
                   comp.os.os2.mail-news            (Usenet)

                 Saturday, 30-Oct-1999 to Friday, 05-Nov-1999

+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: bwtqvg@forno.eg.net                               30-Oct-99 01:40:17
  To: All                                               30-Oct-99 04:09:29
Subj: New Search Engine  696

From: bwtqvg@forno.eg.net

Brand new search engine.
http://www.linkgrinder.com

Brand new search engine.
http://www.linkgrinder.com
elmrjdgqgjtiuhpjbobkjuywepfvsbufcryxqhuymhnsjfdutowrephzqvlyunhwqhnfcejlmbvtjzh
oqezjxpcwyux

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From: rmahoney@_REMOVE_THIS_netusa.net                  30-Oct-99 02:13:01
  To: All                                               30-Oct-99 04:10:00
Subj: Re: Anybody got Postroad DLL: SGPOSTRD.DLL ?

From: rmahoney@_REMOVE_THIS_netusa.net (Robert Mahoney)

On Mon, 18 Oct 1999 22:56:49, frank.vgnNOSPAM@inter.nl.net wrote:

> Innoval is giving away their Postroad mailer and JStreet mailer since 
> they quit OS/2 support.
> 
> Anybody got SGPOSTRD.DLL ?
> 
> It is needed in order to use the SpellGuard spell checker, I suspect it was
on 
> Innoval's site, but they removed all Postroad stuff.
> 
> The Postroad product itself is available for free (including key) 
> from: http://stores.yahoo.com/innoval

  The SpellGuard engine was licensed on a per copy basis so I would 
think that Innoval removed the DLL from the free distribution.

  And I would prefer people that have the SGPOSTRD.DLL not distribute 
it.

Bob
--
Robert Mahoney
2Rud Software and Consulting
http://www.netusa.net/~rmahoney

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From: mike.luther@ziplog.com                            30-Oct-99 06:05:21
  To: All                                               30-Oct-99 04:10:00
Subj: Re: Anybody got Postroad DLL: SGPOSTRD.DLL ?

From: mike.luther@ziplog.com

In <emfngpdFn2Jk-pn2-pxqdPGNk0ibI@localhost>, rmahoney@_REMOVE_THIS_netusa.net 
(Robert Mahoney) writes:
>On Mon, 18 Oct 1999 22:56:49, frank.vgnNOSPAM@inter.nl.net wrote:
>
>> Innoval is giving away their Postroad mailer and JStreet mailer since 
>> they quit OS/2 support.
>> 
>> Anybody got SGPOSTRD.DLL ?
>> 
>> It is needed in order to use the SpellGuard spell checker, I suspect it was 
on 
>> Innoval's site, but they removed all Postroad stuff.
>> 
>> The Postroad product itself is available for free (including key) 
>> from: http://stores.yahoo.com/innoval
>
>  The SpellGuard engine was licensed on a per copy basis so I would 
>think that Innoval removed the DLL from the free distribution.
>
>  And I would prefer people that have the SGPOSTRD.DLL not distribute 
>it.
>
>Bob
>--
>Robert Mahoney
>2Rud Software and Consulting
>http://www.netusa.net/~rmahoney

I paid for the license and have the registration key for it, but never
got the .DLL ..   I need it and have tried several times to get it so I
can register it and use it to no avail.  My registration went through BT
Micro and when I ordered it, I just went ahead and paid for the feature,
but it wasn't on BT Micro's system, for some reason and I was supposed
to go to Innoval and download it from there.

I thought that I did that at the same time I downloaded HACKSAW, but the
file transfer got grunged and I never knew it.

When I went to find the download and install it, a pretty good number of
months later ... no file.  :(

I emailed Innoval ..  No response.    I asked BT Micro; no suggestions.
One poster said he would try to help me, but no Email ever showe up to
give me a pointer.  The SG DLL was pulled from the Innoval site, to my
understanding, before all the rest of the termination work went down.

I still want that file ..

    What now?




--> Sleep well; OS2's still awake! ;)

Mike.Luther@ziplog.com
Mike.Luther@f3000.n117.z1.fidonet.org

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+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: frank@consol.de                                   30-Oct-99 11:35:10
  To: All                                               30-Oct-99 10:28:12
Subj: PMMail 2.1 - bugs and features

From: "Frank Winkler @home" <frank@consol.de>

Hi there !

I include some parts of the list of changes for PMMail 2.1 which I received 
from the new team. Of course, I couldn't test all the mentioned things but 
I'll tell you my new experiences ...


  -Fixed a crash on printing
  -Fixed a crash when printing messages with *really* long lines

Sorry to disappoint you. When I try to print an arbitrary message, this still 
causes a crash:

------------------------------------------------------------

10-30-1999  11:25:15  SYS3175  PID 002d  TID 0002  Slot 0075
F:\SOUTHSOFT\PMMAIL\PMMAIL-2.10.1999.EXE
c0000005
000651ea
P1=00000002  P2=01f8f59c  P3=XXXXXXXX  P4=XXXXXXXX  
EAX=01f9d2c0  EBX=01f9d2c0  ECX=ffff76e0  EDX=000df7c4
ESI=00000000  EDI=01f9fb88  
DS=0053  DSACC=d0f3  DSLIM=1fffffff  
ES=0053  ESACC=d0f3  ESLIM=1fffffff  
FS=150b  FSACC=00f3  FSLIM=00000030
GS=0000  GSACC=****  GSLIM=********
CS:EIP=005b:000651ea  CSACC=d0df  CSLIM=1fffffff
SS:ESP=0053:01f97ebc  SSACC=d0f3  SSLIM=1fffffff
EBP=01f97ecc  FLG=00012206

PMMAIL-2.10.1999.EXE 0001:000551ea

------------------------------------------------------------

10-30-1999  11:25:16  SYS3170  PID 002d  TID 0001  Slot 005c
F:\SOUTHSOFT\PMMAIL\PMMAIL-2.10.1999.EXE
ec8391ec
8957000f
EAX=00000000  EBX=00000000  ECX=02290000  EDX=00000000
ESI=00000000  EDI=00000000  
DS=0053  DSACC=d0f3  DSLIM=1fffffff  
ES=0053  ESACC=d0f3  ESLIM=1fffffff  
FS=150b  FSACC=00f3  FSLIM=00000030
GS=0000  GSACC=****  GSLIM=********
CS:EIP=005b:1e9719e9  CSACC=d0df  CSLIM=1fffffff
SS:ESP=0053:001befb0  SSACC=d0f3  SSLIM=1fffffff
EBP=00000000  FLG=00012206

------------------------------------------------------------

This problem occurs since 2.0 :( ... and several test versions didn't cure it 
yet.

  -Changed the behavior of opening a body in the outbox...when doing
   this, PMMail now defaults the message to NO SIG...this removes the
   double sig problem

Right. But PMMail still adds several blank lines after the signature.

  -Added some RMB cut, copy, and paste options

This does not seem to work in combination with Xit - didn't we hear that in 
earlier versions?


-Added the option to use the spacebar to page through messages


-Fixed a bug with account where turing off "Leave on server" would
 tell you there were messages up on the server when there weren't


Other bugs:

- The attachment indicator in the Remote Control still doesn't work
- The attachment area in outbox windows is invisible again after reopening it;
  even after performing "Save window position".


At least, I have some proposals for new features which I already sent to 
SouthSoft several times. Perhaps the new maintainers also think that they'd be 

useful :) ...

- Add a "Reply-To" input field behind "To" the same way as it is for "CC" and
  "BCC"
- Allow address book entries for combinations of "To" and "[B]CC"
- perhaps even with an option to specify a certain signature to use
- If I forward a message, currently the full header is included and quoted.
  IMO it would be better to default to skipping everything but "From", "To",
  "Date" and "Subject" and not to quote this in the same manner as the body
  text. And let's add a switch to be able to include  the complete header.
- Also add a "find" feature in the compose window (see read window)
- Add IMAP support
- Enable saving search options as a template so that we get some kind of
  message views (show all messages from Mister X.)
- Allow other actions than "read" for search results and also for more than
  one result in the same action

Any comments?

BTW: Will BluePrint also continue the work on PMINews?

