone
>have any experience with it?
>
>If Road Runner didn't charge so much as a setup fee, I'd just have the
>mess installed and start playing with it hoping for the best - but I
>hate shelling out close to $200 (setup + first month) for something I
>might not get working.
>
>-=>John Desmarais
>
>
>
>* Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet's Discussion Network *
>The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet - Free!
>


Matt Walsh  	OS/2 Outpost
El Paso, TX	Computin' & Shootin' in the dust.


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Time Warner Communications, El Paso TX (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: jhimmel@i-2000.com                                02-Dec-99 00:48:28
  To: All                                               01-Dec-99 21:37:13
Subj: Re: digital cameras

From: jhimmel@i-2000.com (James Himmelman)

On Wed, 1 Dec 1999 19:38:54, Grant Bierman <gbierman@fnmail.com> 
wrote:

> We are thinking of maybe getting a digital camera if it is cheap enough,
> and of course works with OS/2. Any suggestion/urls that I can look into?
> 

There are two serial transfer utilities that work with OS/2. One is 
DCITU for OS/2, and the other is J-CAM, which is JAVA, but works fine 
in OS/2. Check for supported camera's - usually the Olympus camera's 
are pretty well supported. Or, you could get a Desktop PCMCIA card 
reader, then you could buy ANY camera and read the card in OS/2. 
That's what I did. serial transfers are SLOW! You will eventually want
a card reader anyway. 

[[[ James Himmelman - jhimmel@i-2000.com ]]]

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: lifedata@xxvol.com                                01-Dec-99 20:59:13
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 03:27:29
Subj: Re: IBM Support for os/2

From: lifedata@xxvol.com

thomas@billert.de (Thomas Billert) said:

>>PS can anyone post a comprehensible list of what 
>>upgrades/what install order are needed to convert a stand 
>>alone but using the internet, Warp 4 system needs to ensure 
>>y2k compliance?

>have a look at http://www.warpupdates.de/

What's wrong with this picture?  Netscape tells me it can't find such a
URL.

Jim L
Remove XX from address to Email
Crooks and kooks will get guns regardless of laws.


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: bCandid - Powering the world's discussions - http
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: mschmidt@home.com                                 02-Dec-99 02:02:08
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 03:27:29
Subj: Re: 3com Elink III pnp

From: Michael Schmidt <mschmidt@home.com>

Thank you all -- I'm on the road so I can't tell who's right (actually
you all could be...) Just wanted to acknowledge before the message
dissapeared over the horizon.

Cheers

Nathan Liskov wrote:
> 
> Boot up to an os2 prompt only (use the alt-f2 keey during boot).
> 
> Run the ethernet configuration programs (available from 3com web site
> if you dont have them)
> 
> In the configuration program, take the card out of PNP mode and
> configure manually.  The config program will help in picking a
> non-conflicting interrupt.
> 
> Make sure that you configure for the used I/O if you have more than
> rj-45 i/o.
> 
>         good luck
> 
>         Nate Liskov
> 
> On Sun, 28 Nov 1999 09:57:26, mike@lionsgate.com (Mike Stephen) wrote:
> 
> > In message <38409460.C9E2D32@home.com> - Michael Schmidt
> > <mschmidt@home.com> writes:
> > :>
> > :>Perhaps I've forgotten some of the basics -- I cannot get Warp 4 fp12 to
> > :>install the subject card. The driver "signs on" at boot up but it isn't
> > :>really there, rmview shows no resources being used by the card, etc..
> > :>I've tried the "recognize all hw" in the hw manager setting notebook,
> > :>nada. I don't really want to do a selective install, as that generally
> > :>trashes at least my video setup. Any suggestions?
> > :>
> > :>Cheers.
> >
> >
> >
> > Run the setup program for the elinkIII from a dos boot (it will not
> > run from a dos box).  Tell the setup programme that you have no modem
> > (even if you do).  You can also adjust the irq and io address if you
> > need to at this time.  Make sure you save the settings to the card,
> > and voila! it works.
> >
> >
> 
> nate@lcs.mit.edu   http://nateliskov.ne.mediaone.net =
> http://24.128.100.70

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: @Home Network (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: terryfry@toward.com                               02-Dec-99 02:19:23
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 03:27:29
Subj: MASM 6.11 under OS/2 (to create DOS exe?)

From: terryfry@toward.com (Terry Fry)

Is there a way to fool MASM into at least working under OS/2's
DOS?


-- 
----------------------------------------------------------
Terry Fry
Baltimore, MD

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: @Home Network (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: clive@cee3DOTdemonDOTco.uk                        30-Nov-99 14:08:26
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 03:27:29
Subj: Re: ATX motherboards

From: "Clive" <clive@cee3DOTdemonDOTco.uk>

On Wed, 24 Nov 1999 13:05:08 GMT, Buddy Donnelly wrote:

:>On Wed, 24 Nov 1999 11:42:58, csaba_r@my-deja.com (Csaba Raduly) a crit 
:>dans un message:
:>
:>> djohnson@isomedia.com (David T. Johnson) wrote in
:>> <383A9D39.935BFC44@isomedia.com>: 
:>> 
:>> >
:>> [snip]
:>> >
:>> >What he means is when you do a shutdown from warpcenter and the system
:>> >says 'It is now safe to...'  The warp center shutdown does not do an APM
:>> >power off on ATX boards.  However, since OS/2 v4 fixpack 6 or
:>> >thereabouts there has been a "power" icon in the "system setup" folder
:>> >which provides APM 1.2 support for either 'suspend' or 'power off.'  
:>> 
:>> ???
:>> I'm at FP11 and the only thing that's visible in "Power" is
:>> Power source : AC powered 
:>> Battery state: No battery
:>> 
:>> >The OS/2 'power off' feature does an APM 1.2 power off shutdown of the
:>> >operating system and the hardware.
:>> 
:>> Where is this ?
:>> Csaba
:>
:>Do you enable APM in your CONFIG.SYS with this line:?
:>
:>DEVICE=x:\OS2\BOOT\APM.SYS
:>
:>plus some systems don't load APM.SYS unless Power Management is enabled in 
:>the BIOS.
:

Or even:


DEVICE=E:\OS2\BOOT\APM.SYS
run=e:\os2\boot\apmdaemn.exe
DEVICE=E:\OS2\MDOS\VAPM.SYS



(changed to suit your drive, of course!)

,c.



--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Home (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rjlapham@infinet.com                              01-Dec-99 16:56:25
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 03:28:00
Subj: Re: IBM Support for os/2

From: rjlapham@infinet.com (Jerry Lapham)

In <HN2tEbdbtdhk-pn2-SkUDF7V0CEPr@localhost>, on 12/01/99 
   at 02:42 PM, rcrane@octa4.net.au (Richard A Crane) said:

> Most recently 2x telephone calls and 1x email enquiring 
> about WSeB unreturned and unacknowledged - and all I want to know is the
> AUS$ price of it (WSeB's existence (and of 
> course price) was not even on the IBM Australia website as  an IBM
> product!  Which leads me to the sad conclusion that  they aren't even
> interested in OS/2 for anybody

IBM is only supporting OS/2 to the extent that some of their large
customers demand it.  If there aren't any such large customers in
Australia, there's no reason to provide *any* support there.

    -Jerry
-- 
============================================================
Jerry Lapham, Monroe, OH
E-Mail: rjlapham@infinet.com
Written Wednesday, December 01, 1999 - 04:56 PM (EST)
============================================================
MR/2 Ice tag:  Deja Boo:  I've seen that ghost before.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: EriNet Online Communications - Dayton, OH (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: fegehrke@worldnet.att.net                         01-Dec-99 23:51:10
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 03:28:00
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: Forrest Gehrke <fegehrke@worldnet.att.net>

Richard A Crane wrote:
> 
> On Tue, 30 Nov 1999 17:48:19, Forrest Gehrke
> <fegehrke@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
> 
> >
> > An interesting sidelight to all this: The Wall Street Journal
> > reported a listing of economic freedom by country which was
> > jointly done by WSJ and the Heritage Foundation.
> > The ranking of economically Free countries:
> >
> >   1. HongKong
> >   2. Singapore
> >   3. New Zealand
> >   4. Bahrain
> >      Luxembourg
> >      U.S.
> >   7. Ireland
> >   8. Australia
> >      Switzerland
> >      U.K.
> >
> > Under Mostly Free the list starts off with:
> >
> >   11. Canada.
> > //
> I recomend that anyone who believes that Hong Kong or
> Singapore are free countries try tangling with their legal
> systems when opposing the governments! Or read Geoffrey
> Robertson's book.
> Richard A Crane
> Barrister & Solicitor

If you are indeed a lawyer, there is something missing 
in your reading comprehension.  The list is directed at
economic freedom in these countries, not political freedom.
For example, I doubt that HongKong gives two hoots in what
languages signs are written.
//

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: AT&T WorldNet Services (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: jdparker@erols.com                                01-Dec-99 22:51:27
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 03:28:00
Subj: Re: OS2 Dual Boot Installation Problem

From: Jim Parker <jdparker@erols.com>

Lorne Sunley wrote:

> On Wed, 1 Dec 1999 11:50:10, "Ian Dawson" <idawson@montupetuk.co.uk>
> wrote:
>
> > Hi,
> >     I have a Toshiba Satellite S300CDT (with 2.1Gb - 80Mb RAM) currently
> > running
> > Win 98.  I want to install OS2 as a dual boot option.
> >
> > After inserting the OS2 Installation Disk, an OS2 symbol appears and after
> > about
> > 30 seconds of disk churning, the machine reboots and starts the whole
> > process again.
> >
> > Any Ideas on whats wrong and how to fix them....
>
> If you are trying to use "dual boot" meaning that the OS/2
> code is in the same partition as Windows 98, this probably
> won't work given that Win 98 is probably using a FAT32 or
> FAT32X partition type which OS/2 cannot read.
>
> The only reliable way is to use "boot manager" which
> will require that you re-partition your disk drive to obtain
> another partition that can be used to install OS/2
>
> --
>
> Lorne Sunley

You need to be careful with Boot Manager and FAT32. I used the Boot Manager
that
came with Partition Magic 3.0 and which  PowerQuest got from IBM.  Later I
installed this Boot Manager on a machine that had Win98 preinstalled in a
FAT32
partition. It didn't handle it correctly. I went on a Partition Magic forum
and
found that PowerQuest had a fix for the problem which I downloaded and
installed
and this updated Boot Manager handled the FAT32 partition correctly. The issue
is that the Boot Manager that comes with Warp is probably the same one that
was
originally distributed with Partition Magic and thus probably suffers from the
same problem. I don't know if IBM ever distributed a fix for the problem.

The symptom of the problem was that, when I booted the FAT32 (Win98) primary
partition, the FAT  primary partition (In which I had installed DOS) was
visible. The FAT32 partition was assigned C: and the FAT partition got
assigned
two drive letters. One of these "drives" appeared to Win98 to be of 0 length
and
inaccessable while the other appeared normal. The problem, of course, is that
there is supposed to be only one primary partition per physical drive visible
at
any one time. I only had two primary partitions on this drive (other than Boot
Manager itself) so I don't know how it would have dealt with more than two
primaries.

Jim


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: jim.danvers@mindex.com                            01-Dec-99 23:10:03
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 03:28:00
Subj: Re: Sound Cards and OS/2 (Creative PCI 128?)

From: Jim Danvers <jim.danvers@mindex.com>

Wow!  Look what I started...  (I kinda forgot about this thread - sorry
guys...)  I have been "talking" with a few other people in the os/2 tcpip
group regarding getting a box attached to an NT network.  (I finally managed
to get Warp v4 installed on one! <@work though...  still can't get it to run
on my hardware here @home...  :(  )

In anycase though - since I did remember to re-visit this group (I ~thought~
that maybe I posted something in here...) I see that there has been some
banter regarding the original question about the sb drivers - the open source
thing looks promising - lets hope that someone does write some drivers for the
sb cards!

Anyway - sorry for not expressing my appreciation for the help guys - I just
forgot to check back... {shrug shoulders}

-=- J.D. -=-


Jim Danvers wrote:

> Hi guys...
>
> I just installed Warp 3 (blue spine) and am trying (hoping) to get audio
> running on this box - it has a Creative Labs Sound Blaster PCI 128 card in
> it and I have not been able to locate any info on getting it running as
> yet.  I'm dual booting this box @present w/Win95 and the audio card works
> fine.
>
> Anyone have any pointers or suggestions?
>
> Thanks in advance....
>
> -=- J.D. -=-
>
> Doug Bissett wrote:
>
> > On Fri, 12 Nov 1999 15:35:20, rcrane@octa4.net.au (Richard A Crane)
> > wrote:
> >
> > > Can anyone comment on the working off/difficulties in
> > > getting  working any of the following: ISA AW37-3D cyrstal
> > > chipset card: PCI AW230 4280 Cyrstal Chipset card; or Yamaha
> > > YME744 card or Aztech 368 DSP PCI card?
> > > Richard A Crane
> > > Barrister & Solicitor
> > > slightly altered email (anti-spamming) rcrane AT
> > > octa4.net.au
> > > OR rcrane AT attglobal.net
> >
> > I have used a few AW37 cards, with good success. Go to:
> > http://www.cirrus.com/drivers/audiodrv/
> > to get the OS/2 driver (Use the FM driver, it works better than the WT
> > driver).
> >
> > Hope this helps...
> > ******************************
> > From the PC of Doug Bissett
> > doug.bissett at attglobal.net
> > The " at " must be changed to "@"
> > ******************************

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: djfirth@attglobal.net                             02-Dec-99 04:33:10
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 03:28:00
Subj: Re: Help with Fix Pack install

From: djfirth@attglobal.net

Many thanks.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Global Network Services - Remote Access Mail & Ne
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: uno@40th.com                                      02-Dec-99 04:40:00
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 03:28:00
Subj: Re: MASM 6.11 under OS/2 (to create DOS exe?)

From: uno@40th.com (uno@40th.com)

Terry Fry? (terryfry@toward.com?) wrote (Thu, 02 Dec 1999 02:19:47 GMT):
>Is there a way to fool MASM into at least working under OS/2's

Set DPMI to enabled (not auto), and ... INT during I/O to off.  Also,
might need the updated TNT extender from VC 1.52.  I think there's a
copy on hobbes (used to be on the old hobbes -- not sure it made it to
the new hobbes (c.1996 or so)).  6.11a flew fine.  Not sure about 611d.

 '`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'`'
 Corne1 Huth     http://40th.com/      Bullet database engines/servers

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Yanaguana (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: JSeder-nospam@syntel.com                          01-Dec-99 21:47:23
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 03:28:01
Subj: OS/2 Sighting - Sunday NY Times Crossword Puzzle!

From: Jonathan Seder <JSeder-nospam@syntel.com>

In the Sunday New York Times crossword puzzle #1121, "Odd Couples", the
clue for 65 across (3 letters) is "OS/2 company".

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: SyntelSoft Inc (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: nemo@union.edu                                    02-Dec-99 00:47:02
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 03:28:01
Subj: Re: problem w/ cdrw

From: nemo@union.edu

In <38445701.C2291A4D@t-online.de>, on 12/01/99 
   at 12:00 AM, Herbert Kaminski <herbert.kaminski@t-online.de> said:

>Well, in my CONFIG.SYS, I have:

>REM *** RSJ CD-Writer File System ***
>BASEDEV=LOCKCDR.FLT
>DEVICE=E:\CDWFS\RSJSCSI.SYS
>IFS=E:\CDWFS\CDWFS.IFS
>RUN=E:\CDWFS\CDWFSD.EXE -p "h:/TRACKS" -c50000 -b4096 -t2 -i3 -s4

>and you should have similar lines too. And, don't forget to
>set the SCSI controller to 'no synch transfer' for the SCSI ID  of the
>CDRW.

I have similar lines but with some extra switches recommended to me for
the cdwfs.ifs line. I sometimes have lockcdr.flt remmed out according to
advice about running the cdrw as the only cdrom.

I'm not sure about 'no synch transfer'. I'm about to reboot. I'll have a
look.

>> The pdf manual is uninformative and I've found nothing so far on deja.com.

>Did you ever try their web pages at www.rsj.de? Or their newsgroups at
>news.rsj.de? I never had to try it, but I am quite sure they answer
>questions by e-mail.

I was directed to them some days ago, and looked at the newsgroup on
Sunday. It provided some added tips and some company in misery. I'll be
checking back there for sure.

>>      OS/2 - ma kauft koi katz em sack

>...and no CDRW either ;-)

I've tried not to. I'm sure the Ricoh is good equipment. You never know
what will 'bite' you though<g>.

F.

-----------------------------------------------------------
      Felmon John Davis		
     davisf@union.edu	|  davisf@capital.net     
     Union College /  Schenectady, NY
     - insert standard doxastic disclaimers -
     OS/2 - ma kauft koi katz em sack 
-----------------------------------------------------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Logical Net (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: hamei@pacbell.net                                 02-Dec-99 07:07:02
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 05:22:14
Subj: Re: Java 1.2 for OS/2

From: hamei@pacbell.net

In <38452B6C.F716F198@opera.no>, =?iso-8859-1?Q?Bj=F8rn?= Vermo <bv@opera.no>
writes:
>Bob Germer wrote:
>> 
>> Now I realize that in the United States we have the highest percentage of
>> participation in investments in the world. Perhaps our citizens have
>> become more sophisticated than elsewhere in the English speaking world.
>> 
>Or, more likely, less sophisticated. US companies are, after all,
>notorious for
>their short-sightedness (long term meaning beyond the next quarterly
>results,
>as the saying goes).
>

for the rest of us as-yet unindoctrinated Americans I'd like to apologize 
for Mr Germer.  To my knowledge "sophisticated" has never been  
successfully applied to the philistine mentality displayed by the small-
shopkeeper 'investment' community. Third generation Robber Barons, perhaps -
but housewives taking night classes in an attempt to take over the world ?
I think not . . . Joel Grey is one thing, Bob Germer chanting, "Money makes 
ze vorld go 'round," quite another.

--
hrad ngravvd

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: SBC Internet Services (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: admin@hotmail.com                                 02-Dec-99 07:42:13
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 05:22:14
Subj: Re: Font Editor?

From: admin@hotmail.com (Edmond Dantes)

On Wed, 1 Dec 1999 15:01:13, alex@eddie.cis.uoguelph.ca (Alex Taylor) 
wrote:

> On Tue, 30 Nov 1999 02:50:18 GMT, Edmond Dantes <admin@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > I'm looking for a font editor.  Is there a native one?
> > Edmond Dantes
> > phydeaux(the 'at' thing)home.com
>
> The Developer's Toolkit includes one.  I haven't really tried using it,
> though.

As I understand it that only does bitmap fonts, not Adobe Type 1 or 
True Type.

Am I wrong.

Edmond Dantes
phydeaux(the 'at' thing)home.com

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: @Home Network (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: cbzh@my-deja.com                                  02-Dec-99 07:49:28
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 05:22:14
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: cbzh@my-deja.com

In article <822icr$ra1$1@dagger.ab.videon.ca>,
  larso@ualberta.ca wrote:
> As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw cbzh@my-deja.com write:
> >   larso@ualberta.ca wrote:
>
> > > Does Microsoft send people to force you to buy their products?
Which gun is
> > > being placed at your skull?
> > >
> > > Or is it a matter of Microsoft "forcing you" to buy the product by
providing
> > > a valued product at an affordable rate?
> >
> > Oh, that's it: I am 100% convinced now!
> >
> > So I must have _willingly_ bought the two never used and never
needed -
> > but surely paid for! - Win95 licenses I still have somewhere around,
> > because there was actually no gun around anywhere??!
>
> Well, through what mechanism did Microsoft force you to purchase the
> product?  Where was your free choice removed?  Was your free choice
removed
> at the point where you wanted to usurp the free choices of others?
>

_YOU_ should answer this question! Didn't you see that I gave you 100%
right? I can only repeat: Neither guns nor governments were involved,
thus no monopoly power - just following your own logic!

> > I still cannot see why I should have spent money for these licenses,
but
> > maybe I still wanted them unconsciously?? Or it was in a moment that
I
> > felt some kind of pity with poor Billy boy and I just wanted to make
a
> > free donation for him???
>
> Well, why did you pay the fucking money?
>

Strange thing, isn't it? People are donating money to a company that
neither forces them with guns nor being supported by a government? Once
on your own line of argumentation, I don't see any solution to this
question!

> > Still not understanding my motivation thus - but it was sure no
monopoly
> > power that was forcing me - "because monopolies are always imposed
by
> > governments" (never contradict the Ormberg dogma!), and our
government
> > sure would have allowed selling computers without Windows
licenses!!!
>
> You can sell a computer without Windows licences.
>
> I helped a friend set such a machine up less than a week ago.
>

Sure I can, if I am ready to pay the extra cost: I can just buy the
Toshiba notebook that fits my needs best, format the HD and throw the
Windows CD immediately in the trash can! This doesn't change the fact
that I have paid for a Windows license that way!

Cornelis Bockemhl <cbockem@datacomm.ch>

> --
> Lars P. Ormberg     ICQ#:8827066
> mailto:larso@ualberta.ca
> The University of Lars:   http://www.ualberta.ca/~larso/
>
> "The way you're bathed in light, reminds me of that night
> God laid me down into your rose garden of trust and I was
> swept away with nothin' left to say some helpless fool
> yeah I was lost in a swoon of peace you're all I need to
> find so when the time is right come to me sweetly, come
> to me come to me..love will lead us, alright.  love will
> lead us, she will lead us.  can you hear the dolphin's
> cry?  see the road rise up to meet us its in the air we
> breathe tonight love will lead us, she will lead us"
>                             -Live, "The Dolphin's Cry"
>


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Deja.com - Before you buy. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: cbzh@my-deja.com                                  02-Dec-99 08:09:20
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 05:22:14
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: cbzh@my-deja.com

In article <824afn$52v$1@nnrp1.deja.com>,
  Chris J Delanoy <cdelanoy@ualberta.ca> wrote:
>  letoured@nospam.net wrote:
>
[...]
>
> And the -only- institution capable of legally initiating force
> against you is the government.  Bill Gates can not;  he has no
> power over you and can not force anybody to do anything.

But Bill Gates _has_ most governments of the world on his side! He is
not selling any material objects but _licenses_ - which are legal
constructs and just _nothing_ if there is no governmental power behind
to enforce it!

Removing all governmental regulation would mean: No protected
copyrights, patents etc. any more, thus no licenses you could sell on
any "free market"!

Your thesis is: No _monopoly_ without governmental/legal regulations!

I say: No _free market_ without governmental/legal regulations!

Example: See above!

Cornelis Bockemhl <cbockem@datacomm.ch>


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Deja.com - Before you buy. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: admin@hotmail.com                                 02-Dec-99 08:29:12
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 05:22:14
Subj: fixpack 12 problem

From: admin@hotmail.com (Edmond Dantes)

Everytime I go to install a fixpack this happens.  I can't find all 
the files.
At least this time I was able to get the fixpack from hobbes.  The 
problem is
that I can't find the kicker disks.  The readme say I need fixtool 
f1.41 or
later.  It doesn't give a filename or a url.

I tried the URL object that comes with warp and it goes to a redirect 
page that
has a bad link.

I expect this from microsoft, not IBM.

Where can I get the disks.


Edmond Dantes
phydeaux(the 'at' thing)home.com

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: @Home Network (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: cbzh@my-deja.com                                  02-Dec-99 08:17:06
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 05:22:14
Subj: Re: Font Editor?

From: cbzh@my-deja.com

In article <ZKa14.80305$V4.772913@news2.rdc1.on.home.com>,
  alex@eddie.cis.uoguelph.ca (Alex Taylor) wrote:
> On Tue, 30 Nov 1999 02:50:18 GMT, Edmond Dantes <admin@hotmail.com>
wrote:
> > I'm looking for a font editor.  Is there a native one?
> > Edmond Dantes
> > phydeaux(the 'at' thing)home.com
>
> The Developer's Toolkit includes one.  I haven't really tried using
it,
> though.
>

The one I have from there can only edit bitmap fonts, so not really very
useful in most cases!

The program I used for my astronomy fonts (see my freeware
astronomy programs "PmAs" at http://www.datacomm.ch/cobo) is just Corel
Draw 5 for Win3 (under WinOS2), which can create or modify Adobe Fonts
(and probably also TrueType - I didn't check that now).

Cornelis Bockemhl <cbockem@datacomm.ch>

PS: You see I don't miss a chance to advertise my programs ;-)

> --
> -----------------------------------------------------------------
>  Alex Taylor                  BA - CIS - University of Guelph
>  alex@eddie.cis.uoguelph.ca   http://eddie.cis.uoguelph.ca/~alex
> -----------------------------------------------------------------
>


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Deja.com - Before you buy. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: lsunley@mb.sympatico.ca                           02-Dec-99 10:08:24
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 12:07:28
Subj: Re: fixpack 12 problem

From: lsunley@mb.sympatico.ca (Lorne Sunley)

On Thu, 2 Dec 1999 08:29:24, admin@hotmail.com (Edmond Dantes) wrote:

> Everytime I go to install a fixpack this happens.  I can't find all 
> the files.
> At least this time I was able to get the fixpack from hobbes.  The 
> problem is
> that I can't find the kicker disks.  The readme say I need fixtool 
> f1.41 or
> later.  It doesn't give a filename or a url.
> 
> I tried the URL object that comes with warp and it goes to a redirect 
> page that
> has a bad link.
> 
> I expect this from microsoft, not IBM.
> 
> Where can I get the disks.

It's available from the ftp.software.ibm.com site

URL ftp://ftp.software.ibm.com/ps/products/os2/fixtool/english-us/

That URL assumes you want the US English version.
There are also many other language versions at

URL ftp://ftp.software.ibm.com/ps/products/os2/fixtool/

The file is cs_141.exe. It is a self expanding executable.

--

Lorne Sunley

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: MBnet Networking Inc. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bv@opera.no                                       02-Dec-99 11:46:20
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 12:07:28
Subj: Re: MASM 6.11 under OS/2 (to create DOS exe?)

From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Bj=F8rn?= Vermo <bv@opera.no>

Terry Fry wrote:
> 
> Is there a way to fool MASM into at least working under OS/2's
> DOS?
> 
Why bother? Unless the source code you have is very MASM-specific,
it is probably better to use ALP.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bv@opera.no                                       02-Dec-99 12:10:02
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 12:07:28
Subj: Re: Java 1.2 for OS/2

From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Bj=F8rn?= Vermo <bv@opera.no>

hamei@pacbell.net wrote:
> 
> 
> for the rest of us as-yet unindoctrinated Americans I'd like to apologize
> for Mr Germer.  To my knowledge "sophisticated" has never been
> successfully applied to the philistine mentality displayed by the small-
> shopkeeper 'investment' community. 

On the other hand, it is quite possible that he was applying what is
known as "irony" - a type of humour which is admittedly rather more
common on this side of the big water.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: thaimann@dmreg.infi.net                           02-Dec-99 06:39:26
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 12:07:28
Subj: Connect to Host by name

From: "Terry Haimann" <thaimann@dmreg.infi.net>

I want to connect to my network host by name instead of by ip address.  Where
do I enter this information in Warp 4.0?

Thx	Terry


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: InfiNet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: cocke@catherders.com                              02-Dec-99 06:33:17
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 12:07:28
Subj: Re: OS/2 Warp vs 2gig Jaz

From: Michael W. Cocke <cocke@catherders.com>

Download the OAD driver from the Iomega site and configure it for the 
1Gb Jaz drive - it works fine with the 2 Gb.  I use it with the Jaz 
traveler (PP adapter) on numerous warp 4 and WSeB systems.


On Wed, 01 Dec 1999 15:47:04 GMT, James Moe wrote:

>
>
>"Michael W. Cocke" wrote:
>> 
>> On Wed, 01 Dec 1999 03:46:31 GMT, James Moe wrote:
>> 
>> >>
>> >> Is there anyway to run a 2 gigabyte Jaz drive under OS/2 Warp 4?
>> >>
>> >    <sigh> Details?
>> >
>> >    Parallel Port : no
>> 
>>  Parallel Port : Yes
>> 
>    Really? Did Iomega make a driver for the JAZ drive and parallel
>port?
>
>-- 
>
>sma at rtd dot com
>Remove ".spam-not" for email
>

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Please note:  My Email and web page addresses are changing in January
2000.
                     The new email address is cocke@catherders.com   
                      The web page is at http://www.catherders.com

                    Because network administration is like herding cats.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------



--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: UseNet Server, Inc.  http://www.usenetserver.com 
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com                           02-Dec-99 07:58:29
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 15:58:12
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com>

On <943885853snz@deltrak.demon.co.uk>, on 11/29/99 at 02:30 PM,
   ames@deltrak.demon.co.uk (Andrew Stephenson) said:

> In article <3842703d$3$obot$mr2ice@news.pics.com>
> 	   bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com "Bob Germer" writes:

> > [...]
> >
> > No American is forced to pay taxes to support an unelected head
> > of state who lives 3,000 miles away and only sets foot in the
> > country every decade or less.
> >
> > [...]

> Sorry to stop you in mid-flow, Bob.  If it's Queen Liz 2 of the Windsors
> we're discussing, the way I heard it is, we in the UK pay for her upkeep
> (and that of her sprogs) and the rest of the Commonwealth are allowed to
> borrow her, essentially free, over the weekends.  A smart move on their
> part, I've always thought.

I understand that the Canadian, Australian, etc. governments must
reimburse the Royal Navy or Air Force for the costs of her transportation,
pay for her lodgings, etc. Since governments have no income other than
what they raise via taxes, user charges, or whatever other euphanism
governments the world over use to hide the fact they are fleecing
taxpayers, the citizens of those countries are forced to pay.

> If it's otherwise, then yes I suppose I'd be a tad vexed too.

They also have to pay for the Governor General (in Canada - I don't know
if that title is universal in the realm) who does nothing. Now the GG of
Canada doesn't have the staff of our President nor is his residence nearly
as large as our White House. He doesn't get the security our Prez needs
(to no small extent due to the number of aggrieved husbands and boyfriends
looking for a shot at Billy).

But when one combines the cost of housing, security, salary, etc. of the
Prime Minister with the costs of maintaining the Queen's representative, I
imagine the cost per citizen in Canada is not much less than our cost per
citizen for President Bubba.

> But look at it this way: the Windsors are prepared to do those dirty
> jobs we commoners won't touch: read out hours of boring speeches; shake
> hands with innumerable scumbag foreign leaders (along with the nice
> ones, of course); oversee horse breeding; help keep down the grouse
> population; house-sit those draughty old palaces; test ickky recipes;... 
> Hey, it's not easy.  Dare say they even have to be nice to King Billy
> when he comes round. --

I presume King Billy refers to President Bubba, not Chief Thief Billy
Gates. And, I suppose that making nice with that liar from Arkansas does
make HRM somewhat worth what you all pay one way or another for her and
her offspring.

And if perchance the other Billy should come to visit, I suggest you take
a lesson from your history and do to him what the Campbells did to the
MacDonalds at Glencoe a few decades back.