TIA

-- 
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Frank Winkler                                                frank@consol.de
ConSol GmbH
Franziskanerstr. 38                                   Voice +49 89 45841.180
81669 Munich - Germany                                  Fax +49 89 45841.199




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From: bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com                           30-Oct-99 08:29:15
  To: All                                               30-Oct-99 14:31:17
Subj: Re: Anybody got Postroad DLL: SGPOSTRD.DLL ?

From: Bob Germer <bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com>

On <s1l2ln2mcsf87@corp.supernews.com>, on 10/30/99 at 06:05 AM,
   mike.luther@ziplog.com said:

> I emailed Innoval ..  No response.    I asked BT Micro; no suggestions.
> One poster said he would try to help me, but no Email ever showe up to
> give me a pointer.  The SG DLL was pulled from the Innoval site, to my
> understanding, before all the rest of the termination work went down.

> I still want that file ..

>     What now?

When I was in high school, I really wanted Susie Morgan, but she wouldn't
go out with me. I had two choices, - act like a fool and go about
bemoaning my fate or moving on.

I chose the latter. I suggest you do the same and stop cluttering
newsgroups with your mewling and crying.

--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
Bob Germer from Mount Holly, NJ - E-mail: bobg@Pics.com
Proudly running OS/2 Warp 4.0 w/ FixPack 12
MR/2 Ice Registration Number 67
Aut Pax Aut Bellum
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------

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From: mike.luther@ziplog.com                            30-Oct-99 15:04:20
  To: All                                               30-Oct-99 14:31:18
Subj: Re: Anybody got Postroad DLL: SGPOSTRD.DLL ?

From: mike.luther@ziplog.com

In <381ae536$1$obot$mr2ice@news.pics.com>, Bob Germer
<bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com> writes:
>On <s1l2ln2mcsf87@corp.supernews.com>, on 10/30/99 at 06:05 AM,

>When I was in high school, I really wanted Susie Morgan, but she wouldn't
>go out with me. I had two choices, - act like a fool and go about
>bemoaning my fate or moving on.
>
>I chose the latter. I suggest you do the same and stop cluttering
>newsgroups with your mewling and crying.


You get what you inspect, not what you expect.  ;)


--> Sleep well; OS2's still awake! ;)

Mike.Luther@ziplog.com
Mike.Luther@f3000.n117.z1.fidonet.org

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From: spamonoloawmg@yesic.com                           30-Oct-99 13:08:23
  To: All                                               30-Oct-99 16:38:13
Subj: Mailing List

From: "andrew g" <spamonoloawmg@yesic.com>

Hi everyone. I tried HaWi's robot, and the other two mailing list proggies on
Hobbes. I would still rather start my parish's mailing list using tools I
already have: PMMail and Hacksaw.

Does anyone know if Hacksaw can send mail with a carbon copy? What's the
proper command line, if possible?

Thanks,

andrew
// Fr. Andrew Graham
// St Columba and All Hallows Church 
// 2723 St. Clair Ave. East
// Toronto Ontario  M4B 1M8
// (416) 755 - 0301 
// yesic.com, awmg (you know what to do, right?)



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From: aboritz@cybernex.net                              30-Oct-99 12:59:05
  To: All                                               30-Oct-99 21:22:10
Subj: Re: Anybody got Postroad DLL: SGPOSTRD.DLL ?

From: aboritz@cybernex.net (Alan Boritz)

In article <381ae536$1$obot$mr2ice@news.pics.com>, Bob Germer
<bobg.REMOVEME.@pics.com> wrote:
>On <s1l2ln2mcsf87@corp.supernews.com>, on 10/30/99 at 06:05 AM,
>   mike.luther@ziplog.com said:
>
>> I emailed Innoval ..  No response.    I asked BT Micro; no suggestions.
>> One poster said he would try to help me, but no Email ever showe up to
>> give me a pointer.  The SG DLL was pulled from the Innoval site, to my
>> understanding, before all the rest of the termination work went down.
>
>> I still want that file ..
>
>>     What now?
>
>When I was in high school, I really wanted Susie Morgan, but she wouldn't
>go out with me. I had two choices, - act like a fool and go about
>bemoaning my fate or moving on.

Nah, you didn't have ANY choices.  Susie couldn't stand you.

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From: aboritz@cybernex.net                              30-Oct-99 12:44:14
  To: All                                               30-Oct-99 21:22:10
Subj: Re: Anybody got Postroad DLL: SGPOSTRD.DLL ?

From: aboritz@cybernex.net (Alan Boritz)

In article <s1l2ln2mcsf87@corp.supernews.com>, mike.luther@ziplog.com wrote:
...
>I paid for the license and have the registration key for it, but never
>got the .DLL ..   I need it and have tried several times to get it so I
>can register it and use it to no avail.  My registration went through BT
>Micro and when I ordered it, I just went ahead and paid for the feature,
>but it wasn't on BT Micro's system, for some reason and I was supposed
>to go to Innoval and download it from there.
>
>I thought that I did that at the same time I downloaded HACKSAW, but the
>file transfer got grunged and I never knew it.
>
>When I went to find the download and install it, a pretty good number of
>months later ... no file.  :(

Innoval was running a "special" a while back, giving away the Spellguard
add-on for the first 100 or so people who bought PRM.  I seriously doubt that
ANYONE got it, since no one knows how many copies they actually sold.

>I emailed Innoval ..  No response.    I asked BT Micro; no suggestions.

Innoval hasn't been answering email from customers or anyone else, for well
over a year.  BMT Micro should have gotten you what you needed or refunded
(even partially) your registration.  BMT Micro is getting a reputation for
selling products that are substantially less functional than advertised, or
that work for a short time and then not at all.

>One poster said he would try to help me, but no Email ever showe up to
>give me a pointer.  The SG DLL was pulled from the Innoval site, to my
>understanding, before all the rest of the termination work went down.
>
>I still want that file ..
>
>    What now?

Don't give up yet, you may still find someone with the missing dll who's
willing to share.  But don't hesitate to spread the word that BMT Micro didn't
provide the product for which you've paid.

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From: frank.vgnNOSPAM@inter.nl.net                      30-Oct-99 23:45:13
  To: All                                               30-Oct-99 21:22:10
Subj: Re: Anybody got Postroad DLL: SGPOSTRD.DLL ?

From: frank.vgnNOSPAM@inter.nl.net (Frank van Groen)

 Sat, 30 Oct 1999 02:13:03, rmahoney@_REMOVE_THIS_netusa.net (Robert 
Mahoney) wrote:

>On Mon, 18 Oct 1999 22:56:49, frank.vgnNOSPAM@inter.nl.net wrote:
>
>> Innoval is giving away their Postroad mailer and JStreet mailer 
since 
>> they quit OS/2 support.
>> 
>> Anybody got SGPOSTRD.DLL ?
>> 
>> It is needed in order to use the SpellGuard spell checker, I 
suspect it was on 
>> Innoval's site, but they removed all Postroad stuff.
>> 
>> The Postroad product itself is available for free (including key) 
>> from: http://stores.yahoo.com/innoval
>
>  The SpellGuard engine was licensed on a per copy basis so I would 
>think that Innoval removed the DLL from the free distribution.
>
>  And I would prefer people that have the SGPOSTRD.DLL not distribute 
>it.
>
>Bob
>--
>Robert Mahoney
>2Rud Software and Consulting
>http://www.netusa.net/~rmahoney

The question remains: if I register SpellGuard, do I get this DLL, so 
I can use SpellGuard in a more integrated way with PostRoad?
I am assuming this is the purpose of the DLL.
Otherwise SpellGuard would not be more useful to me than any other 
product using similar technology.

Greetings,
           Frank.

frank.vgnNOSPAM@inter.nl.net

Standard disclaimer: The views of this user are strictly her/his own.
To reply, remove the word NOSPAM from my address.


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From: frank.vgnNOSPAM@inter.nl.net                      30-Oct-99 23:45:15
  To: All                                               30-Oct-99 21:22:10
Subj: ProNews/2 forgets username/password

From: frank.vgnNOSPAM@inter.nl.net (Frank van Groen)

I am trying to access my old dial-up provider through my new cable 
provider. (my old provider saves articles and binaries way much longer
then the cable provider.)

To access their news server it needs my username and password, 
however ProNews/2 does not seem to store or remember these settings.

The moment I press OK on Server settings page 1, my data seems to get
lost. When I reenter the settings notebook, both fields are blank 
again.

When I try to connect I only get this message:

"This server requires authentication and you have not setup your 
username/password. Reverting that server to offline mode."