--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: bobg@Pics.com
Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 12
MR/2 Ice Registration Number 67
Aut Pax Aut Bellum
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com                           02-Dec-99 07:28:03
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 15:58:12
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com>

On <81uc0f$nuh$2@dagger.ab.videon.ca>, on 11/29/99 at 05:09 PM,
   larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) said:

>  Lars, I was going to respond to this with a flame that you should >
> have read the rest of my post before replying so knee-jerkily,

> I did read it.

> Does Microsoft send people to force you to buy their products?  Which
> gun is being placed at your skull?

No, it sends people to the manufacturers and vendors of computers forcing
them to include Windows on every machine they sell or pay four times as
much for Windows. Thus competition forces vendors to comply since the
margin on a typical PC is far less than 4 times the price of Windows if
they do.

> Or is it a matter of Microsoft "forcing you" to buy the product by
> providing a valued product at an affordable rate?

Valued product? Not to me it is not. It is a piece of garbage I do not and
will not use but must pay for despite my desire to use an alternate
operating system. I do, however, give those copies away free to friends,
relatives, etc. who wish to upgrade from Windows 3.1 or 95. I use a couple
of Windows 95 CD's as frisbees for my dog.

--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: bobg@Pics.com
Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 12
MR/2 Ice Registration Number 67
Aut Pax Aut Bellum
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com                           02-Dec-99 07:17:13
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 15:58:12
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com>

On <81uc53$nuh$3@dagger.ab.videon.ca>, on 11/29/99 at 05:12 PM,
   larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) said:


> Time to ask a simple question: how does this monopoly keep a competitor
> from forming.  All that is needed is a mechanism.

A monopoly as defined by US law is a company so dominant in its industry
segment that it can force its will on virtually the entire market segment.
MS forces computer buyers to pay for Windows whether the customer wants to
or not.

A monopoly as defined in US law is a company which can set prices
regardless of actual cost or value. Microsoft still charges the same price
for its products as the day they were released. No other consumer product
in my memory is not reduced in price as the end of production nears.

A monopoly as defined in US law is a company which can force competitors
out of business or make it financially unfeasible to compete. Where is
Digital Research? Where is Seattle Computer? Where are several other DOS's
which I could buy in 1988?

A monopoly under US law is a company which can force third parties to
conform to its will and to cease taking actions which would help an actual
or potential competitor. Where are WordPerfect, Volkswriter, Brown Bag
Software, and hundreds of other companies which wrote software for other
than Windows?

IBM was twice found to be a monopoly in the past 40 or so years yet there
are other companies which produce mainframe computers. IBM was forced to
comply with the same law that MS is being held to have violated.

> > >The finding of fact is comprised of fiction.
> > 
> > As if you have even read it let alone understand it.

> Read, understood, almost puked.

Well, you are not a US citizen. You don't have to like our law. However,
if you cross the southern border of Canada, you damn well better obey it.


--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: bobg@Pics.com
Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 12
MR/2 Ice Registration Number 67
Aut Pax Aut Bellum
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com                           02-Dec-99 07:09:21
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 15:58:12
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com>

On <81uccp$nuh$4@dagger.ab.videon.ca>, on 11/29/99 at 05:16 PM,
   larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) said:

> > What are you smoking, snorting, or shooting? The U.S. Courts have
> > determined that MS is a monopoly.

> Yes, they have.  Now, what does that mean?  It doesn't mean that
> Microsoft is devoid of competition.  Do you have another definition of a
> monopoly? Say, a business which is winning a competition?

Monopoly as defined by U. S. law is a company so dominant in an industry
segment that it can dictate to the entire segment, use its position to
damage competitors, overcharge customers, etc.

> > Again the question. The U.S. Government does not establish monopolies.

> Right now, there are 3 examples that come to mind of monopolies I live
> under:

> - Cable television.  Under the CRTC, Edmonton has 2 cable companies. 
> One is only allowed to sell on the east side of town, the other only on
> the west

This is not true in the United States. Each state here establishes the
rules for cable television companies. Several communities here have a
second franchise, much to the chagrin of the cable television industry. In
those communities, rates are much lower, btw.

> - Telephone service.  While I can choose any long distance provider, I
> can only have one local phone service.  Anything else is illegal.

We have choices for local telephone service here in the United States.

> - Health care.  I am only allowed to use one health care system, the
> government one.  It is illegal to be serviced by a hospital not
> government-administered.

Well, that is not the case in the United States despite the best efforts
of the liberals who would foist such a rotten system off on us. That is
why there are dozens if not hundreds of small border towns with more
physicians than residents.

> None of these can exist without the government.  I can think of no
> monopolies I live under not involving government.

Microsoft comes to mind. Try buying an Intel based computer without paying
for Windows.

> > > The finding of fact is comprised of fiction.
> > 
> > You are really stoned out. The finding of fact is the reasoned judgement
> > of a United States District Court Judge.

> Applying a set of laws that have no validity in real life, or any
> rational basis.

They have very real validity in the United States. The reasoning set for
in the FOF is rock solid and unassailable unless one concludes that every
witness cited was lying or misquoted. And once a FOF has been made, it is
extremely rare for any appellate court to overrule the finder of fact be
it a judge or jury.


--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: bobg@Pics.com
Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 12
MR/2 Ice Registration Number 67
Aut Pax Aut Bellum
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com                           02-Dec-99 08:18:27
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 15:58:12
Subj: Re: IBM Support for os/2

From: Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com>

On <3845ed74$0$54870@news.erinet.com>, on 12/01/99 at 04:56 PM,
   rjlapham@infinet.com (Jerry Lapham) said:

> IBM is only supporting OS/2 to the extent that some of their large
> customers demand it.  If there aren't any such large customers in
> Australia, there's no reason to provide *any* support there.

>     -Jerry

Wrong, Jerry, wrong. IBM does provide support for Warp around the world as
I posted in another article here.

--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: bobg@Pics.com
Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 12
MR/2 Ice Registration Number 67
Aut Pax Aut Bellum
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: sbritton@cadvision.com                            02-Dec-99 08:54:15
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 15:58:12
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: "Steven C. Britton" <sbritton@cadvision.com>

Bob Germer wrote:
>
> No, it sends people to the manufacturers and vendors of computers forcing
> them to include Windows on every machine they sell or pay four times as
> much for Windows.

That's not coercive.  It's a package deal.  Microsoft can't force computer
distributors to put Windows on their machines; but they _can_ say that "if
you sell a computer with windows, we'll give you a massive discount on it".

> Thus competition forces vendors to comply since the
> margin on a typical PC is far less than 4 times the price of Windows if
> they do.

Wrong.

If a customer buys a computer without Windows, the store isn't buying
Windows from Microsoft for that particular machine, so it becomes a
non-issue.

If the customer wants to buy Windows as an add-on later, then they pay 4
times as much as they would have paid if they'd bought Windows with the
machine.

That is _not_ a monopoly, nor is it a "monopolistic" practise.

> Valued product? Not to me it is not. It is a piece of garbage I do not and
> will not use but must pay for despite my desire to use an alternate
> operating system.

No you don't.  You just don't buy Windows with the machine.  The store won't
care: they'll just package that Windows system with a different machine and
buy one less package from MicroSoft.

> I do, however, give those copies away free to friends,
> relatives, etc. who wish to upgrade from Windows 3.1 or 95. I use a couple
> of Windows 95 CD's as frisbees for my dog.

What a silly way to choose to waste your money -- and it is 100% _your_
choice to do so.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
What have YOU done to bust a union today?
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Work better: Work union-free.

Steven C. Britton
Calgary

www.cadvision.com/sbritton



--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: CADVision Development Corporation (http://www.cad
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: martin.brown@pandora.be                           02-Dec-99 16:04:13
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 15:58:12
Subj: Re: IBM Support for os/2

From: Martin Brown <martin.brown@pandora.be>

ALDEL wrote:

> In <384576C3.1C304F42@pandora.be>, on 12/01/99
>    at 08:28 PM, Martin Brown <martin.brown@pandora.be> said:
>
> >Thomas Billert wrote:
>
> >> Hi Richard,
> >>
> >> On 1 Dec 1999 14:42:21 GMT, Richard A Crane wrote in
> >> comp.os.os2.misc:
> >>
> >> >PS can anyone post a comprehensible list of what
> >> >upgrades/what install order are needed to convert a stand
> >> >alone but using the internet, Warp 4 system needs to ensure
> >> >y2k compliance?
> >>
> >> have a look at http://www.warpupdates.de/
>
> >Ooops !!!
>
> >While trying to retrieve the URL: http://www.warpupdates.de/ The
> >following error was encountered:
>
> >    ERROR 205 -- DNS name lookup failure. Please contact your system
> >administrator.
>
> >It works about as well as some of the IBM links :(

>
> It works OK here!

Must have been a transient network fault. OK from here now too !

Regards,
Martin Brown

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Nezumi (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: nospam@here.please                                02-Dec-99 10:31:12
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 15:58:12
Subj: Re: QUESTION: OBJECTDESKTOP ON WSEB?

From: "Walter Metcalf" <nospam@here.please>

I suggest you try the OD Support Group at

news://news.Stardock.com/stardock.os2.support

Brad Wardell et. al. monitor this group.

Walter Metcalf
Focus on OS/2
http://os2.about.com

On Mon, 29 Nov 1999 08:51:05 +0000, filippo sartori wrote:

>HI
>I tried to install Object Desktop 2.0 on Workspace for e-business.
>I failed. Did anybody succeeded?
>Is it incompatible?
>
>Regards
>
>Filippo Sartori
>
>Please mail me also.
>
>Thanks
>
>



--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Golden Triangle Online (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: prather@infi.net                                  02-Dec-99 13:20:22
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 15:58:12
Subj: Re: digital cameras

From: prather@infi.net (Jerry Prather)

In message <384579ac$1$tovrezna$mr2ice@news.usenetserver.com> -
Grant Bierman <gbierman@fnmail.com>Wed, 01 Dec 1999 13:38:54
-0600 writes:
:>
:>We are thinking of maybe getting a digital camera if it is cheap enough,
:>and of course works with OS/2. Any suggestion/urls that I can look into?

I eliminated the operating system issue and bought a Sony Mavica
model FD-73.  This uses a 3.5" diskette to save the pictures and
has a 10X zoom lens (plus a whole lot of other bells and
whistles).  It used to sell for $800, but they're going for $500
now.  It isn't real cheap, but it seems to be real good.

I just pop the diskette into Drive A and double click on the .jpg
file.  The picture comes up in PMView.  Or I can move it to an
html file and use Netscape, or.....  I like it!


Jerry Prather                    prather@infi.net

"Many religions are worth dying for; no religion is worth killing
for."
					- Me (circa 1998)

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: infi.net (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com                           02-Dec-99 08:32:10
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 15:58:12
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com>

On <38453c54.764492@news1.sympatico.ca>, on 12/01/99 at 03:21 PM,
   siberREMOVETHIS@sympatico.ca (E. Barry Bruyea) said:

> >
> >Mr. Delanoy, 
> >
> >I, like Mr. Germer, run OS/2.  That is my choice.  This past year
> >I bought a new notebook computer.  The primary factor in choosing
> >which one to buy was whether the notebook computer was fully
> >compatible with OS/2.  The best I could find was an IBM Thinkpad
> >- and even then it came with a WinModem which I had to replace
> >with a PCMCIA real modem in order to get 56K speed.  All
> >Thinkpads came with Windows98 pre-installed.  I could _not_ order
> >a Thinkpad without a Win98 installation.  I could get OS/2
> >preinstalled and could have elected to have Win98 removed by an
> >OS/2 reseller, but I _still_ had to pay for Win98.  I paid the
> >lower price (which included the fee for the Win98 license) and
> >installed OS/2 myself.

> And if you ordered a Chevy from General Motors, and told the dealer you
> wanted a Bosch Alternator, guess what?  You'd still have to pay for the
> Delco Alternator the car came with.  The dealer is not going to take the
> hit for the cost of the OE.  Your compaint falls under the 'Gee Whiz'
> category.

Ah, you lack of reasoning capability clearly shown for all the world to
see. GM is the manufacturer of the car and the alternator. MS is NOT the
manufacturer of the computer.

And, BTW, you are wrong about the car too. One can order a car with a
different alternator from GM through its fleet sales division. Our
township just bought a Caprice with a Bosch alternator that way. We only
bought one too, for our new Fire Commissioner. We use Fords for our Police
department and get them via a state contract. The car for the FC was a
one-off order.

And most dealers would make the switch and give you credit for the cost of
the Delcotron since he can and will sell it or use it for a warranty
replacement.


--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: bobg@Pics.com
Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 12
MR/2 Ice Registration Number 67
Aut Pax Aut Bellum
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: c.k.christacopoulos.REMOVEME@dun...               02-Dec-99 13:43:08
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 15:58:12
Subj: Re: Connect to Host by name

Message sender: c.k.christacopoulos.REMOVEME@dundee.ac.uk

From: Charles Christacopoulos <c.k.christacopoulos.REMOVEME@dundee.ac.uk>

Terry Haimann wrote:
> 
> I want to connect to my network host by name instead of by ip address. 
Where
> do I enter this information in Warp 4.0?
> 
> Thx     Terry
What network.  Lan server (you use the built in warp 4 client), Netware,
Winblows Workgroup network, Peer to Peer?

-- 
Remove REMOVE_ME to reply.
-------------------------------------------------------------------
Charles Christacopoulos, Secretary's Office, University of Dundee,
Dundee DD1 4HN, (Scotland) United Kingdom.
Tel: +44+(0)1382-344891. Fax: +44+(0)1382-201604.
http://somis.ais.dundee.ac.uk/    (runs on OS/2)
Scottish Search Maestro http://somis2.ais.dundee.ac.uk/ (runs on OS/2
too)

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: University of Dundee (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: thaimann@dmreg.infi.net                           02-Dec-99 08:28:05
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 15:58:12
Subj: Re: Connect to Host by name

From: "Terry Haimann" <thaimann@dmreg.infi.net>

A Linux box on my home network, I beleive I have configured something
incorrectly.  I can ftp, telnet only by ip address not by host name.

On Thu, 02 Dec 1999 13:43:17 +0000, Charles Christacopoulos wrote:

>Terry Haimann wrote:
>> 
>> I want to connect to my network host by name instead of by ip address. 
Where
>> do I enter this information in Warp 4.0?
>> 
>> Thx     Terry
>What network.  Lan server (you use the built in warp 4 client), Netware,
>Winblows Workgroup network, Peer to Peer?
>
>-- 
>Remove REMOVE_ME to reply.
>-------------------------------------------------------------------
>Charles Christacopoulos, Secretary's Office, University of Dundee,
>Dundee DD1 4HN, (Scotland) United Kingdom.
>Tel: +44+(0)1382-344891. Fax: +44+(0)1382-201604.
>http://somis.ais.dundee.ac.uk/    (runs on OS/2)
>Scottish Search Maestro http://somis2.ais.dundee.ac.uk/ (runs on OS/2
>too)



--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: InfiNet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com                           02-Dec-99 09:32:01
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 15:58:12
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com>

On <822jq6$j3k$2@dagger.ab.videon.ca>, on 12/01/99 at 07:47 AM,
   larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) said:

> Lars P. Ormberg     ICQ#:8827066
> mailto:larso@ualberta.ca
> The University of Lars:   http://www.ualberta.ca/~larso/

You post from the University of Alberta. Tell, us, are you a student there
or on the staff?

--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: bobg@Pics.com
Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 12
MR/2 Ice Registration Number 67
Aut Pax Aut Bellum
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com                           02-Dec-99 09:33:25
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 15:58:12
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com>

On <821q6h$aoe$1@nnrp1.deja.com>, on 12/01/99 at 12:30 AM,
   Chris J Delanoy <cdelanoy@ualberta.ca> said:

> Nothing that any government has done has ever been for the ACTUAL good
> of the public.

What an asshole you again prove yourself to be. You are advocating
anarchy, rule by the most vicious, strongest, most immoral.

How in God's name can you claim that providing food, clothing, shelter,
health care, etc. for the sick and disabled is bad for society?

How in God's name can you claim providing a police force to prevent the
dishonest from stealing, the murderous from killing, the reckless from
inflicting harm on the public is bad for society?

Name one single society since the Stone Age which functioned and survived
in anarchy. Name one advance since the discovery of fire which occurred in
anarchy.

Between you and Lars you haven't a combined IQ higher than that of my dog
if either of you believes what you post here. If you two are typical
Canadians, then the combined IQ of all Canada doesn't reach 100.

--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: bobg@Pics.com
Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 12
MR/2 Ice Registration Number 67
Aut Pax Aut Bellum
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: jdesmaraNOjdSPAM@novanthealth.or...               02-Dec-99 06:55:01
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 15:58:12
Subj: Re: Road Runner and Warp

Message sender: jdesmaraNOjdSPAM@novanthealth.org.invalid

From: John Desmarais <jdesmaraNOjdSPAM@novanthealth.org.invalid>

In article <zjnyfuryceepbz.fm336b6.pminews@news-server>, "Matt Walsh"
<mwalsh1@elp.rr.com> wrote:
> The drivers work for login with Dhcp and under emx.  Our RR just
> got rid of
> login and so I don't need them any more, but it's worth it and you
> can usually
> get a free install on sale at times.

Wish they'd kill the login here.

When you were using the login, did you use the port of Phil Karn's
'rrlogin' for Toshiba Authentication, or Larkin Lowrey's "experimental"
'RROS2d' program?

-=>John Desmarais


* Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet's Discussion Network *
The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet - Free!

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: http://www.remarq.com: The World's Usenet/Discuss
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: nospam@nospam.org                                 02-Dec-99 14:04:17
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 15:58:12
Subj: Re: taskbar for connect

From: nospam@nospam.org (andrew g)

On Wed, 1 Dec 1999 10:27:37, "Jean-Michel Dossogne" < 
JeanMichel.Dossogne@advalvas.be> wrote:

> for my Warp 3 Connect machine, I search for a way to get a taskbar like the
one
> from my warp 4 machine. Any tip?
> thanks!

If you can find "Lotus Value Pack for OS/2" which is Part No. R06980, 
it contains the exact thing you want. 
Or, Object Desktop (www.stardock.com)



--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Introits and Graduals (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bv@opera.no                                       02-Dec-99 16:27:20
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 15:58:12
Subj: Re: IBM U.S. Announcement Letter

From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Bj=F8rn?= Vermo <bv@opera.no>

Philip Wright wrote:
> 
> IBM withdraws many versions of OS/2....
> 
> http://www.ibmlink.ibm.com/usalets&parms=H_999-377

This is not exactly news - those old versions have not generally
been available for many months now. This announcement just means
that any odd copies left around are not to be sold to customers any
more.

Warp 4, WSeB and WSOD have been the only current versions for a long
time now.

Had you expected a clearance sale? I think it will take some time
before you see IBM putting up garish posters with anything like:

Big SALE!! Last year's models - while they last: Everything must out
of the shelves - 80% off list price!!

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: donnelly@tampabay.rr.com                          02-Dec-99 15:34:19
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 15:58:12
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: donnelly@tampabay.rr.com (Buddy Donnelly)

On Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:42:09, Chris J Delanoy <cdelanoy@ualberta.ca> a 
crit dans un message:

>   prather@infi.net (Jerry Prather) wrote:
> 
> > :>> The problem with M$ is that they are not living by those laws.
> > :>> M$ _is_ forcing me to "eat at their restaurant".
> 
> > Lars, I was going to respond to this with a flame that you should
> > have read the rest of my post before replying so knee-jerkily,
> > but in reading other people's responses, I found that I didn't
> > have to.  Your logic flaws have been well pointed out - or is it
> > your source of income that is being identified????
> 
> Jerry, if you believe you are forced to "eat Microsoft", as it were,
> then I propose the following experiment which will show you the
> difference between production and force:  For the next year, don't
> buy or use any Microsoft products whatsoever.  That is, send the
> alleged "robber barron" Bill Gates no money whatsoever.  

That's a bizarre diversion. The true point is being ignored, that I (and 
all of us) have already paid substantial amounts of money to Micro$oft, 
directly and indirectly, that M$ fraudulently obtained. And we have no way 
of getting it back from them, because M$ has ignored all such claims just 
as they are trying to ignore Judge Jackson's finding of fact.

Unless, that is, our (US and State) governments take action on our 
collective behalf. The governments are not freebooters, they are our 
representatives. 

That's *EXACTLY* what has happened in this case, and it's a good thing they
are learning how to do it, since all major corporations are growing (by the
day) in power towards their own ultimate goals of becoming monopolies, so 
we'll be needing governments to be doing more of this work, not less, in 
future. For us, on our behalves.

(Though the kneejerk Clinton-haters are trying to say the DOJ is being used
to leverage campaign donations, somehow. Ignoring the real bugaboo: the 
adamant refusal of Senator (R-KY) Mitch McConnell, Chairman of the Senate 
Rules Committee, which oversees election law, and also Chairman of the 
National Republican Senatorial Committee, a money-dispensing office, to 
support or allow any changes to the political system's current reliance on 
fatcat donors, a system which distinctly benefits overwhelmingly the 
Republican/Corporate power axis.)


-- 

Good luck,

Buddy

Buddy Donnelly
donnelly@tampabay.rr.com


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: RoadRunner - TampaBay (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: sbritton@cadvision.com                            02-Dec-99 09:04:18
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 15:58:12
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: "Steven C. Britton" <sbritton@cadvision.com>

Bob Germer wrote:
>
> How in God's name can you claim that providing food, clothing, shelter,
> health care, etc. for the sick and disabled is bad for society?

That's not the government's responsibility.

> How in God's name can you claim providing a police force to prevent the
> dishonest from stealing, the murderous from killing, the reckless from
> inflicting harm on the public is bad for society?

That _is_ the government's responsibility.

> Name one single society since the Stone Age which functioned and survived
> in anarchy. Name one advance since the discovery of fire which occurred in
> anarchy.

The government's responsibility is to protect people from the initiation of
force.  Nothing else.

> Between you and Lars you haven't a combined IQ higher than that of my dog
> if either of you believes what you post here. If you two are typical
> Canadians, then the combined IQ of all Canada doesn't reach 100.

If you believe that, perhaps you should move here and raise the average IQ
of both countries...

... but then again, that's quite difficult for someone who causes the sum of
all IQs in a room to DROP the moment you walk into it...
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
What have YOU done to bust a union today?
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Work better: Work union-free.

Steven C. Britton
Calgary

www.cadvision.com/sbritton



--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: CADVision Development Corporation (http://www.cad
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: ktkelvin@yahoo.com                                03-Dec-99 00:15:24
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 15:58:12
Subj: Re: Connect to Host by name

From: "Kelvin Tsang" <ktkelvin@yahoo.com>

Hello Terry,

If you choose not to use DNS, then you have to create
the hosts table by using the TCP/IP Configuration,
you can find a configuration page with a tag named
something like 'Hostname Resolution' (Sorry that I
didn't have a Warp machine around at this moment.)
Just enter the hostnames and the appropriate IP and
reboot.

Actually the hosts table is located at :
x:\mptn\etc\hosts
You may take a look at it for its structure
after the configuration.

Hope this helps.
Kelvin
--
#-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-#
Hong Kong OS/2 User Group
http://www.os2.org.hk
news://news.freeforum.org/comp.os.os2
#-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-#



Terry Haimann <thaimann@dmreg.infi.net> wrote in message
news:unvznaaqzertvasvarg.fm432h0.pminews@news.dmreg.infi.net...
> I want to connect to my network host by name instead of by ip address.
Where
> do I enter this information in Warp 4.0?
>
> Thx Terry
>
>


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Still an OS/2 fan ! (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: donnelly@tampabay.rr.com                          02-Dec-99 15:46:19
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 15:58:12
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: donnelly@tampabay.rr.com (Buddy Donnelly)

On Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:51:55, Chris J Delanoy <cdelanoy@ualberta.ca> a 
crit dans un message:

>  letoured@nospam.net wrote:
> 
> > > Does Microsoft send people to force you to buy their products?
> > > Which gun is being placed at your skull?
> 
> > > Or is it a matter of Microsoft "forcing you" to buy the product
> > > by providing a valued product at an affordable rate?
> 
> > Where do you get this nonsense from?  If you read the Findings of
> > Fact, as you claim to have done, you either do not understand US
> > law and how markets are controlled
> 
> The US anti-trust laws are deliberately designed as so to be
> impossible to be objectively understood.  They are ex-post-facto,
> arbitrary, and entirely open-ended, and any "findings of fact"
> made under them do not necessarily bear any resemblance to reality
> (ie - to actual FACTS).

(Balance snipped, unread.)

Quick tip: When you're composing an argument, don't lead off with a 
bald-faced lie. This one is so silly and self-evidently made-up that it 
gives what you're saying afterward (whatever it was) very little value.

[Ya know, I think the worst thing about Rush Limbaugh is he's taught people
to use very shabby techniques for debate and argument. When you're spouting
off on a one-way medium like radio, instead of addressing real people who 
can talk back to you, you might try to say things that you don't intend to 
support with facts or, worse, intend to be unsupported by the facts, i.e., 
lies. Constructed for buffaloing people instead of convincing them.]

-- 

Good luck,

Buddy

Buddy Donnelly
donnelly@tampabay.rr.com


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: RoadRunner - TampaBay (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: donnelly@tampabay.rr.com                          02-Dec-99 15:57:27
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 15:58:12
Subj: Re: Bind Front end?

From: donnelly@tampabay.rr.com (Buddy Donnelly)

On Sun, 28 Nov 1999 17:35:34, khamlett@dgweb.com a crit dans un message:

> A while back I saw a package for use as a front end to the
> OS/2 port of Bind. Unfortunately now that I need one I can't
> even recall the name much less find it. Any hints appreciated!

I can't tell what you mean by this, but the BIND8 package contains enough 
documentation that even I was able to get it up and running very quickly.

I don't see it at Hobbes FTP but here it is in Russia:

	ftp://crydee.sai.msu.ru:/pub/.1/leo.os2/tcpip/systools/bind812a.zip


-- 

Good luck,

Buddy

Buddy Donnelly
donnelly@tampabay.rr.com


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: RoadRunner - TampaBay (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: lennart-remove-@plg.-remove-a.se                  02-Dec-99 16:27:22
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 15:58:13
Subj: Re: IBM Support for os/2

From: "Lennart Gahm" <lennart-remove-@plg.-remove-a.se>

On Thu, 02 Dec 1999 08:22:37 -0500, Bob Germer wrote:

>On <HN2tEbdbtdhk-pn2-SkUDF7V0CEPr@localhost>, on 12/01/99 at 02:42 PM,
>   rcrane@octa4.net.au (Richard A Crane) said:
>
>> On Tue, 30 Nov 1999 15:25:12, Bob Germer 
>> <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com> wrote in part:
>
>> My general mood was not improved by spending what seemed to  be an
>> exessive amount of time trying to find the IBM site  that has all the
>> y2k fixes for all parts of OS/2 Warp (base  system fix packs, device
>> driver packs, TCP/IP fix packs, are there do I need MPTS fix packs? or
>> anything else for the  stuff that to me was all part of the OS)
>
> ftp.software.ibm.com:/ps/products/os2/fixes/v4warp 

Some other directorys on that site:

MPTS:	/ps/products/mpts/fixes
tcp/ip:	/ps/products/tcpip/fixes
lan:	/ps/products/lan/fixes

For explanations what you at least should use, take a look at:
http://www-4.ibm.com/software/os/warp/solutions/and/y2000/step3.html

Lennart


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Telia Internet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: djohnson@isomedia.com                             02-Dec-99 09:08:28
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 15:58:13
Subj: Re: How do I install fixpack 11 ?

From: "David T. Johnson" <djohnson@isomedia.com>


josco wrote:
> 
> http://www.gt-online.com/~bri/fix.html
> http://members.iquest.net/~dcasey/
> (links above document how I came to this web page below)
> 
> http://www.os2voice.org/ez-reference/fixpak.html I followed the directions
> for an install off my hard drive, not floppy disks which takes too long
> while this went quickly.  It was easy. I installed FP11.
> 
> The fixpack files came from this ftp site.
>
ftp://service.software.ibm.com/ps/products/os2/fixes/v4warp/english-us/xr_m011/

> 
> My advice is to be sure to at least run chkdsk prior to the install to be
> sure not to have any disk errors.  I have my system boot with the HPFS
> automatically checking my drives.  It seems easier than booting off the
> floppies and running chkdsk.  You can modify the CONFIG.SYS file line
> where the cache is installed. You add '+' signs in front of all cached
> disks i.e. +c+d+e
> 
> OS/2 Help will give you the correct symantics -- search help for "cache"
> to see the exact syntax.  "Help cache"
> 
> After the system is okay and running you can edit and remove the forced
> chkdsk if that slows down boot time.

I suggest installing fixpack 12 rather than fixpack 11.  Fixpack 11 had
a problem with HPFS and required downleveling to fixpack 10 HPFS files
(the fix was on Hobbes.)  I download the floppy files and make the
floppyies with loaddskf.exe and then install them with the corrective
service tool from an OS/2 window.  It's a little more trouble to make
floppies than doing the RSU update but also a little more secure, imo.  


> 
> -- joseph
> 
> On Wed, 1 Dec 1999, Rime Saad wrote:
> 
> > Hello
> >
> > How do I install fixpack 11 ?  I downloaded the fixpack from the IBM FTP
> > site, and the file had the extention ".sh".  I do not know how to
> > install such a file
> >
> > Thank you
> >
> >

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: djohnson@isomedia.com                             02-Dec-99 09:49:19
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 15:58:13
Subj: Re: OS2 Dual Boot Installation Problem

From: "David T. Johnson" <djohnson@isomedia.com>


Jim Parker wrote:
> 
> Lorne Sunley wrote:
> 
> > On Wed, 1 Dec 1999 11:50:10, "Ian Dawson" <idawson@montupetuk.co.uk>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > Hi,
> > >     I have a Toshiba Satellite S300CDT (with 2.1Gb - 80Mb RAM) currently
> > > running
> > > Win 98.  I want to install OS2 as a dual boot option.
> > >
> > > After inserting the OS2 Installation Disk, an OS2 symbol appears and
after
> > > about
> > > 30 seconds of disk churning, the machine reboots and starts the whole
> > > process again.
> > >
> > > Any Ideas on whats wrong and how to fix them....
> >
> > If you are trying to use "dual boot" meaning that the OS/2
> > code is in the same partition as Windows 98, this probably
> > won't work given that Win 98 is probably using a FAT32 or
> > FAT32X partition type which OS/2 cannot read.
> >
> > The only reliable way is to use "boot manager" which
> > will require that you re-partition your disk drive to obtain
> > another partition that can be used to install OS/2
> >
> > --
> >
> > Lorne Sunley
> 
> You need to be careful with Boot Manager and FAT32. I used the Boot Manager
that
> came with Partition Magic 3.0 and which  PowerQuest got from IBM.  Later I
> installed this Boot Manager on a machine that had Win98 preinstalled in a
FAT32
> partition. It didn't handle it correctly. I went on a Partition Magic forum
and
> found that PowerQuest had a fix for the problem which I downloaded and
installed
> and this updated Boot Manager handled the FAT32 partition correctly. The
issue
> is that the Boot Manager that comes with Warp is probably the same one that
was
> originally distributed with Partition Magic and thus probably suffers from
the
> same problem. I don't know if IBM ever distributed a fix for the problem.
> 
> The symptom of the problem was that, when I booted the FAT32 (Win98) primary
> partition, the FAT  primary partition (In which I had installed DOS) was
> visible. The FAT32 partition was assigned C: and the FAT partition got
assigned
> two drive letters. One of these "drives" appeared to Win98 to be of 0 length 
and
> inaccessable while the other appeared normal. The problem, of course, is
that
> there is supposed to be only one primary partition per physical drive
visible at
> any one time. I only had two primary partitions on this drive (other than
Boot
> Manager itself) so I don't know how it would have dealt with more than two
> primaries.
> 
I have used Partition Magic 3.05 and the OS/2 v4 boot manager without
problems with FAT32 drives.  The problem you describe really sounds more
like a Partition Magic problem than a boot manager problem.  I have set
up systems with the Windows 9x on a FAT32 partition on the first
partition and OS/2 on a second logical partition.  If Windows is already
installed on the C: FAT32 partion, OS/2 will not see the FAT32 partition
and so will think it is installing on the C: drive unless you create an
additional small partition ahead of OS/2 for the install.  Then you
install OS/2 on what it thinks is now the D: partition and then install
Henk Kelder's FAT32 drivers into OS/2.  Then boot with floppies and
delete the small partition (and reclaim the space to one of the other
two large partitions).  If you've done everything correctly, OS/2 will
boot with the FAT32 drivers and will now recognize the FAT32 partition
as the C: drive and the OS/2 partition as the D: drive and OS/2 will
have read and write access to both the C and D partitions.  Windows 9x
will only see the C: drive (unless you formatted the OS/2 partition to
be FAT16--a very unwise idea IMO).  
  