Greetings,
           Frank.

frank.vgnNOSPAM@inter.nl.net

Standard disclaimer: The views of this user are strictly her/his own.
To reply, remove the word NOSPAM from my address.


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+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: james.arnold@!!!usa.net                           31-Oct-99 02:13:15
  To: All                                               31-Oct-99 06:30:21
Subj: Re: Anybody got Postroad DLL: SGPOSTRD.DLL ?

From: james.arnold@!!!usa.net

In <s1l2ln2mcsf87@corp.supernews.com>, mike.luther@ziplog.com writes:
>In <emfngpdFn2Jk-pn2-pxqdPGNk0ibI@localhost>,
rmahoney@_REMOVE_THIS_netusa.net (Robert Mahoney) writes:
>>On Mon, 18 Oct 1999 22:56:49, frank.vgnNOSPAM@inter.nl.net wrote:
>>

..[snip]...

>I emailed Innoval ..  No response.    I asked BT Micro; no suggestions.
>One poster said he would try to help me, but no Email ever showe up to
>give me a pointer.  The SG DLL was pulled from the Innoval site, to my
>understanding, before all the rest of the termination work went down.
>
>I still want that file ..
>
>    What now?

        I would suggest that you get in touch with the author of
SpellGuard:

>Robert Mahoney
>2Rud Software and Consulting
>http://www.netusa.net/~rmahoney

        I suspect that he should be able to help you,if you can prove to him
that you do in fact have a licensed copy. There was a combo deal for
SpellGuard and the dll for PARM. I cann't remember if there was a special
license number that activated both the program and the PRM dll or if the 
dll was a down load form Innoval with a special password. It's a long time
since I got it myself. All the pertinent information may be on may machine
at the office.

===========================================================================
remove !!! for e-mail
James Arnold                                email:    james.arnold@usa.net
                                              ICQ:    9719182

        Member Toronto OS/2 User Group

Brought to you by the letters O S the number 2 and NR/2
===========================================================================

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From: spamawmgspareme@yesic.please.com                  31-Oct-99 00:23:01
  To: All                                               31-Oct-99 06:30:21
Subj: Re: Mailing List

From: "andrew g" <spamawmgspareme@yesic.please.com>

at http://www.davebsoft.com I found a REXX script that looks promising. 

On Sat, 30 Oct 1999 13:08:47 -0400 (EDT), andrew g wrote:

>Hi everyone. I tried HaWi's robot, and the other two mailing list proggies on
>Hobbes. I would still rather start my parish's mailing list using tools I
>already have: PMMail and Hacksaw.
>
>Does anyone know if Hacksaw can send mail with a carbon copy? What's the
>proper command line, if possible?
>
>Thanks,
>
>andrew
>// Fr. Andrew Graham
>// St Columba and All Hallows Church 
>// 2723 St. Clair Ave. East
>// Toronto Ontario  M4B 1M8
>// (416) 755 - 0301 
>// yesic.com, awmg (you know what to do, right?)
>
>
>



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From: donnelly@tampabay.rr.com                          31-Oct-99 06:34:20
  To: All                                               31-Oct-99 06:30:21
Subj: Re: ProNews/2 forgets username/password

From: donnelly@tampabay.rr.com (Buddy Donnelly)

On Sat, 30 Oct 1999 23:45:31, frank.vgnNOSPAM@inter.nl.net (Frank van 
Groen) a crit dans un message:

> I am trying to access my old dial-up provider through my new cable 
> provider. (my old provider saves articles and binaries way much longer
> then the cable provider.)
> 
> To access their news server it needs my username and password, 
> however ProNews/2 does not seem to store or remember these settings.
> 
> The moment I press OK on Server settings page 1, my data seems to get
> lost. When I reenter the settings notebook, both fields are blank 
> again.

When you enter changes to the Server info in ProNews, look at the three 
buttons named ADD CHANGE DELETE just to the right of the list of servers. 
You must hit the CHANGE button to lock in the changes you've made for the 
selected server.


Good luck,

Buddy

Buddy Donnelly
donnelly@tampabay.rr.com


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From: dwparsons@t-online.de                             31-Oct-99 08:57:21
  To: All                                               31-Oct-99 22:05:17
Subj: Re: ProNews/2 forgets username/password

From: dwparsons@t-online.de (Dave Parsons)

On Sat, 30 Oct 1999 23:45:31, frank.vgnNOSPAM@inter.nl.net (Frank van Groen)
wrote:

> I am trying to access my old dial-up provider through my new cable 
> provider. (my old provider saves articles and binaries way much longer
> then the cable provider.)
> 
> To access their news server it needs my username and password, 
> however ProNews/2 does not seem to store or remember these settings.
> 
> The moment I press OK on Server settings page 1, my data seems to get
> lost. When I reenter the settings notebook, both fields are blank 
> again.

Did you perhaps forget to press ADD before OK?

-- 
Dave

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From: mike.luther@ziplog.com                            31-Oct-99 16:28:19
  To: All                                               31-Oct-99 22:05:18
Subj: Re: Anybody got Postroad DLL: SGPOSTRD.DLL ?

From: mike.luther@ziplog.com

In <fBNS3.32496$up3.49988@news21.bellglobal.com>, james.arnold@!!!usa.net
writes:


>>    What now?

>        I would suggest that you get in touch with the author of
>SpellGuard:
>
>>Robert Mahoney
>>2Rud Software and Consulting
>>http://www.netusa.net/~rmahoney
>
>        I suspect that he should be able to help you,if you can prove to him
>that you do in fact have a licensed copy. There was a combo deal for
>SpellGuard and the dll for PARM. I cann't remember if there was a special
>license number that activated both the program and the PRM dll or if the 
>dll was a down load form Innoval with a special password. It's a long time
>since I got it myself. All the pertinent information may be on may machine
>at the office.
>
>===========================================================================
>remove !!! for e-mail
>James Arnold                                email:    james.arnold@usa.net
>                                              ICQ:    9719182
>
>        Member Toronto OS/2 User Group
>
>Brought to you by the letters O S the number 2 and NR/2
>===========================================================================


Thank you James for your kindness.


--> Sleep well; OS2's still awake! ;)

Mike.Luther@ziplog.com
Mike.Luther@f3000.n117.z1.fidonet.org

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+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: commafaq@locutus.ofB.ORG                          31-Oct-99 09:00:00
  To: All                                               01-Nov-99 05:45:07
Subj: FAQ: News and Mail: pointer to comp.os.msdos.mail-news FAQs

From: commafaq@locutus.ofB.ORG

Archive-name: msdos-mail-news/pointer
Comp-os-msdos-mail-news-archive-name: pointer
Posting-Frequency: weekly
Last-modified: 1998-Jul-12
Intro-Last-modified: 1998-Sep-27
Software-Last-modified: 1999-Oct-30

Comp.Os.Msdos.MAil-news == c.o.m.ma == comma
FAQ == Frequently Asked Questions

comma is about uucp, mail, and news for msdos or ms-windows or os2.

The comp.os.msdos.mail-news FAQ lists can be obtained via all
news.answers access methods:

quoting the news.answers FAQ:

``
		    Where are *.answers archived?

  All of the *.answers newsgroups are archived in the periodic posting
archive on rtfm.mit.edu [18.181.0.24].  Postings are located in the
anonymous ftp directories /pub/usenet/alt.answers,
/pub/usenet/comp.answers, etc., and are archived by "Archive-name".
Other subdirectories of /pub/usenet contain periodic postings that may
not appear in *.answers (as well as most of the *.answers postings),
saved by Subject line rather than by Archive-name.

  If you do not have anonymous ftp access, you can access the archives
by mail server as well.  Send an E-mail message to
mail-server@rtfm.mit.edu with "help" and "index" in the body on
separate lines for more information.
''

The FAQ lists for comp.os.msdos.mail-news can be found on the Internet:
  <ftp://rtfm.mit.edu/pub/usenet/comp.os.msdos.mail-news/intro>
  <ftp://rtfm.mit.edu/pub/usenet/comp.os.msdos.mail-news/software>
  <http://www.faqs.org/faqs/msdos-mail-news/intro/>
  <http://www.faqs.org/faqs/msdos-mail-news/software/>

Note that the charter of comp.os.msdos.mail-news _explicitly_ covers
mail, news, and uucp under msdos and compatibles, and used to cover
ms-windows and os2 until they got their own groups (although uucp
under ms-windows didn't, so it can stay).  the FAQs still list
information for os2 users and ms-windows users.