> Jim

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: mktorg@hotmail.com                                03-Dec-99 01:59:01
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 15:58:13
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: Bob Davies <mktorg@hotmail.com>

Only NOW can you buy a computer without an MS DOS or Windows licence -
but it took thousands of protests and government action. If I recall
correctly the action was taken under the RESTRAINT of TRADE laws. 

Boo hoo Billy Boo hoo!

cbzh@my-deja.com wrote:
> 
> In article <822icr$ra1$1@dagger.ab.videon.ca>,
>   larso@ualberta.ca wrote:
> > As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw cbzh@my-deja.com write:
> > >   larso@ualberta.ca wrote:
> >
> > > > Does Microsoft send people to force you to buy their products?
> Which gun is
> > > > being placed at your skull?
> > > >
> > > > Or is it a matter of Microsoft "forcing you" to buy the product by
> providing
> > > > a valued product at an affordable rate?
> > >
> > > Oh, that's it: I am 100% convinced now!
> > >
> > > So I must have _willingly_ bought the two never used and never
> needed -
> > > but surely paid for! - Win95 licenses I still have somewhere around,
> > > because there was actually no gun around anywhere??!
> >
> > Well, through what mechanism did Microsoft force you to purchase the
> > product?  Where was your free choice removed?  Was your free choice
> removed
> > at the point where you wanted to usurp the free choices of others?
> >
> 
> _YOU_ should answer this question! Didn't you see that I gave you 100%
> right? I can only repeat: Neither guns nor governments were involved,
> thus no monopoly power - just following your own logic!
> 
> > > I still cannot see why I should have spent money for these licenses,
> but
> > > maybe I still wanted them unconsciously?? Or it was in a moment that
> I
> > > felt some kind of pity with poor Billy boy and I just wanted to make
> a
> > > free donation for him???
> >
> > Well, why did you pay the fucking money?
> >
> 
> Strange thing, isn't it? People are donating money to a company that
> neither forces them with guns nor being supported by a government? Once
> on your own line of argumentation, I don't see any solution to this
> question!
> 
> > > Still not understanding my motivation thus - but it was sure no
> monopoly
> > > power that was forcing me - "because monopolies are always imposed
> by
> > > governments" (never contradict the Ormberg dogma!), and our
> government
> > > sure would have allowed selling computers without Windows
> licenses!!!
> >
> > You can sell a computer without Windows licences.
> >
> > I helped a friend set such a machine up less than a week ago.
> >
> 
> Sure I can, if I am ready to pay the extra cost: I can just buy the
> Toshiba notebook that fits my needs best, format the HD and throw the
> Windows CD immediately in the trash can! This doesn't change the fact
> that I have paid for a Windows license that way!
> 
> Cornelis Bockemhl <cbockem@datacomm.ch>
> 
> > --
> > Lars P. Ormberg     ICQ#:8827066
> > mailto:larso@ualberta.ca
> > The University of Lars:   http://www.ualberta.ca/~larso/
> >
> > "The way you're bathed in light, reminds me of that night
> > God laid me down into your rose garden of trust and I was
> > swept away with nothin' left to say some helpless fool
> > yeah I was lost in a swoon of peace you're all I need to
> > find so when the time is right come to me sweetly, come
> > to me come to me..love will lead us, alright.  love will
> > lead us, she will lead us.  can you hear the dolphin's
> > cry?  see the road rise up to meet us its in the air we
> > breathe tonight love will lead us, she will lead us"
> >                             -Live, "The Dolphin's Cry"
> >
> 
> Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
> Before you buy.

-- 
Bob Davies

Socialism is about the equal distribution of poverty!
Learn about Socialism - everyone needs a laugh!
http://www.worldsocialism.org/

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Marketing One! (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: siberREMOVETHIS@sympatico.ca                      02-Dec-99 18:14:00
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 15:58:13
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: siberREMOVETHIS@sympatico.ca (E. Barry Bruyea)

On Fri, 03 Dec 1999 01:59:03 +0800, Bob Davies <mktorg@hotmail.com>
wrote:

>Only NOW can you buy a computer without an MS DOS or Windows licence -
>but it took thousands of protests and government action. If I recall
>correctly the action was taken under the RESTRAINT of TRADE laws. 

That, my friend, is a crock.  When I bought my first PC I had a choice
of CPM, MS-Dos or PC-Dos.  As a matter of fact, I chose CPM at the
time and it wasn't until two years later that I went to MS-Dos with
the purchase of a new computer...and it was my choice.

>Boo hoo Billy Boo hoo!
>
>cbzh@my-deja.com wrote:
>> 
>> In article <822icr$ra1$1@dagger.ab.videon.ca>,
>>   larso@ualberta.ca wrote:
>> > As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw cbzh@my-deja.com write:
>> > >   larso@ualberta.ca wrote:
>> >
>> > > > Does Microsoft send people to force you to buy their products?
>> Which gun is
>> > > > being placed at your skull?
>> > > >
>> > > > Or is it a matter of Microsoft "forcing you" to buy the product by
>> providing
>> > > > a valued product at an affordable rate?
>> > >
>> > > Oh, that's it: I am 100% convinced now!
>> > >
>> > > So I must have _willingly_ bought the two never used and never
>> needed -
>> > > but surely paid for! - Win95 licenses I still have somewhere around,
>> > > because there was actually no gun around anywhere??!
>> >
>> > Well, through what mechanism did Microsoft force you to purchase the
>> > product?  Where was your free choice removed?  Was your free choice
>> removed
>> > at the point where you wanted to usurp the free choices of others?
>> >
>> 
>> _YOU_ should answer this question! Didn't you see that I gave you 100%
>> right? I can only repeat: Neither guns nor governments were involved,
>> thus no monopoly power - just following your own logic!
>> 
>> > > I still cannot see why I should have spent money for these licenses,
>> but
>> > > maybe I still wanted them unconsciously?? Or it was in a moment that
>> I
>> > > felt some kind of pity with poor Billy boy and I just wanted to make
>> a
>> > > free donation for him???
>> >
>> > Well, why did you pay the fucking money?
>> >
>> 
>> Strange thing, isn't it? People are donating money to a company that
>> neither forces them with guns nor being supported by a government? Once
>> on your own line of argumentation, I don't see any solution to this
>> question!
>> 
>> > > Still not understanding my motivation thus - but it was sure no
>> monopoly
>> > > power that was forcing me - "because monopolies are always imposed
>> by
>> > > governments" (never contradict the Ormberg dogma!), and our
>> government
>> > > sure would have allowed selling computers without Windows
>> licenses!!!
>> >
>> > You can sell a computer without Windows licences.
>> >
>> > I helped a friend set such a machine up less than a week ago.
>> >
>> 
>> Sure I can, if I am ready to pay the extra cost: I can just buy the
>> Toshiba notebook that fits my needs best, format the HD and throw the
>> Windows CD immediately in the trash can! This doesn't change the fact
>> that I have paid for a Windows license that way!
>> 
>> Cornelis Bockemhl <cbockem@datacomm.ch>
>> 
>> > --
>> > Lars P. Ormberg     ICQ#:8827066
>> > mailto:larso@ualberta.ca
>> > The University of Lars:   http://www.ualberta.ca/~larso/
>> >
>> > "The way you're bathed in light, reminds me of that night
>> > God laid me down into your rose garden of trust and I was
>> > swept away with nothin' left to say some helpless fool
>> > yeah I was lost in a swoon of peace you're all I need to
>> > find so when the time is right come to me sweetly, come
>> > to me come to me..love will lead us, alright.  love will
>> > lead us, she will lead us.  can you hear the dolphin's
>> > cry?  see the road rise up to meet us its in the air we
>> > breathe tonight love will lead us, she will lead us"
>> >                             -Live, "The Dolphin's Cry"
>> >
>> 
>> Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
>> Before you buy.
>
>-- 
>Bob Davies
>
>Socialism is about the equal distribution of poverty!
>Learn about Socialism - everyone needs a laugh!
>http://www.worldsocialism.org/

EBB

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Sympatico (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: djohnson@isomedia.com                             02-Dec-99 09:33:21
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 15:58:13
Subj: Re: Switching drives - how?

From: "David T. Johnson" <djohnson@isomedia.com>


lifedata@xxvol.com wrote:
> 
> How can I change my second physical hard drive to first?
> 
> I unplugged the first drive and made the hardware changes to jumpers, etc.
> My OS/2 boot partition is on this drive and when I set it up I put a
> primary partition on the beginning so it could hold the boot manager when I
> moved it.
> 
> But when I booted it up, it still had the same drive letter and the C:
> drive and it's partitions were just not there.  I'm back in my original
> configuration now.  What do I need to do to get this drive in first
> position?
> 
OS/2 makes the primary partition on the first physical drive the C:
drive and the primary partition on the second physical drive the D:
drive.  Then, it makes a second logical partition on the first physical
drive the E: drive and so on.  If you are using IDE drives, the master
drive on the primary channel will be the first physical drive.  A slave
drive or a drive on the secondary channel will be the second physical
drive.  Now, if you physically reverse the drives (and change the
jumpers on the drives if necessary), the primary partition on what used
to be the second physical drive will now be the C: drive and what used
to be the primary partition on the former first physical drive will now
be the D: drive.  If OS/2 was installed on a partition that it was
calling the D: drive, it will not boot if that same partition has become
the C: drive by reversing the position of the physical drives.  If you
moved the second drive to be first and it still booted up as the D:
drive, there must have been another partition that OS/2 was recognizing
as the C: partition.  There are three possibilities:  1) You didn't
really get the drive postion changed like you intended.  The cable
position isn't the determining factor.  2) You used FDISK to assign the
former first drive as the C: drive, 3) You are using a boot filter like
the PARTFILT program that Henk Kelder distributes in his Windows FAT32
IFS drivers to arbitrarily assign the drive letters.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: jglatt@spamgone-borg.com                          02-Dec-99 21:08:22
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 16:42:03
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: jglatt@spamgone-borg.com (Jeff Glatt)

>Bob Germer
>Try buying an Intel based computer without paying
>for Windows.

I do it all of the time. But that's because I'm clearly MUCH more
competent than a phony like you who lies about his alleged experience
in setting up and maintaining computers

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: doug.bissett"at"attglobal.net                     02-Dec-99 19:54:13
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 16:42:03
Subj: Re: New modem list

From: doug.bissett"at"attglobal.net (Doug Bissett)

On Wed, 1 Dec 1999 22:52:04, rgibson@ix.netcom.com (Ron Gibson) wrote:

> Actually you can tweak performance a bit.  IMO, the ideal connection is
> V90 ARQ.  You don't need compression on large downloads of compressed
> files as they are already compressed.  Graphics compression rates are
> very low. 
> 
> Also with 3COM modems AT$, AT&$ and ATS$ will give you all the modem
> commands when invoked from a comm app such as ZOC, Telix, Qmodem, etc.
> 
>                       email: rgibson@ix.netcom.com
> 

Actually, I heard that myth some time ago, but I don't believe it. 
TRUE, files that are already compressed don't benefit from modem 
compression, and TRUE that most graphics are already compressed. NOT 
TRUE that you don't benefit from modem compression (upload, or 
download). MOST of the text that gets downloaded is NOT compressed, 
and modem compression makes a significant difference with that (not to
mention that there are a few sites that don't compress files, even ZIP
files don't have to be compressed, and email, and news groups, are not
compressed). Turning off compression does NOT really speed up 
downloading of compressed files either (perhaps a very small 
improvevment, but not nearly enough to make up for the losses by not 
compressing text data). 

I suggest getting the IPSPEED program, which graphicaly demonstrates 
what is happening (on a TCP/IP connection). You should be able to find
it at one of the "usual" places.

Hope this helps...
******************************
From the PC of Doug Bissett
doug.bissett at attglobal.net
The " at " must be changed to "@"
******************************

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Global Network Services - Remote Access Mail & Ne
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: pvwrght@attglobal.net                             02-Dec-99 15:02:17
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 16:42:03
Subj: Re: IBM U.S. Announcement Letter

From: pvwrght@attglobal.net

Actually, Bjorn it is news. It is an official announcement from
IBM regarding a large and important base of installed software.
That is sort of the definition of news. For those of us who
have corporate accounts using the software listed , we can go
to the IT managers and say: "The software that you are using has
been officially withdrawn by IBM. Do you wan't to start making
plans to upgrade or replace it?". An official withdrawal by IBM
still carries a lot of weight with IT professionals, so I would
call it news for OS/2 people. That's why I posted it.

Sincerely,
Philip Wright

Bjrn Vermo wrote:

> This is not exactly news - those old versions have not generally
> been available for many months now. This announcement just means
> that any odd copies left around are not to be sold to customers any
> more.
> 
> Warp 4, WSeB and WSOD have been the only current versions for a long
> time now.
> 
> Had you expected a clearance sale? I think it will take some time
> before you see IBM putting up garish posters with anything like:
> 
> Big SALE!! Last year's models - while they last: Everything must out
> of the shelves - 80% off list price!!

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Global Network Services - Remote Access Mail & Ne
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: mktorg@hotmail.com                                03-Dec-99 04:50:22
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 16:42:03
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: Bob Davies <mktorg@hotmail.com>

Barry:

I agree with you - early on you had the choice. But there was a
significant period of time when distributors were forced to supply a MS
operating system when they sold a system.

"E. Barry Bruyea" wrote:
> 
> On Fri, 03 Dec 1999 01:59:03 +0800, Bob Davies <mktorg@hotmail.com>
> wrote:
> 
> >Only NOW can you buy a computer without an MS DOS or Windows licence -
> >but it took thousands of protests and government action. If I recall
> >correctly the action was taken under the RESTRAINT of TRADE laws.
> 
> That, my friend, is a crock.  When I bought my first PC I had a choice
> of CPM, MS-Dos or PC-Dos.  As a matter of fact, I chose CPM at the
> time and it wasn't until two years later that I went to MS-Dos with
> the purchase of a new computer...and it was my choice.
> 
> >Boo hoo Billy Boo hoo!
> >
> >cbzh@my-deja.com wrote:
> >>
> >> In article <822icr$ra1$1@dagger.ab.videon.ca>,
> >>   larso@ualberta.ca wrote:
> >> > As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw cbzh@my-deja.com write:
> >> > >   larso@ualberta.ca wrote:
> >> >
> >> > > > Does Microsoft send people to force you to buy their products?
> >> Which gun is
> >> > > > being placed at your skull?
> >> > > >
> >> > > > Or is it a matter of Microsoft "forcing you" to buy the product by
> >> providing
> >> > > > a valued product at an affordable rate?
> >> > >
> >> > > Oh, that's it: I am 100% convinced now!
> >> > >
> >> > > So I must have _willingly_ bought the two never used and never
> >> needed -
> >> > > but surely paid for! - Win95 licenses I still have somewhere around,
> >> > > because there was actually no gun around anywhere??!
> >> >
> >> > Well, through what mechanism did Microsoft force you to purchase the
> >> > product?  Where was your free choice removed?  Was your free choice
> >> removed
> >> > at the point where you wanted to usurp the free choices of others?
> >> >
> >>
> >> _YOU_ should answer this question! Didn't you see that I gave you 100%
> >> right? I can only repeat: Neither guns nor governments were involved,
> >> thus no monopoly power - just following your own logic!
> >>
> >> > > I still cannot see why I should have spent money for these licenses,
> >> but
> >> > > maybe I still wanted them unconsciously?? Or it was in a moment that
> >> I
> >> > > felt some kind of pity with poor Billy boy and I just wanted to make
> >> a
> >> > > free donation for him???
> >> >
> >> > Well, why did you pay the fucking money?
> >> >
> >>
> >> Strange thing, isn't it? People are donating money to a company that
> >> neither forces them with guns nor being supported by a government? Once
> >> on your own line of argumentation, I don't see any solution to this
> >> question!
> >>
> >> > > Still not understanding my motivation thus - but it was sure no
> >> monopoly
> >> > > power that was forcing me - "because monopolies are always imposed
> >> by
> >> > > governments" (never contradict the Ormberg dogma!), and our
> >> government
> >> > > sure would have allowed selling computers without Windows
> >> licenses!!!
> >> >
> >> > You can sell a computer without Windows licences.
> >> >
> >> > I helped a friend set such a machine up less than a week ago.
> >> >
> >>
> >> Sure I can, if I am ready to pay the extra cost: I can just buy the
> >> Toshiba notebook that fits my needs best, format the HD and throw the
> >> Windows CD immediately in the trash can! This doesn't change the fact
> >> that I have paid for a Windows license that way!
> >>
> >> Cornelis Bockemhl <cbockem@datacomm.ch>
> >>
> >> > --
> >> > Lars P. Ormberg     ICQ#:8827066
> >> > mailto:larso@ualberta.ca
> >> > The University of Lars:   http://www.ualberta.ca/~larso/
> >> >
> >> > "The way you're bathed in light, reminds me of that night
> >> > God laid me down into your rose garden of trust and I was
> >> > swept away with nothin' left to say some helpless fool
> >> > yeah I was lost in a swoon of peace you're all I need to
> >> > find so when the time is right come to me sweetly, come
> >> > to me come to me..love will lead us, alright.  love will
> >> > lead us, she will lead us.  can you hear the dolphin's
> >> > cry?  see the road rise up to meet us its in the air we
> >> > breathe tonight love will lead us, she will lead us"
> >> >                             -Live, "The Dolphin's Cry"
> >> >
> >>
> >> Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
> >> Before you buy.
> >
> >--
> >Bob Davies
> >
> >Socialism is about the equal distribution of poverty!
> >Learn about Socialism - everyone needs a laugh!
> >http://www.worldsocialism.org/
> 
> EBB

-- 
Bob Davies

Socialism is about the equal distribution of poverty!
Learn about Socialism - everyone needs a laugh!
http://www.worldsocialism.org/

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Marketing One! (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: nospam@savebandwidth.invalid                      02-Dec-99 17:49:29
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 16:42:03
Subj: Re: Connect to Host by name

From: nospam@savebandwidth.invalid       (John Thompson)

In <unvznaaqzertvasvarg.fm432h0.pminews@news.dmreg.infi.net>, "Terry Haimann"
<thaimann@dmreg.infi.net> writes:

>I want to connect to my network host by name instead of by ip address.  Where
>do I enter this information in Warp 4.0?

put it in your etc/hosts file.  Eg:

192.168.0.2     starfleet     starfleet.attglobal.net

allows me to connect to my linux machine over the LAN by using 
"startfleet" as the hostname.


-John (John.Thompson@attglobal.net)

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: The Crimson Permanent Assurance (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rgibson@ix.netcom.com                             02-Dec-99 21:01:25
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 16:42:03
Subj: Re: New modem list

From: rgibson@ix.netcom.com (Ron Gibson)

On Thu, 2 Dec 1999 19:54:26, doug.bissett"at"attglobal.net (Doug Bissett) 
wrote:

> > Actually you can tweak performance a bit.  IMO, the ideal connection is
> > V90 ARQ.  You don't need compression on large downloads of compressed
> > files as they are already compressed.  Graphics compression rates are
> > very low. 
 
> > Also with 3COM modems AT$, AT&$ and ATS$ will give you all the modem
> > commands when invoked from a comm app such as ZOC, Telix, Qmodem, etc.
  
> Actually, I heard that myth some time ago, but I don't believe it. 

No it's true. I'm serious! My modem tells me it's commands :-)

> TRUE, files that are already compressed don't benefit from modem 
> compression, and TRUE that most graphics are already compressed. NOT 
> TRUE that you don't benefit from modem compression (upload, or 
> download). MOST of the text that gets downloaded is NOT compressed, 
> and modem compression makes a significant difference with that (not to

> I suggest getting the IPSPEED program, which graphicaly demonstrates 
> what is happening (on a TCP/IP connection). You should be able to find
> it at one of the "usual" places.

OK.  I'll take a look... 

                      email: rgibson@ix.netcom.com

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: MindSpring Enterprises (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: donnelly@tampabay.rr.com                          02-Dec-99 20:39:04
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 19:45:01
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: donnelly@tampabay.rr.com (Buddy Donnelly)

On Thu, 2 Dec 1999 15:54:31, "Steven C. Britton" 
<sbritton@cadvision.com> wrote:

snip
> What have YOU done to bust a union today?
> 
> Work better: Work union-free.

Right. Just in time for the "New Millennium", let's get right back to 
a hellish Blakeian world of:

	1. Child labour
	2. 66-hour work weeks
	3. Paid at piecework
	4. No job-related injuries (or deaths) compensated
	5. Lockdown factories (remember Triangle Shirtwaist Company?)
	6. No light, heat, or ventilation in the workplace.
	7. Exposure to toxic liquids, solids, and atmospheres.
	8. Random strip searches for stolen company property.
	9. Payment by credit to company store accounts instead of cash.
	10. Zero rights to the value added to raw materials by dangerous 
	and difficult physical efforts.

And a long list of other improvements on the natural exploitation and 
sub-human treatment those Dashing Bold Mustachioed Capitalist 
employers of yours will use, whenever allowed, untrammelled by law or 
the evil of simple Collective Bargaining, on the class of sad 
disadvantaged peasants who have to come to work in their factories to 
put a daily scrap of bread on their families' tables.

-- 

Good luck,

Buddy

Buddy Donnelly
donnelly@tampabay.rr.com


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: RoadRunner - TampaBay (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: sbritton@cadvision.com                            02-Dec-99 15:51:26
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 19:45:01
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: "Steven C. Britton" <sbritton@cadvision.com>

Buddy Donnelly wrote:
>
> Right. Just in time for the "New Millennium", let's get right back to
> a hellish Blakeian world of:

<list of issued unrelated to unionism deleted>

> And a long list of other improvements on the natural exploitation and
> sub-human treatment those Dashing Bold Mustachioed Capitalist
> employers of yours will use, whenever allowed, untrammelled by law or
> the evil of simple Collective Bargaining, on the class of sad
> disadvantaged peasants who have to come to work in their factories to
> put a daily scrap of bread on their families' tables.

All of these issues are totally unrelated to unionism.  Unions do not
effectively prevent these things from happening.

All unions do is create an environment of mediocrity and laziness; and pay
the union bosses big bucks to create havoc.

The real truth is that companies that DON'T have unions have better, more
productive workforces, higher wages, and treat their employees better.  If I
owned a corporation, I would do whatever I could to keep a union OUT of my
company.  If one formed, I would do whatever I could to get it decertified.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
What have YOU done to bust a union today?
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Work better: Work union-free.

Steven C. Britton
Calgary

www.cadvision.com/sbritton



--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: CADVision Development Corporation (http://www.cad
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: OS2Guy@WarpCity.com                               02-Dec-99 15:00:13
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 19:45:01
Subj: Re: Software Choice

From: Tim Martin <OS2Guy@WarpCity.com>

John Brock wrote:

> In article <38466B94.389536E1@canoemail.com>,
> James Stotz  <jstotz@canoemail.com> wrote:
> >I know that Software Choice will become a pay for use for all new
> >updates and applications, but is IBM going to keep current versions of
> >Netscape/2 and Java avaliable for free.  If not, new OS/2 buyers will
> >not be able to get any Netscape without forking out more money.  Also,
> >We'd all better download everything and save it in a safe place.
>
> I am hoping for a refresh of NS 4.61 like there was with NS 2.02.
> (There seems to be a bug in NS 4.61 which causes CPU usage to shoot to
> 100 percent and download speed to slow to a crawl on many web pages).
> Would a refresh of a currently free product still be free?
> --
> John Brock
> jbrock@panix.com

Jeffrey Kobal of the IBM Netscape team reported in a public message
that a a fixpak for Communicator v4.61 will be released AFTER January
2000 but there is a slight chance it may be released in mid-December.
And it will be free!

He added, "you won't have to pay to get fixpacks even after the
new year. Software Choice distributes whole software packages,
not fixpacks...

The above was reported to all members of Warp City on Saturday,
November 13th.  Just one of the many tidbits we keep track of
for our members.

Tim Martin
The OS/2 Guy
Warp City
http://warpcity.com
"1999 Members!  Re-Up Today!"





--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Warp City (http://warpcity.com) (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: haa@mail1.stofanet.dk                             02-Dec-99 21:32:13
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 19:45:01
Subj: Re: Road Runner and Warp

From: Henrik Aaen <haa@mail1.stofanet.dk>

John Desmarais wrote:
> 
> Hey, is anybody here using Time Warner's Road Runner cable system as
> their ISP in either Ohio or North Carolina?  I'm trying to find out how
> difficult it will be to set up before I start spending money.
> 
> I specify Ohio and NC because some of Road Runner's regions have done
> away with their authentication system, but NC Triad Region (where I
> live) hasn't.  The NC-Triad branch is new, so I doubt I'll find anyone
> using OS/2 with it, but they use the same connection manager has the
> Northern Ohio region (which also has not done away with the DEC
> authentication system they use).
> 
> -=>John Desmarais
> 
> * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet's Discussion Network *
> The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet - Free!

Try this: http://home1.stofanet.dk/haa/itrafic.htm
Henrik Aaen

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Customer at Telia Danmark (http://www.telia.dk/) (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rgibson@ix.netcom.com                             02-Dec-99 21:34:03
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 19:45:01
Subj: Netscape/Win version locks VDM session

From: rgibson@ix.netcom.com (Ron Gibson)

Well I finally found a version of Netscape/W31 that will run on my
system. Previously, every version had some sort of strange problem.

This is version 4.08 for W31, stand alone. 

But there is still a problem.  It opens, displays pages fine but after
I close it the WIN-OS/2 session freezes requiring me to kill it with
WatchCat.  I'm trying to get some Win Plugins to work.  Anybody got any
suggestions?

BTW, Warp 3, FP 40, Java RT 1.18, GRADD .8 drivers.

                      email: rgibson@ix.netcom.com


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: MindSpring Enterprises (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: isaacl@bulls.ece.ubc.ca                           02-Dec-99 21:47:25
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 19:45:01
Subj: Re: IBM U.S. Announcement Letter

From: isaacl@bulls.ece.ubc.ca (e-frog)

Not to belabour the point, but I agree with Bjorn. This isn't really news.
IBM has said that these would be withdrawn over a year ago. That was the
warning to all IT managers "We will stop selling and supporting THIS piece
of software on THIS date"

This announcement letter (which I also received), merely says that it now
has been done "Okay, we are stopping sales and support NOW, as we told you
many moons ago."

Any IT personnel worth his/her salt (no insult intended) should have known
this was coming a long, long time ago and should have known it was time to
at least plan on moving on to Warp 4 or WSEB over a year ago. Not now.

This is one part I do like about IBM, they support older stuff for long,
long periods of time (support for Win95 ran out waay before even Warp 3),
they provide sufficient time warning of withdrawal for support and provide
a recommended (if not desired) upgrade path. I do not get this with _any_
of the Windows s/w vendors.


Isaac

pvwrght@attglobal.net wrote:
: Actually, Bjorn it is news. It is an official announcement from
: IBM regarding a large and important base of installed software.
: That is sort of the definition of news. For those of us who
: have corporate accounts using the software listed , we can go
: to the IT managers and say: "The software that you are using has
: been officially withdrawn by IBM. Do you wan't to start making
: plans to upgrade or replace it?". An official withdrawal by IBM
: still carries a lot of weight with IT professionals, so I would
: call it news for OS/2 people. That's why I posted it.

: Sincerely,
: Philip Wright

: Bjrn Vermo wrote:

: > This is not exactly news - those old versions have not generally
: > been available for many months now. This announcement just means
: > that any odd copies left around are not to be sold to customers any
: > more.
: > 
: > Warp 4, WSeB and WSOD have been the only current versions for a long
: > time now.
: > 
: > Had you expected a clearance sale? I think it will take some time
: > before you see IBM putting up garish posters with anything like:
: > 
: > Big SALE!! Last year's models - while they last: Everything must out
: > of the shelves - 80% off list price!!

--
_____________________________________________________________________________
<INSERT YOUR OWN CLEVER SAYING HERE>

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: ITServices, University of British Columbia (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: lifedata@xxvol.com                                02-Dec-99 16:16:19
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 19:45:01
Subj: Re: Switching drives - how?

From: lifedata@xxvol.com

"David T. Johnson" <djohnson@isomedia.com> said:

>the C: drive by reversing the position of the physical drives.  If you
>moved the second drive to be first and it still booted up as the D: drive,
>there must have been another partition that OS/2 was recognizing as the C:
>partition. 

As a matter of fact there were two logical drives on the old 1st physical
drive, making the first drive on the 2nd physical drive E:.  While
switched, the (old 2nd phys) drive now become the new 1st phys drive still
displayed E:.  Jumpers on the new 1st phys drive were set identical
(electrically) to the old 1st phys drive.

Would the second point:

2) You used FDISK to assign the former first drive as the C: drive,

apply to this case?

If so, does that mean merely going into FDISK and renaming it will suffice?

Jim L
Remove XX from address to Email
Crooks and kooks will get guns regardless of laws.


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: bCandid - Powering the world's discussions - http
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: donnelly@tampabay.rr.com                          02-Dec-99 23:07:28
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 20:44:17
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: donnelly@tampabay.rr.com (Buddy Donnelly)

On Thu, 2 Dec 1999 22:51:52, "Steven C. Britton" 
<sbritton@cadvision.com> wrote:
snipsies


> All unions do is create an environment of mediocrity and laziness; 

Had a look lately at the mind-numbing mediocrity of network TeeVee, 
and the the vacuous, surface-appeal products cramming your favorite 
local Consumerism Merchandise Store?



> and pay the union bosses big bucks to create havoc.

Had a look lately at the phenomenal jump in compensation being paid to
the Corporate Geniuses at the top of the food chain?


In the words of little Oblio, "We see what we want to see, and we hear
what we want to hear." 

Neither the workers, nor the unions who represent a few of them, are 
responsible for the mountain of exploitative shit that is being poured
on the heads of the "industrialized" North American civilization. But 
the police riot you might have seen a little of in Seattle is proof 
that the corporate powers will do anything, constitutional or not, to 
stomp any little effort to object to it, or to try to influence it for
the human good, into the ground.


But don't bother responding to my note, here. Go and seek out Philip 
"Nike" Knight, who must be a longlost spiritual brother, who has built
a $6.47 billion empire using expendable Asian women to glue together 
pieces of rubber into shoes they kill for in de ghetto, without 
benefit of a single bit of union "interference".



-- 

Good luck,

Buddy

Buddy Donnelly
donnelly@tampabay.rr.com


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: RoadRunner - TampaBay (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: sbritton@cadvision.com                            02-Dec-99 16:43:07
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 20:44:17
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: "Steven C. Britton" <sbritton@cadvision.com>

Buddy Donnelly wrote:
>
> > All unions do is create an environment of mediocrity and laziness;
>
> Had a look lately at the mind-numbing mediocrity of network TeeVee,
> and the the vacuous, surface-appeal products cramming your favorite
> local Consumerism Merchandise Store?

If people are willing to buy such garbage, then people will produce it.

They will produce it efficiently, I might add.  Competition breeds
efficiency.

Unions bring quality and efficency down to the lowest common denominator
because people are not encouraged to do a good job for fear of making
everyone else look bad.

> > and pay the union bosses big bucks to create havoc.
>
> Had a look lately at the phenomenal jump in compensation being paid to
> the Corporate Geniuses at the top of the food chain?

The "Corporate Geniuses" at the top of the "food chain", as you put it are
there and get paid the big bucks because it's their necks on the line if the
corporation fails: they're the ones who carry the greatest financial risk:
and the fundamental law of risk-taking is that the higher the risk, the
bigger the reward.

Union bosses, on the other hand, don't lose their $100K salaries when the
"workers" go out on strike; they just drive their BMWs to the picket line,
make a little speech, give a media interview with the cheering rentamob
behind them, get back in their BMW and drive to their next event.

Unions aren't for the "workers" any more -- they're political activist
groups trying to ram ridiculous collectivist, socialistic, and totalitarian
practises down the throats of those who REALLY work hard.

> Neither the workers, nor the unions who represent a few of them, are
> responsible for the mountain of exploitative shit that is being poured
> on the heads of the "industrialized" North American civilization.

There is no "mountain of exploitative shit", as you call it.  The first
mistake you make is creating the acrimony between the "workers" and
management.  You don't seem to recognize that management IS work.  The
second mistake you make is that you assume that there is some Big Brother
pointing a gun at workers' heads saying "you WILL work here, or I will shoot
you"; which just doens't happen.

Don't like the job?  Find a better one!

> But  the police riot you might have seen a little of in Seattle is proof
> that the corporate powers will do anything, constitutional or not, to
> stomp any little effort to object to it, or to try to influence it for
> the human good, into the ground.

If the collectivists hadn't rioted, the police would have let them have
their little protest.  Their ideological bankruptcy notwithstanding...

> But don't bother responding to my note, here. Go and seek out Philip
> "Nike" Knight, who must be a longlost spiritual brother, who has built
> a $6.47 billion empire using expendable Asian women to glue together
> pieces of rubber into shoes they kill for in de ghetto, without
> benefit of a single bit of union "interference".

You forget, however, that some places have lower costs of living than
others, and as such, while people don't get paid as much, the VALUE of what
they get paid is equivalent relative to the cost of living.  Eventually,
these "expendable Asian women" as you call them (which, right now, AREN'T
"expendable", or Nike wouldn't be employing them) will be replaced by
automation; like most unskilled labour.

But the bottom line is this: don't like Nike?  DON'T BUY THE FREAKING SHOE!
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
What have YOU done to bust a union today?
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Work better: Work union-free.

Steven C. Britton
Calgary

www.cadvision.com/sbritton



--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: CADVision Development Corporation (http://www.cad
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: larso@commodore.                                  03-Dec-99 00:43:20
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 20:44:17
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg)

As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw Bob Germer write:
>    larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) said:
> 
> 
> > Time to ask a simple question: how does this monopoly keep a competitor
> > from forming.  All that is needed is a mechanism.
> 
> A monopoly as defined by US law is a company so dominant in its industry
> segment that it can force its will on virtually the entire market segment.

So how, exactly, does Microsoft force its will?

Here's a hint, US LAW DEFINING MONOPOLIES is the entire problem!  I'm not
trying to argue that MS is acting legally, but rather that its actions
should never have been illegal in the first place.

> MS forces computer buyers to pay for Windows whether the customer wants to
> or not.

MS doesn't force computer buyers to do anything.  Microsoft sells its code.
People buy it.  This is called a free exchange.

> A monopoly as defined in US law is a company which can set prices
> regardless of actual cost or value.  Microsoft still charges the same price
> for its products as the day they were released.

Why haven't they skyrocketed?  Why doesn't Microsoft charge $4.4 million
dollars (or all your income, whichever comes first) for each copy?

> A monopoly as defined in US law is a company which can force competitors
> out of business

Again, Microsoft can't stop a competitor from existing.  They can't have
them arrested or anything.

Netscape can, of course.

> A monopoly under US law is a company which can force third parties to
> conform to its will

Again, all MS can do is sign a contract.

-- 
Lars P. Ormberg     ICQ#:8827066
mailto:larso@ualberta.ca
The University of Lars:   http://www.ualberta.ca/~larso/

"The way you're bathed in light, reminds me of that night
God laid me down into your rose garden of trust and I was
swept away with nothin' left to say some helpless fool
yeah I was lost in a swoon of peace you're all I need to
find so when the time is right come to me sweetly, come
to me come to me..love will lead us, alright.  love will
lead us, she will lead us.  can you hear the dolphin's
cry?  see the road rise up to meet us its in the air we
breathe tonight love will lead us, she will lead us"
                            -Live, "The Dolphin's Cry"

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: PowerSurfr - High Speed Internet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: OS2Guy@WarpCity.com                               02-Dec-99 14:47:04
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 20:44:17
Subj: Re: PGP and Netscape mail

From: Tim Martin <OS2Guy@WarpCity.com>

"Roberto F. Salomon" wrote:

> I know this has been discussed before, but is there a way to have Netscape
> use PGP for encryption?

Yes.  William H. Geiger III offers all the information, instructions
and guides for PGP 5.0i GA

You can download PGP 5.0i GA for OS/2 (International Version)
from his site (pgp50ios2.zip) or PGP 5.0 GA for OS/2 (USA Version
[uses RSAREF lib]) (pgp50os2.zip)

PGP for OS/2 requires the lattest EMX runtime be installed.
( emxrt.zip - available at Hobbes)

Bill's url is here:

http://www.openpgp.net/getpgp.html

Tim Martin
The OS/2 Guy
Warp City
http://warpcity.com
(1999 WC Members Need To ReUP Today)


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Warp City (http://warpcity.com) (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: postmaster@[127.0.0.1]                            02-Dec-99 18:33:15
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 20:44:17
Subj: Re: Software Choice

From: postmaster@[127.0.0.1]

In <3846FA0A.8B73BCAA@WarpCity.com>, on 12/02/99 
   at 03:00 PM, Tim Martin <OS2Guy@WarpCity.com> said:

>He added, "you won't have to pay to get fixpacks even after the new year.
>Software Choice distributes whole software packages, not fixpacks...

Good news.  I'll be able to keep up with the fixpacks until I can swing a
Software Choice membership.

Is it really only $100 a year?

--
GK
            
FrodoJRR at Interaccess dot com
OS/2 Version 4.00 FixPack 12 
There are 29 Processes with 118 Threads.
This machine's uptime is 0d 20h 20m 59s 398ms.


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: domi@kenavo.NOSPAM.fi                             02-Dec-99 17:23:11
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 20:44:17
Subj: Re: digital cameras

From: domi@kenavo.NOSPAM.fi (Dominique Pivard)

On Thu, 2 Dec 1999 00:48:56, jhimmel@i-2000.com (James Himmelman) 
wrote:
> 
> > We are thinking of maybe getting a digital camera if it is cheap enough,
> > and of course works with OS/2. Any suggestion/urls that I can look into?
> 
> Or, you could get a Desktop PCMCIA card 
> reader, then you could buy ANY camera and read the card in OS/2. 
> That's what I did. serial transfers are SLOW! You will eventually want
> a card reader anyway. 

I second this: I have a laptop and I bought a SmartMedia to PCMCIA 
adapter for $39.90. It took me some time to get it to work under OS/2 
(thanks James for your help!) but it's now so much faster and more 
reliable than a serial transfer and it eliminates the need for a 
cable. The price of the adapter was about the same as the registration
fee for DCITU (which I initially purchased). I'm much happier with the
PCMCIA solution.

Dominique

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: None!! (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: Tim Stephen@CIOS.ORG                              03-Dec-99 00:26:04
  To: All                                               02-Dec-99 20:44:17
Subj: CIRRUS LOGIC cl-gdM30 or is is cl-gdN30 ??

From: Tim Stephen@CIOS.ORG (Tim Stephen)

    The DUAL-SMP GW2K machine we just bought has built in video which is
very slow for PM applications.  The built in video apparently uses
either the cirrus logic cl-gdm30 or cl-gdn30 chip set, which are
supported out of the box by WSeB (our OS).  I'm having trouble finding a
replacement PCI-type video board for this machine.  Of course if it
would be possible somehow to speed up the PM video, that would be great.
Any suggestions?

Thanks.

Tim Stephen
CIOS

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Monmouth Internet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: jim.danvers@mindex.com                            02-Dec-99 21:01:24
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 03:35:07
Subj: Re: OS2 Dual Boot Installation Problem

From: Jim Danvers <jim.danvers@mindex.com>

Dave...

I'd be interested in learning a little bit more about "... Henk Kelder's FAT32 
drivers
into OS/2" (as taken from your post below).  Can you provide a link to a web
page or
some other source of info regarding these drivers, and hopefully locations
where they
can be obtained from?  Are they shareware / freeware, or commercial.  
Obviously I'm
hoping for the freeware... but...  if the price is right.

Thanks in advance...

-=- J.D. -=-


"David T. Johnson" wrote:

> Jim Parker wrote:
> >
> > Lorne Sunley wrote:
> >
> > > On Wed, 1 Dec 1999 11:50:10, "Ian Dawson" <idawson@montupetuk.co.uk>
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > > > Hi,
> > > >     I have a Toshiba Satellite S300CDT (with 2.1Gb - 80Mb RAM)
currently
> > > > running
> > > > Win 98.  I want to install OS2 as a dual boot option.
> > > >
> > > > After inserting the OS2 Installation Disk, an OS2 symbol appears and
after
> > > > about
> > > > 30 seconds of disk churning, the machine reboots and starts the whole
> > > > process again.
> > > >
> > > > Any Ideas on whats wrong and how to fix them....
> > >
> > > If you are trying to use "dual boot" meaning that the OS/2
> > > code is in the same partition as Windows 98, this probably
> > > won't work given that Win 98 is probably using a FAT32 or
> > > FAT32X partition type which OS/2 cannot read.
> > >
> > > The only reliable way is to use "boot manager" which
> > > will require that you re-partition your disk drive to obtain
> > > another partition that can be used to install OS/2
> > >
> > > --
> > >
> > > Lorne Sunley
> >
> > You need to be careful with Boot Manager and FAT32. I used the Boot
Manager that
> > came with Partition Magic 3.0 and which  PowerQuest got from IBM.  Later I
> > installed this Boot Manager on a machine that had Win98 preinstalled in a
FAT32
> > partition. It didn't handle it correctly. I went on a Partition Magic
forum and
> > found that PowerQuest had a fix for the problem which I downloaded and
installed
> > and this updated Boot Manager handled the FAT32 partition correctly. The
issue
> > is that the Boot Manager that comes with Warp is probably the same one
that was
> > originally distributed with Partition Magic and thus probably suffers from 
the
> > same problem. I don't know if IBM ever distributed a fix for the problem.
> >
> > The symptom of the problem was that, when I booted the FAT32 (Win98)
primary
> > partition, the FAT  primary partition (In which I had installed DOS) was
> > visible. The FAT32 partition was assigned C: and the FAT partition got
assigned
> > two drive letters. One of these "drives" appeared to Win98 to be of 0
length and
> > inaccessable while the other appeared normal. The problem, of course, is
that
> > there is supposed to be only one primary partition per physical drive
visible at
> > any one time. I only had two primary partitions on this drive (other than
Boot
> > Manager itself) so I don't know how it would have dealt with more than two
> > primaries.
> >
> I have used Partition Magic 3.05 and the OS/2 v4 boot manager without
> problems with FAT32 drives.  The problem you describe really sounds more
> like a Partition Magic problem than a boot manager problem.  I have set
> up systems with the Windows 9x on a FAT32 partition on the first
> partition and OS/2 on a second logical partition.  If Windows is already
> installed on the C: FAT32 partion, OS/2 will not see the FAT32 partition
> and so will think it is installing on the C: drive unless you create an
> additional small partition ahead of OS/2 for the install.  Then you
> install OS/2 on what it thinks is now the D: partition and then install
> Henk Kelder's FAT32 drivers into OS/2.  Then boot with floppies and
> delete the small partition (and reclaim the space to one of the other
> two large partitions).  If you've done everything correctly, OS/2 will
> boot with the FAT32 drivers and will now recognize the FAT32 partition
> as the C: drive and the OS/2 partition as the D: drive and OS/2 will
> have read and write access to both the C and D partitions.  Windows 9x
> will only see the C: drive (unless you formatted the OS/2 partition to
> be FAT16--a very unwise idea IMO).
>
> > Jim

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: lsunley@mb.sympatico.ca                           03-Dec-99 03:04:21
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 03:35:07
Subj: Re: OS2 Dual Boot Installation Problem

From: lsunley@mb.sympatico.ca (Lorne Sunley)

On Fri, 3 Dec 1999 02:01:49, Jim Danvers <jim.danvers@mindex.com> 
wrote:

> Dave...
> 
> I'd be interested in learning a little bit more about "... Henk Kelder's
FAT32 drivers
> into OS/2" (as taken from your post below).  Can you provide a link to a web 
page or
> some other source of info regarding these drivers, and hopefully locations
where they
> can be obtained from?  Are they shareware / freeware, or commercial.  
Obviously I'm
> hoping for the freeware... but...  if the price is right.
> 

<lots of snip>

Henk's Homepage is

URL http://www.os2ss.com/information/kelder/

Don't forget to pick up the INVALUBLE WPTools
that includes the CHECKINI program.

--

Lorne Sunley

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: MBnet Networking Inc. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: letoured@nospam.net                               01-Dec-99 21:02:23
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 03:35:07
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: letoured@nospam.net

>>seberREMOVETHIS@sympatico.ca (E. Barry Bruyea) said:

>And if you ordered a Chevy from General Motors, and told the dealer you
>wanted a Bosch Alternator, guess what?  You'd still have to pay for the
>Delco Alternator the car came with.  The dealer is not going to take the
>hit for the cost of the OE.  Your compaint falls under the 'Gee Whiz'
>category.

Baloney. You MS guys are out of touch with reality. The MS case is about
MS forcing its products on manufacturers. It is not about the end consumer
deciding he wants a different component and having to pay for it.

BTW, if  want to tell us that MS is doing no such thing, then step up and
tell us where we go for a refund on the Wincrap license we have to pay for
and don't want.     --- Here's betting you can't do it! 



_____________
Ed Letourneau <letoured@sover.net>

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: bCandid - Powering the world's discussions - http
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: letoured@nospam.net                               01-Dec-99 20:38:00
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 03:35:07
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: letoured@nospam.net

Chris J Delanoy <cdelanoy@ualberta.ca> said:

>> >Explain how markets can create "monopolies" which can SIMULTANEOUSLY
>> >charge prices that are too high AND too low - which are among the
>> >so-called "facts" cited by Judge Jackson.
>> Its in the Findings of Fact.

>Yes, it is - which is precisely why I said that the "facts" in the
>Findings of Fact do not pertain to reality.

Have you given any thought to the idea that you don't have a clue as to
what you're talking about?  Think of it this way; if MS wasn't guilty do
you really they would be in negotiations to settle?  In the US, the
innocent appeal. The dead-wrong guilty settle. 

<snip>   all the lines insisting that monopolies only exist when the
government creates them.... 


_____________
Ed Letourneau <letoured@sover.net>

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: bCandid - Powering the world's discussions - http
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: letoured@nospam.net                               02-Dec-99 06:59:20
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 03:35:07
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: letoured@nospam.net

>Chris J Delanoy <cdelanoy@ualberta.ca> said:

You're a real walkie-talkie windup MS Munchkin aren't you.  I'll condense
your theme:

According to you (and MS) all the judges, all the prosecutors -- from the
Federal government and 19 states, not to mention the people conducting
on-going investigations in several other nations are ALL WRONG and poor,
poor Billy is just an good old boy trying hard to bring new things to us
all -- and everyone else is just a bunch of meanies who want to stop him.

I'll repeat a question posted elsewhere. If there is no monopoly then how
come no one can get a refund for unused copies of Wincrap?  The licence
that comes with it says you don't agree with it you can get a refund --
But no one I've ever heard of can get it.

That means Monopoly -- and unless you can tell us who to talk to get the
money back, this constant pathetic whining about the injustice done to
poor Billy makes you and the rest here MS Munchkins.  Of course we knew
that anyway since you're all trolling an OS2 group trying to  tell us how
dumb we all are. 


>> That, sir, is force.

>Your inability to shop around is not evidence of force.  Force means
>coercion - and I'll be delighted to read your explanation of how,
>precisely, you were coerced against your will to make this transaction
>(ie - What would the physical consequences have been if you hadn't made
>it?  Imprisonment?)

>> I just had to say that I didn't want to buy a computer!
>> That was the only way I could have avoided the Gates tax.

>Even if every computer manufacturer on earth had a deal to
>sell Windows (which isn't true and never could be), it would still not be
>force because nothing would ever preclude any
>manufacturer from changing its mind or any new supplier from entering the
>market.

>Your problem is that the great majority of people happen to
>want to buy Windows at this particular time - which means you don't agree
>with the CHOICE they are making.  It isn't choice or competition that you
>want (because such exists already):
>you want them to make the choice that you WANT them to make, which is
>something they just aren't doing.

>And the fact that you have the abusive persecutors in the
>US Justice Department on your side does not make you right.

_____________
Ed Letourneau <letoured@sover.net>

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: bCandid - Powering the world's discussions - http
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: ames@deltrak.demon.co.uk                          03-Dec-99 01:06:28
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 03:35:07
Subj: Re: MASM 6.11 under OS/2 (to create DOS exe?)

From: ames@deltrak.demon.co.uk (Andrew Stephenson)

In article <slrn84bme6.60.terryfry@cc823516-b.twsn1.md.home.com>
	   terryfry@toward.com "Terry Fry" writes:

> Is there a way to fool MASM into at least working under OS/2's
> DOS?

I have MASM 5.10A and it runs fine in Warp4@FP11's VDM.  Is 6.11
so different?  Could it be your setup?  (Mine is very average.)
--
Andrew Stephenson

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: DNS (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: haa@mail1.stofanet.dk                             03-Dec-99 00:13:12
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 03:35:07
Subj: Re: Hauppauge TV card advice.

From: Henrik Aaen <haa@mail1.stofanet.dk>

Lorne Sunley wrote:
> 
> On Fri, 26 Nov 1999 14:29:42, Dave Critelli <DCritel@ATTGlobal.net>
> wrote:
> 
> > I was thinking about picking up a Hauppauge TV card for my PC and was
> > wondering which Hauppauge cards everyone was using successfully with
> > Warp?
> >
> I've got two
> 
> Model 401 - TV, FM Radio, DBX stereo
> Model 400 - TV Monaural
> 
> Both work fine with the drivers from
> 
> http://www.wdi.co.uk/os2tv/download.htm
> 
> --
> 
> Lorne Sunley

What has the wdi.co.uk done to the os2tv/download.htm site.
Henrik Aaen

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Customer at Telia Danmark (http://www.telia.dk/) (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: letoured@nospam.net                               02-Dec-99 20:24:29
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 03:35:08
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: letoured@nospam.net

Steven C. Britton" <sbritton@cadvision.com> said:

>The "Corporate Geniuses" at the top of the "food chain", as you put it
>are there and get paid the big bucks because it's their necks on the line
>if the corporation fails: they're the ones who carry the greatest
>financial risk: and the fundamental law of risk-taking is that the higher
>the risk, the bigger the reward.

Baloney. Every VP I've ever seen "fired" at GE and elsewhere walked off
with millions on the way out. There is no risk. --And in most cases they
left because the risk they took was to cook the numbers for next two guys
up the food chain. Lets also accept that fact that people don't work their
way up to that level, they are pulled up. So the risk is not nearly as
real as you want to think. 

BTW, I can't think of corporation that failed except when the big bucks
guys didn't know what the business was about, or refused to accept changes
in the market. 


>Union bosses, on the other hand, don't lose their $100K salaries when the
>"workers" go out on strike; they just drive their BMWs to the picket
>line, make a little speech, give a media interview with the cheering
>rentamob behind them, get back in their BMW and drive to their next
>event.

Name the bosses that get 100K, and the rentamobs. -- In the US that would
be a violation of federal law and would be verifiable -- that is unless
your making it up and spouting off.


>Unions aren't for the "workers" any more -- they're political activist
>groups trying to ram ridiculous collectivist, socialistic, and
>totalitarian practises down the throats of those who REALLY work hard.

Examples; what are these totalitarian practices

<snip> the rest of the rightwing crap... as we call it in the US



_____________
Ed Letourneau <letoured@sover.net>

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: bCandid - Powering the world's discussions - http
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: letoured@nospam.net                               02-Dec-99 19:36:15
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 03:35:08
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: letoured@nospam.net

>> And a long list of other improvements on the natural exploitation and
>> sub-human treatment those Dashing Bold Mustachioed Capitalist
>> employers of yours will use, whenever allowed, untrammelled by law or
>> the evil of simple Collective Bargaining, on the class of sad
>> disadvantaged peasants who have to come to work in their factories to
>> put a daily scrap of bread on their families' tables.

>All of these issues are totally unrelated to unionism.  Unions do not
>effectively prevent these things from happening.

Are you 15 years old or just stupid?   Dou you really think GM and the
rest asked for the OSHA regulations out of goodness and concern for
workers?

>All unions do is create an environment of mediocrity and laziness; and
>pay the union bosses big bucks to create havoc.

And all non-union shops are productive, intelligent and well run. That is
why companies like GE have downsized the non-union staff by 80% in the
last 15 years. 


>The real truth is that companies that DON'T have unions have better, more
>productive workforces, higher wages, and treat their employees better. 
>If I owned a corporation, I would do whatever I could to keep a union OUT
>of my company.  If one formed, I would do whatever I could to get it
>decertified.

And you would not survive. Not because of unions, but you're too stupid to
treat people as human beings -- which is what gave rise to unions in the
first place.  

Don't know about Canada, but in the US someone with your attitude could
expect to have it readjusted.  _____________
Ed Letourneau <letoured@sover.net>

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: bCandid - Powering the world's discussions - http
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: letoured@nospam.net                               02-Dec-99 19:29:23
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 03:35:08
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: letoured@nospam.net

>>Try buying an Intel based computer without paying
>>for Windows.

>I do it all of the time. But that's because I'm clearly MUCH more
>competent than a phony like you who lies about his alleged experience in
>setting up and maintaining computers

Please tell us where to buy say IBM Thinkpads or any
tier-one laptop without Windozs?  Better yet, tell us where to get a
refund for the copy of windoze that comes on a machine. And the license
says I can get one -- but just try.

All you MS Munchkins ignore that one. How come? Could it be that it goes
to the heart of the lies you live in.


_____________
Ed Letourneau <letoured@sover.net>

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: bCandid - Powering the world's discussions - http
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: ames@deltrak.demon.co.uk                          03-Dec-99 01:01:05
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 03:35:08
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: ames@deltrak.demon.co.uk (Andrew Stephenson)

In article <38466f30$5$obot$mr2ice@news.pics.com>
	   bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com "Bob Germer" writes:

> I presume King Billy refers to President Bubba, not Chief Thief
> Billy Gates. [...]

Nooo, I was having a fit of irony.  Perhaps he needs a less grand
title.  How does "The Squire of Redmond" grab you?

> And if perchance the other Billy should come to visit, I
> suggest you take a lesson from your history and do to him what
> the Campbells did to the MacDonalds at Glencoe a few decades
> back.

Wouldn't that call for me to go sleep under his roof?  There are
some thresholds one hesitates to cross.  Contemplate the hazards
of visiting a cyberhouse controlled by M$ systems...  *shudder*
--
Andrew Stephenson

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: DNS (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com                           02-Dec-99 08:22:18
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 03:35:08
Subj: Re: IBM Support for os/2

From: Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com>

On <HN2tEbdbtdhk-pn2-SkUDF7V0CEPr@localhost>, on 12/01/99 at 02:42 PM,
   rcrane@octa4.net.au (Richard A Crane) said:

> On Tue, 30 Nov 1999 15:25:12, Bob Germer 
> <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com> wrote in part:

> My general mood was not improved by spending what seemed to  be an
> exessive amount of time trying to find the IBM site  that has all the
> y2k fixes for all parts of OS/2 Warp (base  system fix packs, device
> driver packs, TCP/IP fix packs, are there do I need MPTS fix packs? or
> anything else for the  stuff that to me was all part of the OS)

 ftp.software.ibm.com:/ps/products/os2/fixes/v4warp 

I don't know if you use the English-US or English-UK version of Warp but
all languages are there. That site will lead you to the Device Driver Pack
as well if you go up to a higher subdirectory and work down. Apply FP 12
(actually 8 or 7 also made Warp Y2K compliant if memory serves) and DD
Pack 1 if your hardware needs it and you will be Y2K compliant assuming
you are using Netscape 4.6.

> PS can anyone post a comprehensible list of what 
> upgrades/what install order are needed to convert a stand 
> alone but using the internet, Warp 4 system needs to ensure  y2k
> compliance?
> Richard A Crane
> Barrister & Solicitor
> slightly altered email (anti-spamming) rcrane AT 
> octa4.net.au 
> OR rcrane AT attglobal.net


--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: bobg@Pics.com
Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 12
MR/2 Ice Registration Number 67
Aut Pax Aut Bellum
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: noyb@noyb.no                                      03-Dec-99 02:46:24
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 03:35:08
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: noyb@noyb.no (None Of Your Business)

BTW, I can't think of anyone I know who's been killed by a gun.

letoured@nospam.net wrote in <38471bea$1$yrgbherq$mr2ice@news.sover.net>:
>BTW, I can't think of corporation that failed except when the big bucks
>guys didn't know what the business was about, or refused to accept changes
>in the market. 

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: None Dammit (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: glend@nospam.direct.ca                            02-Dec-99 18:56:16
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 03:35:08
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: Glenn Davies <glend@nospam.direct.ca>

On 3 Dec 1999 00:43:40 GMT, larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) wrote:

>As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw Bob Germer write:

>> MS forces computer buyers to pay for Windows whether the customer wants to
>> or not.
>
>MS doesn't force computer buyers to do anything.  Microsoft sells its code.
>People buy it.  This is called a free exchange.
>

Under MS's per-processor licensing agreements, which the '95 consent
decree eliminated, customers paid for DOS and Windows even if they
didn't want those products. This was commonly referred to the "DOS
tax" on computers.


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: via Internet Direct - http://www.mydirect.com/ (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: wernerkn@telus.net                                02-Dec-99 19:22:18
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 03:35:08
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: Werner Knoll <wernerkn@telus.net>


letoured@nospam.net wrote:
> 
> >> And a long list of other improvements on the natural exploitation and
> >> sub-human treatment those Dashing Bold Mustachioed Capitalist
> >> employers of yours will use, whenever allowed, untrammelled by law or
> >> the evil of simple Collective Bargaining, on the class of sad
> >> disadvantaged peasants who have to come to work in their factories to
> >> put a daily scrap of bread on their families' tables.
> 
> >All of these issues are totally unrelated to unionism.  Unions do not
> >effectively prevent these things from happening.
> 
> Are you 15 years old or just stupid?   Dou you really think GM and the
> rest asked for the OSHA regulations out of goodness and concern for
> workers?
> 
> >All unions do is create an environment of mediocrity and laziness; and
> >pay the union bosses big bucks to create havoc.
> 
> And all non-union shops are productive, intelligent and well run. That is
> why companies like GE have downsized the non-union staff by 80% in the
> last 15 years.
> 
> >The real truth is that companies that DON'T have unions have better, more
> >productive workforces, higher wages, and treat their employees better.
> >If I owned a corporation, I would do whatever I could to keep a union OUT
> >of my company.  If one formed, I would do whatever I could to get it
> >decertified.
> 
> And you would not survive. Not because of unions, but you're too stupid to
> treat people as human beings -- which is what gave rise to unions in the
> first place.
> 
> Don't know about Canada, but in the US someone with your attitude could
> expect to have it readjusted.  _____________
> Ed Letourneau <letoured@sover.net>

In all likelihood Britton is a born again Christian who is acting as a
foreskin for his masters.

Misfit's like him take advantage of what unions have been fighting for
and the only reason he is happy because he can sit on his masters lap.