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+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: auofaq@locutus.ofB.ORG                            29-Oct-99 06:00:00
  To: All                                               01-Nov-99 05:45:07
Subj: FAQ: pointer to alt.usenet.offline-reader FAQs

From: auofaq@locutus.ofB.ORG (a.u.o FAQ)

Archive-name: offline-reader/usenet/pointer
Alt-usenet-offline-reader-archive-name: pointer
Posting-Frequency: weekly
Last-modified: 1998-Jul-12
Intro-Last-modified: 1998-Nov-21
Software-Last-modified: 1999-Jul-13

[
  Please note that this message has a Followup-To: alt.usenet.offline-reader
  which directs all followups to that one group only.  If you see a response
  directly to this post which spams all the groups on the list, that user is
  either extremely rude or using very broken software.  In either case, they
  might benefit from you mailing them, and asking them to correct it.

  Also note that there are no opinions in this pointer -- it merely contains
  unrefutable facts about the *.answers newsgroups.
]

Alt.Usenet.Offline-Reader is about reading mail and news available to
your normal login account, but while you're not actually logged in.

The alt.usenet.offline-reader FAQ lists can be obtained via all
news.answers access methods:

quoting the news.answers FAQ:

``
		    Where are *.answers archived?

  All of the *.answers newsgroups are archived in the periodic posting
archive on rtfm.mit.edu [18.181.0.24].  Postings are located in the
anonymous ftp directories /pub/usenet/alt.answers,
/pub/usenet/comp.answers, etc., and are archived by "Archive-name".
Other subdirectories of /pub/usenet contain periodic postings that may
not appear in *.answers (as well as most of the *.answers postings),
saved by Subject line rather than by Archive-name.

  If you do not have anonymous ftp access, you can access the archives
by mail server as well.  Send an E-mail message to
mail-server@rtfm.mit.edu with "help" and "index" in the body on
separate lines for more information.
''

The FAQ lists for alt.usenet.offline-reader can be found on the Internet:
  <ftp://rtfm.mit.edu/pub/usenet/alt.usenet.offline-reader/intro>
  <ftp://rtfm.mit.edu/pub/usenet/alt.usenet.offline-reader/software>
  <http://www.faqs.org/faqs/off-line-readers/usenet/intro/>
  <http://www.faqs.org/faqs/off-line-readers/usenet/software/>

Note that, despite the name including `usenet' and not `mail', discussion of
mail as well as news is welcomed (and common) in alt.usenet.offline-reader.

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From: jspringf@xxxpro-ns.net                            02-Nov-99 14:59:24
  To: All                                               02-Nov-99 14:32:22
Subj: Re: Need help with Ultimail on OS/2 WSeB

From: jspringf@xxxpro-ns.net

In <381E32FC.6C37C00F@bogusdomain.com>, Robert Basler <bogus@bogusdomain.com>
writes:
>I'm trying to get Ultimail 2.10.004 to work on OS/2 WSeB, I couldn't
>find any way to install just ultimail from the Warp 4 CD's, so I copied
>my UMAIL directory and mailstor over wholesale from my working Warp 4
>system, then put the SENDMAIL.UML file into the MPTN directory.  Note
>that all paths are the same on both systems.
>
>It will send and recieve mail as long as you are connected to the
>internet.
>
>If you are not connected and send a message, it says that it was queued
>successfully, but there is no message in the MQUEUE directory and the
>message text can be found in a file called DEADLET.TER in the MPTN\ETC
>directory.
>
>I have the ETC dir set to MPTN\ETC
>
>When I connect to the internet, it does not do the sendmail thing in the
>status window, but I suspect that this has more to do with there being
>no files in the MQUEUE directory, rather than some problem with that
>program feature.
>
>Suggestions???  I really want to stick to Ultimail since I have
>thousands of archived messages that I access regularly and have been
>very happy with the app in general to date.
>
>This is what I got when I ran UMCHECK.CMD
>
>The key "AURORASW /MAIL_GW" in D:\MPTN\ETC\TCPOS2.INI was not found!
>No "Mlocal" line was found in D:\MPTN\ETC\SENDMAIL.CF!
>
>Installation information:
>  The UltiMail provider is ADVANTIS
>  TMP = D:\TCPIP\TMP
>  ETC = D:\MPTN\ETC
>  SRV = D:\TCPIP\UMAIL\SERVER
>  CONNECTION = AURORASW
>  POPSRVR = mail.direct.ca
>  REPLY_DOMAIN = direct.ca
>  MQueue from SENDMAIL.CF:  D:\MPTN\ETC\MQUEUE
>  DD from SENDMAIL.CF:      Your.Domain
>  MQueue from SENDMAIL.UML: D:\MPTN\ETC\MQUEUE
>  Mlocal from SENDMAIL.UML: Mlocal  P=d:\tcpip\umail\umailer.exe
>F=lsmDFP
>S=10  R=0  A=-dest d:\tcpip\umail\server\inbox -to $u
>
>FYI my email address above is bogus, send email to: aurorasw direct ca
>after inserting appropriate ats and dots, thanks.
>

I noticed the same problem after installing mpts wr08600(included
with tcpip v4.1), wr08610, and wr08620 on Warp 4.

After many installs, many postings, and even reporting this to IBM,
I have not found the cause of the problem, or a possible solution.

Like you, I would like to be able to use my UML with the "32 bit"
stacks, and hope someone shows up with some answers or some ideas
of what can be tried.

-----------------------------------------------------------
Fred Springfield                       for e-mail remove 'xxx'
Plymouth, MN
-----------------------------------------------------------

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From: mckinnis@attglobal.net                            02-Nov-99 08:07:25
  To: All                                               02-Nov-99 14:32:22
Subj: Re: Need help with Ultimail on OS/2 WSeB

From: Chuck McKinnis <mckinnis@attglobal.net>

I won't quibble.  I run PMMail as my main mailer on my home machine.

Nick Knight wrote:
> 
> In <381EFAE0.77DBB58@attglobal.net>, on 11/02/99
>    at 07:53 AM, Chuck McKinnis <mckinnis@attglobal.net> said:
> 
> >Most people have given up on Ultimail under OS/2.  I would suggest that
> >you look at other mailers.  Innoval has made both of their mailers, Post
> >Road Mailer and JSteet Mailer public domain.  There is an active group of
> >knowledgable Java programmers who have been fixing up and improving
> >JStreet into a very usable product.  Both products run fine under WSeB.
> 
> Although, it would benefit him greatly to shop around.  "Free" may be an
> ultimate enticement for some, but there are two other award-winning
> mailers on the OS/2 block to consider:  PM Mail and MR/2.  These are both,
> already, "very usable products".
> 
> I'll leave it to the PM Mail advocates to paste in a URL, I don't have it.
> However, information about MR/2 ICE can be acquired from:
> 
>     http://nick.secant.com/mr2ice.htm
> 
> NOTE that MR/2 development is still active.  In fact, I'm preparing to
> release a v2.0 before the end of the year.
> 
> Nick
> --
> -----------------------------------------------------------
> Nick Knight  <nick@secant.com>       http://nick.secant.com
> Senior Software Engineer
> Secant Technologies, Inc.             http://www.secant.com
> -----------------------------------------------------------

-- 
Chuck McKinnis
Senior Systems Engineer
Denver Solutions Group, Inc.
IBM Business Partner
IBM Senior Systems Engineer (retired)

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+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: mckinnis@attglobal.net                            02-Nov-99 07:53:10
  To: All                                               02-Nov-99 14:32:23
Subj: Re: Need help with Ultimail on OS/2 WSeB

From: Chuck McKinnis <mckinnis@attglobal.net>

Most people have given up on Ultimail under OS/2.  I would suggest that
you look at other mailers.  Innoval has made both of their mailers, Post
Road Mailer and JSteet Mailer public domain.  There is an active group
of knowledgable Java programmers who have been fixing up and improving
JStreet into a very usable product.  Both products run fine under WSeB.