Werner Knoll

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: The Knoll's (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: jdparker@erols.com                                02-Dec-99 23:11:25
  To: djohnson@isomedia.com                             03-Dec-99 03:35:08
Subj: Re: OS2 Dual Boot Installation Problem

To: "David T. Johnson" <djohnson@isomedia.com>
From: Jim Parker <jdparker@erols.com>

"David T. Johnson" wrote:

> Jim Parker wrote:
> >
> > Lorne Sunley wrote:
> >
> > > On Wed, 1 Dec 1999 11:50:10, "Ian Dawson" <idawson@montupetuk.co.uk>
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > > > Hi,
> > > >     I have a Toshiba Satellite S300CDT (with 2.1Gb - 80Mb RAM)
currently
> > > > running
> > > > Win 98.  I want to install OS2 as a dual boot option.
> > > >
> > > > After inserting the OS2 Installation Disk, an OS2 symbol appears and
after
> > > > about
> > > > 30 seconds of disk churning, the machine reboots and starts the whole
> > > > process again.
> > > >
> > > > Any Ideas on whats wrong and how to fix them....
> > >
> > > If you are trying to use "dual boot" meaning that the OS/2
> > > code is in the same partition as Windows 98, this probably
> > > won't work given that Win 98 is probably using a FAT32 or
> > > FAT32X partition type which OS/2 cannot read.
> > >
> > > The only reliable way is to use "boot manager" which
> > > will require that you re-partition your disk drive to obtain
> > > another partition that can be used to install OS/2
> > >
> > > --
> > >
> > > Lorne Sunley
> >
> > You need to be careful with Boot Manager and FAT32. I used the Boot
Manager that
> > came with Partition Magic 3.0 and which  PowerQuest got from IBM.  Later I
> > installed this Boot Manager on a machine that had Win98 preinstalled in a
FAT32
> > partition. It didn't handle it correctly. I went on a Partition Magic
forum and
> > found that PowerQuest had a fix for the problem which I downloaded and
installed
> > and this updated Boot Manager handled the FAT32 partition correctly. The
issue
> > is that the Boot Manager that comes with Warp is probably the same one
that was
> > originally distributed with Partition Magic and thus probably suffers from 
the
> > same problem. I don't know if IBM ever distributed a fix for the problem.
> >
> > The symptom of the problem was that, when I booted the FAT32 (Win98)
primary
> > partition, the FAT  primary partition (In which I had installed DOS) was
> > visible. The FAT32 partition was assigned C: and the FAT partition got
assigned
> > two drive letters. One of these "drives" appeared to Win98 to be of 0
length and
> > inaccessable while the other appeared normal. The problem, of course, is
that
> > there is supposed to be only one primary partition per physical drive
visible at
> > any one time. I only had two primary partitions on this drive (other than
Boot
> > Manager itself) so I don't know how it would have dealt with more than two
> > primaries.
> >
> I have used Partition Magic 3.05 and the OS/2 v4 boot manager without
> problems with FAT32 drives.  The problem you describe really sounds more
> like a Partition Magic problem than a boot manager problem.  I have set
> up systems with the Windows 9x on a FAT32 partition on the first
> partition and OS/2 on a second logical partition.  If Windows is already
> installed on the C: FAT32 partion, OS/2 will not see the FAT32 partition
> and so will think it is installing on the C: drive unless you create an
> additional small partition ahead of OS/2 for the install.  Then you
> install OS/2 on what it thinks is now the D: partition and then install
> Henk Kelder's FAT32 drivers into OS/2.  Then boot with floppies and
> delete the small partition (and reclaim the space to one of the other
> two large partitions).  If you've done everything correctly, OS/2 will
> boot with the FAT32 drivers and will now recognize the FAT32 partition
> as the C: drive and the OS/2 partition as the D: drive and OS/2 will
> have read and write access to both the C and D partitions.  Windows 9x
> will only see the C: drive (unless you formatted the OS/2 partition to
> be FAT16--a very unwise idea IMO).
>
> > Jim

If you have Partition Magic 3.05 then you have the updated Boot Manager. You
may or
may not be using the updated Boot Manager. It doesn't matter to you because
the old
Boot Manager will handle the scenario you described. What I described was a
different
scenario and the old Boot Manager will not handle it correctly.

Jim




--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: lsunley@mb.sympatico.ca                           03-Dec-99 03:14:17
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 03:35:08
Subj: Re: Hauppauge TV card advice.

From: lsunley@mb.sympatico.ca (Lorne Sunley)

On Thu, 2 Dec 1999 23:13:24, Henrik Aaen <haa@mail1.stofanet.dk> 
wrote:

> 
> What has the wdi.co.uk done to the os2tv/download.htm site.
> Henrik Aaen

John Rodriguez mentioned in another thread that the server
hosting the Wincast/TV OS/2 drivers has gone down and
won't be up for a few days.

In the meantime, if you need to obtain the drivers
I have put them up on my web page. These are
the current version 1.041w

http://www3.mb.sympatico.ca/~lsunley

The link is right after the reference to the Abbotsbury 
software site.

--

Lorne Sunley

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: MBnet Networking Inc. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: lsunley@mb.sympatico.ca                           03-Dec-99 03:18:22
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 03:35:08
Subj: Re: CIRRUS LOGIC cl-gdM30 or is is cl-gdN30 ??

From: lsunley@mb.sympatico.ca (Lorne Sunley)

On Fri, 3 Dec 1999 00:26:09, Tim Stephen@CIOS.ORG (Tim Stephen) wrote:

>     The DUAL-SMP GW2K machine we just bought has built in video which is
> very slow for PM applications.  The built in video apparently uses
> either the cirrus logic cl-gdm30 or cl-gdn30 chip set, which are
> supported out of the box by WSeB (our OS).  I'm having trouble finding a
> replacement PCI-type video board for this machine.  Of course if it
> would be possible somehow to speed up the PM video, that would be great.
> Any suggestions?
> 

If you don't have an AGP slot on the motherboard
you'll have to try the discount stores for a PCI
based video card. If you can find one, grab
a Matrox Millenium II PCI card. The card is supported
by WSeB's built-in GRADD drivers and provides
"fairly quick" video speed.

--

Lorne Sunley

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: MBnet Networking Inc. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: mwalsh1@elp.rr.com                                02-Dec-99 20:47:12
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 03:35:08
Subj: Re: Road Runner and Warp

From: "Matt Walsh" <mwalsh1@elp.rr.com>

On Thu, 02 Dec 1999 06:55:03 -0800, John Desmarais wrote:

>When you were using the login, did you use the port of Phil Karn's
>'rrlogin' for Toshiba Authentication, or Larkin Lowrey's "experimental"
>'RROS2d' program?

I guess it was the port of rrlogin for toshiba.   Larkin's did work when I
tried it once.


Matt Walsh  	OS/2 Outpost
El Paso, TX	Computin' & Shootin' in the dust.


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Time Warner Communications, El Paso TX (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: sma.spam-not@rtd.com                              03-Dec-99 06:19:16
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 03:35:08
Subj: Re: Software Choice

From: James Moe <sma.spam-not@rtd.com>


postmaster@[127.0.0.1] wrote:
> 
> [ ... ]
>
> Is it really only $100 a year?
> 
    It's $250 for two years. There is no one year option.

-- 

sma at rtd dot com
Remove ".spam-not" for email

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Sohnen-Moe Associates, Inc (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: oliver.rick@oor.de                                01-Dec-99 23:00:29
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 03:35:08
Subj: Re: IBM Support for os/2

From: oliver.rick@oor.de (Oliver Rick)

On Wed, 01 Dec 1999 Richard A Crane wrote:

> My general mood was not improved by spending what seemed to be an
> exessive amount of time trying to find the IBM site that has all the y2k
> fixes for all parts of OS/2 Warp (base system fix packs, device driver
> packs, TCP/IP fix packs, are there do I need MPTS fix packs?

No, MPTS is Y2K ready with or without FixPak.

> or anything else for the stuff that to me was all part of the OS) PS can
> anyone post a comprehensible list of what upgrades/what install order
> are needed to convert a stand alone but using the internet, Warp 4
> system needs to ensure y2k compliance?

http://www.warpupdates.de/english/warp_year2000.html

   /Olli/
--
IBM OS/2 Warp Update Summary:
http://www.warpupdates.de/english/warpupdates.html

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Out of Rosenheim/2 (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: larso@commodore.                                  03-Dec-99 08:25:07
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 05:15:15
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg)

As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw Glenn Davies write:
> On 3 Dec 1999 00:43:40 GMT, larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) wrote:

> >MS doesn't force computer buyers to do anything.  Microsoft sells its code.
> >People buy it.  This is called a free exchange.
> 
> Under MS's per-processor licensing agreements, which the '95 consent
> decree eliminated, customers paid for DOS and Windows even if they
> didn't want those products.

How was that?  I know the answer.  I can't wait to see how you express it.

-- 
Lars P. Ormberg     ICQ#:8827066
mailto:larso@ualberta.ca
The University of Lars:   http://www.ualberta.ca/~larso/

"The way you're bathed in light, reminds me of that night
God laid me down into your rose garden of trust and I was
swept away with nothin' left to say some helpless fool
yeah I was lost in a swoon of peace you're all I need to
find so when the time is right come to me sweetly, come
to me come to me..love will lead us, alright.  love will
lead us, she will lead us.  can you hear the dolphin's
cry?  see the road rise up to meet us its in the air we
breathe tonight love will lead us, she will lead us"
                            -Live, "The Dolphin's Cry"

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: PowerSurfr - High Speed Internet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: larso@commodore.                                  03-Dec-99 08:34:13
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 05:15:15
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg)

As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw Bob Germer write:
>    larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) said:

> > Does Microsoft send people to force you to buy their products?  Which
> > gun is being placed at your skull?
> 
> No, it sends people to the manufacturers and vendors of computers forcing
> them to include Windows on every machine they sell or pay four times as
> much for Windows.

That isn't forcing them.  If they don't want to include Windows on a single
sold machine, they don't have to.  "Paying four times as much for Windows"
isn't a problem, because they don't have to buy Windows in the first place.

>                       Thus competition forces vendors to comply since the
> margin on a typical PC is far less than 4 times the price of Windows if
> they do.

That's if they are selling Windows machines.  What about if they decide not
to sell a single Windows machine.

> > Or is it a matter of Microsoft "forcing you" to buy the product by
> > providing a valued product at an affordable rate?
> 
> Valued product? Not to me it is not. It is a piece of garbage I do not and
> will not use but must pay for despite my desire to use an alternate
> operating system.

Apparently blindness to alternatives comes free with your copies of Windows.

Tell me, do you think that you are the only person in the world to not want
Windows?

-- 
Lars P. Ormberg     ICQ#:8827066
mailto:larso@ualberta.ca
The University of Lars:   http://www.ualberta.ca/~larso/

"The way you're bathed in light, reminds me of that night
God laid me down into your rose garden of trust and I was
swept away with nothin' left to say some helpless fool
yeah I was lost in a swoon of peace you're all I need to
find so when the time is right come to me sweetly, come
to me come to me..love will lead us, alright.  love will
lead us, she will lead us.  can you hear the dolphin's
cry?  see the road rise up to meet us its in the air we
breathe tonight love will lead us, she will lead us"
                            -Live, "The Dolphin's Cry"

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: PowerSurfr - High Speed Internet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: larso@commodore.                                  03-Dec-99 08:41:11
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 05:15:15
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg)

As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw Stan Goodman write:
> On Mon, 29 Nov 1999 08:22:34, larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) wrote:

> > Yes.  So much for "home of the free".
> 
> No, that is what keeps it the home of the free.

The heavy-hand of the government gun tearing apart successful businesses?

-- 
Lars P. Ormberg     ICQ#:8827066
mailto:larso@ualberta.ca
The University of Lars:   http://www.ualberta.ca/~larso/

"The way you're bathed in light, reminds me of that night
God laid me down into your rose garden of trust and I was
swept away with nothin' left to say some helpless fool
yeah I was lost in a swoon of peace you're all I need to
find so when the time is right come to me sweetly, come
to me come to me..love will lead us, alright.  love will
lead us, she will lead us.  can you hear the dolphin's
cry?  see the road rise up to meet us its in the air we
breathe tonight love will lead us, she will lead us"
                            -Live, "The Dolphin's Cry"

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: PowerSurfr - High Speed Internet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rde@tavi.co.uk                                    03-Dec-99 07:43:21
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 05:15:15
Subj: Re: MASM 6.11 under OS/2 (to create DOS exe?)

From: rde@tavi.co.uk (Bob Eager)

On Fri, 3 Dec 1999 01:06:56, ames@deltrak.demon.co.uk (Andrew 
Stephenson) wrote:

> I have MASM 5.10A and it runs fine in Warp4@FP11's VDM.  Is 6.11
> so different?  Could it be your setup?  (Mine is very average.)

Actually, it is. Doesn't like running in OS/2....

-- 
Bob Eager
rde at tavi.co.uk
PC Server 325; PS/2s 8595*3, 9595*3 (2*P60 + P90), 8535, 8570, 9556*2,
8580*6,
8557*2, 8550, 9577, 8530, P70, PC/AT..

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Tavi Systems (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: Thomas.Kellerer@tps-labs.com                      03-Dec-99 08:48:03
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 05:15:15
Subj: Re: New modem list

From: Thomas Kellerer <Thomas.Kellerer@tps-labs.com>

> Actually you can tweak performance a bit.  IMO, the ideal connection is
> V90 ARQ.  You don't need compression on large downloads of compressed
> files as they are already compressed.  Graphics compression rates are
> very low.
That's true, but I don't think that enabling compression will slow it
down. But plain HTML files compress *very* good (I had times where
Netscape reported about 12KB/s transfer rate for plain HTML files!)

I'm using Injoy and the peak throughput is normally around 7-8KB/s
(although my telefon line and/or my serial port, I don't know which of
those only connects with 45000)

Cheers
Thomas

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: cbzh@my-deja.com                                  03-Dec-99 08:18:09
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 05:15:15
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: cbzh@my-deja.com

In article <38469645_1@news.cadvision.com>,
  "Steven C. Britton" <scb@scb-group.com> wrote:
> Bob Germer wrote:
> >
> > No, it sends people to the manufacturers and vendors of computers
forcing
> > them to include Windows on every machine they sell or pay four times
as
> > much for Windows.
>
> That's not coercive.  It's a package deal.  Microsoft can't force
computer
> distributors to put Windows on their machines; but they _can_ say that
"if
> you sell a computer with windows, we'll give you a massive discount on
it".
>
> > Thus competition forces vendors to comply since the
> > margin on a typical PC is far less than 4 times the price of Windows
if
> > they do.
>
> Wrong.
>
> If a customer buys a computer without Windows, the store isn't buying
> Windows from Microsoft for that particular machine, so it becomes a
> non-issue.
>
> If the customer wants to buy Windows as an add-on later, then they pay
4
> times as much as they would have paid if they'd bought Windows with
the
> machine.
>
> That is _not_ a monopoly, nor is it a "monopolistic" practise.
>

If what you said was actually true, you would be right, but it isn't: In
many cases the vendor has to pay Windows licenses per processor, not per
actually sold copy of Windows, so they would lose money when selling
computers without Windows! So they prefer to give that damage further
to the end buyers, forcing them to buy e.g. rather expensive frisbees
for their dogs...

And now tell me please why the vendors have signed such an unfavorable
contract???

> > Valued product? Not to me it is not. It is a piece of garbage I do
not and
> > will not use but must pay for despite my desire to use an alternate
> > operating system.
>
> No you don't.  You just don't buy Windows with the machine.  The store
won't
> care: they'll just package that Windows system with a different
machine and
> buy one less package from MicroSoft.
>
> > I do, however, give those copies away free to friends,
> > relatives, etc. who wish to upgrade from Windows 3.1 or 95. I use a
couple
> > of Windows 95 CD's as frisbees for my dog.
>
> What a silly way to choose to waste your money -- and it is 100%
_your_
> choice to do so.

Do you think this becomes true just by repetition???

Cornelis Bockemhl <cbockem@datacomm.ch>



Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Deja.com - Before you buy. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: cbzh@my-deja.com                                  03-Dec-99 08:32:00
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 05:15:15
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: cbzh@my-deja.com

In article
<Z8vLRdP7nz3N-pn2-iudRsz3LRdoO@SPHERICALBURN.TAMPABAY.RR.COM>,
  donnelly@tampabay.rr.com (Buddy Donnelly) wrote:
> On Mon, 29 Nov 1999 23:42:09, Chris J Delanoy <cdelanoy@ualberta.ca> a
> crit dans un message:
>
> >   prather@infi.net (Jerry Prather) wrote:
> >
> > > :>> The problem with M$ is that they are not living by those laws.
> > > :>> M$ _is_ forcing me to "eat at their restaurant".
> >
> > > Lars, I was going to respond to this with a flame that you should
> > > have read the rest of my post before replying so knee-jerkily,
> > > but in reading other people's responses, I found that I didn't
> > > have to.  Your logic flaws have been well pointed out - or is it
> > > your source of income that is being identified????
> >
> > Jerry, if you believe you are forced to "eat Microsoft", as it were,
> > then I propose the following experiment which will show you the
> > difference between production and force:  For the next year, don't
> > buy or use any Microsoft products whatsoever.  That is, send the
> > alleged "robber barron" Bill Gates no money whatsoever.
>
> That's a bizarre diversion. The true point is being ignored, that I
(and
> all of us) have already paid substantial amounts of money to
Micro$oft,
> directly and indirectly, that M$ fraudulently obtained. And we have no
way
> of getting it back from them, because M$ has ignored all such claims
just
> as they are trying to ignore Judge Jackson's finding of fact.
>
> Unless, that is, our (US and State) governments take action on our
> collective behalf. The governments are not freebooters, they are our
> representatives.
>
> That's *EXACTLY* what has happened in this case, and it's a good thing
they
> are learning how to do it, since all major corporations are growing
(by the
> day) in power towards their own ultimate goals of becoming monopolies,
so
> we'll be needing governments to be doing more of this work, not less,
in
> future. For us, on our behalves.

And don't forget: Governments do _also_ protect the business of
companies like M$ because they are responsible to enforce the copyright
and patent laws, which means the simple antagony "business vs.
government" is not a real one! Without copyrights etc. there wouldn't
exist such a thing as "licenses" which is what M$ mainly sells!

So it is not more than right if governments protect other vendors and
the end users as well and not only concentrate on prosecuting people
using M$ and other programs without having paid for the licenses!

Cornelis Bockemhl <cbockem@datacomm.ch>

[Some US interna snipped...]


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Deja.com - Before you buy. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: larso@commodore.                                  03-Dec-99 08:38:16
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 05:15:15
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg)

As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw letoured@nospam.net write:
> >Chris J Delanoy <cdelanoy@ualberta.ca> said:
> 
> According to you (and MS) all the judges, all the prosecutors -- from the
> Federal government and 19 states, not to mention the people conducting
> on-going investigations in several other nations are ALL WRONG and poor,
> poor Billy is just an good old boy trying hard to bring new things to us
> all -- and everyone else is just a bunch of meanies who want to stop him.

Yes, this pretty much summarizes how the DOJ operates.  It doesn't help when
anti-trust laws make it easy for a bureaucrat with a desire for greatness to
ruin the world.

> I'll repeat a question posted elsewhere. If there is no monopoly then how
> come no one can get a refund for unused copies of Wincrap?  The licence
> that comes with it says you don't agree with it you can get a refund --
> But no one I've ever heard of can get it.

The non-existance of this mythical "Microsoft monopoly" is a notwithstanding
issue.  Is Microsoft violating contracts?  If so, why isn't the DOJ
prosecuting MS under contract law?  If the whole problem is the violation of
a contract, why punish Microsoft for the contracts it does not violate?

-- 
Lars P. Ormberg     ICQ#:8827066
mailto:larso@ualberta.ca
The University of Lars:   http://www.ualberta.ca/~larso/

"The way you're bathed in light, reminds me of that night
God laid me down into your rose garden of trust and I was
swept away with nothin' left to say some helpless fool
yeah I was lost in a swoon of peace you're all I need to
find so when the time is right come to me sweetly, come
to me come to me..love will lead us, alright.  love will
lead us, she will lead us.  can you hear the dolphin's
cry?  see the road rise up to meet us its in the air we
breathe tonight love will lead us, she will lead us"
                            -Live, "The Dolphin's Cry"

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: PowerSurfr - High Speed Internet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: larso@commodore.                                  03-Dec-99 08:31:09
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 05:15:15
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg)

As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw cbzh@my-deja.com write:
>   larso@ualberta.ca wrote:

> > > So I must have _willingly_ bought the two never used and never needed -
> > > but surely paid for! - Win95 licenses I still have somewhere around,
> > > because there was actually no gun around anywhere??!
> >
> > Well, through what mechanism did Microsoft force you to purchase the
> > product?  Where was your free choice removed?  Was your free choice
> > removed at the point where you wanted to usurp the free choices of others?
> 
> _YOU_ should answer this question!

Okay, your free choice was not usurped, you chose to purchase a product.  You
also chose to purchase a product you say you didn't want.  Do you often
purchase products you don't really want?

>                                      Didn't you see that I gave you 100%
> right? I can only repeat: Neither guns nor governments were involved,
> thus no monopoly power - just following your own logic!

Yes, and you would therefore be right.

> > > I still cannot see why I should have spent money for these licenses, but
> > > maybe I still wanted them unconsciously?? Or it was in a moment that I
> > > felt some kind of pity with poor Billy boy and I just wanted to make a
> > > free donation for him???
> >
> > Well, why did you pay the fucking money?
> 
> Strange thing, isn't it? People are donating money to a company that
> neither forces them with guns nor being supported by a government?

They aren't really donating.  They are paying for a product.  Whether or not
the consumer WANTS or will USE the product isn't the manufacturer's business.

> > > Still not understanding my motivation thus - but it was sure no monopoly
> > > power that was forcing me - "because monopolies are always imposed by
> > > governments" (never contradict the Ormberg dogma!), and our government
> > > sure would have allowed selling computers without Windows licenses!!!
> >
> > You can sell a computer without Windows licences.
> >
> > I helped a friend set such a machine up less than a week ago.
> 
> Sure I can, if I am ready to pay the extra cost

Yeah, tough luck.  It isn't Microsoft's problem if competing products are
more expensive.

>                                                     I can just buy the
> Toshiba notebook that fits my needs best, format the HD and throw the
> Windows CD immediately in the trash can! This doesn't change the fact
> that I have paid for a Windows license that way!

Or you can purchase a computer that doesn't involve any sort of Windows
licence.  As I said, I set up such a machine a couple weeks back.  There was
no Windows CD to throw away because there was no Windows CD because there
was no Windows.

-- 
Lars P. Ormberg     ICQ#:8827066
mailto:larso@ualberta.ca
The University of Lars:   http://www.ualberta.ca/~larso/

"The way you're bathed in light, reminds me of that night
God laid me down into your rose garden of trust and I was
swept away with nothin' left to say some helpless fool
yeah I was lost in a swoon of peace you're all I need to
find so when the time is right come to me sweetly, come
to me come to me..love will lead us, alright.  love will
lead us, she will lead us.  can you hear the dolphin's
cry?  see the road rise up to meet us its in the air we
breathe tonight love will lead us, she will lead us"
                            -Live, "The Dolphin's Cry"

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: PowerSurfr - High Speed Internet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: larso@commodore.                                  03-Dec-99 08:40:19
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 05:15:15
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg)

As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw letoured@nospam.net write:
> >>seberREMOVETHIS@sympatico.ca (E. Barry Bruyea) said:
> 
> >And if you ordered a Chevy from General Motors, and told the dealer you
> >wanted a Bosch Alternator, guess what?  You'd still have to pay for the
> >Delco Alternator the car came with.  The dealer is not going to take the
> >hit for the cost of the OE.  Your compaint falls under the 'Gee Whiz'
> >category.
> 
> Baloney. You MS guys are out of touch with reality. The MS case is about
> MS forcing its products on manufacturers.

You don't even know what "force" means.  By your measure, if tomorrow you go
to McDonalds and order a Big Mac, you have just been 'forced' to buy a Big
Mac (or, in a nice semantical sidestep, you have been 'forced' to pay three
bucks for a Big Mac).  But you weren't forced.  An offer of sale was
available.  You agreed to the terms.

-- 
Lars P. Ormberg     ICQ#:8827066
mailto:larso@ualberta.ca
The University of Lars:   http://www.ualberta.ca/~larso/

"The way you're bathed in light, reminds me of that night
God laid me down into your rose garden of trust and I was
swept away with nothin' left to say some helpless fool
yeah I was lost in a swoon of peace you're all I need to
find so when the time is right come to me sweetly, come
to me come to me..love will lead us, alright.  love will
lead us, she will lead us.  can you hear the dolphin's
cry?  see the road rise up to meet us its in the air we
breathe tonight love will lead us, she will lead us"
                            -Live, "The Dolphin's Cry"

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: PowerSurfr - High Speed Internet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: larso@commodore.                                  03-Dec-99 08:44:25
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 05:15:15
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg)

As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw cbzh@my-deja.com write:

> I.e.: Physical weapons are needed to maintain a monopoly!

Force, or coercion, is required to maintain a monopoly.  Nobody can use
arbitrary force legally, except for government.

-- 
Lars P. Ormberg     ICQ#:8827066
mailto:larso@ualberta.ca
The University of Lars:   http://www.ualberta.ca/~larso/

"The way you're bathed in light, reminds me of that night
God laid me down into your rose garden of trust and I was
swept away with nothin' left to say some helpless fool
yeah I was lost in a swoon of peace you're all I need to
find so when the time is right come to me sweetly, come
to me come to me..love will lead us, alright.  love will
lead us, she will lead us.  can you hear the dolphin's
cry?  see the road rise up to meet us its in the air we
breathe tonight love will lead us, she will lead us"
                            -Live, "The Dolphin's Cry"

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: PowerSurfr - High Speed Internet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: larso@commodore.                                  03-Dec-99 08:51:23
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 05:15:15
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg)

As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw letoured@nospam.net write:
> Chris J Delanoy <cdelanoy@ualberta.ca> said:

> >Explain how markets can create "monopolies" which can SIMULTANEOUSLY
> >charge prices that are too high AND too low - which are among the
> >so-called "facts" cited by Judge Jackson.
> 
> Its in the Findings of Fact. The price is higher then it needs to be for
> the public

If you aren't leaving the issue of how high something "needs to be" to the
free market, who are you leaving it to, and why do they get to impose "needs
to be" upon both consumers and producers.

>              and either too low for companies that don't sell anything but
> Windows

How is a price "too low"?  Should I return the Aero bar I bought today for
$.35 (4/$1.40 special) because I didn't pay enough for it?

Of course not, because the only one who can decide a price is lower than it
needs to be is the market, the complex interplay between consumer and
producer.

I want to buy Windows with Office included for $0.02.
MS wants to sell me Windows for $18,000,000, with Office for an additional
12 million bucks.

But we have to make concessions.  Microsoft has to lower its price until it
is at the stage that people want to buy, or else they will quickly falter
out of business.

>                                   or Wincrap is not sold to them at all.

If you want the free choice to choose not to buy Windows, you have to accept
that Microsoft has the free choice not to sell it to you (and I mean you,
specifically.  As in, Bill Gates rings my doorbell tomorrow selling me
Windows 98.  You come up the walk and ask if Bill has more copies for sale.
He says "yes, but you cannot have them" and walks away.  Tough bananas.

> >He didn't get any such franchise from any government.  And he therefore
> >has no monopoly powers whatsoever.  If you don't believe me, then there's
> >a simple experiment you can conduct:  stop buying Microsoft products, and
> >stop paying taxes.  Then wait and see who comes after you for your money
> >and with what weapons.
> 
> So this is your proof that there is free market and no monoply!   E.g., If
> there is no use or threat of force there is a free market?

If everyone from you to Microsoft Inc. is allowed to use their property as
they see fit, it is a free market.

-- 
Lars P. Ormberg     ICQ#:8827066
mailto:larso@ualberta.ca
The University of Lars:   http://www.ualberta.ca/~larso/

"The way you're bathed in light, reminds me of that night
God laid me down into your rose garden of trust and I was
swept away with nothin' left to say some helpless fool
yeah I was lost in a swoon of peace you're all I need to
find so when the time is right come to me sweetly, come
to me come to me..love will lead us, alright.  love will
lead us, she will lead us.  can you hear the dolphin's
cry?  see the road rise up to meet us its in the air we
breathe tonight love will lead us, she will lead us"
                            -Live, "The Dolphin's Cry"

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: PowerSurfr - High Speed Internet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: larso@commodore.                                  03-Dec-99 08:58:16
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 05:15:15
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg)

As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw Bob Germer write:
>    Chris J Delanoy <cdelanoy@ualberta.ca> said:

> > Then wait.  Then see who comes after you for your money, and with what
> > weapons.  Perhaps then you'll see what force is and why neither
> > Microsoft nor any other private enterprise has any such power.
> 
> What an assinine analogy. It is preposterous! You are comparing oranges
> and lima beans.
> 
> If I do not wish to enrich Mr. Gates and his illegal monopoly, I cannot
> buy a Toshiba, IBM, Dell, Gateway, etc., etc.

Correct, because these businesses have chosen to sell only
Microsoft-enriched products.  You can not buy a Windows-free Toshiba because
Toshiba has agreed to sell systems only with Windows.  You cannot bully
Toshiba into doing something they do not wish to do, any more than Microsoft
can bully you into doing something that you do not wish to do.

Here's the catch: you have no inherent right to receive a Toshiba product.
If Toshiba wants to sell something that you want to buy at an agreed upon
exchange, it will be sold.  Otherwise, it will not.  Is this following along
quite well?

> If I want to expand my business or my clients do with most name brand
> computers, I and they must pay for Windows whether we wish to use it or
> not.

You have already made the choice to "wish" to use it, though, when you
decided that you wanted to limit yourself to Windows-equipped computers in
the first place.

>         Thus my clients and I are forced to support someone we have no wish
> to support. That, sir, is force.

How are they forced?

Here's a reminder: you aren't forced to make the best choice, and if you
choose the best choice (Windows-equipped machines) then you aren't doing
anything out of force.

> At one time, licensed monopolies controlled our telephone systems here in
> the US.

Without a licence, they could not have been a monopoly.

> I have a choice of electric suppliers now and my rates have gone down 15%
> in the past 3 months.

An excellent testimonial to the government steering clear of businesses and
their customers.

So WHY DO YOU WANT TO REVERSE THAT WITH MICROSOFT?

-- 
Lars P. Ormberg     ICQ#:8827066
mailto:larso@ualberta.ca
The University of Lars:   http://www.ualberta.ca/~larso/

"The way you're bathed in light, reminds me of that night
God laid me down into your rose garden of trust and I was
swept away with nothin' left to say some helpless fool
yeah I was lost in a swoon of peace you're all I need to
find so when the time is right come to me sweetly, come
to me come to me..love will lead us, alright.  love will
lead us, she will lead us.  can you hear the dolphin's
cry?  see the road rise up to meet us its in the air we
breathe tonight love will lead us, she will lead us"
                            -Live, "The Dolphin's Cry"

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: PowerSurfr - High Speed Internet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: hamei@pacbell.net                                 03-Dec-99 09:51:11
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 10:26:26
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: hamei@pacbell.net

In <38470425_2@news.cadvision.com>, "Steven C. Britton"
<sbritton@cadvision.com> writes:
>
>The "Corporate Geniuses" at the top of the "food chain", as you put it are
>there and get paid the big bucks because it's their necks on the line if the
>corporation fails: they're the ones who carry the greatest financial risk:
>and the fundamental law of risk-taking is that the higher the risk, the
>bigger the reward.
>

You are a certified victim of a clandestine frontal lobotomy. I can name 
ten large corporations bankrupted by their megalomaniacal CEO's off 
the top of my head and in every single case the CEO walked home the 
proud possessor of several million dollars. Conversely you cannot name ONE 
CEO of a large failed corporation in the last ten years who has taken a 
financial hit.


>>
>Work better: Work union-free.
>
>Steven C. Britton
>Calgary
>
>www.cadvision.com/sbritton
>
>
>


--
hrad ngravvd

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: SBC Internet Services (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: hamei@pacbell.net                                 03-Dec-99 10:12:14
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 10:26:26
Subj: Re: Java 1.2 for OS/2

From: hamei@pacbell.net

In <3846538C.3BAB3A0B@opera.no>, =?iso-8859-1?Q?Bj=F8rn?= Vermo <bv@opera.no>
writes:
>hamei@pacbell.net wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> for the rest of us as-yet unindoctrinated Americans I'd like to apologize
>> for Mr Germer.  To my knowledge "sophisticated" has never been
>> successfully applied to the philistine mentality displayed by the small-
>> shopkeeper 'investment' community. 
>
>On the other hand, it is quite possible that he was applying what is
>known as "irony" - a type of humour which is admittedly rather more
>common on this side of the big water.

ah ha ! a more entertaining alternative than the grasping curmudgeon
my monitor was displaying. Your interpretation is preferable, maybe this 
is a good time for them rose-coloured glasses  :-) 

--
hrad ngravvd

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: SBC Internet Services (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: nykisle@attglobal.net                             03-Dec-99 22:06:28
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 10:26:26
Subj: Re: Replacement Disks

From: nykisle@attglobal.net

I have ver 3 red spine on disks and ver 3
blue spine on cd and do you mean the
first disk which is not numbered, just
called installation or the second disk
numbered  "1".
I can send it to your email address after
 I read netscape to find out how too attach it .

jspepper@my-deja.com wrote:

> I just purchased OS/2 Warp 3 from eBay.  Disk #1 is unusable.
> Does IBM offer replacement disks?  Would someone be willing
> to make me a disk image of their disk #1.
>
> aTdHvAaNnKcSe,
>
> --
> Jeff
>
> Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
> Before you buy.