Robert Basler wrote:
> 
> I'm trying to get Ultimail 2.10.004 to work on OS/2 WSeB, I couldn't
> find any way to install just ultimail from the Warp 4 CD's, so I copied
> my UMAIL directory and mailstor over wholesale from my working Warp 4
> system, then put the SENDMAIL.UML file into the MPTN directory.  Note
> that all paths are the same on both systems.
> 
> It will send and recieve mail as long as you are connected to the
> internet.
> 
> If you are not connected and send a message, it says that it was queued
> successfully, but there is no message in the MQUEUE directory and the
> message text can be found in a file called DEADLET.TER in the MPTN\ETC
> directory.
> 
> I have the ETC dir set to MPTN\ETC
> 
> When I connect to the internet, it does not do the sendmail thing in the
> status window, but I suspect that this has more to do with there being
> no files in the MQUEUE directory, rather than some problem with that
> program feature.
> 
> Suggestions???  I really want to stick to Ultimail since I have
> thousands of archived messages that I access regularly and have been
> very happy with the app in general to date.
> 
> This is what I got when I ran UMCHECK.CMD
> 
> The key "AURORASW /MAIL_GW" in D:\MPTN\ETC\TCPOS2.INI was not found!
> No "Mlocal" line was found in D:\MPTN\ETC\SENDMAIL.CF!
> 
> Installation information:
>   The UltiMail provider is ADVANTIS
>   TMP = D:\TCPIP\TMP
>   ETC = D:\MPTN\ETC
>   SRV = D:\TCPIP\UMAIL\SERVER
>   CONNECTION = AURORASW
>   POPSRVR = mail.direct.ca
>   REPLY_DOMAIN = direct.ca
>   MQueue from SENDMAIL.CF:  D:\MPTN\ETC\MQUEUE
>   DD from SENDMAIL.CF:      Your.Domain
>   MQueue from SENDMAIL.UML: D:\MPTN\ETC\MQUEUE
>   Mlocal from SENDMAIL.UML: Mlocal  P=d:\tcpip\umail\umailer.exe
> F=lsmDFP
> S=10  R=0  A=-dest d:\tcpip\umail\server\inbox -to $u
> 
> FYI my email address above is bogus, send email to: aurorasw direct ca
> after inserting appropriate ats and dots, thanks.

-- 
Chuck McKinnis
Senior Systems Engineer
Denver Solutions Group, Inc.
IBM Business Partner
IBM Senior Systems Engineer (retired)

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+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: nick@secant.com                                   02-Nov-99 10:01:02
  To: All                                               02-Nov-99 14:32:23
Subj: Re: Need help with Ultimail on OS/2 WSeB

From: Nick Knight <nick@secant.com>

In <381EFAE0.77DBB58@attglobal.net>, on 11/02/99 
   at 07:53 AM, Chuck McKinnis <mckinnis@attglobal.net> said:

>Most people have given up on Ultimail under OS/2.  I would suggest that
>you look at other mailers.  Innoval has made both of their mailers, Post
>Road Mailer and JSteet Mailer public domain.  There is an active group of
>knowledgable Java programmers who have been fixing up and improving
>JStreet into a very usable product.  Both products run fine under WSeB.

Although, it would benefit him greatly to shop around.  "Free" may be an
ultimate enticement for some, but there are two other award-winning
mailers on the OS/2 block to consider:  PM Mail and MR/2.  These are both,
already, "very usable products".

I'll leave it to the PM Mail advocates to paste in a URL, I don't have it. 
However, information about MR/2 ICE can be acquired from:

    http://nick.secant.com/mr2ice.htm

NOTE that MR/2 development is still active.  In fact, I'm preparing to
release a v2.0 before the end of the year.

Nick
-- 
-----------------------------------------------------------
Nick Knight  <nick@secant.com>       http://nick.secant.com
Senior Software Engineer
Secant Technologies, Inc.             http://www.secant.com
-----------------------------------------------------------

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From: jspringf@xxxpro-ns.net                            02-Nov-99 16:44:28
  To: All                                               02-Nov-99 14:32:23
Subj: Re: Need help with Ultimail on OS/2 WSeB

From: jspringf@xxxpro-ns.net

In <381EFAE0.77DBB58@attglobal.net>, Chuck McKinnis <mckinnis@attglobal.net>
writes:
>Most people have given up on Ultimail under OS/2.  I would suggest that
>you look at other mailers.  Innoval has made both of their mailers, Post
>Road Mailer and JSteet Mailer public domain.  There is an active group
>of knowledgable Java programmers who have been fixing up and improving
>JStreet into a very usable product.  Both products run fine under WSeB.
>
>Robert Basler wrote:
>> 
>> I'm trying to get Ultimail 2.10.004 to work on OS/2 WSeB, I couldn't
>> find any way to install just ultimail from the Warp 4 CD's, so I copied
>> my UMAIL directory and mailstor over wholesale from my working Warp 4
>> system, then put the SENDMAIL.UML file into the MPTN directory.  Note
>> that all paths are the same on both systems.
>> 
>> It will send and recieve mail as long as you are connected to the
>> internet.
>> 
>> If you are not connected and send a message, it says that it was queued
>> successfully, but there is no message in the MQUEUE directory and the
>> message text can be found in a file called DEADLET.TER in the MPTN\ETC
>> directory.
>> 
>> I have the ETC dir set to MPTN\ETC
>> 
>> When I connect to the internet, it does not do the sendmail thing in the
>> status window, but I suspect that this has more to do with there being
>> no files in the MQUEUE directory, rather than some problem with that
>> program feature.
>> 
>> Suggestions???  I really want to stick to Ultimail since I have
>> thousands of archived messages that I access regularly and have been
>> very happy with the app in general to date.
>> 
>> This is what I got when I ran UMCHECK.CMD
>> 
>> The key "AURORASW /MAIL_GW" in D:\MPTN\ETC\TCPOS2.INI was not found!
>> No "Mlocal" line was found in D:\MPTN\ETC\SENDMAIL.CF!
>> 
>> Installation information:
>>   The UltiMail provider is ADVANTIS
>>   TMP = D:\TCPIP\TMP
>>   ETC = D:\MPTN\ETC
>>   SRV = D:\TCPIP\UMAIL\SERVER
>>   CONNECTION = AURORASW
>>   POPSRVR = mail.direct.ca
>>   REPLY_DOMAIN = direct.ca
>>   MQueue from SENDMAIL.CF:  D:\MPTN\ETC\MQUEUE
>>   DD from SENDMAIL.CF:      Your.Domain
>>   MQueue from SENDMAIL.UML: D:\MPTN\ETC\MQUEUE
>>   Mlocal from SENDMAIL.UML: Mlocal  P=d:\tcpip\umail\umailer.exe
>> F=lsmDFP
>> S=10  R=0  A=-dest d:\tcpip\umail\server\inbox -to $u
>> 
>> FYI my email address above is bogus, send email to: aurorasw direct ca
>> after inserting appropriate ats and dots, thanks.
>
>-- 
>Chuck McKinnis
>Senior Systems Engineer
>Denver Solutions Group, Inc.
>IBM Business Partner
>IBM Senior Systems Engineer (retired)

Sorry--but this type of reply is not helpful at all.

I think you meant well, but you just have not answered the question.

-----------------------------------------------------------
Fred Springfield                       for e-mail remove 'xxx'
Plymouth, MN
-----------------------------------------------------------

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From: bv@mail.bv.no                                     02-Nov-99 14:13:19
  To: All                                               02-Nov-99 14:32:23
Subj: Re: Need help with Ultimail on OS/2 WSeB

From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Bj=F8rn?= Vermo <bv@mail.bv.no>

Robert Basler wrote:

>
> Suggestions???  I really want to stick to Ultimail since I have
> thousands of archived messages that I access regularly and have been
> very happy with the app in general to date.
>

I would take a hint from the fact that Ultimail is explicitely listed as not
supported by WSeB. If it were trivial to get it working, I suspect it would
still be supported.

In your place, I would look for another mail client and convert the
archives.


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From: bogus@bogusdomain.com                             02-Nov-99 09:43:04
  To: All                                               02-Nov-99 16:47:17
Subj: Re: Need help with Ultimail on OS/2 WSeB

From: Robert Basler <bogus@bogusdomain.com>

The problem appears to be with sendmail, not with ultimail.  It doesn't seem
to
be willing to queue messages.  There are DNS lookup errors in the sendmail
error
log.  I note that I also have DNS problems with any app that is started before 
I
am actually connected to the internet.

Bjrn Vermo wrote:

> > Suggestions???  I really want to stick to Ultimail since I have
> > thousands of archived messages that I access regularly and have been
> > very happy with the app in general to date.
> >
>
> I would take a hint from the fact that Ultimail is explicitely listed as not
> supported by WSeB. If it were trivial to get it working, I suspect it would
> still be supported.



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From: mckinnis@attglobal.net                            02-Nov-99 14:15:27
  To: All                                               02-Nov-99 19:59:28
Subj: Re: Need help with Ultimail on OS/2 WSeB

From: Chuck McKinnis <mckinnis@attglobal.net>

After over 35 years in this business, I have come to realize that a dead
horse still just lies even after a beating.

There may be serious issues in the Ultimail TCP/IP 4.2 stack interface.

The effort to convert to a working mailer may well be far less than the
effort to make an unsupported product run.  And even if you do get it to
work, the next maintenance you apply to the system may take you right
back to ground zero.

jspringf@xxxpro-ns.net wrote:
> 
> Sorry--but this type of reply is not helpful at all.
> 
> I think you meant well, but you just have not answered the question.
> 
> -----------------------------------------------------------
> Fred Springfield                       for e-mail remove 'xxx'
> Plymouth, MN
> -----------------------------------------------------------

-- 
Chuck McKinnis
Senior Systems Engineer
Denver Solutions Group, Inc.
IBM Business Partner
IBM Senior Systems Engineer (retired)

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+----------------------------------------------------------------------------+

From: greg_t@connect.net.au                             03-Nov-99 15:58:16
  To: All                                               03-Nov-99 03:33:27
Subj: Whats the free best News server for OS/2?

From: Greg Thomas <greg_t@connect.net.au>

I've got a bit of a LAN at home and wanting to setup a News Server. I
have had a bit of a look at Changi (though not deeply yet), but was
wondering if those in the know could tell me if I should be looking at
something else instead.

Greg


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From: hamei@pacbell.net                                 03-Nov-99 20:35:21
  To: All                                               03-Nov-99 21:54:22
Subj: Re: Need help with Ultimail on OS/2 WSeB

From: hamei@pacbell.net

In <381efd7d$1$avpx$mr2ice@client.ce.news.psi.net>, Nick Knight
<nick@secant.com> writes:
>
>NOTE that MR/2 development is still active.  In fact, I'm preparing to
>release a v2.0 before the end of the year.
>

trying not to sound like a snotty ungrateful tightwad wretched OS/2
bottom-feeding nattering nabob of negativism, but :

will v2 of MR/2 ICE work correctly with Unicode fonts in DBCS mail ?
v 1.62 does not . . . 


>Nick
>-- 
>-----------------------------------------------------------
>Nick Knight  <nick@secant.com>       http://nick.secant.com
>Senior Software Engineer
>Secant Technologies, Inc.             http://www.secant.com
>-----------------------------------------------------------

--
hrad ngravvd

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From: nick@secant.com                                   03-Nov-99 16:02:29
  To: All                                               03-Nov-99 21:54:22
Subj: Re: Need help with Ultimail on OS/2 WSeB

From: Nick Knight <nick@secant.com>

In <c1.2b8.2Sn3Wz$02X@hamei.pacbell.net>, on 11/03/99 
   at 08:35 PM, hamei@pacbell.net said:

>will v2 of MR/2 ICE work correctly with Unicode fonts in DBCS mail ? v
>1.62 does not . . . 

Nope.  Sorry.  I have some DBCS users that seem to be having good luck,
but I can't tell you how they do it.  I do know that I explored full DBCS,
but I saw no way to install a machine with a DBCS version, and if I
managed to do that, I wouldn't have known enough about what I was seeing
to a) work with it and b) prove to me that what I was doing was "working".

If there are enough requests, I may revisit the idea.

Nick
-- 
-----------------------------------------------------------
Nick Knight  <nick@secant.com>       http://nick.secant.com
Senior Software Engineer
Secant Technologies, Inc.             http://www.secant.com
-----------------------------------------------------------

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From: nospam@savebandwidth.invalid                      04-Nov-99 00:23:04
  To: All                                               04-Nov-99 03:16:20
Subj: Re: Whats the free best News server for OS/2?

From: nospam@savebandwidth.invalid       (John Thompson)

In <381FCF08.9B1B3CFF@connect.net.au>, Greg Thomas <greg_t@connect.net.au>
writes:

>I've got a bit of a LAN at home and wanting to setup a News Server. I
>have had a bit of a look at Changi (though not deeply yet), but was
>wondering if those in the know could tell me if I should be looking at
>something else instead.

I've been using changi here for several years.  Never 
even bothered looking further; I'm not even sure there are other 
free OS/2 news server packages.

-John (John.Thompson@attglobal.net)

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From: news@fenrir.demon.co.uk                           03-Nov-99 07:57:00
  To: All                                               04-Nov-99 03:16:21
Subj: Re: Whats the free best News server for OS/2?

From: "Brian Morrison" <news@fenrir.demon.co.uk>

On Wed, 03 Nov 1999 15:58:32 +1000, Greg Thomas wrote:

>I've got a bit of a LAN at home and wanting to setup a News Server. I
>have had a bit of a look at Changi (though not deeply yet), but was
>wondering if those in the know could tell me if I should be looking at
>something else instead.
>

You mean there is another free news server for OS/2? If so, tell us
what it is. I don't recall seeing another news server for OS/2 at all,
free or not.

FWIW, I use Changi all the time, it works fairly well, but development
is stalled and most likely will not restart. The author did say he
would release the source code, but that was over a year ago, still no
sign yet.


-- 
Brian Morrison                                       news@fenrir.demon.co.uk
               to reply, change address from 'news' to 'bdm'
 ...Grim faced, cold as fishwife's fingers, he snatched from the wall
 the sickle-sharp boar tusks he used for defacing Readers' Digest....


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From: hamei@pacbell.net                                 04-Nov-99 05:57:10
  To: All                                               04-Nov-99 03:16:21
Subj: Re: Need help with Ultimail on OS/2 WSeB

From: hamei@pacbell.net

In <3820a383$1$avpx$mr2ice@client.ce.news.psi.net>, Nick Knight
<nick@secant.com> writes:
>In <c1.2b8.2Sn3Wz$02X@hamei.pacbell.net>, on 11/03/99 
>   at 08:35 PM, hamei@pacbell.net said:
>
>>will v2 of MR/2 ICE work correctly with Unicode fonts in DBCS mail ? v
>>1.62 does not . . . 
>
>Nope.  Sorry.  I have some DBCS users that seem to be having good luck,
>but I can't tell you how they do it.  I do know that I explored full DBCS,
>but I saw no way to install a machine with a DBCS version, and if I
>managed to do that, I wouldn't have known enough about what I was seeing
>to a) work with it and b) prove to me that what I was doing was "working".
>
>If there are enough requests, I may revisit the idea.
>
>Nick
>-- 

thanks for the quick reply -

even I, the ultimate scrooge os/2 user with anti-corporate tendencies, 
could not expect a Western software guy to get too excited about a 
DBCS application for a thinly-used os in a version you cannot even buy 
in the US !

however, IBM and her henchmen (poetic license, not meant seriously) 
ASSURE me that locale-aware apps opened from the correct codepage
with a Unicode font installed will correctly display the national language.
This has been true with the e.exe editor and a couple of other programs, 
but in my fooling around with MR/2 ICE dbcs/unicode would correctly
display only in the front page -  saving messages in folders made the
display go awry, importing files that correctly display in E.EXE made
the display go awry, attaching correct-displaying Unicode files to 
messages butchered the files, etc etc. 

according to IBM, and for all I know they are right, this should not 
happen in correctly-written locale-aware apps. If this were a matter of
writing MR/2 ICE for Beijing Warp I'd agree with you, but either MR/2
has a problem with its locale-awareness/Unicode handling, or I have 
screwed up somehow. [ impossible :-) ] Since all one should have to 
do is open the program from the correct codepage to display the national 
language correctly, and Unicode must be correctly installed for it to work 
here in E.EXE, ummm, well, maybe MR/2 has a problem ? and the strange 
part is how it works fine in one page but is all butchered in others . . .
since 
it isn't just a dbcs problem, but is actually a locale-aware problem, perhaps 
you might want to look into it a bit further ? 

nice program, otherwise


--
hrad ngravvd

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From: mikus@bga.com                                     04-Nov-99 08:33:07
  To: All                                               04-Nov-99 14:41:01
Subj: Re: Need help with Ultimail on OS/2 WSeB

From: mikus@bga.com (Mikus Grinbergs)

>
> however, IBM and her henchmen (poetic license, not meant seriously)
> ASSURE me that locale-aware apps opened from the correct codepage
> with a Unicode font installed will correctly display the national language.