--
-
-
- Regards
                RonN


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Global Network Services - Remote Access Mail & Ne
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: letoured@nospam.net                               03-Dec-99 01:33:12
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 10:26:26
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: letoured@nospam.net

noyb@noyb.no (None Of Your Business) said:

>BTW, I can't think of anyone I know who's been killed by a gun.

Unless you're drug dealer or friends with them, what is your point? Other
then to show you're a near moron by using an association that has no
relevance.  


>letoured@nospam.net wrote in <38471bea$1$yrgbherq$mr2ice@news.sover.net>:
>>BTW, I can't think of corporation that failed except when the big bucks
>>guys didn't know what the business was about, or refused to accept changes
>>in the market. 

_____________
Ed Letourneau <letoured@sover.net>

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: bCandid - Powering the world's discussions - http
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com                           03-Dec-99 08:07:09
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 10:26:26
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com>

On <8273ns$d5t$2@dagger.ab.videon.ca>, on 12/03/99 at 12:43 AM,
   larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) said:

> Here's a hint, US LAW DEFINING MONOPOLIES is the entire problem!  I'm
> not trying to argue that MS is acting legally, but rather that its
> actions should never have been illegal in the first place.

You have absolutely no say in what our laws are or ought to be. You are a
Canadian, a foreigner. I do not presume to tell you what your laws should
provide and you have no right to do so to the United States.

Our citizens decided that actions such as MicroSoft has been proven to
engage in violate laws we found necessary for our society. If the majority
of our citizens speaking via their respective Senators and Congressmen and
our President decide what MS is doing is illegal, it is illegal no matter
what a brain dead idiot from a foreign country thinks.

Why don't you do something about your Soverign's laws against a blind
person bringing his or her guide dog into England? You're her subject.

--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: bobg@Pics.com
Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 12
MR/2 Ice Registration Number 67
Aut Pax Aut Bellum
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: jmalloy@borg.com                                  03-Dec-99 08:10:13
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 10:26:26
Subj: Re: Why can't Germer compute?

From: "Joe Malloy" <jmalloy@borg.com>

Gads, this Germer fellow's a real bore.  How can someone claims to be a
"computer professional" and yet be stuck with buying Windows each and every
time he assembles a computer?  Inquiring minds want to know!  I, too, got my
last two machines with no OS installed, but I guess I'm even smarter than
Germer himself...

- Joe

Jeff Glatt <jglatt@spamgone-borg.com> wrote in message
news:3848df93.1343048@news.borg.com...
> >Bob Germer
> >Try buying an Intel based computer without paying
> >for Windows.
>
> I do it all of the time. But that's because I'm clearly MUCH more
> competent than a phony like you who lies about his alleged experience
> in setting up and maintaining computers


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com                           03-Dec-99 07:52:25
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 10:26:27
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com>

On <8280no$cou$9@burn.ab.videon.ca>, on 12/03/99 at 08:58 AM,
   larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) said:

> You cannot bully
> Toshiba into doing something they do not wish to do, any more than
> Microsoft can bully you into doing something that you do not wish to
> do.


Bullshit. Has the cold weather frozen your brain or do you refuse to read
the testimony from the OEM's summarized in the Findings of Fact.

--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: bobg@Pics.com
Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 12
MR/2 Ice Registration Number 67
Aut Pax Aut Bellum
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com                           03-Dec-99 07:55:15
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 10:26:27
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com>

On <827vi9$cou$4@burn.ab.videon.ca>, on 12/03/99 at 08:38 AM,
   larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) said:

> Lars P. Ormberg     ICQ#:8827066
> mailto:larso@ualberta.ca
> The University of Lars:   http://www.ualberta.ca/~larso/

I have just sent 30 of your messages to the President of the University of
Alberta via snail mail asking him to investigate your qualifications.

--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: bobg@Pics.com
Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 12
MR/2 Ice Registration Number 67
Aut Pax Aut Bellum
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com                           03-Dec-99 08:04:27
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 10:26:27
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com>

On <3845D267.DB45DB8B@hotmail.com>, on 12/03/99 at 01:59 AM,
   Bob Davies <mktorg@hotmail.com> said:

> Only NOW can you buy a computer without an MS DOS or Windows licence -
> but it took thousands of protests and government action. If I recall
> correctly the action was taken under the RESTRAINT of TRADE laws. 

Not from Gateway or Dell. I just called both of them trying to buy a
system without Windows. Other than multiple (more than 20 machines) or
very high end servers, you must buy either Win98 (most models) or NT 4.

--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: bobg@Pics.com
Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 12
MR/2 Ice 2.01 Registration Number 67
Aut Pax Aut Bellum
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: siberREMOVETHIS@sympatico.ca                      03-Dec-99 13:41:14
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 10:46:24
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: siberREMOVETHIS@sympatico.ca (E. Barry Bruyea)

On Fri, 03 Dec 1999 08:07:19 -0500, Bob Germer
<bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com> wrote:

>On <8273ns$d5t$2@dagger.ab.videon.ca>, on 12/03/99 at 12:43 AM,
>   larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) said:
>
>> Here's a hint, US LAW DEFINING MONOPOLIES is the entire problem!  I'm
>> not trying to argue that MS is acting legally, but rather that its
>> actions should never have been illegal in the first place.
>
>You have absolutely no say in what our laws are or ought to be. You are a
>Canadian, a foreigner. I do not presume to tell you what your laws should
>provide and you have no right to do so to the United States.
>
>Our citizens decided that actions such as MicroSoft has been proven to
>engage in violate laws we found necessary for our society. If the majority
>of our citizens speaking via their respective Senators and Congressmen and
>our President decide what MS is doing is illegal, it is illegal no matter
>what a brain dead idiot from a foreign country thinks.
>
>Why don't you do something about your Soverign's laws against a blind
>person bringing his or her guide dog into England? You're her subject.

Yes, that's almost as bad as forbidding a Canadian writer entry into
the U.S. because he was a dues paying member to Greenpeace.  There's
danger all around us, isn't there?

>
>--
>------------------------------------------------------------------------------
----------------
>Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: bobg@Pics.com
>Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 12
>MR/2 Ice Registration Number 67
>Aut Pax Aut Bellum
>------------------------------------------------------------------------------
----------------
>

EBB

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Sympatico (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com                           03-Dec-99 08:12:18
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 10:46:24
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com>

On <jORXtcYCR8l4-pn2-Hxs5ylwUzsIP@SPHERICALBURN.TAMPABAY.RR.COM>, on
12/02/99 at 08:39 PM,
   donnelly@tampabay.rr.com (Buddy Donnelly) said:

> And a long list of other improvements on the natural exploitation and 
> sub-human treatment those Dashing Bold Mustachioed Capitalist  employers
> of yours will use, whenever allowed, untrammelled by law or  the evil of
> simple Collective Bargaining, on the class of sad  disadvantaged
> peasants who have to come to work in their factories to  put a daily
> scrap of bread on their families' tables.

How come, Buddy, if what you rant on about were true that trade unions now
represent less than 20% of the American workforce when it was more than
50% not that long ago?

How come so many former teamsters are now owner-operators of their own
trucks and making two or more times what they did as teamsters just 4 or 5
years ago?

How come, Buddy, if what you say were true does it cost some school
districts more per child for public school education than the tuition at
the most prestigious private schools?

How come when our Liberal Democrat township government decided to contract
out trash pickup our taxes went down when the formerly unionized "civil
servants" were laid off? This action was not taken by capitalists. Our
seven man Township Committee is composed of 6 Democrats and one
independent. Two of the Democrats are members of the NEA and NJEA, 1 is a
member of the International Associaton of Electrical Workers, a fourth is
a member of the Operating Engineers. Yet the vote was 7-0 to privatize
trash pickup rather than raise taxes 7%.

One of my neighbors who drives a brand new Lexus and a $300,000 tractor
formerly was a teamster. He saved his money and bought his own used
tractor and went into business for himself about 5 years ago. He arranges
his own contracts with shippers, chooses where he will and will no go,
what he will and will not haul, and when he will and will not travel. Most
importantly, he nets better than 3 times what he took home when working
for a union trucking company.

How come more and more union employees are now owners of the very
businesses the union forced out of business? There used to be a chain of
supermarkets called A&P throughout metropolitan Philadelphia as well as
nationally. It went bankrupt and sold many of the stores to the members of
the Retail Clerks Union and is now an employee operated company. The
worker/owners are making more money than before, getting higher wages than
they formerly did, have better benefits, and the stores are profitable.
Why? Because those owner/operators of those stores can fire workers who do
not meet minimum performance standards among other things. Because the
featherbedding forced on A&P by strikes has been eliminated.

One of my best friend's father and grandfather were in the road
construction and later general contracting business. They operated two
companies. One was union, the other non-union. They paid the same hourly
rate to workers of both companies but no union dues for the non-union
companies. They were able to perform most contracts for 20% less with the
non-union companies because they could demand better production from the
non-union employees than from the unionized ones. Their bricklayers
working for the union company were limited to laying 450 pieces of jumbo
brick (commercial buildings as opposed to single family homes) per 8 hour
day. The non-union men averaged well over 700 bricks a day. If the union
bricklayers produced more than the union approved 450 pieces a day, they
were fined by the local.

Under the union rules of the Operating Engineers, a bulldozer pulling a
pan (a huge scraper which removed dirt) required two operators and two
oilers even though the pan had no engine and nothing for an oiler to do by
the mid 1960's and the bulldozers no longer required servicing more than
once a week other than refueling. Thus a union contractor had to pay the
wages of four men where a non-union contractor had to pay only one plus a
small allowance for weekly maintenance equivalent to about 5 hours work
per week.

Under the rules of the Railway workers, freight trains required an
engineer, a fireman, a headend brakeman, a rear end brakeman, and a
conductor as a minimum crew even if the train only constituted an engine
and a caboose. The fireman's job disappeared with the last steam engine.
The brakeman jobs died before the turn of the current century with the
mandatory adoption of air brakes controlled solely by the engineer. The
caboose disappeared everywhere but the US in the 1950's because it was
nothing more than a waste of money, fuel, and wear and tear on the rails.
Only after every railroad in the northeast went bankrupt did the
government force changes in those featherbedding work rules when it was
forced to take over those railroads. Now the only place one sees a caboose
is on some freight lines where they have to drop off and pick up cars from
a one-way single track where the load has to be pushed across grade
crossings coming or going. We have two pipe plants which are served by
such a line in Burlington County. Conrail parks a caboose on the siding so
that the conductor can see where the train is going, hop off to make sure
traffic stops at two crossings, etc. When they leave the plant, they leave
the caboose on the siding, pick up what's left of the train, and go on.

The Pennsylvania Railroad, the New York Central, the Reading, the
Erie-Lackawanna, the Delaware and Hudson, the Central of New Jersey, the
New York New Haven and Hartford, the Long Island, and others whose names I
forget were all forced into bankruptcy by 1976 despite having been
relieved of the costs of carrying passengers by Amtrack earlier in the
1970's. Conrail became profitable in less than a decade despite having to
pay billions of dollars to remedy deferred right of way maintenance which
the bankrupt roads neglected trying to stay in business, paying billions
of dollars to upgrade bridges, signalling systems, etc.

Look at the airlines. I can cite at least 10 formerly major carriers who
were forced into bankruptcy or merger by labor costs. Ever hear of
Eastern? PanAM? Northeast? Lake Central? Braniff? Air West? Seaboard?
Mohawk? Capitol? Southern? Even TWA barely survived and then only by
having the employees take over ownership of the company. Isn't it
interesting that the owners of TWA were all members of one union or
another before they took over, eliminated featherbedding, changed work
rules to demand 8 hours work for 8 hours pay, gave up significant portions
of their salaries, etc. before the line became profitable.

Look at the automobile industry. Until the near bankruptcy of Chrysler in
the late 70's forced the UAW into major wage and work rule concessions the
UAW forbid the manufacturers to automate, forced a separate worker for
every job on the floor, forbade idle workers from doing things like
sweeping the floor, emptying trash cans, etc. It took nearly 3 times as
many man-hours to produce a car in 1980 than it does today. The quality of
those cars was crap compared to what the big 3 turn out today. Once the
cuckhold of the UAW was eliminated and the Big 3 could institute sane work
rules, hold workers accountable for the quality of their workmanship,
replaced inefficient hand labor with automated machines, the quality of
the cars increased by orders of magnitude, the cost in real dollars went
down despite inclusion of costly items such as airbags, etc.

Remember 1981? Remember what happened when the air traffic controllers
walked out? Remember what happened when replacement workers were hired? In
case your forget, the system functioned and functioned well. In fact,
there have been fewer mid-air collisions of planes under ATC control since
1981 than there were in the previous 10 years despite the traffic
increasing 4 fold since that time. In the latter half of the Carter
Administration, the union had forced the FAA to accept a contract where a
worker in a "high stress" assignment only worked 2 hours of his or her 8
hour shift. The other 6 hours were spent in "recurrent training" which
consisted of playing gin, reading magazines, shooting the bull, etc. for
the most part as evidenced by testimony before several Congressional
committees. The rate of medically related disability retirements was
nearly 20% per year. Well, now the rate is less than 7% for the last 15
years and the safety record is better despite much more frequent equipment
failures due to antiquated equipment which should have been retired 10 or
more years ago, despite a huge increase in the number of operations into
and out of every major airport, despite a huge increase in corporate jet
traffic, despite a huge increase in the number of foreign carriers serving
more and more US airports, despite the virtual lack of any new runways at
all but a handful of terminals.

The most congested metropolitan areas, New York and Los Angeles, have the
exact same number of runways as they had in 1981. The same is true of
Washington, Philadelphia (although a commuter plane only runway is under
construction there scheduled to open this time next year), Chicago,
Atlanta, Miami, Orlando, Dallas Fort Worth, San Francisco. Of the airports
I regularly flew into, only Charlotte and Pittsburgh come to mind as
having added new runways in the past 18 years.

Unions are good? Bull!



There was a time when workers needed protection from employer abuse and
unions served a useful function. That time is past as shown by the decline
in union membership. By far the largest category of union membership is
among government employees or quasi government employees. Among the
Communication Workers which represent far more "civil servants" than
workers in the communications field, another union whose name I cannot
recall (something about State, County, and Municipal workers), and the NEA
and the NFT there are more members than all industrial workers combined.



--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: bobg@Pics.com
Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 12
MR/2 Ice Registration Number 67
Aut Pax Aut Bellum
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com                           03-Dec-99 09:23:06
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 10:46:24
Subj: Re: Why can't Germer compute?

From: Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com>

On <3847c174.0@nntp2.borg.com>, on 12/03/99 at 08:10 AM,
   "Joe Malloy" <jmalloy@borg.com> said:


> Gads, this Germer fellow's a real bore.  How can someone claims to be a
> "computer professional" and yet be stuck with buying Windows each and
> every time he assembles a computer?  Inquiring minds want to know!  I,
> too, got my last two machines with no OS installed, but I guess I'm even
> smarter than Germer himself...

I neve said I had to buy Monopows when I assemble a computer. I said I had
to buy it whenever I BOUGHT a computer to fulfill a contract with a
client, many of whom require certain name-brand only hardware. I said I am
forced to buy it whenever I purchase a notebook computer from a recognized
manufacturer. It takes a minimum of 10 man-hours to order parts, inventory
them, build the machine, install an operating system, test, and package
for shipment a computer we assemble. Not including the cost of the space
the employees occupy, it costs us a minimum of $175 to do this job which
is more than the margin vs. buying a system and drop shipping it to our
clients in most instances. 

Also, if we have a problem with a failed component and we built the
machine, we have to absorb the costs of inventory of replacements,
diagnosis and repair, and the cost of securing replacement from the
manufacturer. With name brand machines, service contracts with third party
vendors are available and we generally recommend them for our clients too
small to have an MIS repairman on staff.

If we build a machine and the motherboard goes south, our reputation is on
the line. If Dell or IBM or HP etc. built the machine, it's not our
problem. If Xerox or CompUSA, etc. fail to provide good service, our
reputation is not harmed. If we cannot supply a part overnight or sooner,
our reputation is hurt.

Take a Pentium 100 built in 1995 which has an integrated clock and CMOS
battery package typical of those days. We cannot readily find an AT format
Socket 7 motherboard with 4 ISA slots using SIMM memory. The cost of
replacement thus involves new motherboard, new memory, new expansion
cards, and lately a new case/powersupply as well as AT format motherboards
become less and less available. If it's our machine, the repair costs as
much or nearly as much as scrapping the machine and replacing it. But if
it is an IBM, Dell, etc. under service contract, it costs the client
nothing more than lost time.

When a client has a problem with a name-brand machine or third party
service, we frequently will provide a temporary replacement from our own
shop, restore the software from backups or install the customer's hard
drive in the loaner, and keep him running until his machine is repaired.
This enhances our reputation and sometimes does lead to sales of our
machines. By choosing suppliers carefully and only using components
successfully used in house, we keep failures to a minimum, thankfully.

But when we supply those name-brand machines, we pay $30 or so for Windows
we don't want, need, or have use for now or in the foreseeable future.



--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: bobg@Pics.com
Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 12
MR/2 Ice Registration Number 67
Aut Pax Aut Bellum
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com                           03-Dec-99 10:01:22
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 10:46:24
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com>

On <38469645_1@news.cadvision.com>, on 12/02/99 at 08:54 AM,
   "Steven C. Britton" <sbritton@cadvision.com> said:

> Bob Germer wrote:
> >
> > No, it sends people to the manufacturers and vendors of computers forcing
> > them to include Windows on every machine they sell or pay four times as
> > much for Windows.

> That's not coercive.  It's a package deal.  Microsoft can't force
> computer distributors to put Windows on their machines; but they _can_
> say that "if you sell a computer with windows, we'll give you a massive
> discount on it".

Which is a direct violation of U. S. Fair Trade Laws which prohibit a
vendor from charging different prices to two customers for the same
quantiy of merchandise.





--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: bobg@Pics.com
Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 12
MR/2 Ice Registration Number 67
Aut Pax Aut Bellum
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: letoured@nospam.net                               03-Dec-99 07:24:15
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 10:46:24
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: letoured@nospam.net

larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) said:

>> According to you (and MS) all the judges, all the prosecutors -- from the
>> Federal government and 19 states, not to mention the people conducting
>> on-going investigations in several other nations are ALL WRONG and poor,
>> poor Billy is just an good old boy trying hard to bring new things to us
>> all -- and everyone else is just a bunch of meanies who want to stop him.

>Yes, this pretty much summarizes how the DOJ operates.  It doesn't help
>when anti-trust laws make it easy for a bureaucrat with a desire for
>greatness to ruin the world.

If you nuts in Canada don't like US laws then don't come here, either
physically or electronically -- unless ofcores it is to take courses in US
history, law, and economics which you surly have no concept of.

The truth is that you see the world the way you want it and not the way it
is -- all you and couple of other trolls are doing here is whining that it
doesn't work they way you want it to. Guess what? It ain't ever going to
work your way and MS is going to be broken up or PAYBACK billions before
this is done, so get over it. 

You characters also reminds me of the US right-wing loony tunes who ran
around after our 1992 election saying Clinton wasn't a real president
because he didn't receive at least 50% of the votes -- and never had the
the good sense to shut up when it it was pointed out that two of their
dear ones; Nixon and Thather weren't  legitimate leaders either based on
that standard. Did they shut up. No. They continued until they lost all
credibility as intelligent people. You have done the same to yourself.



>> I'll repeat a question posted elsewhere. If there is no monopoly then how
>> come no one can get a refund for unused copies of Wincrap?  The licence
>> that comes with it says you don't agree with it you can get a refund --
>> But no one I've ever heard of can get it.

I'm still waiting for an answer. Why doesn't MS honor their terms boys?


_____________
Ed Letourneau <letoured@sover.net>

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: bCandid - Powering the world's discussions - http
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bv@opera.no                                       03-Dec-99 14:28:17
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 10:46:24
Subj: Re: IBM U.S. Announcement Letter

From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Bj=F8rn?= Vermo <bv@opera.no>

e-frog wrote:
> 
> 
> This is one part I do like about IBM, they support older stuff for long,
> long periods of time (support for Win95 ran out waay before even Warp 3),
> they provide sufficient time warning of withdrawal for support and provide
> a recommended (if not desired) upgrade path. I do not get this with _any_
> of the Windows s/w vendors.

What I REALLY like is that they tell you up front when you buy the
software how long the will (at least) support it.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: siberREMOVETHIS@sympatico.ca                      03-Dec-99 13:38:16
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 10:46:24
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: siberREMOVETHIS@sympatico.ca (E. Barry Bruyea)

On Fri, 03 Dec 1999 07:52:50 -0500, Bob Germer
<bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com> wrote:

>On <8280no$cou$9@burn.ab.videon.ca>, on 12/03/99 at 08:58 AM,
>   larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) said:
>
>> You cannot bully
>> Toshiba into doing something they do not wish to do, any more than
>> Microsoft can bully you into doing something that you do not wish to
>> do.
>
>
>Bullshit. Has the cold weather frozen your brain or do you refuse to read
>the testimony from the OEM's summarized in the Findings of Fact.

And, of course, OEM's have nothing to gain from trashing MS, do they?
And the  so called 'Finding Of Fact' is primarily based on OEM
submissions, who as we all know, would be above using false
information salted with a little hyperbole in those documents.  I'll
bet you believe in the Tooth Fairy.




EBB

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Sympatico (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: glend@nospam.direct.ca                            03-Dec-99 06:05:15
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 10:46:24
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: Glenn Davies <glend@nospam.direct.ca>

On Fri, 03 Dec 1999 13:38:32 GMT, siberREMOVETHIS@sympatico.ca (E.
Barry Bruyea) wrote:

>On Fri, 03 Dec 1999 07:52:50 -0500, Bob Germer
><bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com> wrote:
>
>>On <8280no$cou$9@burn.ab.videon.ca>, on 12/03/99 at 08:58 AM,
>>   larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) said:
>>
>>> You cannot bully
>>> Toshiba into doing something they do not wish to do, any more than
>>> Microsoft can bully you into doing something that you do not wish to
>>> do.
>>
>>
>>Bullshit. Has the cold weather frozen your brain or do you refuse to read
>>the testimony from the OEM's summarized in the Findings of Fact.
>
>And, of course, OEM's have nothing to gain from trashing MS, do they?
>And the  so called 'Finding Of Fact' is primarily based on OEM
>submissions, who as we all know, would be above using false
>information salted with a little hyperbole in those documents.  I'll
>bet you believe in the Tooth Fairy.
>

Actually, since they still all depend on the good graces of MS it was
hard to get them to talk. If you had followed the trial you would have
seen that many OEM employees were reluctent to talk and some whose
initial depositions were damaging to MS tried to downplay or "clarify"
their statements later. And MS used some OEM testimony for their
defense or where those the ones that contained the false information
that you're implying?


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: via Internet Direct - http://www.mydirect.com/ (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: robin.hinde@nzpca.org.nz                          03-Dec-99 22:16:00
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 10:46:24
Subj: Re: RC5DES setup

From: robin.hinde@nzpca.org.nz (ROBIN HINDE)

peter volsted <pvolsted@image.dk> wrote:

PV>> On Tue, 30 Nov 1999 14:57:50 +0000 (GMT), Roland Pinches wrote:
PV>>
PV>> ->Can anyone suggest how to setup InJoy and RC5DES so that after a couple
PV>> ->minutes idle time, the connection will close?
PV>> ->
PV>> ->Seems a shame to waste all this processing power...
PV>>

PV>I have made a 'manual' instance of InJoy thus:
PV>Open InJoy.  Click on New. Name for ex. Def Org and Save.
PV>Open your DOD-InJoy and without making changes Save as Default.
PV>Click on New. Name for ex. Manual - in the DOD-section remove the x's and
th
PV>Save.

Why not use the *best* scheduler for OS/2 to automate the whole process.
NYTS is easily capable of launching your dialler, or RC5DES -update.
Best scheduler I know of, period. First class, cannot recommend it
highly enough.

Then use the *best* OS/2 dialler, InJoy. Make a specific host entry (say
DESupdate) and ensure the start-per-host settings include "RC5DES
-update" and ensure that idle before disconnect is a suitably short
period. (Forget this if using DOD over a network, otherwise - is DOD
really required?)

Make NYTS launch InJoy with "D:/DIR/InJoy.exe DESupdate". Easy.

While you are at it, do a similar thing for automatically adjusting your
PC clock using NTP.

PV>When time to update, start your manual InJoy, then stop Rc5DES with Ctl-C,
a
PV>give the command: RC5DES -update. Then restart RC5DES and stop InJoy.
PV>It usually lasts around 22 seconds in my case.

No need to stop the first instance of the RC5 client, updates will
occur just fine in a second instance.
---
 * OLX 2.1 TD * (robin.hinde@nzpca.org.nz      3:771/1680)

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: MegaBaud BBS, NZPCA, Wellington, New Zealand, 64-
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com                           03-Dec-99 09:20:27
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 10:46:24
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com>

On <81v3ip$bq7$1@nnrp1.deja.com>, on 11/29/99 at 11:51 PM,
   Chris J Delanoy <cdelanoy@ualberta.ca> said:


> IBM lost it's market dominance before the persecution against it by the
> US government was even half-completed.  The idea that anti-trust jihads
> by Justice bureaucats have increased competition is an absolute joke. 
> On the contrary, more than any other single law, the Sherman Anti-Trust
> Act and it's successors have set the standard in -destroying-
> competition.

Another totally unqualified Canuck spreading lies about our laws. For your
information, you asshole, the two suits instituted by the DOJ were started
in January 1953 and January 1969 on the last day of the Truman and Johnson
administrations. MicroSoft was not started until 1976 by which time IBM
and the DOJ had long since entered into consent agreements ending the
suits.


--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: bobg@Pics.com
Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 12
MR/2 Ice Registration Number 67
Aut Pax Aut Bellum
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com                           03-Dec-99 09:43:04
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 10:46:24
Subj: Re: IBM U.S. Announcement Letter

From: Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com>

On <3847C582.79D0B0D8@opera.no>, on 12/03/99 at 02:28 PM,
   Bjrn Vermo <bv@opera.no> said:

> e-frog wrote:
> > 
> > 
> > This is one part I do like about IBM, they support older stuff for long,
> > long periods of time (support for Win95 ran out waay before even Warp 3),
> > they provide sufficient time warning of withdrawal for support and provide
> > a recommended (if not desired) upgrade path. I do not get this with _any_
> > of the Windows s/w vendors.

> What I REALLY like is that they tell you up front when you buy the
> software how long the will (at least) support it.

Oh, be fair to poor, prosecuted, persecuted, lilly white, pure as the
driven snow Microsoft. They too tell you how long they will support a
product.

They support everything they sell until marketing decides they can milk
the sheep into buying upgrades into which they put code to break the older
applications.


--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: bobg@Pics.com
Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 12
MR/2 Ice Registration Number 67
Aut Pax Aut Bellum
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com                           03-Dec-99 09:53:26
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 10:46:24
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com>

On <384698a6_3@news.cadvision.com>, on 12/02/99 at 09:04 AM,
   "Steven C. Britton" <sbritton@cadvision.com> said:

The double chevrons are my questions to Mr. Briteoff's contention that no
government ever did anything to help its people. Remember that as you read
this idiot's replies.

> > How in God's name can you claim that providing food, clothing, shelter,
> > health care, etc. for the sick and disabled is bad for society?

> That's not the government's responsibility.

Oh, who feeds the homeless in Montreal, Quebec, Vancouver, Calgary,
Ottowa, etc.? Who provides the public housing in which many disadvantaged
live? And how is doing so bad for them or society?

> > How in God's name can you claim providing a police force to prevent the
> > dishonest from stealing, the murderous from killing, the reckless from
> > inflicting harm on the public is bad for society?

> That _is_ the government's responsibility.

But you claim that no government ever did anything good for the people. By
your logic, providing a police force is bad.

> > Name one single society since the Stone Age which functioned and survived
> > in anarchy. Name one advance since the discovery of fire which occurred in
> > anarchy.

> The government's responsibility is to protect people from the initiation
> of force.  Nothing else.

But this is bad for society according to your logic.

Bye, bye you brain dead idiot savant.


--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: bobg@Pics.com
Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 12
MR/2 Ice Registration Number 67
Aut Pax Aut Bellum
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: donnelly@tampabay.rr.com                          03-Dec-99 14:38:04
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 10:46:24
Subj: Re: Java 1.2 for OS/2

From: donnelly@tampabay.rr.com (Buddy Donnelly)

On Fri, 3 Dec 1999 10:12:28, hamei@pacbell.net wrote:

> In <3846538C.3BAB3A0B@opera.no>, =?iso-8859-1?Q?Bj=F8rn?= Vermo
<bv@opera.no> writes:
> >hamei@pacbell.net wrote:
> >> 
> >> 
> >> for the rest of us as-yet unindoctrinated Americans I'd like to apologize
> >> for Mr Germer.  To my knowledge "sophisticated" has never been
> >> successfully applied to the philistine mentality displayed by the small-
> >> shopkeeper 'investment' community. 
> >
> >On the other hand, it is quite possible that he was applying what is
> >known as "irony" - a type of humour which is admittedly rather more
> >common on this side of the big water.

Or maybe our US irony is so sweeping and subtle that y'all miss it? 
How about a constitutional democracy separating Church and State that 
is overrun with nuevi-evangelisti trying to put Church Doctrine into 
local law everywhere (except Ha'waii, I think)? Is that ironical 
enough for you? Or "Choose Life" stickers on the bumpers of cars that 
would happily pay to attend a drive-in Capital Punishment session. Ya 
want irony, tune in to US "news" programming.


> 
> ah ha ! a more entertaining alternative than the grasping curmudgeon
> my monitor was displaying. Your interpretation is preferable, maybe this 
> is a good time for them rose-coloured glasses  :-) 

It's *always* time for them rose-coloured glasses. And no one *ever* 
expects a Spanish Inquisition, either.

-- 

Good luck,

Buddy

Buddy Donnelly
donnelly@tampabay.rr.com


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: RoadRunner - TampaBay (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: noyb@noyb.no                                      03-Dec-99 15:43:18
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 14:33:06
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: noyb@noyb.no (None Of Your Business)

Ouch, that hurts leotard.