*IF* all the user's correspondence is in ONE national language,
code pages and locale-aware apps manage to get the job done.

But what if a that user has to deal with MULTIPLE national
languages in quick succession, or even simultaneously?  If
there is not a common character set between those languages
then IMHO OS/2 'locale' concept becomes just another PITA.

mikus

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From: planb@newsreaders.com                             04-Nov-99 20:22:09
  To: All                                               05-Nov-99 03:42:22
Subj: GNKSA Evaluation of Outlook Express 5.0 (1513)

From: planb@newsreaders.com (J. Moreno)

Enclosed is my GNKSA evaluation of Outlook Express 5.0 (1513) a
Macintosh newsreader.  It does NOT qualify for the Good Net-Keeping Seal
of Approval.

This version fixes several problems, but has a couple of bugs that cause
it to fail several requirements that it had previously passed.

The GNKSA attempts to establish a standard for newsreader behavior
on Usenet.  For more information on the aims and requirements of
the Good Net-Keeping Seal of Approval, as well as additional
evaluations, see:

   <URL:http://www.xs4all.nl/~js/gnksa/>

************************************************************************
                                            GNKSA  Evaluation Form  2.05

Product Name           : Outlook Express
Product Version        : 5.0 (1513)
Tested on platform     : MacOS 8.6
Available for platforms: MacOS
Evaluation date        : 10/24/199
Evaluated by           : John Moreno <planb@newsreaders.com>


Conclusion
==========

Outlook Express 5.0 fails to satisfy some basic GNKSA requirement(s),
hence does NOT qualify for the Good Net-Keeping Seal of Approval.


Summary
=======

         Pass   Fail   Total   Pass/Fail%
MUSTs     28     11      39     72%/28%
SHOULDs   16     11      27     59%/41%

%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%                     72%M
%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%                              59%S
                                                   [GNKSA Score-O-Meter]

Details
=======

Regarding the strict GNKSA requirements (MUSTs), Outlook Express 5.0
FAILS on the following points:

    4c   Does not allow setting Followup-To: poster
    7a   Does not include MsgID of original article as the last reference
    7b   Fails to include the last three references from the original
    8a   Neglects the Reply-To directions
    11a  Does not require a non-empty, user-specified subject
    11b  Will not refuse to post articles without subject
    11c  Uses some default subject when the user did not set one
    12a  May not provide a syntactically correct From-address
    12b  Fails to refuse to post messages with syntactically incorrect From:
    16c  Does not warn when posting quoted text only
    17   Can encrypt or encode messages into oblivion by default


Outlook Express 5.0 violates `soft' GNKSA requirements (SHOULDs)
in the following way:

    2d   Fails to use standard terminology
    3c   Fails to encourage setting a Followup-To on large crossposts
    7e   Fails to omit `broken' Message-IDs.
    9b   Does not support posting instead after replying
    9d   Mail message not preceded by notification when posted and mailed
    12c  Can use a bogus e-mail address
    13a  Does not let users cancel their own articles
    13b  Does not enable users to supersede their own articles
    14c  Refuses to post articles containing long lines
    15b  Does not warn on, or refuse, excessive signatures
    16d  Does not refuse to post quoted text only


Outlook Express 5.0 offers the following nice net-keeping
features unmentioned by the GNKSA:

Handles multiple servers very well, and adds support for several new
standards (the Posted-and-Mailed header and In-Reply-To for mail).


Additional Comments:

In a welcome improvement over previous version, this version defaults 
to use internet style quotes and replies. And unlike in the previous
version there is no need for a non-english version evaluation to show
the problem with Subject, that has been fixed.  Unfortunately, several
bugs in this version cause it to fail requirements it had previous
passed, I feel sure these will be fixed soon, but for the moment they
fail.

2e    - Uses "Reply to Sender" & "Reply to Newsgroup".
3b    - Warns when posting to more than 10 newsgroups.
3c    - Followup-To is not mentioned (see 4c).
4c    - Followup-To could be set by including it in the extra headers,
        but not on a individual basis.
6a    - Informs user,and asks what to do, the default is to send by mail
7a    - Leaves off the separating space when References already exist,
        this causes both the final id and the previous one to be 
        incorrect.
7b    - Because of the above mistake the former last id is damaged.
7c    - Restricts References.
7e    - Doesn't remove broken Messages-ID's, and in fact by leaving out
        the space can be considered to create them.
8a    - Does not use Reply-To when replying to a news post.
9a    - If you delete the newsgroups, fill in the Cc and try to post
        it will be mailed and not posted. Probably best described as a
        bug, but Passed.
9b    - Can't switch.
9d    - Includes notification in the header, but not in the body. This 
        is a good start, but not enough for the moment (the header won't
        be shown by most mail readers, OE itself doesn't show it).
11abc - Warns about empty Subject, and then creates a fake Subject to
        avoid server restrictions.
12abc - Easily set fake address, and one with a invalid syntax.
13ab  - No cancel or supersede.
14a   - In plain-text mode (the default) it soft wraps in the window
        at the same point as it will be hard wrapped upon sending.
        Excellent!
14b   - Not Applicable. Prevents long lines.
14c   - Prevents long lines.
14d   - Has a obvious and very useful Rewrap button.
15a   - Yep. Yay!
15b   - Doesn't warn, doesn't refuse.
16b   - Refuses to post empty bodies.  Great
16cd  - Doesn't warn, doesn't refuse.
17    - Can encode into HTML without warning, but default is plain text.

A copy of this review has been sent to the developers.


Checklist
=========                                                       (M)UST /
                                                                (S)HOULD
1) Displays all essential header information
   Software clearly displays:
   [Y] a) Article's author (From)                                      M
   [Y] b) Article's Subject                                            M
   [Y] c) List of groups posted to (Newsgroups)                        M
   [Y] d) Where (and how) to direct followups (Followup-To)            M
   [Y] e) Where to reply to if not the From-address (Reply-To)         M
[Y] PASS: Satisfies all MUSTs                                          M

2) Provides clear, separate commands for new  posting, followup, and
   e-mail reply
   [Y] a) for posting a new article                                    M
   [Y] b) for posting a followup article                               M
   [Y] c) for replying by e-mail                                       M
   [N] d) Uses standard terminology                                    S
   [Y] e) Avoids ambiguous terminology                                 S
[Y] PASS: Satisfies all MUSTs                                          M

3) Provides cross-posting functionality
   [Y] a) Allows specifying multiple groups                            M
   [Y] b) Warns about, or prevents, posting to large numbers of groups S
   [N] c) Strongly encourages setting Followup-To: on large crossposts S
          (`Y' if large crosspostings are disallowed)
[Y] PASS: Satisfies all MUSTs                                          M

4) Allows users to change essential headers
   [Y] a) Allows editing Subject at all times during composition       M
   [Y] b) Allows specifying new Subject of at least 70 characters      M
   [N] c) Allows setting "Followup-To: poster"                         M
[N] PASS: Satisfies all MUSTs                                          M

5) Ensures followups and e-mail replies contain a correct Subject
   [Y] a) Prepends "Re: " if (and only if) not already present         M
   [Y] b) Preserves entire original Subject (modulo minor repairs)     M
[Y] PASS: Satisfies all MUSTs                                          M

6) Directs followups to the correct newsgroups
   [Y] a) Initiates e-mail reply rather than a followup posting on
          "Followup-To: poster", clearly informing the user            M
   [Y] b) Posts to groups in Followup-To if present                    M
   [Y] c) Posts to groups in Newsgroups otherwise                      M
[Y] PASS: Satisfies all MUSTs                                          M

7) Make sure followups contain valid References
   [N] a) Creates References header with Message-ID of original article
          as the last element                                          M
   [N] b) Includes last three References from original                 M
   [Y] c) Ensures References will fit in 998 characters                M
   [Y] d) Keep as many References from original as fit                 S
   [N] e) Does not propagate broken Message-IDs in original References S
[N] PASS: Satisfies all MUSTs                                          M

8) Direct e-mail replies to the correct address
   [N] a) Uses Reply-To if present                                     M
   [Y] b) Uses From address otherwise                                  M
[N] PASS: Satisfies all MUSTs                                          M

9) Allow the user to change her mind about whether to post or mail (or
   do both) and behave if doing both
   [Y] a) Allows users to change their mind and mail rather than
          post after having initiated a followup message               S
   [N] b) Allows users to change their mind and post rather than
          mail after having initiated a reply message                  S
   [Y] c) Does not offer both posting and mailing as default behaviour M
   [N] d) Inserts a notification that the message was posted as well
          as mailed in the e-mail copy when both posting and mailing
          a followup article                                           S
[Y] PASS: Satisfies all MUSTs                                          M

10) Provide adequate quotation and attribution facilities
    [Y] a) Allows including quoted original                            M
    [Y] b) Clearly distinguishes quoted material                       M
    [Y] c) Prefixes quoted material with `>'/`> '                      S
    [Y] d) Omits correctly delimited signatures from quoted material   S
    [Y] e) Provides a means of indicating which part(s) to followup to S
    [Y] f) Attribution line containing original author precedes quotes M
[Y] PASS: Satisfies all MUSTs                                          M

11) Provide a user-specified "Subject: " header
    [N] a) Requires non-empty, user-specified Subject for new articles M
    [N] b) Refuses posting articles without, or with an empty, Subject M
    [N] c) Does not provide default Subject if user did not set one    M
    [N] d) Allows changing the Subject at any time while editing       M
[N] PASS: Satisfies all MUSTs                                          M

12) Provide a valid "From: " header
    [N] a) Sets "From: " header to syntactically valid e-mail address  M
    [N] b) Refuses posting articles without a syntactically valid
           "From: " header                                             M
    [N] c) Uses correct e-mail addresses (valid and belonging to the
           user) only, as far as it can possibly know                  S
[N] PASS: Satisfies all MUSTs                                          M

13) Allow users to both cancel and supersede their own articles (and
    _no_ others!)
    [N] a) Allows cancelling articles                                  S
    [N] b) Allows superseding articles                                 S
    [Y] c) As far as possible, does not allow cancelling or superseding
           other peoples' articles                                     M
    [Y] d) Uses standard terminology                                   S
[Y] PASS: Satisfies all MUSTs                                          M

14) Try to respect the 80-character line-length convention
    [Y] a) Articles are posted as edited, with linebreaking intact     S
    [Y] b) Warns about lines over 80 characters                        S
    [N] c) Does not refuse to post articles containing long lines      S
    [Y] d) Allows rewrapping quoted text                               S
    [Y] e) Enforces formatting requirements on article after external
           editing (`Y' if there is no support for external editors)   S
[Y] PASS: Satisfies all MUSTs                                          M

15) Separate signatures correctly, and don't use excessive ones
    [Y] a) Uses (and enforces) standard signature delimiter            S
    [N] b) Warns against or refuses to use excessive signatures        S
[Y] PASS: Satisfies all MUSTs                                          M

16) Try to prevent obvious user errors
    [Y] a) Warns when attempting to post empty articles                M
    [Y] b) Refuses posting empty articles                              S
    [N] c) Warns when post articles containing quoted material only    M
    [N] d) Refuses posting quoted-text-only articles                   S
    [Y] e) Warns against posting multiple copies (`Y' if impossible)   M
    [Y] f) Prevents multiple posting entirely                          S
[N] PASS: Satisfies all MUSTs                                          M

17) Post human-readable articles unless ordered otherwise
    [N] Does not (and can not) encode or encrypt articles unless
        on explicit user demand                                        M
[N] PASS: Satisfies all MUSTs                                          M

18) Provide self-protection
    [Y] Allows filtering out annoying articles (killing)               S
[Y] PASS: Satisfies all MUSTs                                          M

19) Be kind to servers, leave room for others
    [Y] a) Does not unnecessarily open multiple connections            M
    [Y] b) Does not generate excessive server load otherwise           M
[Y] PASS: Satisfies all MUSTs                                          M

-- 
John Moreno

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From: bvermo@powertech.no                               05-Nov-99 15:25:26
  To: All                                               05-Nov-99 14:49:07
Subj: Re: Need help with Ultimail on OS/2 WSeB

From: =?iso-8859-1?Q?Bj=F8rn?= Vermo <bvermo@powertech.no>

Mikus Grinbergs wrote:

>
> But what if a that user has to deal with MULTIPLE national
> languages in quick succession, or even simultaneously?  If
> there is not a common character set between those languages
> then IMHO OS/2 'locale' concept becomes just another PITA.
>

Not if the software is correctly written. OS/2 has good i18n support, but most
programmers seem to neglect anything beyond their own immediate surroundings.

NC 4.6.1 has it working after a fashion, but is full of holes. Some not too
bright spammer on Taiwan has put me on his list. Even if the mail headers
correctly identify the contents as big-5, the stupid program tries to display
it
with the default codepage. Then I use "View / Character Set..." to switch, and 
it
displays (as far as I can tell, knowing only a handful of Chinese words)
correctly. This is not satisfactory, but it is useable. It also shows that the
underlying functionsin OS/2 work.

Now, if I want to write in some language not supported by my default (8859-1)
character set, we run into the area of poor support in OS/2. The keyboard
codepage cannot be switched on a per window basis, so support for writing in
different codepages takes quite a bit of extra work. In Communicator, this
effort
has clearly not been taken. It is possible to select a character set in the
composer window, but not even the ALT+(numeric code) method works correctly.

It should be rather obvious that you usually want to answer in the same
language
the sender has used. This is not some unusual special case - after all, the
majority of the world population has to use more than one language on a
frequent
basis. Assigning a default language to each entry in the address book ought to 
be
a self-evident need. Assigning a default language to national domains should
not
be  too far-fetched, either.


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From: hamei@pacbell.net                                 05-Nov-99 09:23:24
  To: All                                               05-Nov-99 16:48:26
Subj: Re: Need help with Ultimail on OS/2 WSeB

From: hamei@pacbell.net

In <rkZI4kW2vfqA092yn@daina.bga.com>, mikus@bga.com (Mikus Grinbergs) writes:
>>
>> however, IBM and her henchmen (poetic license, not meant seriously)
>> ASSURE me that locale-aware apps opened from the correct codepage
>> with a Unicode font installed will correctly display the national language.
>
>*IF* all the user's correspondence is in ONE national language,
>code pages and locale-aware apps manage to get the job done.
>
>But what if a that user has to deal with MULTIPLE national
>languages in quick succession, or even simultaneously?  If
>there is not a common character set between those languages
>then IMHO OS/2 'locale' concept becomes just another PITA.
>
>mikus
>

since it is only possible to even HAVE two codepages on a system
your complaint isn't the half of it . . IBM's national language support 
is a joke to anyone who has actually tried to use it, though it does 
manage to look impressive loading hundreds of files onto the hard 
disk . . so i am going to officially hand the baton over to you. I have 
bitched, whined, moaned, snivelled for hundreds of lines about
this situation, to no avail. Even writers of esteemed OS/2 software 
don't really give a damn if their apps are functional in the 
locale-aware abortion-set codepage system. Apparently this global
e-business economy is more hot air than reality, as it is difficult
to believe many people would put up with this gruesome situation.

good luck mikus, and if you ever need any backup testimony from 
one who's actually tried to USE multiple languages instead of talking
about it, feel free.


--
hrad ngravvd

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From: coville@localnet.com                              05-Nov-99 18:26:05
  To: All                                               05-Nov-99 16:48:26
Subj: Re: Anybody got Postroad DLL: SGPOSTRD.DLL ?

From: coville@localnet.com (Brian)

On Sat, 30 Oct 1999 02:13:03, rmahoney@_REMOVE_THIS_netusa.net (Robert
Mahoney) wrote:

>  The SpellGuard engine was licensed on a per copy basis so I would 
> think that Innoval removed the DLL from the free distribution.
>  
>   And I would prefer people that have the SGPOSTRD.DLL not distribute 
> it.

Any chance you could get a the original .dll and sell it?  I 
appreciate the work you've down on spellguard but prefer an integrated
product.  If this .dll was still available I probably would have 
purchased it from Innoval as a package including spellguard ( using 
spell guard occasionally, the dll daily).

	Brian

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