It may be hard, but look again.  It carries the exact same weight as your 
statement below.

letoured@nospam.net wrote in <38476277$1$yrgbherq$mr2ice@news.sover.net>:
>noyb@noyb.no (None Of Your Business) said:
>
>>BTW, I can't think of anyone I know who's been killed by a gun.
>
>Unless you're drug dealer or friends with them, what is your point? Other
>then to show you're a near moron by using an association that has no
>relevance.  
>
>>>letoured@nospam.net:
>>>BTW, I can't think of corporation that failed except when the big bucks
>>>guys didn't know what the business was about, or refused to accept 
>>>changes in the market. 

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: None Dammit (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: jglatt@spamgone-borg.com                          03-Dec-99 16:09:23
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 14:33:06
Subj: Re: Why can't Germer compute?

From: jglatt@spamgone-borg.com (Jeff Glatt)

>>>Bob Germer
>>>Try buying an Intel based computer without paying
>>>for Windows.

>>Jeff Glatt
>> I do it all of the time. But that's because I'm clearly MUCH more
>> competent than a phony like you who lies about his alleged experience
>> in setting up and maintaining computers

>Joe Malloy
>Gads, this Germer fellow's a real bore.  How can someone claims to be a
>"computer professional" and yet be stuck with buying Windows each and every
>time he assembles a computer?  Inquiring minds want to know!  I, too, got my
>last two machines with no OS installed, but I guess I'm even smarter than
>Germer himself...

According to his "testimony", his alleged "clients" (he doesn't really
have any -- what he claims to have done are things that he read about
someone else doing via computer magazines or web sites -- but let's
pretend otherwise for a moment just to analyze just how illogical,
implausible, and just plain dumb are his contrived anecdotes) don't
trust him to supply hardware because he's a local guy who doesn't have
millions of dollars in capital. So, they demand that hardware be
purchased from non-local companies like IBM or Compaq so that
professional, uninterrupted "service can be guaranteed years down the
road". And yet, these same "clients" have eschewed the professional
services of companies like IBM (whose specialty actually is what
Germer claims to be doing) in installing and maintaining these
computers. Instead, they have hired a 60-something year old local guy
to adminster millions of dollars worth of equipment for which they
require guarantees of service years down the road.

Riiiiiiiiiiiiight. Suuuuuuuuuure. We believe that.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: c.k.christacopoulos.REMOVEME@dun...               03-Dec-99 16:34:12
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 14:33:06
Subj: Re: Software Choice

Message sender: c.k.christacopoulos.REMOVEME@dundee.ac.uk

From: Charles Christacopoulos <c.k.christacopoulos.REMOVEME@dundee.ac.uk>

Tim Martin wrote:
> 
> John Brock wrote:
> 
> > In article <38466B94.389536E1@canoemail.com>,
> > James Stotz  <jstotz@canoemail.com> wrote:
> > >I know that Software Choice will become a pay for use for all new
> > >updates and applications, but is IBM going to keep current versions of
> > >Netscape/2 and Java avaliable for free.  If not, new OS/2 buyers will
> > >not be able to get any Netscape without forking out more money.  Also,
> > >We'd all better download everything and save it in a safe place.

Software choice has always been for complete packages and not fixes (or
fixes which in effect upgrade a package to a newer version).  Fixes are
free if you can find them,  However, if a fix results in a newer version
then you cannot buy the new version unless you are part of software
choice.  Examples, newer version of tcpip for warp server, PSNS for warp
server and so on.

I am not sure they can get away with charging either for Java or
Netscape, remains to be seen.

From a business point of view it does make sence for IBM to know what is
the subscription rate as the income generated may indicate interest in
os/2.  From this end, I have to buy licences for my OS/2 server(s), it
would make business sence for us too.  However, buying licences for
clients can be an expensive recurrent cost (I guess financial
institutions can be happy to pay it and may even negotiate better
prices).

Charles


-- 
Remove REMOVE_ME to reply.
-------------------------------------------------------------------
Charles Christacopoulos, Secretary's Office, University of Dundee,
Dundee DD1 4HN, (Scotland) United Kingdom.
Tel: +44+(0)1382-344891. Fax: +44+(0)1382-201604.
http://somis.ais.dundee.ac.uk/    (runs on OS/2)
Scottish Search Maestro http://somis2.ais.dundee.ac.uk/ (runs on OS/2
too)

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: University of Dundee (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com                           03-Dec-99 10:05:17
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 14:33:06
Subj: Re: IBM U.S. Announcement Letter

From: Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com>

On <3846D05B.69A3DCF5@attglobal.net>, on 12/02/99 at 03:02 PM,
   pvwrght@attglobal.net said:

> Actually, Bjorn it is news. It is an official announcement from IBM
> regarding a large and important base of installed software. That is sort
> of the definition of news. For those of us who have corporate accounts
> using the software listed , we can go to the IT managers and say: "The
> software that you are using has been officially withdrawn by IBM. Do you
> wan't to start making plans to upgrade or replace it?". An official
> withdrawal by IBM still carries a lot of weight with IT professionals,
> so I would call it news for OS/2 people. That's why I posted it.

No, Philip you are the one wrong. It is a reissue of the same information
provided the public in May of this year. If you bothered to read the
announcement, you would see that it was being reissued because the
original announcement  failed to list part numbers being withdrawn. The
Web Page's third paragraph reads:

-------BEGIN PASTE from IBM WEBSITE ANNOUNCEMENT_________

Part numbers listed in the Program Withdrawals section were inadvertently
omitted from the referenced withdrawals dated May 1999. 

-------END
PASTE--------------------------------------------------------------------------
---

You must be one of the very few who missed the original announcement.
Moreover, reposting it and resending it to the email list where I also got
it is nothing different from magazine companies reminding you for several
successive issues that your subscription is about to expire.

There is no news in the IBM announcement for any professional. Moreover,
withdrawal from sale doesn't mean the product becomes unusable..

--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: bobg@Pics.com
Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 12
MR/2 Ice Registration Number 67
Aut Pax Aut Bellum
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: gbierman@fnmail.com                               03-Dec-99 09:24:09
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 14:33:06
Subj: digital cameras - thank you

From: Grant Bierman <gbierman@fnmail.com>

Thank you everone for your help...

------------------[ Web Master/Author For Hire ]-----------------
Grant Bierman <gbierman@fnmail.com> 
-------------------------[ Random Insert ]-----------------------
Rush Limbaugh's 14 Commandments Of The Religious Left
 NUMBER 5: Honor thy mother. If she is dysfunctional, it is thy father's
 fault.
------------------------[ ICQ: 22733875 ]------------------------
                      - Yatara.dyndns.org -
                   *All Mail Filtered For Spam*



--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: UseNet Server, Inc.  http://www.usenetserver.com 
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: rgibson@ix.netcom.com                             03-Dec-99 15:50:21
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 14:33:06
Subj: Re: New modem list

From: rgibson@ix.netcom.com (Ron Gibson)

On Fri, 3 Dec 1999 07:48:06, Thomas Kellerer 
<Thomas.Kellerer@tps-labs.com> wrote:

> > Actually you can tweak performance a bit.  IMO, the ideal connection is
> > V90 ARQ.  You don't need compression on large downloads of compressed
> > files as they are already compressed.  Graphics compression rates are
> > very low.

> That's true, but I don't think that enabling compression will slow it
> down. But plain HTML files compress *very* good (I had times where
> Netscape reported about 12KB/s transfer rate for plain HTML files!)

Well we need a good debate, although I'm rusty on the details of this
argument that has it's history in old FIDO echoes.

As I recall the argument centered around "overhead".

Now for analogy I'll use my old CMS 350 streamer (now a planter).  There
was one drive on which I kept all graphics anf compressed files.  If I
turned on compression when archiving the ratio was .9:1 

Turning off compression assured at least a 1:1 ratio and the backups
were much faster.
 
> I'm using Injoy and the peak throughput is normally around 7-8KB/s
> (although my telefon line and/or my serial port, I don't know which of
> those only connects with 45000)
 
And for that I'd submit that the transfer of HTML and text is trivial,
as these are small files anyway.  Real crunch time is downloading a 300
meg distribution of Linux, which I've done more than once.

That being said, I usually just use AT&F1 which enables hardware control
on my Sportster V90. BTW, ATZ4 is equivalent to this command on my modem.

                      email: rgibson@ix.netcom.com

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: MindSpring Enterprises (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: martin.brown@pandora.be                           03-Dec-99 16:47:03
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 14:33:06
Subj: Re: IBM U.S. Announcement Letter

From: Martin Brown <martin.brown@pandora.be>

Bob Germer wrote:

> They support everything they sell until marketing decides they can milk
> the sheep into buying upgrades into which they put code to break the older
> applications.

MS aren't the only ones to do that. There are still some old but still useful
16bit OS/2
applications in use out there that will not run on Warp 4 due to
"improvements" in the PM API.

Regards,
Martin Brown

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Nezumi (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: larso@commodore.                                  03-Dec-99 17:00:07
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 14:33:06
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg)

As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw Bob Germer write:
>    larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) said:
> 
> > Lars P. Ormberg     ICQ#:8827066
> > mailto:larso@ualberta.ca
> > The University of Lars:   http://www.ualberta.ca/~larso/
> 
> I have just sent 30 of your messages to the President of the University of
> Alberta via snail mail asking him to investigate your qualifications.

Huh?  Are you really that bored and/or incapable of reading?

-- 
Lars P. Ormberg     ICQ#:8827066
mailto:larso@ualberta.ca
The University of Lars:   http://www.ualberta.ca/~larso/

"The way you're bathed in light, reminds me of that night
God laid me down into your rose garden of trust and I was
swept away with nothin' left to say some helpless fool
yeah I was lost in a swoon of peace you're all I need to
find so when the time is right come to me sweetly, come
to me come to me..love will lead us, alright.  love will
lead us, she will lead us.  can you hear the dolphin's
cry?  see the road rise up to meet us its in the air we
breathe tonight love will lead us, she will lead us"
                            -Live, "The Dolphin's Cry"

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: PowerSurfr - High Speed Internet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: larso@commodore.                                  03-Dec-99 17:06:26
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 14:33:06
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg)

As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw Bob Germer write:
>    Bob Davies <mktorg@hotmail.com> said:
> 
> > Only NOW can you buy a computer without an MS DOS or Windows licence -
> > but it took thousands of protests and government action. If I recall
> > correctly the action was taken under the RESTRAINT of TRADE laws. 
> 
> Not from Gateway or Dell. I just called both of them trying to buy a
> system without Windows. Other than multiple (more than 20 machines) or
> very high end servers, you must buy either Win98 (most models) or NT 4.

If you have a problem with how a company does business, don't support them.
If you can't find a company you want to support, then you just don't support
any.  They don't have to change to suit your needs.  If the consumer base
you represent isn't worth the company's time, and happens to be not worth
any company's time, that's just the way of things.

-- 
Lars P. Ormberg     ICQ#:8827066
mailto:larso@ualberta.ca
The University of Lars:   http://www.ualberta.ca/~larso/

"The way you're bathed in light, reminds me of that night
God laid me down into your rose garden of trust and I was
swept away with nothin' left to say some helpless fool
yeah I was lost in a swoon of peace you're all I need to
find so when the time is right come to me sweetly, come
to me come to me..love will lead us, alright.  love will
lead us, she will lead us.  can you hear the dolphin's
cry?  see the road rise up to meet us its in the air we
breathe tonight love will lead us, she will lead us"
                            -Live, "The Dolphin's Cry"

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: PowerSurfr - High Speed Internet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: sbritton@cadvision.com                            03-Dec-99 10:13:23
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 20:03:06
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: "Steven C. Britton" <sbritton@cadvision.com>

Ed Letourneau wrote:
>

> >The real truth is that companies that DON'T have unions have better, more
> >productive workforces, higher wages, and treat their employees better.
> >If I owned a corporation, I would do whatever I could to keep a union OUT
> >of my company.  If one formed, I would do whatever I could to get it
> >decertified.
>
> And you would not survive. Not because of unions, but you're too stupid to
> treat people as human beings -- which is what gave rise to unions in the
> first place.

Actually, I would treat people as human beings first and foremost -- that's
HOW I would prevent a union from walking in an destroying my company.  I'd
pay them well, give them excellent working conditions, and ensure that they
are happy with their jobs.

> Don't know about Canada, but in the US someone with your attitude could
> expect to have it readjusted.  _____________

Most Canadians don't subscribe to fascism, unlike the union goons...
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
What have YOU done to bust a union today?
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Work better: Work union-free.

Steven C. Britton
Calgary

www.cadvision.com/sbritton



--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: CADVision Development Corporation (http://www.cad
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: sbritton@cadvision.com                            03-Dec-99 10:19:00
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 20:03:06
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: "Steven C. Britton" <sbritton@cadvision.com>

Ed Letourneau, Union Goon, wrote:
>
> >The "Corporate Geniuses" at the top of the "food chain", as you put it
> >are there and get paid the big bucks because it's their necks on the line
> >if the corporation fails: they're the ones who carry the greatest
> >financial risk: and the fundamental law of risk-taking is that the higher
> >the risk, the bigger the reward.
>
> Baloney. Every VP I've ever seen "fired" at GE and elsewhere walked off
> with millions on the way out.

VPs aren't necessarily the investors.  They've received severence packages,
perhaps, but they're not the ones with the front money for the operation.

> There is no risk. --And in most cases they left because the risk they took
was to
> cook the numbers for next two guys up the food chain. Lets also accept
that fact
> that people don't work their way up to that level, they are pulled up. So
the risk is
> not nearly as real as you want to think.

I guess we should all go back to the stone age and bang rocks together then,
because without people willing to invest and risk -- real risk -- we
wouldn't be where we are right now.

> BTW, I can't think of corporation that failed except when the big bucks
> guys didn't know what the business was about, or refused to accept changes
> in the market.

That's business.

> >Union bosses, on the other hand, don't lose their $100K salaries when the
> >"workers" go out on strike; they just drive their BMWs to the picket
> >line, make a little speech, give a media interview with the cheering
> >rentamob behind them, get back in their BMW and drive to their next
> >event.
>
> Name the bosses that get 100K, and the rentamobs.

Buzz Hargrove.  Ted White.  Canadian Auto Workers.  CUPW.

> -- In the US that would be a violation of federal law and would be
verifiable -- that is unless
> your making it up and spouting off.

Ever see what happens when legitimate workers cross a picket line?

> >Unions aren't for the "workers" any more -- they're political activist
> >groups trying to ram ridiculous collectivist, socialistic, and
> >totalitarian practises down the throats of those who REALLY work hard.
>
> Examples; what are these totalitarian practices
>
> <snip> the rest of the rightwing crap... as we call it in the US

Totalitarian is leftist.  Rightist is the opposite of totalitarian.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
What have YOU done to bust a union today?
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Work better: Work union-free.

Steven C. Britton
Calgary

www.cadvision.com/sbritton



--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: CADVision Development Corporation (http://www.cad
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: larso@commodore.                                  03-Dec-99 17:11:03
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 20:03:06
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg)

As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw Bob Germer write:
> On <38469645_1@news.cadvision.com>, on 12/02/99 at 08:54 AM,
>    "Steven C. Britton" <sbritton@cadvision.com> said:

> > That's not coercive.  It's a package deal.  Microsoft can't force
> > computer distributors to put Windows on their machines; but they _can_
> > say that "if you sell a computer with windows, we'll give you a massive
> > discount on it".
> 
> Which is a direct violation of U. S. Fair Trade Laws

Precisely the point.

Why on earth is such a straightforward transaction illegal?  What kind of
crazy law is that?

-- 
Lars P. Ormberg     ICQ#:8827066
mailto:larso@ualberta.ca
The University of Lars:   http://www.ualberta.ca/~larso/

"The way you're bathed in light, reminds me of that night
God laid me down into your rose garden of trust and I was
swept away with nothin' left to say some helpless fool
yeah I was lost in a swoon of peace you're all I need to
find so when the time is right come to me sweetly, come
to me come to me..love will lead us, alright.  love will
lead us, she will lead us.  can you hear the dolphin's
cry?  see the road rise up to meet us its in the air we
breathe tonight love will lead us, she will lead us"
                            -Live, "The Dolphin's Cry"

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: PowerSurfr - High Speed Internet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: sbritton@cadvision.com                            03-Dec-99 10:22:01
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 20:03:06
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: "Steven C. Britton" <sbritton@cadvision.com>

<hamei@pacbell.net> wrote:
>
> I can name  ten large corporations bankrupted by their megalomaniacal
CEO's off
> the top of my head and in every single case the CEO walked home the
> proud possessor of several million dollars. Conversely you cannot name ONE
> CEO of a large failed corporation in the last ten years who has taken a
> financial hit.

CEO's aren't necessarily the investors; and in the case where they are, the
majority of instances where the CEO loses are in small, unestablished
businesses which fail during their first year of operation.  You never hear
about them because they never make it big in the first place.

The companies which you talk about are _already_ successful, turning a
profit, and someone sabotages the operation from within.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
What have YOU done to bust a union today?
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Work better: Work union-free.

Steven C. Britton
Calgary

www.cadvision.com/sbritton



--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: CADVision Development Corporation (http://www.cad
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: sbritton@cadvision.com                            03-Dec-99 10:31:28
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 20:03:06
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: "Steven C. Britton" <sbritton@cadvision.com>

Bob Germer wrote:
>
> > That's not coercive.  It's a package deal.  Microsoft can't force
> > computer distributors to put Windows on their machines; but they _can_
> > say that "if you sell a computer with windows, we'll give you a massive
> > discount on it".
>
> Which is a direct violation of U. S. Fair Trade Laws which prohibit a
> vendor from charging different prices to two customers for the same
> quantiy of merchandise.

It isn't the same quantity of merchandise.  One has Windows, the other
doesn't.  Microsoft is offering a large discount on Windows when it is
bundled with a computer.  You still pay more for a computer with Windows
than a computer with no OS at all.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
What have YOU done to bust a union today?
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Work better: Work union-free.

Steven C. Britton
Calgary

www.cadvision.com/sbritton



--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: CADVision Development Corporation (http://www.cad
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: larso@commodore.                                  03-Dec-99 17:31:18
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 20:03:06
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg)

As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw Bob Germer write:
>    larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) said:
> 
> > When I sell something, I base my price on who is asking.  You will not
> > be able to buy a slice of pizza off me at the same rate I'd offer my
> > cousin. In fact, I may refuse to sell you the slice at all.
> 
> If you did, you would be charged with a crime. A restaurant must serve
> everyone regardless of race, creed, color, national origin, etc. The civil
> rights laws apply to you as to everyone else.

I don't have the right to take away the right of a property-owner to do with
his property as he sees fit.  If a law says otherwise, that law is wrong.

-- 
Lars P. Ormberg     ICQ#:8827066
mailto:larso@ualberta.ca
The University of Lars:   http://www.ualberta.ca/~larso/

"The way you're bathed in light, reminds me of that night
God laid me down into your rose garden of trust and I was
swept away with nothin' left to say some helpless fool
yeah I was lost in a swoon of peace you're all I need to
find so when the time is right come to me sweetly, come
to me come to me..love will lead us, alright.  love will
lead us, she will lead us.  can you hear the dolphin's
cry?  see the road rise up to meet us its in the air we
breathe tonight love will lead us, she will lead us"
                            -Live, "The Dolphin's Cry"

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: PowerSurfr - High Speed Internet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: larso@commodore.                                  03-Dec-99 17:33:23
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 20:03:06
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg)

As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw Andrew Stephenson write:
> 	   bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com "Bob Germer" writes:

> > If you did, you would be charged with a crime. A restaurant
> > must serve everyone regardless of race, creed, color, national
> > origin, etc. The civil rights laws apply to you as to everyone
> > else.
> 
> Obviously you North Americans have managed to build a veritable
> paradise-on-earth.  Here in the backward old UK, AFAIK a trader
> can refuse to sell to a person, at whim.

It's called property rights.

Your "paradise-on-earth" is only from the point of view of the person
getting the product.  The person with the product isn't in paradise if his
property can be taken when he doesn't want it to be.

-- 
Lars P. Ormberg     ICQ#:8827066
mailto:larso@ualberta.ca
The University of Lars:   http://www.ualberta.ca/~larso/

"The way you're bathed in light, reminds me of that night
God laid me down into your rose garden of trust and I was
swept away with nothin' left to say some helpless fool
yeah I was lost in a swoon of peace you're all I need to
find so when the time is right come to me sweetly, come
to me come to me..love will lead us, alright.  love will
lead us, she will lead us.  can you hear the dolphin's
cry?  see the road rise up to meet us its in the air we
breathe tonight love will lead us, she will lead us"
                            -Live, "The Dolphin's Cry"

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: PowerSurfr - High Speed Internet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: greywolf@onlink.net                               03-Dec-99 12:27:11
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 20:03:06
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: "Wolf Kirchmeir" <greywolf@onlink.net>

On Fri, 3 Dec 1999 10:19:00 -0700, Steven C. Britton wrote:

=>Totalitarian is leftist.  Rightist is the opposite of totalitarian.

Now THERE's a brilliantly stupid remark!

=>----------------------------------------------------------------------------
=>What have YOU done to bust a union today?
=>----------------------------------------------------------------------------
=>
=>Work better: Work union-free.
=>
=>Steven C. Britton
=>Calgary




--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: NSMS (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: sbritton@cadvision.com                            03-Dec-99 10:49:15
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 20:03:06
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: "Steven C. Britton" <sbritton@cadvision.com>

Wolf Kirchmeir wrote:
>
> =>Totalitarian is leftist.  Rightist is the opposite of totalitarian.
>
> Now THERE's a brilliantly stupid remark!

Totalitarian is collectivist.  Collectivist is leftist.  Ergo, totalitarian
is leftist.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
What have YOU done to bust a union today?
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Work better: Work union-free.

Steven C. Britton
Calgary

www.cadvision.com/sbritton



--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: CADVision Development Corporation (http://www.cad
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: larso@commodore.                                  03-Dec-99 18:03:03
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 20:03:06
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg)

As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw Bob Germer write:
>    larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) said:
> 
> > Here's a hint, US LAW DEFINING MONOPOLIES is the entire problem!  I'm
> > not trying to argue that MS is acting legally, but rather that its
> > actions should never have been illegal in the first place.
> 
> You have absolutely no say in what our laws are or ought to be.  You are a
> Canadian, a foreigner.

So you say that you have absolutely no right to speak out against, say,
China's one-child policy?  Or totalitarian regimes where thousands of
citizens are killed each year?

>                      I do not presume to tell you what your laws should
> provide and you have no right to do so to the United States.

An unjust law is an unjust law, whether it is in your country or not.

> Our citizens decided that actions such as MicroSoft has been proven to
> engage in violate laws we found necessary for our society.

That's when things get interesting.  For the sake of your society, a
person's property is not deemed to be of their own control.  How does that
jive with the right to own property?  Or the American slogan of being for
"Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness"?

>                                                            If the majority
> of our citizens speaking via their respective Senators and Congressmen and
> our President decide what MS is doing is illegal, it is illegal

And when the citizens had spoken through their Senators and Congressman in
the past, was it always right?  

-- 
Lars P. Ormberg     ICQ#:8827066
mailto:larso@ualberta.ca
The University of Lars:   http://www.ualberta.ca/~larso/

"The way you're bathed in light, reminds me of that night
God laid me down into your rose garden of trust and I was
swept away with nothin' left to say some helpless fool
yeah I was lost in a swoon of peace you're all I need to
find so when the time is right come to me sweetly, come
to me come to me..love will lead us, alright.  love will
lead us, she will lead us.  can you hear the dolphin's
cry?  see the road rise up to meet us its in the air we
breathe tonight love will lead us, she will lead us"
                            -Live, "The Dolphin's Cry"

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: PowerSurfr - High Speed Internet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: larso@commodore.                                  03-Dec-99 18:12:12
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 20:03:06
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg)

As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw Bob Germer write:
>    larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) said:

> > Yes, they have.  Now, what does that mean?  It doesn't mean that
> > Microsoft is devoid of competition.  Do you have another definition of a
> > monopoly? Say, a business which is winning a competition?
> 
> Monopoly as defined by U. S. law is a company so dominant in an industry
> segment that it can dictate to the entire segment, use its position to
> damage competitors, overcharge customers, etc.

Well, there are two options: either Microsoft is not a monopoly, or all
businesses are monopolies.  After all, "damaging competitors" and
"overcharging customers" are crimes committed by all businesses without
"pure competition".

> > Right now, there are 3 examples that come to mind of monopolies I live
> > under:
> 
> > - Cable television.  Under the CRTC, Edmonton has 2 cable companies. 
> > One is only allowed to sell on the east side of town, the other only on
> > the west
> 
> This is not true in the United States. Each state here establishes the
> rules for cable television companies. Several communities here have a
> second franchise, much to the chagrin of the cable television industry. In
> those communities, rates are much lower, btw.

Naturally.  Why was there only one cable company before?

> > - Telephone service.  While I can choose any long distance provider, I
> > can only have one local phone service.  Anything else is illegal.
> 
> We have choices for local telephone service here in the United States.

The same as you have choices for computer operating systems.  No government
is forcing all other businesses away.

> > None of these can exist without the government.  I can think of no
> > monopolies I live under not involving government.
> 
> Microsoft comes to mind. Try buying an Intel based computer without paying
> for Windows.

Guess what?  If Intel has agreed to a deal, or all Intel vendors on earth
have agreed to a deal, wherein Windows must be sold in tandem, that isn't
the sign of a monopoly.  That is the sign of a set of agreements amoungst
private individuals.

Or do you believe Microsoft cannot sign contracts?

-- 
Lars P. Ormberg     ICQ#:8827066
mailto:larso@ualberta.ca
The University of Lars:   http://www.ualberta.ca/~larso/

"The way you're bathed in light, reminds me of that night
God laid me down into your rose garden of trust and I was
swept away with nothin' left to say some helpless fool
yeah I was lost in a swoon of peace you're all I need to
find so when the time is right come to me sweetly, come
to me come to me..love will lead us, alright.  love will
lead us, she will lead us.  can you hear the dolphin's
cry?  see the road rise up to meet us its in the air we
breathe tonight love will lead us, she will lead us"
                            -Live, "The Dolphin's Cry"

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: PowerSurfr - High Speed Internet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: siberREMOVETHIS@sympatico.ca                      03-Dec-99 19:08:27
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 20:03:06
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: siberREMOVETHIS@sympatico.ca (E. Barry Bruyea)

On Fri, 3 Dec 1999 10:22:03 -0700, "Steven C. Britton"
<sbritton@cadvision.com> wrote:

><hamei@pacbell.net> wrote:
>>
>> I can name  ten large corporations bankrupted by their megalomaniacal
>CEO's off
>> the top of my head and in every single case the CEO walked home the
>> proud possessor of several million dollars. Conversely you cannot name ONE
>> CEO of a large failed corporation in the last ten years who has taken a
>> financial hit.


I could name dozens.  Your commentary is interesting in that you seem
to come across as knowledgeable and then to spoil it all, you say
something really stupid.  In the last few years, many CEO's have
depended on stock options as the largest portion of their potential
earnings. What the hell do you think happens to stock options when a
company either goes belly-up or gets purchased for break-up value?
Or, if it shows a significant loss on revenues?  Now, just to stay in
the realm of things you may know something about, tell us about brain
surgery?

EBB

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Sympatico (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: lifedata@xxvol.com                                03-Dec-99 12:29:26
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 20:03:06
Subj: Re: Software Choice

From: lifedata@xxvol.com

James Moe <sma.spam-not@rtd.com> said:
>> Is it really only $100 a year?
>> 
>    It's $250 for two years. There is no one year option.

I wasn't sure about the actual figure, and remembered it as $200.  But that
still comes out at $125 a year, even though you can't get it for one year
at a time.  The reason I said anything at all was I knew some people must
still think it is a lot higher than it really is.

When you consider that there are a lot of things on SWC other than Netscape
and Java, you're not getting a bad deal at all.

That's my point.

Jim L
Remove XX from address to Email
Crooks and kooks will get guns regardless of laws.


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: bCandid - Powering the world's discussions - http
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: larso@commodore.                                  03-Dec-99 17:03:09
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 20:03:07
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg)

As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw Bob Germer write:
>    larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) said:
> 
> > You cannot bully
> > Toshiba into doing something they do not wish to do, any more than
> > Microsoft can bully you into doing something that you do not wish to
> > do.
> 
> Bullshit. Has the cold weather frozen your brain or do you refuse to read
> the testimony from the OEM's summarized in the Findings of Fact.

The long and the short of it is that Microsoft proposed a partnership which
was agreed to.  If the OEM had such a problem with this, they could easily
have not made the agreement.

-- 
Lars P. Ormberg     ICQ#:8827066
mailto:larso@ualberta.ca
The University of Lars:   http://www.ualberta.ca/~larso/

"The way you're bathed in light, reminds me of that night
God laid me down into your rose garden of trust and I was
swept away with nothin' left to say some helpless fool
yeah I was lost in a swoon of peace you're all I need to
find so when the time is right come to me sweetly, come
to me come to me..love will lead us, alright.  love will
lead us, she will lead us.  can you hear the dolphin's
cry?  see the road rise up to meet us its in the air we
breathe tonight love will lead us, she will lead us"
                            -Live, "The Dolphin's Cry"

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: PowerSurfr - High Speed Internet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: larso@commodore.                                  03-Dec-99 17:10:06
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 20:03:07
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg)

As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw cbzh@my-deja.com write:
>   "Steven C. Britton" <scb@scb-group.com> wrote:

> > If a customer buys a computer without Windows, the store isn't buying
> > Windows from Microsoft for that particular machine, so it becomes a
> > non-issue.
> >
> > If the customer wants to buy Windows as an add-on later, then they pay 4
> > times as much as they would have paid if they'd bought Windows with the
> > machine.
> >
> > That is _not_ a monopoly, nor is it a "monopolistic" practise.
> 
> If what you said was actually true, you would be right, but it isn't

You are correct, it isn't true.  The action Steve described is illegal under
U.S. law.  How dare Microsoft give a discount.

>                                                                      In
> many cases the vendor has to pay Windows licenses per processor, not per
> actually sold copy of Windows

Well, then I guess that's what their agreement says.

> And now tell me please why the vendors have signed such an unfavorable
> contract???

If it was unfavourable, they wouldn't have signed it (unless they are
stupid, in which case you may wish to avoid them).  Clearly, to them, the
agreement had some value.

-- 
Lars P. Ormberg     ICQ#:8827066
mailto:larso@ualberta.ca
The University of Lars:   http://www.ualberta.ca/~larso/

"The way you're bathed in light, reminds me of that night
God laid me down into your rose garden of trust and I was
swept away with nothin' left to say some helpless fool
yeah I was lost in a swoon of peace you're all I need to
find so when the time is right come to me sweetly, come
to me come to me..love will lead us, alright.  love will
lead us, she will lead us.  can you hear the dolphin's
cry?  see the road rise up to meet us its in the air we
breathe tonight love will lead us, she will lead us"
                            -Live, "The Dolphin's Cry"

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: PowerSurfr - High Speed Internet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: siberREMOVETHIS@sympatico.ca                      03-Dec-99 17:19:06
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 20:03:07
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: siberREMOVETHIS@sympatico.ca (E. Barry Bruyea)

On Fri, 03 Dec 1999 06:05:31 -0800, Glenn Davies
<glend@nospam.direct.ca> wrote:

>On Fri, 03 Dec 1999 13:38:32 GMT, siberREMOVETHIS@sympatico.ca (E.
>Barry Bruyea) wrote:
>
>>On Fri, 03 Dec 1999 07:52:50 -0500, Bob Germer
>><bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com> wrote:
>>
>>>On <8280no$cou$9@burn.ab.videon.ca>, on 12/03/99 at 08:58 AM,
>>>   larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) said:
>>>
>>>> You cannot bully
>>>> Toshiba into doing something they do not wish to do, any more than
>>>> Microsoft can bully you into doing something that you do not wish to
>>>> do.
>>>
>>>
>>>Bullshit. Has the cold weather frozen your brain or do you refuse to read
>>>the testimony from the OEM's summarized in the Findings of Fact.
>>
>>And, of course, OEM's have nothing to gain from trashing MS, do they?
>>And the  so called 'Finding Of Fact' is primarily based on OEM
>>submissions, who as we all know, would be above using false
>>information salted with a little hyperbole in those documents.  I'll
>>bet you believe in the Tooth Fairy.
>>
>
>Actually, since they still all depend on the good graces of MS it was
>hard to get them to talk. If you had followed the trial you would have
>seen that many OEM employees were reluctent to talk and some whose
>initial depositions were damaging to MS tried to downplay or "clarify"
>their statements later. And MS used some OEM testimony for their
>defense or where those the ones that contained the false information
>that you're implying?


The 'Finding of Fact' was based primarily on OEM submissions; nothing
you've said changes that.
>
>

EBB

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Sympatico (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: sbritton@cadvision.com                            03-Dec-99 10:30:09
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 20:03:07
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: "Steven C. Britton" <sbritton@cadvision.com>

Bob Germer wrote:
>
> > > How in God's name can you claim that providing food, clothing,
shelter,
> > > health care, etc. for the sick and disabled is bad for society?
>
> > That's not the government's responsibility.
>
> Oh, who feeds the homeless in Montreal, Quebec, Vancouver, Calgary,
> Ottowa, etc.?

Handouts by passers-by.  Soup kitchens.  Charity.

> Who provides the public housing in which many disadvantaged live?
> And how is doing so bad for them or society?

The appropriate question is "who SHOULD provide...?"

The correct answer is "private charity, churches, and good-hearted
individuals".

The government providing such assistance depersonalizes the issue and makes
it worse.  Throwing money at a problem does not solve it.

> > > How in God's name can you claim providing a police force to prevent
the
> > > dishonest from stealing, the murderous from killing, the reckless from
> > > inflicting harm on the public is bad for society?
>
> > That _is_ the government's responsibility.
>
> But you claim that no government ever did anything good for the people. By
> your logic, providing a police force is bad.

I didn't actually make that particular claim.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
What have YOU done to bust a union today?
----------------------------------------------------------------------------

Work better: Work union-free.

Steven C. Britton
Calgary

www.cadvision.com/sbritton



--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: CADVision Development Corporation (http://www.cad
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: greywolf@onlink.net                               03-Dec-99 12:16:19
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 20:03:07
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: "Wolf Kirchmeir" <greywolf@onlink.net>

On 3 Dec 1999 08:31:19 GMT, Lars P Ormberg wrote:

=>> > Well, through what mechanism did Microsoft force you to purchase the
=>> > product?  Where was your free choice removed?  Was your free choice
=>> > removed at the point where you wanted to usurp the free choices of
others?
=>> 
=>> _YOU_ should answer this question!
=>
=>Okay, your free choice was not usurped, you chose to purchase a product. 
You
=>also chose to purchase a product you say you didn't want.  Do you often
=>purchase products you don't really want?

It became IMPOSSIBLE to buy any off the shelf machine without Win95 by July
of 1997. That was when I tried to get a BLANK machine - no OSs, no software.
Couldn't be done (there were some pretty good deals -- machine cost a good
eal less thanthe parts needed to build one.) The reseller said I could
low-level reformat the drive myself if I wanted a blank machine. Would he do
it and give me a rebate for the price of the software I didn't buy? Only for
the software, NOT for Windows! -- Or I could buy a assorted bits'n'pieces and
assemble the machine myself.

So to AVOID BUYING WINDOWS I would have to pay more!

Now, you tell me if that means I had a real choice in your terms. Why should
I have to pay more for less??????

It's clear that MS was limiting my choices as a consumer by strong-arming the
builders and resellers. In a free market, the consumer rules, not the
supplier. 

We obviously do not have free market -- and never will have.

So the only political question is: Who controls the market? I see no reason
to let the suppliers control it. Use the Government to bring those bastards
into line!

Or let those bastards use the Government against us.

Wolf Kirchmeir

If you didn't want to go to chicago,
why did you get on the train? (Anon.)


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: NSMS (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: larso@commodore.                                  03-Dec-99 17:42:19
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 20:03:07
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg)

As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw letoured@nospam.net write:
> Chris J Delanoy <cdelanoy@ualberta.ca> said:

> >Yes, it is - which is precisely why I said that the "facts" in the
> >Findings of Fact do not pertain to reality.
> 
> Have you given any thought to the idea that you don't have a clue as to
> what you're talking about?  Think of it this way; if MS wasn't guilty do
> you really they would be in negotiations to settle?

That's the inherent problem: Microsoft has bought into this notion that
making a profit or signing contracts is an evil thing.

Microsoft is guilty of believing it is guilty.  It apologizes for its
innovations, its profits, its sales, its stock value, its contracts.

>                                                       In the US, the
> innocent appeal. The dead-wrong guilty settle. 

And nobody should complain about random searches of their home, since they
have nothing to hide, right?

-- 
Lars P. Ormberg     ICQ#:8827066
mailto:larso@ualberta.ca
The University of Lars:   http://www.ualberta.ca/~larso/

"The way you're bathed in light, reminds me of that night
God laid me down into your rose garden of trust and I was
swept away with nothin' left to say some helpless fool
yeah I was lost in a swoon of peace you're all I need to
find so when the time is right come to me sweetly, come
to me come to me..love will lead us, alright.  love will
lead us, she will lead us.  can you hear the dolphin's
cry?  see the road rise up to meet us its in the air we
breathe tonight love will lead us, she will lead us"
                            -Live, "The Dolphin's Cry"

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: PowerSurfr - High Speed Internet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bstephan@redshift.com                             03-Dec-99 09:30:27
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 20:03:07
Subj: Re: MASM 6.11 under OS/2 (to create DOS exe?)

From: bstephan@redshift.com

On Fri, 3 Dec 1999 01:06:56, ames@deltrak.demon.co.uk
(Andrew  Stephenson) wrote:

>Actually, it is. Doesn't like running in OS/2....

I use Borland's Turbo Assembler and it runs fine under OS/2.
You could probably get a copy cheap in an online auction.

-- 
-----------------------------------------------------------
Bob Stephan bstephan@redshift.com or BobStephan@compuserve.com
  Happily using OS/2 Warp on the Central California Coast.
   http://www.redshift.com/~bstephan
-----------------------------------------------------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: djohnson@isomedia.com                             03-Dec-99 09:44:18
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 20:03:07
Subj: Re: Switching drives - how?

From: "David T. Johnson" <djohnson@isomedia.com>


lifedata@xxvol.com wrote:
> 
> "David T. Johnson" <djohnson@isomedia.com> said:
> 
> >the C: drive by reversing the position of the physical drives.  If you
> >moved the second drive to be first and it still booted up as the D: drive,
> >there must have been another partition that OS/2 was recognizing as the C:
> >partition.
> 
> As a matter of fact there were two logical drives on the old 1st physical
> drive, making the first drive on the 2nd physical drive E:.  While
> switched, the (old 2nd phys) drive now become the new 1st phys drive still
> displayed E:.  Jumpers on the new 1st phys drive were set identical
> (electrically) to the old 1st phys drive.
> 
> Would the second point:
> 
> 2) You used FDISK to assign the former first drive as the C: drive,
> 
> apply to this case?
> 
> If so, does that mean merely going into FDISK and renaming it will suffice?

If there were two partitions on the old first physical drive, the first
primary partition should have been drive C and the partition on the
second physical drive *should* have been drive D.  The second partition
on the first drive should have been drive E.  Then when you switched
them, the partition on the old second drive should have been drive C and
the primary partition on the other drive should have been drive D.  The
second partition on the old first physical drive (now 2nd) would remain
as drive E.  Since this is not the case something else is happening. 
You said in your earlier post: "...when I set it [first] up I put a
primary partition on the beginning so it could hold the boot manager
when I moved it."  

Normally, you install the boot manager with FDISK and it creates a small
hidden primary partition for the boot manager that doesn't figure into
the drive order assignment.  If you created a partition for the boot
manager that is not hidden, then this could be changing your drive order
assignment.  If so, your old first physical disk might have 3 partitions
and the second partition might have been manually assigned as C using
FDISK.  In this case, though, there should have been a drive F on the
first disk somewhere.  What does OS/2 FDISK show for each physical
drive?
 
> 
> Jim L
> Remove XX from address to Email
> Crooks and kooks will get guns regardless of laws.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bklein@nospam.earthlink.net                       03-Dec-99 17:56:05
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 20:03:07
Subj: Re: MASM 6.11 under OS/2 (to create DOS exe?)

From: "Brian K. Klein" <bklein@nospam.earthlink.net>

MASM 6.11d runs from the WPS okay on my system. It doesn't run from a DOS or
OS/2 prompt though. I have Odin Alpha 5 installed and that may be why it
works.

-- 
Brian K. Klein
remove "nospam" to reply

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Do NOT spam me (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: heloman@my-deja.com                               03-Dec-99 18:07:00
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 20:03:07
Subj: Bootmanager

From: heloman@my-deja.com

I am contemplating adding another operating system to my
computer. I will have two physical hard drives. From the posts I
have read it appears that bootmanager is the way to go vice dual
boot. Under bootmanager if I make one (physical) drive 'C'   and
install the 'other' operating system on it - create a logical
partition or two then go to the other (physical) drive on which
I have my currently running operating system - will this drive
still be 'C' or will it become some other designation? Will the
other partitions (logical) on the second physical drive
automatically be renamed (should it no longer be referred to as
'C') to their correct drive letters? Sorry for all the questions
but have never used it and really hadn't contemplated on
installing another system. Any help/responses will be cheerfully
accepted.........


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Deja.com - Before you buy. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: heloman@my-deja.com                               03-Dec-99 18:07:23
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 20:03:07
Subj: Bootmanager

From: heloman@my-deja.com

I am contemplating adding another operating system to my
computer. I will have two physical hard drives. From the posts I
have read it appears that bootmanager is the way to go vice dual
boot. Under bootmanager if I make one (physical) drive 'C'   and
install the 'other' operating system on it - create a logical
partition or two then go to the other (physical) drive on which
I have my currently running operating system - will this drive
still be 'C' or will it become some other designation? Will the
other partitions (logical) on the second physical drive
automatically be renamed (should it no longer be referred to as
'C') to their correct drive letters? Sorry for all the questions
but have never used it and really hadn't contemplated on
installing another system. Any help/responses will be cheerfully
accepted.........


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Deja.com - Before you buy. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: heloman@my-deja.com                               03-Dec-99 18:10:25
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 20:03:07
Subj: Bootmanager

From: heloman@my-deja.com

I am contemplating adding another operating system to my
computer. I will have two physical hard drives. From the posts I
have read it appears that bootmanager is the way to go vice dual
boot. Under bootmanager if I make one (physical) drive 'C'   and
install the 'other' operating system on it - create a logical
partition or two then go to the other (physical) drive on which
I have my currently running operating system - will this drive
still be 'C' or will it become some other designation? Will the
other partitions (logical) on the second physical drive
automatically be renamed (should it no longer be referred to as
'C') to their correct drive letters? Sorry for all the questions
but have never used it and really hadn't contemplated on
installing another system. Any help/responses will be cheerfully
accepted.........


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Deja.com - Before you buy. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: heloman@my-deja.com                               03-Dec-99 18:06:21
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 20:03:07
Subj: Bootmanager

From: heloman@my-deja.com

I am contemplating adding another operating system to my
computer. I will have two physical hard drives. From the posts I
have read it appears that bootmanager is the way to go vice dual
boot. Under bootmanager if I make one (physical) drive 'C'   and
install the 'other' operating system on it - create a logical
partition or two then go to the other (physical) drive on which
I have my currently running operating system - will this drive
still be 'C' or will it become some other designation? Will the
other partitions (logical) on the second physical drive
automatically be renamed (should it no longer be referred to as
'C') to their correct drive letters? Sorry for all the questions
but have never used it and really hadn't contemplated on
installing another system. Any help/responses will be cheerfully
accepted.........


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Deja.com - Before you buy. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: larso@commodore.                                  03-Dec-99 18:38:29
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 20:03:07
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg)

As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw Wolf Kirchmeir write:
> On 3 Dec 1999 08:31:19 GMT, Lars P Ormberg wrote:

> =>Okay, your free choice was not usurped, you chose to purchase a product. 
You
> =>also chose to purchase a product you say you didn't want.  Do you often
> =>purchase products you don't really want?
> 
> It became IMPOSSIBLE to buy any off the shelf machine without Win95 by July
> of 1997.

How?  Through was law was this done?

How is it that you could not buy a computer without Win95?  What was to
prevent somebody from selling one?  Please, feel free to provide any
possible mechanism.

> It's clear that MS was limiting my choices as a consumer

Guess what?  As "a consumer" Microsoft does not owe you the ability to buy
non-Microsoft stuff.

Other companies are free to compete.  Microsoft cannot stop them from doing
so.

-- 
Lars P. Ormberg     ICQ#:8827066
mailto:larso@ualberta.ca
The University of Lars:   http://www.ualberta.ca/~larso/

"The way you're bathed in light, reminds me of that night
God laid me down into your rose garden of trust and I was
swept away with nothin' left to say some helpless fool
yeah I was lost in a swoon of peace you're all I need to
find so when the time is right come to me sweetly, come
to me come to me..love will lead us, alright.  love will
lead us, she will lead us.  can you hear the dolphin's
cry?  see the road rise up to meet us its in the air we
breathe tonight love will lead us, she will lead us"
                            -Live, "The Dolphin's Cry"

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: PowerSurfr - High Speed Internet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: larso@commodore.                                  03-Dec-99 20:52:05
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 20:03:07
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg)

As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw Bob Davies write:
> Barry:
> 
> I agree with you - early on you had the choice. But there was a
> significant period of time when distributors were forced to supply a MS
> operating system when they sold a system.

Huh?  When did Microsoft get all distributors to, against their will, supply
MS OSes with all systemms?

-- 
Lars P. Ormberg     ICQ#:8827066
mailto:larso@ualberta.ca
The University of Lars:   http://www.ualberta.ca/~larso/

"The way you're bathed in light, reminds me of that night
God laid me down into your rose garden of trust and I was
swept away with nothin' left to say some helpless fool
yeah I was lost in a swoon of peace you're all I need to
find so when the time is right come to me sweetly, come
to me come to me..love will lead us, alright.  love will
lead us, she will lead us.  can you hear the dolphin's
cry?  see the road rise up to meet us its in the air we
breathe tonight love will lead us, she will lead us"
                            -Live, "The Dolphin's Cry"

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: PowerSurfr - High Speed Internet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: cdelanoy@ualberta.ca                              03-Dec-99 20:57:02
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 20:03:07
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: Chris J Delanoy <cdelanoy@ualberta.ca>

 letoured@nospam.net wrote:

> > Yes, it is - which is precisely why I said that the "facts" in
> > the Findings of Fact do not pertain to reality.

> Have you given any thought to the idea that you don't have a clue
> as to what you're talking about?  Think of it this way; if MS
> wasn't guilty do you really they would be in negotiations to
> settle?  In the US, the innocent appeal. The dead-wrong guilty
> settle.

I have never denied that Microsoft is "guilty" of violating
anti-trust laws.  In fact, as we've been over before, it is possible
under these laws to PROSECUTE AND CONVICT for ANY AND EVERY
activity that any business can ever engage in.  It's impossible
NOT to be found guilty if the government wants you to be guilty,
in other words.

The reason that Microsoft is settling is because Bill Gates is
a coward.  The only proper response to this vicious persecution
should be to attack the tyranny known as anti-trust at it's
very roots, but Bill Gates has neither the courage nor the
philisophical backing required to do so.

Chris J Delanoy


Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Deja.com - Before you buy. (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: glend@nospam.direct.ca                            03-Dec-99 13:14:08
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 20:03:07
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: Glenn Davies <glend@nospam.direct.ca>

On 3 Dec 1999 08:25:14 GMT, larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) wrote:

>As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw Glenn Davies write:
>> On 3 Dec 1999 00:43:40 GMT, larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) wrote:
>
>> >MS doesn't force computer buyers to do anything.  Microsoft sells its
code.
>> >People buy it.  This is called a free exchange.
>> 
>> Under MS's per-processor licensing agreements, which the '95 consent
>> decree eliminated, customers paid for DOS and Windows even if they
>> didn't want those products.
>
>How was that?  I know the answer.  I can't wait to see how you express it.

If you ordered a computer from a OEM and stated that you didn't want a
copy of DOS with it they would say fine it won't come with a copy of
DOS. And when you asked how much did you save they would answer $0.00.

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: via Internet Direct - http://www.mydirect.com/ (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: isaacl@sonics.ece.ubc.ca                          03-Dec-99 20:21:11
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 20:03:07
Subj: Re: Software Choice

From: isaacl@sonics.ece.ubc.ca (e-frog)

lifedata@xxvol.com wrote:
: James Moe <sma.spam-not@rtd.com> said:
: >> Is it really only $100 a year?
: >> 
: >    It's $250 for two years. There is no one year option.

: I wasn't sure about the actual figure, and remembered it as $200.  But that
: still comes out at $125 a year, even though you can't get it for one year
: at a time.  The reason I said anything at all was I knew some people must
: still think it is a lot higher than it really is.

: When you consider that there are a lot of things on SWC other than Netscape
: and Java, you're not getting a bad deal at all.

There are other things, but delivery of items are not guaranteed. You get
what IBM decides to deliver during your subscription period

Netscape and Java are free for other platforms. You might get UDF for DVD
and TCPIP 4.x updates. That's not worth $125/year for me.
If they could provide a "real" client upgrade, or a specific list of
deliverables, then yes, $125/year is not too bad.


Isaac

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: ITServices, University of British Columbia (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: josco@sea.monterey.edu                            03-Dec-99 14:49:17
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 20:03:07
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: josco <josco@sea.monterey.edu>

On 3 Dec 1999, Lars P Ormberg wrote:

> As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw Bob Germer write:
> >    larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) said:
> > 
> > > Here's a hint, US LAW DEFINING MONOPOLIES is the entire problem!  I'm
> > > not trying to argue that MS is acting legally, but rather that its
> > > actions should never have been illegal in the first place.
> > 
> > You have absolutely no say in what our laws are or ought to be.  You are a
> > Canadian, a foreigner.
> 
> So you say that you have absolutely no right to speak out against, say,
> China's one-child policy?  Or totalitarian regimes where thousands of
> citizens are killed each year?

You have no sense of proportion.  None! It shows poorly developed values
and sensibilities.  Without a sense of proportion, there is no justice.

Drop OS/2 newsgroups if you need to make inappropiate references.


--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: CSUnet (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bstephan@redshift.com                             03-Dec-99 12:51:21
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 20:03:08
Subj: Re: Bootmanager

From: bstephan@redshift.com

If you want to install OS/2 on a second drive, make the
second drive an extended partition (no primary partition)
and install it there. It will retain the drive letter of the
logical drive that you install it in. If you put a primary
on the 2nd drive it will be D: which is OK if that is really
what you want to do and understand the assignment of drive
letters.


In <8290tf$g9p$1@nnrp1.deja.com>, on 12/03/99 
   at 06:07 PM, heloman@my-deja.com said:

>I am contemplating adding another operating system to my
>computer. I will have two physical hard drives. From the
>posts I have read it appears that bootmanager is the way to
>go vice dual boot. Under bootmanager if I make one
>(physical) drive 'C'   and install the 'other' operating
>system on it - create a logical partition or two then go to
>the other (physical) drive on which I have my currently
>running operating system - will this drive still be 'C' or
>will it become some other designation? Will the other
>partitions (logical) on the second physical drive
>automatically be renamed (should it no longer be referred
>to as 'C') to their correct drive letters? Sorry for all
>the questions but have never used it and really hadn't
>contemplated on installing another system. Any
>help/responses will be cheerfully accepted.........


>Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
>Before you buy.

-- 
-----------------------------------------------------------
Bob Stephan bstephan@redshift.com or BobStephan@compuserve.com
  Happily using OS/2 Warp on the Central California Coast.
   http://www.redshift.com/~bstephan
-----------------------------------------------------------

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: tsipple@us.iNoSPAMbm.com                          03-Dec-99 16:45:24
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 20:03:08
Subj: Re: IBM U.S. Announcement Letter

From: Timothy Sipples <tsipple@us.iNoSPAMbm.com>

Martin Brown wrote:
> Bob Germer wrote:
> > They support everything they sell until marketing decides they can milk
> > the sheep into buying upgrades into which they put code to break the older
> > applications.
> MS aren't the only ones to do that. There are still some old but still
useful 16bit OS/2
> applications in use out there that will not run on Warp 4 due to
"improvements" in the PM API.

Such as?

-- 
Timothy Sipples
IBM Network Computing Software
Chicago, Illinois
Web: http://www.satdirect.com/aviation

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: IBM Network Computing Software (Chicago) (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: oliver.rick@oor.de                                03-Dec-99 16:30:03
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 20:03:08
Subj: Re: IBM Support for os/2

From: oliver.rick@oor.de (Oliver Rick)

On Wed, 01 Dec 1999 lifedata@xxvol.com wrote:

>> have a look at http://www.warpupdates.de/

> What's wrong with this picture?  Netscape tells me it can't find such a
> URL.

I really start to get fu**ed up with all this. There is trouble with the
provider that hosts the domain and services the redirection. My ISP which
hosts the homepage directory plays around with the ftp server which
suddenly requires a ftp-delete before ftp-put for existing files.

I would really appreciate any suggestions about a serious US webspace
provider offering 2 to 5 MB webspace without ads, ftp access, .com domain
hosting at a reasonable price.

I hope at least the link below to the English start page works for you.

   /Olli/
--
IBM OS/2 Warp Update Summary:
http://www.warpupdates.de/english/warpupdates.html

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Out of Rosenheim/2 (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: letoured@nospam.net                               03-Dec-99 18:23:19
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 21:12:24
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: letoured@nospam.net

noyb@noyb.no (None Of Your Business) said:

>Ouch, that hurts leotard.

>It may be hard, but look again.  It carries the exact same weight as your
> statement below.

If that is your interpretation then you don't know jack shilt about
business.



>letoured@nospam.net wrote in <38476277$1$yrgbherq$mr2ice@news.sover.net>:
>>noyb@noyb.no (None Of Your Business) said:
>>
>>>BTW, I can't think of anyone I know who's been killed by a gun.
>>
>>Unless you're drug dealer or friends with them, what is your point? Other
>>then to show you're a near moron by using an association that has no
>>relevance.  
>>
>>>>letoured@nospam.net:
>>>>BTW, I can't think of corporation that failed except when the big bucks
>>>>guys didn't know what the business was about, or refused to accept 
>>>>changes in the market. 
_____________
Ed Letourneau <letoured@sover.net>

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: bCandid - Powering the world's discussions - http
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: letoured@nospam.net                               03-Dec-99 18:47:23
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 21:12:25
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: letoured@nospam.net

 larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) said:

>> > That's not coercive.  It's a package deal.  Microsoft can't force
>> > computer distributors to put Windows on their machines; but they _can_
>> > say that "if you sell a computer with windows, we'll give you a massive
>> > discount on it".
>> 
>> Which is a direct violation of U. S. Fair Trade Laws
>Precisely the point.


Are you in Special Ed? The issue is not the discount. The issue is that no
one gets the discount if they sell anything but Windoze.


>Why on earth is such a straightforward transaction illegal?  What kind of
>crazy law is that?

Your the one who is not thinking with a full set of brains, and resisting
an education.


_____________
Ed Letourneau <letoured@sover.net>

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: bCandid - Powering the world's discussions - http
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: jansens_at_ibm_dot_net                            04-Dec-99 00:34:19
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 21:12:25
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: jansens_at_ibm_dot_net (Karel Jansens)

On Fri, 3 Dec 1999 18:03:07, larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) wrote:

[snip]
> 
> That's when things get interesting.  For the sake of your society, a
> person's property is not deemed to be of their own control.  How does that
> jive with the right to own property?  Or the American slogan of being for
> "Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness"?
> 
On a somewhat unrelated, yet debatebly funny note; I came across the 
nymphomanic version of that motto:

"Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of a Penis"

It brought tears to my eyes. Eventually.
(Wasn't it that Lewinsky woman who said it first?)

[snip again]

Karel Jansens
jansens_at_attglobal_dot_net
=======================================================
"Give people jam today and they'll just sit and eat it.
Jam tomorrow, now - that'll keep them going for ever.
(Terry Pratchett - Hogfather)
=======================================================

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Global Network Services - Remote Access Mail & Ne
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: tim.timmins@bcs.org.uk                            03-Dec-99 23:38:25
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 21:12:25
Subj: Re: Java 1.2 for OS/2

From: Tim Timmins <tim.timmins@bcs.org.uk>

Oops, sorry. When I said "...the 2nd quarter of the 3rd millennium", I meant
the
2nd quarter of the first year of the 3rd millennium. Sorry for any confusion.

I guess a year is a long time in politics.

Regards,
Tim

James Himmelman wrote:

> On Tue, 30 Nov 1999 13:34:00, Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com>
> wrote:
>
> > On <uprsNDlpp0Dh-pn2-3SlVlK2XxRb7@f01-207-41-174-32.i-2000.net>, on
> > 11/30/99 at 01:10 AM,
> >    jhimmel@i-2000.com (James Himmelman) said:
> >
> > > Ask them if they would take - "The first quarter of the 3rd  millennium"
> > > to mean the first 3 months or the first 250yrs. My results were 5 for 5
> > > in favor of the first 250yrs, but try it for yourself. I  asked a
> > > construction contractor, a retired manager of the New York  Stock
> > > Exchange, an architect, a manager at a department store, and a  retired
> > > manager of one of the biggest printing companies in the  country.
> >
> > I had my wife who is teaching a course at our local community college on
> > investment strategies ask the question of the 23 students in her class.
> > The results were 14 for the second three months of 2001, 5 for the first
> > three months of 2000, and 4 for the first 250 years of the third
> > millenium.
>
> Interesting results, but not too surprising considering the nature of
> the class.
>
> [[[ James Himmelman - jhimmel@i-2000.com ]]]

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Origin Line 1 Goes Here (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: tjerick@ibm.net                                   03-Dec-99 23:37:29
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 21:12:25
Subj: Re: IBM U.S. Announcement Letter

From: tjerick@ibm.net (Tim Erickson)

On Fri, 3 Dec 1999 22:45:49, Timothy Sipples 
<tsipple@us.iNoSPAMbm.com> wrote:

> Martin Brown wrote:
> > Bob Germer wrote:
> > > They support everything they sell until marketing decides they can milk
> > > the sheep into buying upgrades into which they put code to break the
older
> > > applications.
> > MS aren't the only ones to do that. There are still some old but still
useful 16bit OS/2
> > applications in use out there that will not run on Warp 4 due to
"improvements" in the PM API.
> 
> Such as?

IBM Audio Visual Connection. Authorware.

Tim

I expect the bleating of the M$ cattle will get louder in the next few
weeks as cattle always do when they smell the charnel house, alas for 
them, too late!

----Me, Nov 1999

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Global Network Services - Remote Access Mail & Ne
(1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: siberREMOVETHIS@sympatico.ca                      04-Dec-99 00:40:13
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 21:12:25
Subj: Re: Who runs this country?

From: siberREMOVETHIS@sympatico.ca (E. Barry Bruyea)

On 3 Dec 1999 20:52:10 GMT, larso@commodore. (Lars P Ormberg) wrote:

>As I stepped out onto the Stoop, I saw Bob Davies write:
>> Barry:
>> 
>> I agree with you - early on you had the choice. But there was a
>> significant period of time when distributors were forced to supply a MS
>> operating system when they sold a system.
>
>Huh?  When did Microsoft get all distributors to, against their will, supply
>MS OSes with all systemms?
>
>-- 
>Lars P. Ormberg     ICQ#:8827066


Computer users have also forgotten all those neat little dweebs &
nerds who started up computer stores all over hell's half acre and
until the last year or so were building and selling clones; barebones
or otherwise. They advertised in computer mags and even serviced mail
order customers. These days, with OEM hardware prices as low as they
are now, those individuals are now doing computer graphics for
Industrial Light & Magic.  In addition, online web sites selling
hardware will not give you a credit if you don't want windows, but
there are many retail computer stores out there that will not charge
you for windows if you don't want it on the condition they wipe the
disk.  Those paranoid about MS just don't get it.  Of *all* of the
software business in the U.S, MS has 10% of the total market.
Granted, they have 80% of the PC market, but already we are seeing a
merging of all hardware/platform/software in the computer world.  If
even a modicum of the accusation of a monopoly is true today, it will
disappear very quickly.  This is a tempest in a teapot and just a way
for the Clinton Whitehouse to convince the great unwashed that they
are being protected against Bad Bill by Good Bill.
EBB

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Sympatico (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: sma@spam-not.rtd.com                              04-Dec-99 00:06:09
  To: All                                               03-Dec-99 21:12:25
Subj: Re: Switching drives - how?

From: James Moe <sma@spam-not.rtd.com>


lifedata@xxvol.com wrote:
>
> How can I change my second physical hard drive to first?
>
> I unplugged the first drive and made the hardware changes to jumpers, etc.
> My OS/2 boot partition is on this drive and when I set it up I put a
> primary partition on the beginning so it could hold the boot manager when I
> moved it.
>
> But when I booted it up, it still had the same drive letter and the C:
> drive and it's partitions were just not there.  I'm back in my original
> configuration now.  What do I need to do to get this drive in first
> position?
>
I guess I don't understand your drive layout. Is this the original:

disk 1
  part 1 -- boot manager
  part 2 -- C: os/2 system
disk 2
  part 1 -- D:

How were the drive partitions created? As primary or logical? Which are
which?


    Here is the precedence for assigning drive letters:
primary partition -- fixed disk
logical partition -- fixed disk
primary partition -- removable disk
logical partition -- removable disk
CDROM -- whatever is left over, or whatever follows the
RESERVEDRIVELETTER= command in config.sys.

    To a small extent removable drive letter aasignments can be
controlled by the placement of drivers in config.sys.

    A disk can have multiple primary boot partitions, but only one may
be active at a time.
    It is not possible to arbitrarily assign drive letters in FDISK.
Only change the active primary partition.

-- 

sma at rtd dot com
Remove "spam-not." for email

--- WtrGate+ v0.93.p7 sn 165
 * Origin: Usenet: Northlink (northlink.com) (1:109/42)

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

+============================================================================+
